EP093 Signs It's Time to Transition to a New Ecommerce Provider
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[00:00:06] DARIN NEWBOLD: Well, good day and welcome to Commerce Today. Hey, Josh, it is great to have you as always. How are you

[00:00:11] JOSHUA WARREN: Doing good. How are you doing,

[00:00:12] DARIN NEWBOLD: I'm doing well and we are going to be talking about, it could be signs. It's time to transition to a new e commerce provider. And I know Josh, you always have a lot of great information that you're going to bring to us, but just to kind of kick us off, kind of give us an overview.

[00:00:29] DARIN NEWBOLD: This is, to talk about both agencies and platforms and how they're vital to that, to your e commerce success. And it's so important because if you're working with the wrong provider, it can really limit your growth. While if you're doing something with the right one, it can drive significant revenue and that operational efficiency that we all want.

[00:00:50] DARIN NEWBOLD: And lastly, we're going to talk some red flags. And the impact of staying with what happens if you stay with that underperforming, provider and [00:01:00] how best to make that smooth transition to the new one when you need to do that. So with that, Josh, let's start off with some red flags with your current e commerce provider.

[00:01:10] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah. So, and what I love is that with all of these things, this could be caused by your platform. It could be caused by your agency or it could be both. And so that's why we're really looking at both. And so the first one is one big red flag. If you have frequent downtime or site instability, so often, and when I'm talking to a potential client, they'll ask me, you know, what's your, your on call policy and what's your policy for when our site crashes.

[00:01:35] JOSHUA WARREN: And I always have to say, well. It shouldn't crash. The whole point of the work that we're doing is so that it doesn't crash. If your site's crashing a lot, there's either something wrong with your agency or something wrong with your platform. and obviously your site's crashing, you're going to lose money.

[00:01:52] JOSHUA WARREN: They're not going to, people won't be able to purchase. it can actually lower customer trust. I've seen it greatly impact SEO [00:02:00] rankings. Google does not like when they try to crawl your site and it's not there. That's not, not good. So, you You really want to have a site that is online, and really any modern platform, if implemented correctly for the average e commerce site out there is going to do okay.

[00:02:18] JOSHUA WARREN: Usually where I see problems with this is either you've outgrown the platform, your business is just too big now. Or more often than not, either the agency you're working with now, or the agency that implemented the site, didn't understand that platform, didn't implement it well.

[00:02:33] DARIN NEWBOLD: And they didn't, yeah, didn't have some planning for all of that. And that really leads us, you kind of already said, if you're outgrowing it, that leads to kind of this next red flag of not being able to support that growing traffic, the transaction volumes, and all of those things that are, that are hitting, you know, Black Friday's around the corner.

[00:02:51] JOSHUA WARREN: That's exactly what I was thinking about. I know that, we do a lot of work with Adobe commerce and Adobe commerce cloud, and already their team [00:03:00] is reaching out and actually some time ago, reached out to all of the, the B2C retailers and the D2C retailers and basically said, Hey, let's plan out, do some capacity planning and discussions about what you expect your holiday volumes to be.

[00:03:14] JOSHUA WARREN: just because they want to make sure you have the right things in place. So if your platform isn't doing something like that, and if it is experiencing challenges on whether it's a peak day like Black Friday or just a peak day for your business, it's another sign that, it might be time to look at a new platform or a new partner.

[00:03:32] JOSHUA WARREN: so often, People just assume, Oh, this is just e commerce. Like everyone's site goes down on black Friday, but no, everyone's site does not go down on black Friday. and that's again, a good sign that you might be with the wrong platform or agency.

[00:03:46] DARIN NEWBOLD: Well, very, very important. And then another key piece to all of this that, that is definitely a red flag is not being able to innovate.

[00:03:54] DARIN NEWBOLD: We've talked about this over and over again, Josh, in our, in virtually every one of our podcasts about [00:04:00] innovation. I won't mention that two letter acronym that you will, I'm sure shortly, but you gotta be able to adopt a new 

[00:04:07] JOSHUA WARREN: technology. Yeah. So if your, platform or your agency is kind of slow to get on board with new technologies, that's another red flag.

[00:04:15] JOSHUA WARREN: E commerce and retail these days moves very fast. Consumer expectations move fast. it's been interesting as you teased, I'm going to mention AI and specifically things like chat GPT. And there's platforms that still basically trying to integrate in with an LLM or a chat GPT site service just isn't possible.

[00:04:37] JOSHUA WARREN: there's agencies that still don't really know even the basics of working with those tools and you're really missing out. we actually have a new client that we're working with where We were able to find a very innovative use of chat GPT that is going to save them literally thousands of dollars a month in service fees.

[00:04:56] JOSHUA WARREN: And just because we're looking at, going to work with a [00:05:00] platform that is flexible, easy to integrate with. So it's going to be easy to bring the, open AI's API into that. And it's just a technology that we have stayed up on. And so a lot of platforms and agencies, as they get kind of older and maybe they have a, An established client base, but they're not too worried about growth.

[00:05:18] JOSHUA WARREN: They start slowing down their innovation. They start being more resistant to change, more resistant to new technologies. And that's usually right about the time you want to be thinking, Okay, I need to find a new platform or a new agency.

[00:05:31] DARIN NEWBOLD: Yeah, you end up with that, that evil thing, that technology debt that, ends up there. Well, that hits us for our red flags and kind of those three key pieces, but moving forward, we want to look at what happens if you, if you stay with a, with that underperforming provider, there's some impact that you're going to feel.

[00:05:52] DARIN NEWBOLD: And we've, we've teased a few of those things, but Josh, maybe lead us a little bit further into some 

[00:05:58] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah. So you're going to [00:06:00] lose money. that's the, probably the most important one. you will lose money. if you have an underperforming partner or underperforming platform, you're Typically your user experience will suffer. So your site will be slow. It will not meet modern standards. It'll be harder to use on a mobile device.

[00:06:17] JOSHUA WARREN: It might be unstable crashing, like we talked about, and that's just a really good way to take your revenue and hand it to your competitors because the world of e commerce, you got to remember your competition is a click away. 

[00:06:29] DARIN NEWBOLD: Well, you can't losing money. Obviously we got their attention. So moving, moving on beyond that is just simply falling behind. You said it there a click away. Well, Gosh, if you're behind in their technology, how does that look?

[00:06:46] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah. So first of all, you can lose money just because, like I said, your, your performance and your user experience is so bad. But on the flip side, your competitors could have such a. Good experience compared to yours that you start falling behind them.[00:07:00] 

[00:07:00] JOSHUA WARREN: And then obviously you're going to, again, lose money that way. So you really have to watch, it's really interesting to see there will be different verticals where you'll see a wave of replatforming where basically some of the category leaders are lots of times the. like the third or fourth largest company in that category will say, Hey, we're going to replatform onto a newer, more innovative platform.

[00:07:22] JOSHUA WARREN: They will kind of raise the, the stakes for everyone else. okay, now this is the experience we're going to deliver. If your platform can't keep up with that, or if your agency can't keep up with that, then again, you're gonna, you're gonna lose out in that race. And lots of times I've seen, you know, That's how that number three or number four player in a category actually becomes the number one

[00:07:43] DARIN NEWBOLD: Suddenly does the big jump. Yeah, well the other piece of this that besides losing money, it's gonna cost you more because you're inefficient.

[00:07:54] JOSHUA WARREN: so often, when someone comes

[00:07:58] JOSHUA WARREN: to us either from a different [00:08:00] platform or different agency, we will just see, they have so many manual processes and they have so many manual workarounds because either their existing platform just didn't support the level of automation and workflow improvements that they needed.

[00:08:12] JOSHUA WARREN: Or the agency they selected didn't know how to set those up. and this can be, you know, really advanced things like really optimizing and improving your shipping workflows. Sometimes this is as simple, and I talked about this one a few weeks ago, as simple as if it's, if you have to call a developer to add a new product, that's, you're losing time, you're losing money.

[00:08:33] JOSHUA WARREN: And that's so, so much of a inefficiency that it just, I, my skin still crawls thinking about that company that is dealing with that situation. and that's because of a combination of the platform they're on and the agency that implemented it.

[00:08:47] DARIN NEWBOLD: Yeah, that those kind of things are just, I mean, just unacceptable. You just can't can't do that. All right. Well, go ahead.

[00:08:54] JOSHUA WARREN: me. Like it's, and I'll get on my soapbox for a minute or two here. hopefully we have the time for it, but [00:09:00] it just frustrates me because sometimes it's, it is benign negligence. It is the agency just didn't know, or the platform just didn't know, like they didn't think about it.

[00:09:10] JOSHUA WARREN: But sometimes it's worse than that. I do see agencies that their whole thing is, well, if you always have to call a developer to add a product, that's more billable hours for us. And that means you're locked into us and you're not going to switch. And they're not looking at it. The way I like to look at it is if we equip a merchant to succeed, they will make more money.

[00:09:30] JOSHUA WARREN: They will want to invest more money into their e commerce platform. That's kind of the win win that I like to see. Versus there are some agencies out there that their whole approach is, how do we nickel and dime you and force you to pay us for things? And that's how we're going to try to make more money out of you.

[00:09:47] DARIN NEWBOLD: It's kind of almost teaching that learned helplessness. And so you don't even know that you Didn't know that you didn't need a developer to do all of this. Well, as always, great stuff, about the impact of staying with [00:10:00] that underperforming provider, but let's kind of hit that last.

[00:10:03] DARIN NEWBOLD: And, and I won't, I hear, hear that song. Well, I guess it's not the last one, but I hear that song in my head, but I won't do it, but we need to make a smooth transition. So how do we make that smooth transition to a new platform or an agency and or both?

[00:10:18] JOSHUA WARREN: So we actually have a replatforming guide that we released on LinkedIn about a year ago, that is still a good guide for thinking about a new platform.

[00:10:28] JOSHUA WARREN: but so much of it. Really is about understanding what do you need? What does your business need now? And what does it need over the next, you know, one to three years versus what can different platforms provide? another big thing we talked a lot last week and last week's episode about how to select a really good agency to work with.

[00:10:46] JOSHUA WARREN: and one of the things that I got the most feedback on was the fact that you want to find an agency that will tell you, no. And I think you want that even from a platform. I've been in, platform selection discussions with different [00:11:00] platforms on behalf of clients and the really best platforms are the ones that are either going to say, well, no, actually we don't support that or no, we don't recommend your approach it that way.

[00:11:11] JOSHUA WARREN: I think one of the examples that always sticks out to me was one of the SAS platforms that was really honest about the fact that. This particular merchant had a really unique and large combination of product SKUs that broke down into different variants and different classifications. And once you started doing the math, they basically just said, Hey, the architecture of our system, this isn't going to work well.

[00:11:33] JOSHUA WARREN: So you really don't want to, try to move to our platform. Others will tell you no and say, but here's the right way to do it. Or here's the way if you can change your requirements to fit this. And those are the ones that, you know, over the years I've learned you can trust those because they're being truthful versus there's some platforms out there that are usually yes, yes, yes, yes, yes, we can do that.

[00:11:56] JOSHUA WARREN: Yes, however you want it. You know, just sign on the line that is dotted. That is all that [00:12:00] matters. 

[00:12:01] DARIN NEWBOLD: There's a plug in for that.

[00:12:02] JOSHUA WARREN: yeah. Oh, there's a plugin for that. There's an app for that. Yeah. That sort of thing. be very careful, with those both on the agency level and the platform level.

[00:12:11] DARIN NEWBOLD: Well, how do we go about planning for this migration and, and how do we minimize the disruptions that could happen if we choose to do this?

[00:12:19] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah. So on a, platform migration, obviously, and this is the, the one that seems to trip people up the most is know when your contract is up. Because I have had companies coming to me and say, we wanna switch platforms.

[00:12:35] JOSHUA WARREN: We want to do it, you know, soon. And then they start talking and planning out the project and they look and we might say, okay, it'll be ready in March. And they'll say, Oh, wait, we just looked at our contract and we're going to have to pay for a whole another year unless we can migrate by January. That's obviously, yeah, oops.

[00:12:53] JOSHUA WARREN: That's not going to be a smooth migration. So definitely know when those renewals are, know when those key dates are, and plan in advance of [00:13:00] those. also, if you're working with a good agency on a platform migration, there really ought to be very little downtime. This shouldn't be something, and I have seen recently, which scares me, Brands where their site was down for two or three days because they were switching platforms.

[00:13:16] JOSHUA WARREN: And that's again, you might, they might tell you, Oh, that's how it works. No, that's not how it works. That is something is not being done right in handling that migration. and then as far as, migrating agencies, again, know your contract kind of like I mentioned on the platforms. Unfortunately, I have been on the receiving side of someone switching agencies where they're switching to us and they didn't realize that the way their contract was written, they technically didn't own any of their code and they couldn't bring it to another agency.

[00:13:49] JOSHUA WARREN: So lawyers had to get involved and it was, it was not fun. 

[00:13:53] DARIN NEWBOLD: Yeah. know 

[00:13:55] JOSHUA WARREN: your agreement is with your current agency. and there's different schools of thought. [00:14:00] Some people like to spring this on the other agency. They basically like to kind of just cut off their access and flip to the new agency. hopefully you have a good relationship with your current agency.

[00:14:12] JOSHUA WARREN: And I think again, Most agencies, they'll extend professional courtesy. They'll basically realize, hey, sometimes clients transition to us. Sometimes they transition away. We need to make this a smooth process. So I think you'll have to judge what your relationship is with your existing agency, but definitely talking to the agency you're moving to, finding out what information they're going to need, and then kind of planning and talking with the agency you're moving from.

[00:14:41] JOSHUA WARREN: To ensure that's a seamless migration. Now, one thing I always warn about though, is Even in the best cases when both agencies, the old agency and the new agency love each other, and they're the nicest people. you don't want two different agencies deploying changes to your side at the [00:15:00] same time. 

[00:15:00] DARIN NEWBOLD: That's like crossing the streams.

[00:15:02] JOSHUA WARREN: yeah, that's exactly.

[00:15:04] JOSHUA WARREN: And even if they don't argue and they don't blame each other, it's just a recipe for someone's process, stepping on someone else's process. So also plan this out so that. You can wrap up work with the existing agency and you can move to the new agency and you don't really cross the streams there on who's deploying to the site.

[00:15:23] DARIN NEWBOLD: So it sounds like a phased approach to that whole thing is, is one of the best. And you even started to talk about and mentioned a lot about the communications around all of this and making sure that people know we got to make sure that the stakeholders as well as the customers know. And how do you see all that coming together?

[00:15:41] DARIN NEWBOLD: Maybe kind of what's a best practice

[00:15:44] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah. So for the customers, if it's an agency change, it should be transparent. And I would not communicate that for a platform change. So often when you move platforms, customer passwords have to be reset. So letting them know in advance what I would not do. [00:16:00] That I've seen companies do is put a banner up that says, you know, we're moving to a new site.

[00:16:04] JOSHUA WARREN: Sorry, things might not work quite right. Like that just puts people in the mood of, Oh, so I'm going to have a bad experience. That's not how you want people to start their shopping with you. but if they are going to need to reset their password or anything like that, definitely communicate that. But on the stakeholders, it's the internal stakeholders that I find need the most communication, 

[00:16:26] DARIN NEWBOLD: Amen. 

[00:16:27] JOSHUA WARREN: letting them know, yeah, letting them know, a change is coming, why the change is being made.

[00:16:32] JOSHUA WARREN: I think so often, it's either not communicated or it's just like a throwaway line at the end of a meeting of, oh, yeah, and we're switching platforms or, yeah, we're switching agencies. And if you don't share the why, then people get scared. They get frustrated. They might blame everything on the new agency, the old agency, the new platform, the old platform.

[00:16:51] JOSHUA WARREN: So really explaining them why you're making the change and giving them a chance to express how they feel about it can save you so much time after [00:17:00] the transition and dealing with it.

[00:17:01] DARIN NEWBOLD: And that kind of goes hand in hand with a phased approach because you want to make sure and keep, keep those stakeholders involved in being involved in that transition so that they know what to expect once the proverbial switch is pulled.

[00:17:15] JOSHUA WARREN: Yeah.

[00:17:16] JOSHUA WARREN: all right, 

[00:17:17] DARIN NEWBOLD: so we talked about. different things to run into, the red flags, but as well, we really need to, kind of wrap this around. What are the long term benefits of, of making this change? Why is it, why is it a big

[00:17:32] JOSHUA WARREN: and this is important because changing agencies or platforms is work. And so you have to know that there are long term benefits from doing that work.

[00:17:43] JOSHUA WARREN: typically if you're, especially if you're moving to a new platform or if you're moving to a more experienced agency, You will see improvements in your user experience. Lots of times, the easy low hanging fruit wins around performance. Core Web Vitals, Google Lighthouse, that's something else that I'm [00:18:00] talking to a new client with.

[00:18:02] JOSHUA WARREN: they have a platform that just has incredibly low Google Lighthouse scores. It's very hard to improve. their current agency isn't even trying to improve it because it's so hard. And so we're looking at both options for moving to a faster platform, but also what we can do to speed up their current platform in the meantime.

[00:18:22] JOSHUA WARREN: And that's going to give, just immense improvements to their conversion rate. and also just typically you're going to have better technology. You're going to be a little more future proofed, especially if you move to a newer, more modern platform. and then one of the things that we do, whether you're moving to a new platform or not, when you come to Creatuity is we're going to take a holistic look at your workflow and your strategy and basically help you find ways to Have those workflow and efficiency improvements.

[00:18:52] JOSHUA WARREN: So you're going to lower some of your operating costs while increasing your revenue. And that's, that always makes the finance team happy.

[00:18:59] DARIN NEWBOLD: [00:19:00] Yes, it does, especially when it all comes together. Well, folks, we've put together this, this whole episode around the transition of a new e commerce provider, whether that's a, whether that's a platform or your agency.

[00:19:12] DARIN NEWBOLD: We've talked about, the red flags, the impact of staying with an underperforming provider. The steps to make that smooth transition and then, hey, what are the long term benefits? So with that, we're always excited to have you. Josh, tell us about how they can get in touch with

[00:19:27] DARIN NEWBOLD: you. 

[00:19:28] JOSHUA WARREN: LinkedIn, search for Joshua Warren. You'll probably find like 20 results. Look for the guy that looks like me and I am on a gold background and you can reach out to me there. I do free 30 minute e commerce problem solving sessions that you can click a link and schedule one of those right there on my LinkedIn profile.

[00:19:46] DARIN NEWBOLD: And as always, we appreciate your comments, your likes, and support of the, of our podcast. We love to hear from you. So with that, as always, we look forward to talking to you again here at Commerce Today. Take care. 

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