[00:00:00] Quatermass: What you're about to see is a memory stored for millions of years and now picked up by the susceptible brain [00:00:15] Pub Patron: People don't believe nothing nowadays unless they seen it on the telly [00:00:27] Matthew: Hello, and welcome to the IMMP podcast from the Intermillennium Media Project. My name is Matthew Porter. [00:00:35] Ian: I'm Ian Porter. [00:00:36] Jim: I'm Jim Porter. [00:00:37] Matthew: I'm his- Hey dad, he's my son, and that's my brother. [00:00:41] Jim: Hello again. [00:00:44] Ian: We've got a guest here on the IMMP. [00:00:46] Matthew: A very- [00:00:46] Jim: Great to be back [00:00:48] Matthew: It is good to [00:00:48] Jim: be- Hasn't been five million years, just about one year, but I'm here [00:00:51] Ian: Oh, goodness, yeah. [00:00:55] Matthew: It's a special episode because we're gonna be talking about another one of those movies that I remember most from local television, watching that with my brother Jim. [00:01:03] Jim: Oh, yeah. Good old days. Oh. [00:01:06] Matthew: If it wasn't on the, the 4:30 movie on WABC, then it was on, uh, like, the Million Dollar Movie again on Channel 9. [00:01:13] Jim: Channel 9 New York, wonderful thing. [00:01:17] Ian: Oh, goodness. I kind of... I, I get jealous sometimes hearing about how much TV back in the day was just so much more approachable. I mean- Oh, yeah I ha- I, I've lived in this early era of internet streaming, from, like, middle school age but there's something about, like, the movie culture of back in the day is changed. [00:01:35] Matthew: And, and- But it's different because it- ... the serendipity of just it's on, we get to watch it. It's not we can choose it any time. [00:01:41] Ian: Mm. [00:01:41] Jim: And I think this is one of these movies... I, this is, this is the first time to ever watch this film complete from start to finish. [00:01:47] Matthew: Oh, really? Oh. [00:01:47] Jim: It's the kind of thing you're just going through the channels and it's on. You're 20 minutes in, but you sit down and watch the rest of it. Or late at night, you can't sleep. You flip through, and oh, this movie's starting to watch, but you fall asleep halfway through 'cause it's, you know, half past midnight. But to finally I think I've seen it, you know, from beginning to end, no interruptions. [00:02:04] Ian: Oh, my goodness. [00:02:05] Jim: It's a, it's a whole different experience. [00:02:08] Ian: Unintentionally serialized. [00:02:10] Jim: Exactly. Yeah, I've seen the whole thing if you add up all those little increments, but never in one go. [00:02:16] Ian: Oh, boy. [00:02:17] Jim: Until now. [00:02:18] Ian: This is also an interesting one because trying to find it, it's a- Yes ... it's a film of two names, and that means that- Oh, yeah it's got some weird Google interactions. [00:02:29] Matthew: It does. So we are talking about the movie that we always knew as Five Million Years to Earth because that's the movie- Yes ... it was re- that, that's the title under which it was released in the US. Uh, but in the UK and elsewhere it was Quatermass and the Pit. [00:02:47] Ian: Yeah. I, I'm sorry, Five Million Years to Earth sounds like a cool title, but that is absolutely too, like, road trip adventure of a name- for a movie that takes place 90% underground. [00:03:02] Jim: In the same hole. [00:03:03] Ian: In the same hole. Meanwhile, Quatermass and the Pit just sounds like a pay-per-view wrestling special. Sunday, Sunday, sunday. Witness Bernard Quatermass versus British Intelligence and Space Crickets in the Pit. [00:03:21] Jim: Two scientist enter, one scientist leaves [00:03:24] Ian: Exactly. [00:03:25] Matthew: Wow, a, British boffin as a professional wrestling persona would be kind of awesome. [00:03:32] Ian: It kind of would, actually. [00:03:34] Matthew: He- [00:03:34] Jim: Yeah ... [00:03:35] Matthew: carries his little beaker of bubbling liquid, uh- ... into the ring with him before he hands it off to his lab assistant. [00:03:42] Jim: Oh, yeah. Yes, gotta have the assistant escort him out to the ring, yes. [00:03:45] Matthew: Of course. [00:03:46] Ian: Of course. I, I take it that part of the reason why it's got the name Five Million Years to Earth in the United States is, I don't know if... Did, did the... Oh, both of the other two Quatermass movies did get brought to America. So they just didn't- Yeah ... like calling it Quatermass. [00:04:06] Matthew: And they, they came to America, but they weren't as popular as they were in Britain. I mean, Quatermass was a popular character from television and radio- Right ... and other movies. So, "Oh, this is the latest Quatermass movie. Cool." You wouldn't get that in the US, so. [00:04:21] Ian: Yeah. Yeah. I [00:04:23] Matthew: mean, may- maybe there are titles they could have used rather than Five Million Years to Earth and, and yet it, it is evocative. [00:04:29] Ian: It is evocative. [00:04:30] Jim: It gives- [00:04:31] Ian: Oh, admit- It, it gives away part of the plot actually, though. [00:04:34] Jim: When I first saw this, I must have been, oh, maybe seven or eight years old, and just the concept of Five Million Years to Earth, years isn't a distance. I couldn't figure out what the title meant- ... to my little seven-year-old brain, until my dad explained it to me. "Okay." Hard to wrap around. [00:04:51] Ian: W- wait, wait a minute. Wait a minute. Did Star Wars and Quatermass just ex- exchange things? One is using parsecs as time- Yes. ... and one is using years as distance. [00:05:00] Jim: That's it. They got their units confused. [00:05:05] Ian: How does one even, like, approach this story though? Because it feels This is a movie that is absolutely a, a rollercoaster hill climb. You get into the little seat, it hooks you in, and it goes chk, chk, chk, chk, chk, chk, chk, chk, chk. And at the very end, there's a whoosh of rush. Oh, yes. But there's, there's a very long, slow hill climb on this film. [00:05:29] Matthew: Yeah. It does have that build, those little segments, and everything escalates a little bit. And yet every given one of those steps up is itself fascinating and compelling and appropriate for a- True ... a sci-fi horror movie. [00:05:44] Ian: Oh, yeah. [00:05:45] Matthew: Because it starts, there's excavation of a new underground rail- railroad extension, uh, no, tube extension in London, and this is in... The movie's from 1967, and it's more or less set then. [00:05:57] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:05:58] Matthew: And the people who are digging and drilling for the new, uh, railway station find bones. They start to find skulls, and odd skulls. That already, that's pretty compelling and strange. [00:06:14] Jim: Yeah. [00:06:15] Ian: Yeah. We've got a, we've got a scientific discovery story. Bring in the scientists, the paleontologists. [00:06:23] Matthew: Right. They bring in Dr. Roney, who's the first one to come in. Mm. And he, uh, he's fascinated by this because there are these skulls and bones, and they're not quite right. They're very, very old. They're millions of years old, apparently. But they're humanoid, so they're far older than anyone e- ever had reason to believe people or anyth- any pre-humans were around. Mm. [00:06:48] Jim: Now, they never made it clear, was Dr. Roney an archeologist, a paleontologist? I mean, he's also studying brains. He's like, you know, he's a, quote, "scientist," I guess so, [00:06:58] Ian: uh- Yeah. He's a- He, he's a paleontologist with a lot, with a lot of minors on his degree, I'm guessing. [00:07:07] Matthew: Yes. [00:07:08] Jim: I guess so. [00:07:10] Matthew: Yeah, he's a little bit of everything. It's, uh... And when we see the same from the, uh, from Quatermass, who is introduced later. They're, they might have a specialty, but they are the scientist guy, the researcher. [00:07:20] Ian: Actually, weird- weirdly enough, you know, as this gets weirder, q- bringing in Quatermass, Quatermass does have a specialty, thanks to the other two films. [00:07:30] Matthew: Yes. [00:07:30] Ian: But his specialty- Oh, good ... is, is being like... Quatermass is a British X-Files in a weird way. [00:07:37] Matthew: Yes, very much. Yeah. [00:07:39] Ian: Yeah. It's like, "Oh, this is getting odd," because they're finding these ape man skulls, and then they find this metallic object buried amongst them. And they keep trying to dig it out, and it's bigger. And it's huge, and they're like, "Oh, that's probably an unexploded bomb." [00:07:58] Matthew: I love the fact that it, it steps up that next step. Suddenly we've got a, a UXB story, which has tremendous amount of tension. And if this is a bomb, it's a big one [00:08:10] Jim: And it's, it's a common thing in Britain even through the '50s and '60s. Any time they're excavating, they're finding UXBs. [00:08:15] Matthew: Yeah. Mm-hmm. [00:08:16] Jim: But, uh, but getting back to Quatermass, we heard he's introduced as a rocket scientist in this one. [00:08:21] Matthew: Yeah. [00:08:21] Jim: Yeah. He's in charge of a rocket project which the military is trying to co-opt for, for their uses. [00:08:26] Ian: And the military completely brings him in because they're like, "This is the weirdest unexploded bomb we've ever seen. Yeah. Get the guy who knows f- flying objects to tell us how this one flew." [00:08:38] Matthew: And yet he kind of- Which fits ... forces his way in because he's... And Quatermass' thing has always been he's the head of the British Experimental Rocket Group, the BERG. Yes. And he wants to- Was that- ... do space rockets and bring people to the moon and all these things. Right. And of course, the military says, "Sure, we'll send people to space, and they'll bring missiles with them. That's why we want a moon base." Yeah. So this Colonel Breen is being thrust upon, uh, Quatermass as the, the co-head of the British Experimental Rocket Group. Mm-hmm. And it's Breen who is called in, saying, "Oh, he's got a lot of experience in his prior military career with UXBs. He should be here to check this out." And Quatermass, who's now sort of his partner, says, "Well, I'm coming, too." [00:09:23] Ian: Yeah. [00:09:23] Matthew: And starts saying, "This is not a bomb." [00:09:26] Ian: Mm-hmm. Yeah. I'm sorry, that name, the British Experimental Rocket Group, is so awesome. [00:09:32] Matthew: Isn't it? [00:09:33] Ian: That is... There's something about that name that just works, the BERG. [00:09:37] Matthew: BERG. [00:09:38] Jim: Get back to the BERG. [00:09:39] Ian: I, I want... I'm, I'm absolutely... I need, like, a character who, you know, interned at the Banzai Institute and spent- ... spent a year working for the BERG and things like that. Oh. That's the sort of background I need. [00:09:51] Matthew: They are definitely- Yes ... in the same universe in my mind. [00:09:54] Ian: Oh, absolutely. [00:09:57] Matthew: I [00:09:57] Ian: think so. Like the same kinda thing. [00:09:58] Matthew: I think Quatermass, uh, met, uh, uh, Buckaroo Banzai's father at some, at academic conferences. [00:10:05] Ian: Oh, absolutely. But that also tells you the kind of tone if we're bringing up Buckaroo Banzai. There's something about this where it's a, it's a slower, less of a, you know ... It's not the, well, the '80s action film. It is the, the '60s looming terror kind of film. Yeah. But it's got a similar weird edge to it all throughout this film. So when we're describing they find a bomb, there's a lot of camera and tension of like, well, it's bigger and it's not magnetic, and it's oddly shaped. And like that buildup that we're talking about exists in this, but it's got that, that strange science flavor from the early starts. Yeah. [00:10:52] Matthew: And some of that is the question of what weird science did the Nazis have that we don't even know about? Yes. If they were able to create this and drop it on London, and for, uh, for some reason it didn't go off, uh, let's be grateful for that. Yeah. But what do we do now? [00:11:06] Ian: And, I love the bit where we get a fine example of Quatermass' personality when he's there witnessing the excavation, and they find another skull while exposing part of the- Yes ... uh, bomb. And we see our paleontologist, , Dr. Roney go over, grab it, "Oh, this is a brilliant specimen. It, it's perfectly intact. It was just buried inside this metal object." And he brings it over, and he's washing it. We just watch Quatermass, like, watch him move the skull across the room, and then go over and just say, "So that skull was where exactly?" "Well, it was inside the thing, completely int- Oh. It was inside the thing." Yes. "That means it didn't crash here." It, it's like you can tell Quatermass immediately understood this and immediately was... Like, there's a smartest man in the room ability there, and yet he is a very respectful and understanding guy, where his entire point is, "I'm not gonna say it. I'm going-" Yeah ..."to poke everyone and get them to realize it." [00:12:15] Matthew: Yeah. [00:12:18] Ian: And that's such a good moment. [00:12:20] Matthew: I like that bit. It... You're right, it says a lot about Quatermass' personality. It's also the beginning of that mutual respect between Roney and Quater- Quatermass- Yes ... which is partly built on the fact that they both disdain, uh, Breen, who wants to believe nothing about this. He's got his fixed- Yes ... idea as to what this is militarily- Mm-hmm ... and what's going on. [00:12:38] Ian: I, uh... Colonel Breen just wants to, you know, check the box of the one of four options he's got- Mm-hmm ... do the paperwork, and leave. [00:12:48] Matthew: Mm-hmm. [00:12:48] Ian: Yeah. Every day for Breen is a Monday. [00:12:55] Matthew: And, and the way he's played by Julian Glover, he is a good foil for, for Roney and Quatermass. And he's, he's- Yeah ... this movie's equivalent of the EPA guy from, uh, Ghostbusters. [00:13:05] Jim: Yes. [00:13:05] Matthew: His job is- Good analogy, [00:13:06] Jim: yeah ... [00:13:07] Matthew: to be a [00:13:07] Jim: jerk. Yes. And then his only question is, "If this is some new experimental material, how can I use it for our military?" [00:13:14] Matthew: Right. [00:13:15] Jim: That's all he's kicking around, yeah. [00:13:17] Matthew: And it is weird material. Mm-hmm. You can expose it to thousands of degrees of temperature, and it doesn't even get warm. None of the- Yeah ... drills they have, uh, diamond and better, uh, can, can scratch it. It's an amazing material. [00:13:31] Ian: Yeah. It's, it's described almost like a ceramic in some ways- Hmm with some of their pieces of description. Yep. But maybe that's me trying to put, apply actual material science to, to sci-fi. But there's something, like it is the perfect aeronautics material is the idea. Light, temperature resistant, resilient. It is every single thing you'd want for a flying vessel in one object, just perfectly made. [00:14:04] Jim: Except you get frostbite if you touch it. [00:14:07] Matthew: Yes. [00:14:07] Jim: Remember that? [00:14:08] Ian: Yeah, that's the other, that is the problem. That is a very creepy bit. [00:14:12] Jim: Make sure you wear gloves, Doctor. You gotta take, take those gloves. You got a bandaged hand. [00:14:17] Ian: Oh, ugh. [00:14:20] Matthew: And there is something very procedural about how it proceeds from here, where we've, they've got specific things they're investigating about- Mm-hmm this object, and it leads them to something else. But the something else keeps getting stranger and stranger. [00:14:33] Jim: Mm-hmm. And it's, it's the two things. They've got the, the object investigating, and then there's these strange skeletons they're finding. The skulls are human, but not quite human. So it's- [00:14:41] Matthew: Yeah [00:14:42] Jim: there's the two different, I don't know, stories or paths they're going down. And how are these connected? [00:14:48] Matthew: And they make a model- How is the skull- ... a sculpture based upon what they find in terms of the bones, and it's this sort of short, wumpy, pre-humanoid thing, but still very humanoid with an enlarged cranium. [00:15:02] Jim: Yeah. Mm-hmm. [00:15:03] Matthew: Very creepy looking, but also not entirely unfamiliar to people who have watched a lot of science fiction. Kind of thing you might, you wouldn't [00:15:08] Jim: be surprised to see in a museum, yeah. [00:15:10] Matthew: Yeah, [00:15:10] Ian: yeah. And they don't stick purely to the physical sciences. They also delve into the social sciences because trying to learn about this place, they start looking at the local history. Oh, yeah. Yeah. And they start doing the anthropology of it, and they're like, "Well, this is at Hobbs End." Hobbs, as in the devil. As in, there's a lot of artwork depicting odd stuff in this area to begin with. [00:15:39] Matthew: And, and what prompts them to do that is, as they try to do more underground with this object, as they try to drill through it, it starts to react, and there are these paranormal-seeming events where objects start floating and people start having terrible, uh, visions and headaches. Yeah. And it's affecting both the physical environment and people's minds in ways that don't make scientific sense. And a local cop tells them, "Well, you know, yeah, the houses above are, were, were evacuated, but not because of the war. Just people, nobody, no, nobody wants to live there." Yeah. "In Hobbs End." Yeah, 50 [00:16:16] Jim: years ago, people left, yeah. [00:16:18] Ian: Oh, there, this is a fun example, though, of a specific kind of cheesy but engaging acting where you need to depict the room you're in shaking, stuff going wrong. Oh, yeah. And so you shake the camera- ... and you shake a couple of props, and you throw your actors into this- ... the scene, and you break stuff and such. There's like, there's a, there's a visual of that kind of, you know, throw yourself into the table in front of you kind of shaking that is engaging, but when you look at it out of context, it's hilarious. I always enjoy getting to see things like that. [00:16:54] Matthew: But I love the long sequence you were talking about, Ian, where they, they then delve into the history beyond- Yes the 20th century and the 19th century. [00:17:02] Ian: Yes. And it shows, it shows Quatermass is a very well-rounded scientist in that sense. He's not looking for... He, he looks at the larger picture to be able to understand stuff, and he's kind of bringing, bringing Dr. Rooney along with him on this as a bit of an apprentice at times to do that research. And there's a lot of, of mentor and mentee elements in that. [00:17:28] Matthew: Yes. Also bringing Barbara Judd, played by Barbara Shelley, who has been, uh, Rooney's assistant and sort of becomes Quatermass' assistant through part of this. Mm-hmm. and they're going back to-- They're finding that there are 14th century accounts in the archives- Yes ... at Westminster Abbey of people seeing these demonic, hideous dwarves, and it's always when something is disturbing the, the earth, either uprooting- That's right ... old trees or they- [00:17:56] Jim: Digging a well [00:17:56] Matthew: ... when they, digging a well, digging the first of the underground stations in the 1920s. Mm-hmm. That's when the houses were first abandoned. Anytime anything disturbs the earth or digs in this area, weird things happen. [00:18:13] Ian: Exactly. [00:18:14] Matthew: And you talk about how well-rounded Quatermass is. As they're drilling, these glyphs start appearing in, uh, in the chamber inside this, uh, object underground. [00:18:24] Ian: Oh, yeah. [00:18:24] Matthew: And he immediately recognizes, "Oh, it's cabalistic sy- uh, symbols used in magic from ancient times." Like, "Here you go." [00:18:32] Jim: Every rocket scientist knows that, of course. [00:18:34] Matthew: I love it. He is scientific, and yet he's very open-minded about what that means. [00:18:39] Ian: Of course I know that. How do you think we make heat shielding? That's... There, there's something about his attitude, which is just, you, you know, "Oh, yeah, it's those." [00:18:47] Matthew: Right. [00:18:50] Ian: It is also funny that he's, we've established him as this reliable expert, which means that when he's the one who brings in magic, it's just kind of understood. Yeah. Got it. Yeah. Quatermass already has proven himself, so you can roll with it. [00:19:07] Jim: He said it, you gotta believe it, yeah. [00:19:09] Ian: Exactly. It's from Quatermass. You gonna really fight Quatermass? Is it when those symbols are appearing that they finally open the d- the machine- [00:19:17] Matthew: Yeah ... or [00:19:17] Ian: device? [00:19:18] Matthew: They appear when they start drilling, and then they keep going back and forth because the drills aren't working. And then they come back and, oh, there's a hole in this inner bulkhead in this device, and no, that's not a hole that my drill made. [00:19:31] Jim: No. [00:19:32] Matthew: It's starting to melt. It's starting to dissolve and open this chamber on its own. What triggers it, I'm not entirely sure. [00:19:40] Jim: I think Quatermass mentioned it was absorbing power from the generator they used to power the drill. [00:19:45] Matthew: Oh, it was just a [00:19:46] Jim: matter- Any power source ... oh, it needed energy. It can suck power from some other source. That's why later on is when he brings in a bigger generator and it gets even more power. [00:19:54] Ian: Oh, yeah. [00:19:55] Matthew: That makes sense. It just didn't have energy- So- ... to do it before. [00:19:58] Jim: Yeah. [00:19:59] Ian: So yes, the mysterious device is in fact an alien ship, one with wireless charging. Uh. Uh, but that's, that's kind of where the, the five million years to Earth comes in, 'cause it's a, this is a spaceship. This is a- Yes ... an alien spaceship is well-established here, but we get the, the spaceship opening and the interaction, and that five million years is how long it's been, how ancient this is. [00:20:29] Jim: Yeah, they mentioned earlier- And it's- ... they, they dated it to about five million years ago, yeah. [00:20:33] Ian: Yeah. That's very interesting, 'cause it very much sets this, you know, so much older than anything we know. [00:20:41] Jim: Mm-hmm. [00:20:41] Ian: The number is ridiculous, but it has weight for some reason. [00:20:46] Matthew: And inside the spaceship, once this opens, we actually have aliens. [00:20:52] Ian: We do. [00:20:53] Matthew: It, I think this is one of the best dead alien designs I've ever seen in a- [00:20:57] Jim: It's great [00:20:58] Matthew: ... movie. [00:20:59] Ian: They are very good. I feel like I've seen them elsewhere, but that might be prop people making reference. Hmm. And yet in that sense, genericizing them as background aliens. There's something about their three-legged tripod design- [00:21:19] Jim: Yeah ... [00:21:19] Ian: that reminded me of things from, like, the Men in Black movies. [00:21:23] Matthew: Hmm. [00:21:24] Ian: But that's a- Oh, yeah ... going in the wrong direction. But there's something still about, like, that alien design aesthetic that is so quintessential, and these things are cricket-like. [00:21:37] Jim: Locust, somebody says. Yeah. [00:21:38] Ian: Yeah. They're also very much tripods, and that gives some War of the Worlds implications to it. [00:21:45] Jim: Oh, I hadn't thought of that Hmm. [00:21:49] Matthew: And they're designed not to be completely unfamiliar, because they have these kind of sharp faces and horn-like antenna. They are definitely, uh, evoking traditional images of demons. Right. Yes. Which was kind of the point. When other people o- over the d- the centuries had had these visions when the earth was disturbed, they would s- talk about seeing visions of demons and these hideous dwarves, which sound- Right like the humanoids they found. All of these things we're now finding, uh, our characters are now finding physical examples of these- [00:22:24] Jim: Right ... [00:22:24] Matthew: things that people have had visions of. [00:22:27] Jim: And Quatermass tells Roney that you've seen this in gargoyles. This is something you've seen before. Yeah. [00:22:32] Ian: Yeah. [00:22:33] Jim: Creepy, though. [00:22:34] Ian: Creepy. Yeah. Wonderfully creepy, and that also comes with the entire, like, lab scene, where Quatermass and team are taking samples and doing alcohol solutions and- ... chemical testing and such, and... [00:22:47] Matthew: And it is '60s sci-fi, so we have to have a little bit of gross stuff as these things start to decompose and leak, even as they're being brought out of the spaceship and into the lab. [00:22:55] Ian: Oh, yeah. There is syringes full of thinned pistachio pudding- ... squirting out of all of these little pieces. It's... [00:23:03] Jim: But I, I love the '60s lab protocol. Uh, one or two of them were wearing gloves. [00:23:08] Ian: Yes. [00:23:09] Jim: But the others just... They're in their street clothes. There's no masks. There's no PPE. There's no, no aprons even. Yeah. And you're slicing into this oozing bug thing with your bare hands. Not a good idea, if you ask me. [00:23:20] Ian: There's one where you see him, or you see one of the scientists getting, um, getting, like, I think material samples off of the surface. He's got these two segmented sections that are kind of bulbous in shape with a long end off of it, and he's got them in this pan of solution. And it's, it's bubbling as he's, like, dissolving a bit of it. Yes. And I just looked at that and said, "That man is shallow-frying two sticks of chicken." That is, that is not... Like, like, the, like, did I change channel? Is this Food Network for a moment? That just looks like- [00:23:58] Matthew: Welcome to Quatermass Kitchen. Exactly. [00:24:01] Ian: Exactly. It's the wrong procedure for just a moment. [00:24:04] Jim: We're gonna deglaze your, uh, alien pan here. It's... [00:24:09] Ian: Oh. [00:24:10] Jim: but they had to show, and it's this crowded lab, people like right behind each other- Yeah ... all sorts of things. There's not a fume hood in sight. It's- [00:24:17] Ian: Oh, no ... you [00:24:18] Jim: know, no center, yeah. [00:24:19] Ian: And we've also got like one of the military intelligence people off in the corner, like sitting in an armchair while this is all happening. I think smoking a cigar or something. [00:24:27] Jim: I didn't notice that. [00:24:28] Ian: I, I'm not sure if he was, but it feels like that. It's just very casual and yet very intense. [00:24:34] Matthew: And this is the same lab in which a day or two before, Roney and his team were hooking up a volunteer to a an electrode hat to try to read their- Oh, yeah ... brainwaves because this guy's head is shaped very similarly to the skulls that we have found. So if we ex- examine what lights up in his brain as he does different tasks, we'll know more about how these creatures functioned. [00:24:58] Jim: Is Roney a phrenologist too, among other things? I think so. And he's got the- [00:25:02] Matthew: I [00:25:02] Jim: think so ... the same shaped skull. [00:25:04] Matthew: I do love how amiable their research subject was because he's- Oh, yeah ... sitting in the chair being asked to do puzzles. He goes, "Oh, I'm told I'm quite primitive." [00:25:12] Ian: Yeah. [00:25:13] Matthew: I guess. [00:25:13] Jim: He's probably getting paid his, you know, £5 a day, whatever, and he's happy to get that. [00:25:17] Matthew: Nice. [00:25:18] Ian: Oh, yeah. This guy, he's have, he's having like a fine time. This feels like a segment in a different movie- ... just intersecting. [00:25:26] Matthew: Yes. [00:25:28] Ian: This other guy's camera crew is going to go off with him on a comedy. [00:25:31] Matthew: Uh- You know, I, I talked, I mentioned Ghostbusters earlier. It's, I think Ghostbusters- You're right ... is also referencing back to this with the, the electrodes- Oh, yeah they put on Rick Moranis and talk about Zuul. Oh, yeah. And he had the TV screen. Yeah. [00:25:44] Ian: Oh, this is- That's right ... very much that scene. You're right. [00:25:46] Jim: That's Vince Cortho. [00:25:49] Ian: So yeah, we've ramped up from, strange skulls all the way to, "And here is the space locusts that mutated them as helpers." [00:26:01] Matthew: And what pushes them farther in that direction is , the workman who runs the super drill that they were gonna use when the diamonds didn't work. [00:26:09] Jim: Oh, yeah. [00:26:09] Matthew: And he's, again, this, this happy-go-lucky, uh, workman. As they are clearing out the work site underground, he's going back in to get the rest of his tools, and then he sorts of gets possessed by whatever energy is now emanating from this thing. [00:26:26] Jim: Yes. [00:26:27] Ian: Yeah. [00:26:28] Jim: He starts seeing things and, uh- [00:26:31] Ian: Like he goes mad and is running around. There's energy radiating off of him- Yeah ... shaking the buildings. [00:26:39] Matthew: Every place he goes there's this, this poltergeist effect that is following him. That's right. Until he finds himself in a churchyard. [00:26:46] Ian: I, I do love like, is, I don't know if it's a hotdog cart or a newspaper stand or something that he gets near. Yes. We just get the guy running, "Whoa, hey, what's going on here?" Yeah. "What's going on? Hey here." [00:26:58] Jim: I know. [00:26:59] Ian: There's a specific like rapidity to his re- his like rapid repeating lines. [00:27:05] Matthew: Yes. [00:27:06] Ian: It reminds me of like pressing a bunch of characters in a Source game into a room so that they start- ... speaking their like little bump animation noises too fast. But then there's also a lot of similarities in this to like things like Half Life. Hmm. Some of these other sci-fi- Oh ... video games pull from a similar aesthetic. And I keep, we keep- Ah ... referencing other stuff, but then Quatermass is, it's not super early, but it's another one of those early enough to be an influence on a bunch of stuff, elements. And so we're- [00:27:42] Jim: Yes, yes [00:27:42] Ian: ... seeing pieces that get strung off into other stories later on. But I kept having Half Life flashes here. And we haven't even talked about the fact that we've got, we've got Quatermass here sporting his, his hat and his bow tie and his suit jacket with a younger paleontologist as a, as working with him all the entire time. It so feels like Indiana Jones and his father. [00:28:13] Matthew: Oh, yes. [00:28:14] Ian: Costuming- Oh ... and looks-wise. [00:28:17] Jim: I was almost saying a Holmes and Watson myself- Hmm ... but you're right. [00:28:19] Ian: There's both of those, yeah. [00:28:21] Matthew: There, there is kind of almost an, I think an inverse Indiana Jones vibe with Quatermass. With Indiana Jones- Oh ... we've got the action hero, and then we learn, oh, he's not just an action hero, he's got a PhD in archeology, and he's a scientist and an academic. What a cool combination. Yeah. In this we get, oh, Quatermass, he is the scientist who's the head of, the head of the rocket group. Oh, and he can also be kind of an action hero when he needs to be. That's... [00:28:45] Ian: Yeah. Good point. That's a very good point. But yeah, now we've gotten into psychic powers [00:28:50] Matthew: Yes. [00:28:50] Ian: Yes ... infecting the workers And it, uh, this, uh, I... It gets even weirder now [00:28:59] Matthew: And this great little conversation between, , Quatermass and , the vicar who took in, the workman who collapsed in the churchyard. And Quatermass is coming up with these scientific terms to describe what's happening, and the vicar thinks, "Oh, you're just using science to explain it away," and says, "No, I am not." Quatermass is saying, "No, this is ancient evil. I might be describing what it does, but I agree with you- [00:29:24] Jim: You agree on that [00:29:25] Matthew: ... on what it means." [00:29:27] Ian: Oh, yeah. Uh, which immediately I liked Quatermass for that. Yeah. Like- [00:29:32] Jim: Yeah ... [00:29:33] Ian: you know, a, in, in an opportunity to pit faith and science against each other, Quatermass just said, "No, I'm using one to strengthen the other." Right. "Get... Stop that." [00:29:44] Jim: Using different words to explain the same thing. Yeah. Yeah. [00:29:46] Ian: Exactly. [00:29:49] Matthew: And that's that weird open-mindedness. It's, as soon as he has evidence that does not fit his standard scientific models, he's ready to move and create a new one. [00:29:58] Jim: Yeah. [00:29:59] Ian: Mm-hmm. Well, scien- science is not a be all and end all. It is a, the current best understanding. [00:30:06] Matthew: Yeah. [00:30:06] Ian: And Quatermass is very much exemplifying that. You know, if there's something that his science can't explain, that means he needs better science. [00:30:14] Jim: Right. You don't just discount it. [00:30:17] Ian: Exactly. [00:30:17] Jim: As opposed to the colonel, who if it doesn't fit into his military mindset, it's meaningless. Don't, don't worry about that. [00:30:24] Ian: And, and the colonel, who is very much... Uh, Colonel Breen, uh, another reason I kept thinking Half-Life, the name Breen. Uh, I, that might be a reference. [00:30:34] Jim: I didn't catch that. [00:30:35] Ian: Oh, yeah. Uh, but Colonel Breen very much has never left the war, is what we're seeing. [00:30:42] Jim: Yeah. [00:30:43] Ian: Because every time something gets more intense here, all Breen is doing is doubling down on how much this must be Nazi propaganda. Right. And he very much veers into the problem of, like- Breen is so certain that the, the enemy is powerful that he actually starts giving them more power in that sense. He cannot understand the concept that this is beyond them and they were not competent enough to do this. It must be that the enemy is stronger and I have to be in the fight. And it's a very- Yeah ... I'm still in the war, I'm still in the trenches kind of mentality. [00:31:23] Matthew: And that's the other big conflict that Quatermass and Roney and Barbara have, is that they are against Breen and the Minister of Defense- Mm-hmm ... who wants to, who agrees with Breen and wants this all to be explainable. And when Roney and Quatermass, , without authorization - release a statement talking about the fact that this is an alien spacecraft come to Earth probably from Mars five million years ago, uh- Mm-hmm ... the ministry then releases a counter statement saying that was incorrect information. It was a, a Nazi propaganda weapon designed to create exactly this kind of panic. Don't fall for it. Yes. [00:32:00] Jim: And you s- you step right into the trap, yes. Exactly. [00:32:03] Ian: Yeah. [00:32:05] Matthew: But thanks to this workman and the conversation they have when they meet with him at the church, they start to get descriptions of the visions this guy had about- Mm-hmm ... a war among these locust-like alien creatures. [00:32:17] Ian: a war that drove some of them away and killed many And then why are they here on Earth? What's going on here? Hmm As it ramps up, this is the wild bit because we've already got them hooking up people to the, the, the brain scanning machine. So they're like, "Well, we'll use that." ... A fine instance of, uh, Chekhov's science I guess. [00:32:46] Jim: This is one, if I s- I do take issue with Quatermass. [00:32:49] Ian: Yeah. [00:32:50] Jim: He makes some pretty big leaps based on very little evidence. [00:32:53] Ian: He does. [00:32:54] Jim: They, they, they must be from Mars. There must have been a war. There must have been... You know, he, he's described the whole society of these locusts from a couple of snippet of data points. [00:33:03] Matthew: Right. [00:33:04] Jim: And just extrapolates this incredible, I don't know, societal, uh, breakdown, and that must be why they came to Earth and must be why they did this. [00:33:13] Matthew: Yeah. He's a little, little too good at world-building, just from a- Yes. ... a few mentions by this workman of seeing these things jumping around and killing each other, and it's like, "Okay, now we've got an entire society- Well- ... to base on that." [00:33:25] Jim: They're cleansing the hives or whatever else he, he sees. [00:33:27] Ian: Yeah, because they're able to use the machine to, like, pull some information, but I think it's Barbara who also gets- Yes. Yeah ... psychically infected. [00:33:39] Matthew: And we're seeing a combination now of Roney's team and Quatermass's team, because Roney had the, the electrode hat that allowed them to read brainwaves from people. Yes. And for some reason, the British Rocket Group had this device that allowed them to convert electronic signals into visuals. You put these together, you can see pictures of what people are thinking or imagining or experiencing. [00:34:02] Jim: Yes, you, you can read their minds. [00:34:04] Ian: Exactly. [00:34:05] Matthew: And they start to get images, and they bring all of this to , the pit, and they try to read Quatermass's mind, and it doesn't really work. He doesn't get visual images. But then, as you were saying, Ian, Barbara says, "Oh, let me try." [00:34:19] Ian: Mm-hmm, "I'm getting something." And this is the weird moment where it's that Breen was kind of right. But that's because the crickets were Nazis to themselves. These are, these are alien Nazis. [00:34:34] Jim: Space nazis. [00:34:35] Ian: Space Nazis. Th- 'cause that's very much a parallel. The images we wind up receiving are very much coded with a... I mean, they are also badly encoded. They are rough, glitchy transmissions, but they are visually very propaganda film styled of a specific type. They are distinct enough in terms of cinematic language that they are depicting a sort of thing, which all backs up what Quatermass was immediately understanding. [00:35:10] Matthew: Oh. [00:35:10] Ian: But it's very much of that style. [00:35:13] Jim: I have to talk about this. I th- I, like I said, I was about seven years old when I first saw this film, and when Quatermass is showing the generals, whoever else, the, the video, those scenes were nightmare fuel to me. [00:35:25] Ian: Yeah. [00:35:26] Jim: For some reason, that, that grainy, black and white distorted stuff, when I first saw that, I was just... It was hideous, and I literally had nightmares about that for days- Oh, goodness ... after seeing this thing. Got all these weird locust, I think, you know, you can just barely half-see them through the static and the grain. [00:35:44] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:35:45] Jim: Very well done. If, if he wanted to horrify the viewers, they did a good job, at least for young me. [00:35:50] Ian: Oh. [00:35:50] Matthew: And there's something about that film quality, especially at the time, the poorer the film quality, the more real it must be because if somebody were- Yes ... creating this from scratch to fool us, they would've done it better. Mm-hmm. So that- Right ... makes it more impactful. [00:36:04] Ian: Mm-hmm. Yeah. There's, there's nothing quite as effective of, of turning a bunch of small plastic models- into something that feels impactful- Yes ... as a little bit of dust and dirt. [00:36:18] Matthew: Yeah. [00:36:19] Jim: Yeah, makes it real. [00:36:21] Ian: Makes it real. But that's the wild thing because it goes into, like, "Oh, goodness, these creatures, uh, came here after doing that to their land and were trying to set up A bunch of support staff as slave race on their end out of the humans [00:36:42] Matthew: And they also, again, a, a leap that Quaermass makes that, well, if their civilization was collapsing and their planet was doomed, maybe due to some kind of climatic change, uh, they... maybe they wanted to have some legacy by a- adding them something of themselves to whatever was evolving on this neighboring planet, and that's why they abducted proto-humans and modified them and brought them back to Earth. Again, a lot of, a lot of speculation on very little data, but it makes a plausible story in context. [00:37:13] Ian: Yes. [00:37:14] Jim: I like the way when, when Quaermass is giving this explanation about how they, they changed the humans and put their tendencies as he's looking at Breen. Yes. That this, that this, this is where our war, our tendency to war comes from, that these people did that to us or- Mm-hmm ... put into our brains. [00:37:29] Matthew: Yes. [00:37:30] Jim: And now y- you're like one of them. [00:37:34] Matthew: You like your uniforms and your order and your regimentation and your war. [00:37:37] Jim: Yep. This is where it comes from. [00:37:40] Ian: And we've put that parallel of these creatures being very much like the enemy in World War II, the enemy that Breen's never stopped fighting, and here it is- Yes calling Breen just like that. It's like- [00:37:54] Jim: He's one of them [00:37:54] Ian: ... congrats. You've become exactly what you fought against. Yeah. You've, you have b- you've spent so long there, you're no longer what you wanted to be. [00:38:03] Matthew: Mm-hmm. [00:38:04] Jim: Mm. [00:38:04] Matthew: But even though now he's got these videos to show the Minister of Defense and Colonel Breen and the other, uh, government people, and gives his explanation that we're seeing a, a memory that's still encoded in this, uh, this object that sensitive people like Barbara can pick up on and, uh, gives his explanation that it's a war to cleanse the Martian hives of, of mutation or, uh, imperfect individuals. Again, I don't know where Quatermass is getting this. None of this persuades Breen and the Minister of Defense, and they say- Oh, no ... "No, this is nonsense. We're, we're gonna put a stop to this. We are gonna have-" Yeah ... "a big press event. We're gonna invite everybody in, show them this device, which is clearly a Nazi propaganda weapon, and, uh, we'll bring in lots of lights, , and TV cameras, and all this, these things." [00:38:55] Jim: It's perfectly harmless. [00:38:55] Ian: Yeah. Yeah, let's bring a bunch of people near this psychically charged thing- ... that draws energy, and set up lights and cameras nearby that all have power. [00:39:05] Jim: Yes. [00:39:05] Ian: This'll go fine. [00:39:07] Jim: And that's why you see the guys outside with a truck with a generator three times the size of the one the driller used. Right. And here we go. [00:39:14] Ian: Oh, yeah. It's like, "Oh, no." and, and this is where I think that the, the film has crested the top of its slow build hill. [00:39:23] Matthew: Yeah. [00:39:23] Jim: Yeah. [00:39:23] Ian: Because the, the last section of this movie is a mile a minute. [00:39:27] Matthew: Mm. [00:39:28] Jim: Oh, yeah. [00:39:28] Ian: It go, it goes zero to 60 in around a loop-the-loop because this is when one of the power cables for the lights drops on the, on the ship or something. [00:39:38] Jim: Yes. Yeah. One of the electricians gets electrocuted. [00:39:41] Ian: Yeah. And it, it plugs the ship in directly. And now it's charging extra fast and broadcasting wider than ever. [00:39:51] Jim: Yeah. [00:39:52] Matthew: Suddenly we're getting the tremendous poltergeist effects, and this whole, under-construction, underground station starts to collapse, and there's a big panic to get out. But it's spreading to the whole neighborhood. [00:40:02] Jim: And you see the tools on strings- [00:40:04] Matthew: Yes [00:40:04] Jim: ... dangling all around [00:40:05] Matthew: and... Yep. [00:40:08] Ian: Oh, yeah. That is a fun bit with the flying objects going all over the place. It's, it's silly and it's cheap, but boy howdy is it helluva. But it works. It does. It works, yeah. This is also kind of silly though, because now we've got a lot of people getting psychically infected. [00:40:29] Jim: Yes. [00:40:30] Matthew: And part of what makes all those effects and things work is how well this is played by its cast, and how they take everything straight, everything earnest. Yeah. And they are in the moment and believe things so, so clearly that I'm along for the ride. I'm gonna follow Quartermaster and Rony and Barbara. [00:40:46] Ian: Mm-hmm. Yeah, they sell every single thing, and that's what makes- Yeah ... even, even the non-main cast, our secondary characters, the electricians, the technicians, the- [00:40:58] Jim: The soldiers ... the ra- They're all... Yeah. [00:40:59] Ian: Yeah. Ev- the soldiers, everyone is just putting in a good performance, I'll say. I still find the giant psychic cricket funny. Yes. [00:41:10] Matthew: Yeah, as, as this psychic force is spreading out through the neighborhood and throughout Greater London, People are going crazy, and people br- are being possessed. And we see scenes of people singling out others to be destroyed. [00:41:25] Jim: Yes. [00:41:25] Matthew: Kind of what- Mm-hmm Quatermass was speculating happened on Mars. And- [00:41:30] Jim: We're, we're us, you're them, you must be destroyed ... [00:41:31] Matthew: and that too, it's very much, uh, alluding to, the war and to the Nazis, that we're gonna find the- [00:41:39] Jim: Mm-hmm ... [00:41:40] Matthew: those who are in- imperfect in our eyes and destroy them. And I think some of those scenes may have been edited out of the TV version that I saw first, 'cause some of them are- [00:41:49] Jim: That could be [00:41:50] Matthew: are long and brutal in terms of these- Yeah ... these groups of, of blank-faced automaton- Oh, yeah ... people. [00:41:57] Jim: These- Standing silently- Yeah ... staring at this person. [00:41:59] Matthew: And using their psychic powers to stone people to death. [00:42:03] Ian: It's horribly creepy [00:42:05] Matthew: And they give us enough of those specific examples that we get the sense of this is what is happening on every block in London now. [00:42:12] Ian: Right. Yes. [00:42:14] Matthew: But yeah, right, somehow it all centers on the giant... This illuminated giant projection image of one of the space crickets that... And I'm not sure why it would necessarily follow that with this energy we would get a visual and physical locus of all of it, but we do, and it's convenient. [00:42:34] Ian: A [00:42:35] Jim: visual and- Well, you see the ground opening up above where the spaceship was. [00:42:38] Matthew: Yeah. [00:42:38] Jim: Yeah. And the light shines out. [00:42:40] Ian: And we get a visual and physical locust. Oh, yeah. [00:42:47] Jim: But they were talking about y- matter and energy conversions of, they, some kind of scientific... He's talking about that. Yeah. [00:42:52] Matthew: There's some good technical babble there. E- [00:42:54] Ian: I [00:42:54] Matthew: like it ... [00:42:54] Ian: E equals MC bug. But this is also where we get, Rooney just, uh, becoming absolutely an action star in- [00:43:06] Jim: Yes [00:43:07] Ian: in no mo- in no moment's time because he clicks a bunch of things together of, like, "Well, the devil could be dest- uh, stopped with iron and water. We need to hit this with a giant iron device and discharge it into the earth." [00:43:22] Matthew: And, and the way he gets to that conclusion- Oh ... partly due to, you know, energy conduction, partly thinking, "Oh, iron is the enemy of the devil according to magic and folklore." Right. [00:43:33] Jim: Old iron. [00:43:33] Ian: Yeah. Well, it's very much we've seen him kind of learn the Quatermass method- Yes ... over the course of this film. Ah. And we watch him implement that, that hybrid of everything idea all at once. And while Quatermass has been able to do so and make it all the way through his career to this, you know, more wizened age, our young hero R- Roney runs in boldly with that same energy and faces the creature head-on on top of a giant crane. [00:44:14] Matthew: And one of the reasons Roney's able to do all of this is that he is somehow immune to these psychic effects. Apparently people have different- [00:44:21] Jim: That's right. He wasn't getting anything [00:44:22] Matthew: ... degrees of susceptibility. Barbara's very susceptible, so she is totally taken- Yeah ... over. Eventually she's the one person who knows where they're gonna go, and she's trying to stop them because she's possessed. Quatermass- Mm ... is susceptible, but Roney manages to, to snap him out of it with a- Mm ... a stern talking to and a big glass of whiskey. That'll- I don't- ... kind of take care of it. It's... Couldn't hurt. [00:44:44] Jim: Gotta mention the amount of drinking that goes on in this film. Yeah. It- Anytime something happens, somebody happens to have a bottle. Starts passing it around. [00:44:51] Ian: Oh, absolutely. [00:44:52] Jim: I, I guess it's, it's, it's England in the '60s. I guess it's a thing. Yeah. But, uh- [00:44:56] Matthew: But yeah, and we, uh, we talked about some of the other cast. James Donald as, uh, as Dr. Roney, and Andrew Keir as Quatermass. Different actors have played Quatermass over the years, but I think he does a great job of that balance of, of action- Yes and, and academic. [00:45:11] Ian: I swear I've seen Andrew Keir in something else before, and I'm trying to figure out what. [00:45:18] Matthew: Yes. I, I'm sure he's been in other stuff that we have, uh, have talked about. [00:45:24] Ian: Ah, yeah. He's one of those, like, you see him and you immediately go to- Right ... his IMDb because- Yeah ... it's gotta be something. [00:45:34] Jim: And who is it who played Roney? He's somebody that's a face I recognize. [00:45:37] Matthew: Yes. [00:45:38] Ian: Yeah. James Donald, uh, he's been in, like... Uh, he was in, like, Alfred Hitchcock Presents things. [00:45:47] Jim: Oh. [00:45:48] Ian: Uh, he was in The Big Sleep. [00:45:51] Jim: Oh, okay. [00:45:53] Matthew: Yeah, I, I don't know if either of them have been in other things we've talked about on the podcast before. [00:45:58] Ian: Oh. [00:45:59] Matthew: But certainly a lot of movies that we've seen. [00:46:01] Ian: Oh, James Donald had been in Bridge on the River Kwai. [00:46:04] Matthew: Yeah. [00:46:05] Jim: Oh, okay. [00:46:06] Ian: I take it that, uh, Andrew Kier did a lot of, like, one-episode British TV stuff later on. [00:46:12] Matthew: Ah. Okay. [00:46:13] Ian: So I might have seen him pop up in, like, a role as a scientist somewhere else. [00:46:19] Matthew: Yep. [00:46:27] Ian: But, oh yeah [00:46:28] Matthew: But yeah, Roney has this idea. We can use iron, something to ground this energy- Yes ... and dissipate it, and that should take care of everything. [00:46:37] Jim: Sure. Yeah. [00:46:38] Matthew: And there's a convenient construction crane, and apparently there's a lot of building going on in this part of London [00:46:44] Jim: But I gotta ask, with Roney who decides he's gonna climb the crane- Mm-hmm right? So Quatermass goes to destr- get around behind Barbara to stop her from doing the psychic thing at them, and Roney starts climbing the crane. He goes right past the operator's cab- ... and climbs all the way out onto the arm of the crane. What was he expecting to do out there? I [00:47:05] Matthew: don't know. Of all of his technical knowledge, I guess operating a crane he doesn't recognize. He, he doesn't know what lever to pull. Maybe these levers do something. [00:47:12] Jim: Yeah. But, well, well forget about that. I'll just climb out onto the boom. [00:47:16] Matthew: And then what? [00:47:17] Jim: Is he gonna like try to swing it or something? [00:47:21] Matthew: Yeah, all he needed to do was slew this crane so that it intersected the giant- Yeah ... uh, thing. But instead he's on the very edge of the crane, the very tip of the, of horizontal, when the ground b- beneath it starts to crumble. [00:47:33] Jim: Yes. [00:47:34] Matthew: And fortunately, it swings in the right direction. [00:47:38] Jim: It happens to, to land that way, yes. [00:47:40] Ian: Yeah. But that also does... It, it means that Roney gets the very, very fun staring this, this creature dead in the eyes as they, they collide with each other- Ah, yes ... moment as a grand hero. But it absolutely is also like, "You foolhardy young man." "There's an... Those things are usually insulated for good reason." Yeah. "Why were you in it?" [00:48:01] Matthew: The operator seat's probably the best place to be. [00:48:03] Ian: Exactly. Yeah. [00:48:04] Matthew: But it is, it is a great dramatic- [00:48:06] Jim: It's a great visual [00:48:07] Matthew: ... death scene. Yeah. [00:48:08] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:48:10] Matthew: Very heroic. [00:48:11] Jim: And, and even they, they cut to Quatermass yelling, "Roney." And he, he watches and, you know, the noble sacrifice. [00:48:20] Ian: And, and that le- that leaves us on the wildest, and I'm gonna just say best ending to an action film like that I've ever seen. Which is just Quatermass and Barbara just slumped, tired, and in shock. [00:48:39] Jim: Yes. [00:48:40] Ian: I- in an alley on either side as the credits scroll up the middle. [00:48:45] Matthew: We just get this long repeating sequence of the two of them absolutely spent and despondent with, uh- [00:48:50] Jim: With the flames in the background and the smoke drifting by and- [00:48:53] Matthew: The, uh- Yeah the, the undertaker's shop across the street behind them. That's right. [00:48:58] Jim: The undertaker's shop. [00:49:00] Ian: Which is so effective. I'm just like... That is... I'm just sitting there slack-jawed, because I've never seen a movie like leave you in the moment so perfectly. [00:49:16] Jim: It was about a 20-second loop. Did you notice? [00:49:18] Matthew: Yes. [00:49:19] Jim: Mm-hmm. Yeah, a scene in the, uh, sitting there in the alley. Yes, it was. Just the same thing going over and [00:49:23] Matthew: over again. That was disappointing. I, I was hoping that they would've- Yeah ... had the two actors just hold in character with this attitude- [00:49:29] Jim: For a couple of minutes [00:49:29] Matthew: for several minutes, but no. Maybe they- No ... after they shot that they realized, "Oh, let's keep this for the credits, but we have to move" We [00:49:36] Jim: need more credits [00:49:38] Matthew: But this is not a movie that leaves you with, "Oh, yes, great triumph. Let's, can't wait for the next Quatermass- movie. Show me a teaser." And then it's like- No, no "Oh, I think we all need therapy now." [00:49:51] Ian: We got a lot of work to do. Yeah. Oh. [00:49:55] Matthew: But I think this might be leading us towards our final questions and the, the aftermath- It might be ... of this movie. [00:50:00] Jim: Okay. [00:50:02] Matthew: So, uh, stay tuned listeners for those final questions as we talk about, uh, our recommendations around this movie and what else might be next for, for Professor Quatermass. But in the meantime, if you are enjoying the Intermillennium Media Project, please go to immproject.com. That's where you will find all of our back episodes, over 200 episodes now, plus some bonuses. It's also where you'll find places to support the podcast, including our Patreon, where starting at $3 a month you can get additional bonus audio content, and our shop where if you like T-shirts and coffee mugs and other fun things, uh, both for the podcast and, uh, jokes about some of the other things we have talked about like "Space 1999" and "Die Hard." Oh, yeah. Uh, you can find us there. You can also find ways to contact us. We would love to hear from you. What's your favorite '60s British sci-fi movie? And if it's one that, that Jim or I have seen, maybe we'll subject Ian to it. and you can reach us on Blue Sky, Mastodon, our Discord, or our email, or our actual physical United States Postal Service PO box, and you can find all that information on the contact page. So again, that's immproject.com. And, uh, Jim, as our guest, any place, uh, people should look for you online? [00:51:17] Jim: As I said before, I've got almost no online presence being the boomer that I am. But if, uh, people send messages to Ian or Matthew on the Discord, I'm sure they'll get them to me. [00:51:25] Matthew: Absolutely. [00:51:26] Ian: Absolutely. [00:51:28] Matthew: And Ian, where can people find you? [00:51:31] Ian: I can be found most places as ItemCrafting, be that ItemCrafting.com, ItemCrafting on Blue Sky, or ItemCraftingLive on Twitch. I stream most every Thursday, painting minis, playing games, and having a fun time chatting with all of you. So- [00:51:48] Matthew: It's a fun combination of physical crafting and video games. [00:51:52] Ian: Why, thank you. And Dad, where can they find you? [00:51:56] Matthew: Uh, best thing to do is to go to bymatthewporter.com. That's where you'll find links to anything else I'm doing, including my YouTube channel where I review movies and movie theater experiences. And, uh, you'll also find there information about my book, Questions For The Dead, a Martin Rhodak psychic mystery, which is now available at any bookseller, including your local bookstore. Uh, you can have them order it in paperback. It's also available as an e-book. And if you go to my website- [00:52:21] Jim: Excellent story. [00:52:22] Matthew: Oh, thank you, Jim. [00:52:23] Jim: I'm waiting for the sequel. [00:52:25] Matthew: Working- Oh, yeah ... working on that as we speak. And, uh- [00:52:28] Ian: Yay [00:52:28] Matthew: ... if you follow me at,, bymatthewporter.com or sign up for my newsletter, you'll get up-to-date information about anything else I'm doing, which includes some upcoming appearances at conventions and book festivals. I look forward to, seeing some folks in person there. [00:52:43] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:52:45] Matthew: So- [00:52:47] Ian: So [00:52:47] Matthew: ... five, five million years to Earth, AKA Quatermass and the Pit. Screen or no screen? Jim, what's your verdict? [00:53:00] Jim: I hate to say it, but I have to call this a no-screen for modern audiences. [00:53:04] Matthew: Really? [00:53:05] Jim: It's got, it's got such history for me that I, you know, I love it, but somebody just coming across it new is gonna look at it and wonder, you know, "Why did they make this movie?" [00:53:15] Ian: Yeah. [00:53:16] Jim: So if, if... I guess if you like that kind of '60s science fiction, it's a good film. But I'd say most modern audiences wouldn't really be into it. [00:53:26] Matthew: How about you, Ian? [00:53:29] Ian: You see, I'm really split as well 'cause I completely understand general audiences might not like this as much. But I really feel that this has a lot of great moments in terms of, cinema and style, and it's very influential in a unexpected- [00:53:46] Jim: That's true [00:53:46] Ian: way. . There's a lot of things where if you're a fan of it, I'd say go back and see this because you'll see reflections of what you enjoy already. Something that came to mind that we didn't even mention yet is Doctor Who. This definitely- Yeah ... has some Doctor Who energy in it. [00:54:01] Jim: You're right. Early Doctor Who. Yeah. It has... It does seem like that. [00:54:05] Ian: Mm-hmm. But I'm... Yeah, I'm looking at this and saying, if you're already in l- that kind of genre, if you're already a fan, it's a have to watch. But it's not a good entry point to that kind of media. So it's, eh, it's a really conditional screen then. [00:54:22] Jim: Mm-hmm. [00:54:23] Ian: But it is a screen from me, just by a bit. [00:54:25] Jim: Okay. [00:54:26] Matthew: Oh, f- for me it is definitely a screen. I th- I think it holds up well. You were talking about its kind of slow build structure, Ian, and I think the reason that works for me is that every given step has its own conflict, has its own cliffhanger, has its own reason why, "Oh, this is interesting. Oh, there's something else that's even more interesting?" So... And I, and I'm also a sucker for that, that mix of science and magic and history that this- Mm-hmm. Okay ... seamlessly blends. Uh, for me, this is a screen. Anybody who's interested in any of those elements, I'd recommend it. And when it comes to that structure, by the way, I'm not sure we mentioned, this is actually an adaptation of a Quatermass TV series. Series, yes. Wow. On the BBC. And I think that at that episodic step-by-step structure until you get to that top- Oh ... of the rollercoaster is partly because it was well-crafted episodic television. And I think they did a pretty good job of translating that into a feature film running time. So I say screen. [00:55:26] Ian: Mm-hmm. [00:55:28] Matthew: that brings us to our other question, which is, is kind of interesting and complicated, which is, uh, revive, reboot, or rest in peace? [00:55:37] Ian: Well, you already brought it up, but Quatermass is not a singular instance. [00:55:42] Jim: Right. [00:55:42] Ian: Quatermass is a franchise. And in fact, it's a franchise with a very interesting evolution. Every single one of their stories, I believe, has in some way been a TV show, then remade or recut into- Hmm ... a movie. So the Quatermass experiment in the '50s, early '50s, like '53, and Quatermass 2 in '55 are... I mean, the original '53 version is a loss. Only two of six episodes still survive. [00:56:18] Matthew: Oh, wow. [00:56:18] Ian: But, the '53 one got remade into the Quatermass experiment with an X in, in '55. [00:56:26] Jim: Xperiment. [00:56:26] Ian: Xperiment, in '55, which was released as The Creeping Unknown in the USA. [00:56:34] Jim: Oh. [00:56:34] Ian: Quatermass 2 TV show in '55, two years later gets remade into Quatermass 2, which they go from Roman numerals for the TV show to the numeral 2- ... for the film, which is like, uh, Google. That becomes Enemy from Space in the United States. And then Quatermass and the Pit, similar thing, gets redone as Five Million Years to Earth. And the final Quatermass '79 TV show gets recut into the Quatermass Conclusion. [00:57:13] Jim: Hmm. [00:57:15] Ian: there's also been a 2005 remake of the original first Quatermass, Creeping Unknown. [00:57:21] Jim: Okay. [00:57:22] Ian: Quatermass Xperiment. And there's been radio plays, the Quatermass Memoirs and such. So it's a, it's not a book-inspired series from what I can tell But it is a, a self rapidly remaking and reinterpreting BBC funded sci-fi serials project [00:57:52] Jim: It's got decades of life in it. Hmm. [00:57:54] Ian: Yeah. I mean, yeah, we've got, you know, '53 to '79 had at least something... A l- a lot of the '50s, '79, and then 2005. There's been some consistent Quatermass stuff for a long time. [00:58:08] Matthew: So he's never really gone away in Britain. [00:58:10] Jim: No. [00:58:11] Ian: No But it's early enough that it's definitely a, the person who grew up watching this then went on to make a thing you might like kind of churn in the background. Hmm. Hmm. [00:58:26] Matthew: In terms of what comes next, I don't think we necessarily need something that is explicitly, devotedly part of the continuity of Quatermass and the Pit. It's just part of the Quatermass universe. I really do think it would be fun to see some modern TV or filmmaking applied to this character and this style. So I would totally get behind, uh, either a, a prestige TV series or a feature film giving us another good story with an updated, um, uh- Right ... 20- 2020s version of Professor Quatermass, because there's always room for that mix of action and science and magic and adventure that this can bring, and it's, it's a vibe that I enjoy so much. [00:59:12] Jim: And- Yeah ... as a character, he'd do well in almost any decade, you know, from back to the '50s to now. He's the kind of guy you could really build a very good story around. [00:59:20] Ian: Oh, yeah. And I think, I think we're in a good position right now pop culture and media-wise. a couple of the, the story styles That this inspired are in a lull right now we don't have new Doctor Who going on. We don't have- [00:59:37] Jim: Mm-hmm [00:59:37] Ian: ... some of those other shows, and yet Fantastic Four is doing well. So the idea of the adventuring scientist- [00:59:45] Jim: Mm [00:59:46] Ian: ... still has some legs and might have a good opportunity right now. I think we really could use, like, the further adventures of Quatermass. It, it's got a good chance for another revival. We haven't- Yeah ... seen one in... I think this might be the longest gap. 2005. 20 years. Yeah, 20 years. You know, let's, let's get some Quatermass going. [01:00:05] Matthew: It's time. [01:00:06] Ian: It's time for some Quatermass. So I'm all for the revive, and I like the idea of don't remake any of these other ones, but treat Quatermass like a comic book character. [01:00:19] Jim: Right. [01:00:19] Ian: Slide him- [01:00:20] Jim: Yes, give him a new story ... [01:00:21] Ian: a new story, and let him have the previous stories be in his history- [01:00:29] Matthew: Mm-hmm ... [01:00:29] Ian: but slide the timescale and make it a little vague. So he- Yeah ... can show up on a new project and they're like, "Oh, you're that scientist that helps out with the Hobbs Barrow event, didn't you?" [01:00:41] Matthew: Right. " [01:00:41] Ian: Oh, we don't talk about that." And then move on. [01:00:45] Matthew: Or Quatermass thinking, "I wish I could talk to Roney about this, but- Exactly ... he sacrificed himself." Well, kind of those, you know, as seen in Spider-Man number 418 at the bottom of the page. [01:00:59] Ian: Exactly. [01:01:00] Jim: a space locust killed my best friend. [01:01:07] Matthew: It makes me think a little bit about another character I keep coming back to is Doc Savage. And I think I would love- Yes ... to see a modern take on Doc Savage. But that's a much, much tougher uphill climb because there's so much about that character that is dated. [01:01:21] Jim: Yes. [01:01:21] Matthew: Not so much with Quatermass. It'd be much easier to bring him to the modern day [01:01:25] Ian: Yeah. [01:01:26] Jim: Yeah, I, I agree. [01:01:27] Matthew: And these days, you know, there's plenty of global competition for what the British Experimental Rocket Group might be doing. [01:01:34] Ian: Oh, goodness, yeah. [01:01:35] Jim: Oh, boy. Dr. Quatermass verus the Rogue Billionaire [01:01:39] Matthew: Rocket Yeah, plenty of Bond villains to choose from So it seems interesting, we're split on whether or not this movie gets a screen, but it seems like we would all welcome some more Quatermass. [01:01:51] Jim: I would like to see a revival. [01:01:53] Matthew: Cool. [01:01:53] Ian: Yeah. It's not always that we have that. Usually if we like it, we're fine with more, or we like it and we're happy to have it sit there. But the idea of not being sure and yet give us more- Yeah ... that's, that's not a common- Yeah ... result on our show. [01:02:08] Jim: I guess I'd say it's... I, I like this. I'm not sure if everybody else would, but I think anybody could like a, a modern retreatment of it. [01:02:13] Matthew: Yeah. [01:02:14] Ian: Mm-hmm. [01:02:15] Matthew: And it shows how the character is more than just this movie. Yes. If we're eager for more of the character, whether or not this movie is the best example of it. Mm-hmm. That's interesting. [01:02:24] Ian: Yes. [01:02:26] Matthew: Well, this was fun. I'm so glad you could join us- Yes ... for, uh, this- Yeah ... this talk about this movie. [01:02:29] Jim: Thanks for having me again. Had a lot of fun. [01:02:31] Ian: It's always great to have you on, and it's always fun to hear about these films that you guys got to watch, when you were younger on TV and such, because you get the wildest variety. I mean- Oh, yeah ... this is, this is so British. This is- Yeah ... so British, and the fact that it was on your, your, your local New York TV station is brilliant. [01:02:53] Jim: Yeah. I had a steady diet of James Mason movies growing up, and we- Yes. [01:02:57] Ian: Oh, goodness. So I always appreciate when you guys share these with me. Thank you. [01:03:03] Matthew: Well, that is great, and Maybe we'll approach some of those James Mason movies, Jim, and have you back on some time. Yeah. That would be great. [01:03:08] Jim: That could be fun. [01:03:09] Ian: Oh, yeah. [01:03:10] Matthew: But th- this was great, and listeners, thank you very much for joining us. We hope you, enjoyed this. And, uh, we'll be back with some more creepy British movie making- Yes in about two weeks as we continue our discussions of media from the 20th century. [01:03:28] Ian: In the meantime, go find something new to watch. [01:03:32] Jim: Or bring up some repressed ancient, memories if you haven't. Bah.