Delta Dispatches 2.6
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Simone Maloz: Hello, you're listening to Delta Dispatches. We are discussing Louisiana's coast, it's people, wildlife and jobs. And why restoring it matters. I'm your host, Simone Maloz. I'm the campaign director for Restore the Mississippi River Delta. You can find all of our podcast episodes@deltadispatches.org and make sure that you're subscribed to the show on Apple, Google, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcast. welcome to show 200. So today we're gonna have on Delta dispatches, an old friend of ours, Charles Sutcliffe, who is formerly of the Governor's office, but now is working on our team about the importance of investing in Louisiana. Maybe we'll talk about what resilience really means and then we're going to introduce a new fellow on our team and [00:01:00] talk about the important work that he's gonna do with us for the next. Year or so. So without further delay, welcome back to the show Charles. How are you?

Charles: Thanks for having me on.

Simone Maloz: So just a reminder, Charles is the resilience climate and coastal policy specialist for the National Wildlife Federation. He joined our coalition after spending a decade in the governor's office where he worked on policy to support the Coastal Protection and Restoration authority in the coastal program.

He worked through. At least three master plans and was the lead staff on the Governor's Advisory Commission in 2020, Charles was on the governor's small team running the climate initiatives task force and helped develop the 2022 climate. Action plan. In 2020, he became the state's first chief resilience officer, working to broaden the state's approach to managing the implications of the coastal crisis, and then was appointed to [00:02:00] that role statewide and across multiple different departments kind of rounding up the officers in each of those different agencies. Uh, Charles is from Baton Rouge. He went to L-S-U-N-Y-U, all the things. All the things. Charles. So, um, Charles, welcome to the show again. But you know, we wanna start off with a fun question.

It's, it's a little cooler as we record this show in Louisiana and by a little cooler, I mean less humidity. So I think this is an easy, fun question for you 'cause I think I know the answer because, are you a, a pumpkin spice guy or not?

Charles: No, not so much. Uh, sorry to break it to the fans out there. Just 

coffee. I'm probably still gonna drink iced coffees even when it drips below, below 50 too. So.

Simone Maloz: I think I knew the answer to that one had to ash just 'cause the temperatures dipped a little bit. Um,

Fun fact for our listeners, we did a little test run to see if this [00:03:00] old gal still had it in her to host a podcast and Charles was the willing test subject. But this time, Charles, again, we're gonna do it for real. I read your bio just now, but why don't you introduce your self to our listeners and tell folks what you're doing right now for the coalition.

Charles: Yeah. Well, thanks for having me on. Yeah, I have been you know around this issue for a little bit, as you mentioned, and, and glowing, uh. Generous detail. I feel like I've been a partner to the coalition for, for a long time. But now officially a member, uh, joined National Wildlife Federation in January of 2024. And where I've been, you know, yes, still working very much on coastal Louisiana and issues that we're facing, but also getting a chance to kind of. Get my feet wet and some issues up and down the Mississippi River and other states. Connecting with some of my old CRO buddies in, in Virginia and other places a little bit. And just again, trying to connect, you know, the things that we've learned, easy way and the hard way in [00:04:00] Louisiana and trying to bring that to other places through NWF.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, I wanna get into that. That's exactly what I wanted to talk to you about today at, at least at the, the beginning. So, you know, Louisiana has lessons that we can bring to other states, right? In so many ways we've. Experience some things first that includes the bad side of that, but also the, the better side of the planning this idea of a comprehensive plan, you know, a science-based roadmap moving forward.

So tell us, tell, I want you to elaborate on that a little bit more about your time with the state and even today about collaborating with partners outside of Louisiana.

Charles: Yeah, sure. I mean, so when I started with the state and back in 2011, you know, we were, on the the oil spill still, we were still in some senses in the process of standing up the CPRA implementation agency. , That was when we were just about to, you know, really, take the 2012 master plan to the public and [00:05:00] to the legislature.

And that was the first time that we had this, uh, computational modeling to try to figure out project effectiveness and really try to. Prioritize projects based on a, a limited budget and, a very scientifically grounded understanding of what, what was gonna happen in the future.

And so that was a big innovation and that was, you know. What, 15 years ago at this point? So we have been not just, improving these plans as we've gone and kind of like blazing that trail, but we've also been very deep in the implementation phase of, of those plans that a lot of other states haven't gotten to that piece yet.

So they're still trying to build the dataset, they're trying to build the models, they're trying to build the, the outreach and the stakeholder networks. We're kind of, you know, in, in middle age at least in terms of some of those things go. So that, that was a large part of what we did. We wanted the, our public to know how we were kind of the thing up and, and how we were setting up for success and, and trying to, you know, like we used to [00:06:00] always say, maximize the role of science to minimize the role of politics. That was really important for the Louisiana public to get behind what we were doing. But then that was also such a, a good lesson for other coastal states. So the Hurricane Sandy, you know, and then Hurricane Harvey and then, and then the, the list has really gone on and on since then, obviously, but other states have come to see the, the importance of coastal planning.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, so that's, that's a good point that I didn't even think about when, when we kind of listed the question was that, you know, we, we kind of had to. Walk and chew gum at the same time. And the fact that we had this plan, but then we were implementing the plan., We were, we were kind of backing up what we were doing.

And you had to have, like you said, the dataset. You had to have all of that in place so you could evaluate whether or not the beginning implementation of your plan has even been successful. And so that is an important point of where we are in the coastal program, is that we've seen implementation. on the ground, [00:07:00] and, and we can see where we're, where we're going with that. What, what, what was the most asked question you would get from other CROs or, or folks from other states? What was the thing that they asked you the most about Louisiana?

Charles: Yeah, you know, that's a good question. So I think, you know, everybody's specific, like hazard or hurricane or wildfire or whatever was, was very different. But this idea

Simone Maloz: Mm.

Charles: have to 

really complex, problems or changes, we have to include all these different stakeholders. We have to have some kind of. Framework for explaining that to the public, but also making a good decision in the midst of all this uncertainty. I think it really did come down to, to kind of planning and then obviously the second most asked question is, how do you pay for this stuff? And so

Simone Maloz: Yeah, yeah, yeah. Right.

Charles: Our answer has been to never let a disaster go to waste.

You know, which unfortunately it's not how we would choose to do it, but we have [00:08:00] successfully mobilized post-disaster dollars toward to the service of our master plans. And I think as, as other people were, as we were having these conversations, it was like, well, like how would we do that in a sustainable way, in a way that didn't depend on something really terrible happening first anyway, working on that.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, , there's, I think there's a whole nother episode that we could have you on just, just to talk about funding. Right. And some of the things we're, we're obviously can't avoid touching on it 'cause I wanna get to insurance next. But I do think that because of the disasters we have been able to prove that we make good investments here in coastal Louisiana and that we, we had to earn some trust there.

And so that's maybe not something that. Everywhere else has to overcome. But we did right that we were, we were making good decisions, decisions that were gonna have you know, return on investments in the long run. And those are, those are kind of strange words when you're talking about environmental issues. Because we're, it [00:09:00] seems like we're crossing over into the economic side. 

is why we talk about insurance, because we're really talking about reducing our risk here in coastal Louisiana. And to your point about communications, we have to be able to connect those two issues. What we're trying to do with this project or with this investment in coastal Louisiana is trying to reduce the risk of, of living here and make it more sustainable in the long run.

So those two things absolutely intersect. So let's get to insurance. So insurance is just such a hot topic, obviously here in Louisiana and in all of our coastal communities, but it's really something that's being talked about all across the nation, right? Because of wildfires, because of these other extreme events. I would love to hear more about your work in that space from Louisiana perspective, but also about how you're continuing to make that [00:10:00] connection between those coastal investments and reducing risk when, when you have all this competition essentially from all these other places. Right.

Charles: well, we not only have competition from other places in terms of getting federal or other resources to build our projects, but we also have. This real, real pressure from these outside entities that are deciding if Louisiana is a place where they can, you know, do their business and continue to invest.

On the one hand. So one piece of the work is trying to meet those concerns about Louisiana when they look at us and they just say, oh man, y'all are one hurricane away from, from being done for and so we're coming back to, to them and saying like, are you aware of , how transparent we've been about our risk and how we're addressing it in a scientific way. Have you seen the, you know, the 20 something billion we've invested in hurricane protection and coastal restoration. So that's a piece right there mostly to kind of educate. Not just the insurance industry, but you know, bond rating agencies or that future economic development project so that they know that, especially in this age where everybody's got climate [00:11:00] risk Louisiana is at least naming its risk and, and doing something about it.

So I think that's one selling point. And I think the other piece is to try to connect just trying to convince people and to show people that the investments that Louisiana is making does have value, and we want it to have value to an individual, homeowners, individual, you know, businesses and people that are having to buy insurance and they're just seeing the cost go up and up and up and up. And so that is a very real challenge. There's a, a growing gap 

who need insurance and people who have insurance or have enough insurance to kind of cover that risk. And so. been trying to work with others to be innovative about how do you fill that gap? How do you fill the gap in where there are just certain vulnerable communities that are never gonna be able to afford insurance.

We cannot just leave them hanging out there. That's one piece of it. Another piece of it is that are natural 

of the, the environment that are providing a risk reduction service. So a huge wetland is absorbing flood [00:12:00] waters. 

can't just leave it to its own devices. You know, if it gets damaged after an event that might be the last thing on the list to, to go back and restore if you've got a bunch of damages to businesses and the economy and, and people's homes. So are there ways to kind of protect that nature through insurance products or other, other things. So that, that's, that's another piece. And I think the final piece is, you know, these companies, these insurance companies and reinsurance companies they do certain things for a living. They, they measure risk, they price risk, they communicate risk.

And so how can we kind of tap into their expertise in some senses and get them to. Look at the data that we are looking at and how do we have a conversation around, you know, what else could we be doing to preserve the overall insurability and then ideally the affordability of insurance in Louisiana.

But those are longer term conversations and, and discussions , that are gonna be ongoing.

Simone Maloz: So really [00:13:00] interesting that it goes both ways. We're trying to both educate them, but we're also trying to learn from them, okay, how, how do your systems work? How do you value that wetlands? Oh wait, you don't, you know, or, or something like that. So that's. That's really, really interesting. You also said something in that conversation that struck a chord because I think we're seeing that, and we've talked about it a couple of times, that after these hurricanes we're seeing incomplete recovery and, and some of that is due to the fact that folks are, are really, really underinsured and that they may have insurance 'cause they have to carry it or something like that.

But they are really, really underinsured. And so that's slowing down recovery to be able to, to kind of meet in the next storm that comes up. So much about, you know, Louisiana can learn from other people, including maybe some of these bigger industry perspectives, but wanted to talk about like. Do I want a couple of maybe good stories [00:14:00] from other places that, you know, places, Alabama had a roof program, right? You know, Florida's gotta be doing something. Like the parametric insurance or like this idea about insurring. So can you talk a little bit about what may seem like an out of the box idea that another police or state that is trying but, but has been met with some success. a, as it maybe a lesson of where Louisiana could learn from somebody else.

Charles: So I'll start with one on the community side, and that's where in New York City Environmental Defense Fund and some partners in the insurance industry set up. A parametric policy, basically a policy that did not need adjusters to go out and decide how much flooding you got. It was triggered by the event occurring and being measured by a, an external data, data point being hit. And then they used that money to. To fill in an emergency grant program for the people who were affected by the flooding. So again, trying to target that insurance gap. People that maybe didn't have enough flood insurance or didn't know that they needed flood insurance [00:15:00] 'cause of where they live in New York City, they created a grant program.

So we tried that when we were at cPRA, we applied for an Environmental Protection Agency grant to do the same thing in Franklin Parish. So Franklin is very different from New York City. But we said there are people there that are, that are vulnerable, and we wanna see how a policy like this would work for flooding in coastal Louisiana.

And so we got halfway down the, down the road on that, working with the Water Institute. And then the, the grant funding was pulled unfortunately by the EPA and that went away. But that tool, that idea that we can. You know, spending, spending a small amount of money can provide real relief for people that need it.

So that's one example. And then on the nature side, the one everybody talks about the most, which is a great example, is, is kind of ensuring coral reefs. First it was done in, in, off the coast of Mexico and then, then it was more recently done in Hawaii. And so, yes, it's interesting because they're ensuring the nature itself.

So saying coral reefs, just like we talk about barrier Islands, they, they reduce storm surge. They provide all this habitat, they do all these good [00:16:00] things, they also do is they also provide a tourism draw for those, the big hotels around there. And so what I think is really innovative about the, the Coral Reef Project is, is not just that they, somebody decided that it was worth it to insure nature, which is an innovation of itself. But what they did is they got. All these different entities to cooperate, to create a, like a, a fiscal agent together. So you got the hotel industry, you got them agencies, you got environmental NGOs to say we're gonna create a vehicle that is going to buy this policy and not only buy the policy, but as soon as we get, if it ever gets triggered by a hurricane, gonna. Deploy people to do restoration activities immediately in the short term so that we can actually, you know, save parts of that reef. So that's really exciting. We've seen different versions of that pop up, on Mangroves, and other, other issues. A lot, not we're, and so anyway, NWF is actively looking for good places where that might be a, a fit in a more inland system in a, in a coastal [00:17:00] system a little closer to, to Louisiana or maybe up and down Mississippi River.

Simone Maloz: Very interesting. I had heard of the coral reef and, and I guess I, I didn't really realize this idea that there like, kind of took the government piece out of it just to be like, listen, we're. is important to all of us as it is to the government, but that way we can react faster and, and so that is really interesting.

I think it's hard because insurance seems so traditional. You know, and, and it's this idea, and it, it is just something that people keep talking about such a hot topic because it's something that we really need to tackle. And so I think that it's grown to the point that we can't. Tackle it in the traditional ways and that we have to be able to kind of explore different ways to, like you said, cover that gap or to react faster. So that like in, in the case of like assuming that if there was a hurricane that came and damaged the coral reef, it damaged the, the town or whatever, [00:18:00] you know?

What else? Okay. You, you deal with. You know, y'all handle that recovery and we'll handle the nature side of the recovery too. So that's very, very interesting. Well, like I said, Charles, we could go off on a whole nother topic about about funding sources and, and looking for new funding sources and ways to invest coastal Louisiana. But we do have an opportunity. So you, you've picked up a partner in crime, I think, for the, the next year or so. So we wanna introduce another member, new to the coalition team and Mr. Donny David. Donnie comes to us from National Academy, so we wanna welcome him to the show. Charles, why don't you give a little brief introduction of Don, how he kind of came to Donnie and your good experiences with this fellowship program from the past.

And then, then we'll turn the mic over to Donnie for a little bit.

Charles: So yeah, we're very excited to have Donnie, and this is the first time the, the restorative Mississippi River Delta Coalition has been able to host a fellow. , So the National Academies [00:19:00] runs the Science Policy fellowship program. They've done it for, for several years, running now. And really connecting just really top-notch science folks who wanna look at the policy side of, of the issue.

And so I think our organizations have a nice mix of that as where the way we kind of tackle things. And so there's a, there's a matching process and so once Donnie was accepted into, this cohort of, of fellows, then there's a long interview process where they talk to all the different host offices and then, you know, we rank. The fellows and the fellows rank the hosts, and, then here we are

Simone Maloz: It is like the dating game. Donnie, I can't wait to.

Charles: whatever you wanna call it. But, uh, it works out great so far. And so I'm gonna let Donnie talk about himself and what he's here to do.

Simone Maloz: Thank you Charles. So Donnie, welcome to the show. Full disclosure, Donnie charm me the second he walked into my office and said, Hey, I know that voice from Delta Dispatches. So look here, you got an opportunity to be on the show. Welcome, Donny.

Donnie: Yeah. [00:20:00] Yeah. Within like, you know, almost less than two weeks to come up on here is is something else. It's a little surreal to be here. I remember being in the first meeting and hearing your voice outside of the context and being like, where is in my earplugs? Oh, no. In the meeting room with us.

So yeah, I've just, you know, beyond. Excited to be here with the Restore, the Mississippi River Delta Coalition. Like Charles said, you know, I come from the National Academy of the Sciences Science Policy Fellowship. That interview process was crazy. We interviewed eight different host offices and so, you know, not a lot of people get that opportunity.

It felt really special to learn a lot about what's going on around the Gulf Coast. And so, you know, with the science policy fellowship, like Charles said, just trying to for me, take my scientific background. Really wanna learn about how science policy is communicated to stakeholders, specifically like underserved communities, and then also how the science is communicated to policy makers, you know, learning about this [00:21:00] process and can't really, , figure a better place to be than here with y'all at Restore the Mississippi River Delta Coalition.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, we're so excited to have you. We do, you know, we have these interesting conversations around the office and we're in science and policy, but then policy and communications and science. And so a lot of times those. Those folks can work in silos. And here we've, we've tried to do our very best to, to keep everybody talking because of the nature of the work that we do.

And so, you know, we, it's, sometimes hard to tell somebody they can't do something because. And, and it sometimes it's not even a law, Donny, right? It's like just the policy. It's the way that somebody has chosen to work. And so on, on the reverse side, we have to get those policy makers to understand how those rules or, or those guidelines are impacting people on the ground.

And that's really, really kind of what we hope to do is. Is put the people in that plan and, and not always fun and not always [00:22:00] glamorous, but how policy kind of shapes that every day. So why don't you tell us a little bit about yourself, Donnie, your background

Donnie: so I came to New Orleans by way of Seattle, Washington in 2007. I worked in the hospitality industry here in New Orleans until about 2018 where you know, I decided to make a life change and I went back and pursued a bachelor's degree at the University of New Orleans. There I studied Fish Ecology with Dr.

O'Connell, and it was actually there where I was listening, trying to search for local podcasts that had. An environmental tinge just to, to bring it back to Delta dispatchers one more time. So it's a 2018, a long time listener. From there I got to go work at the National Park Services for a year, working under Dr.

Julie Whitbeck, really looking at the forest ecology of the Barrera Preserve. Worked with a lot of long-term monitoring projects and looking at storm surge impacts on the forests there. And then I was able to. returned back to UNO on a coastal [00:23:00] science assistantship program from the CPRA where I pursued my master's with help from the CPRA.

So with my master's, I really was looking at leveraging plant lifecycle and land building opportunities. And with the CPRA we were looking to inform project planning with accretion values. So both those were really awesome looks into, you know, the actuality of restoration, how the projects come from planning to actually making it on the ground. That was, that was really awesome. In my spare time you know, I like to volunteer around with local organizations. C-R-C-L-I still volunteer with the National Parks and then Woodlands Conservancy, I think they have some of the, uh,

Simone Maloz: yes. Yeah.

Donnie: in the area. Always looking to plug them. But yeah, I, I, so that's how I got to New Orleans.

That's how I got here. We just finished our orientation out in Corpus Christi for our science policy fellowship. We actually had the 10 year forum as well. So Charles, it's been going

Simone Maloz: [00:24:00] Oh, that's interesting. Yeah.

Donnie: to meet people in the program, got to expand the network. And, you know, that's really one of the things I'm most excited about here with the MRD is, you know, that idea that collaborative focus, you know, being able to build networks and being able to learn from people. I, I'm really, most of my first weeks are just gonna be, I'm doing a lot of talking now, but really doing a lot of listening and, and trying to gain perspective.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, so many of those things. First of all, you just hit on like kind of the coastal bingo card of all things, right? So great to be connected to U-N-O-C-P-R-A to have volunteer. But Donnie, it's, it's, it's kind of goes back to that conversation with Charles A. Little bit and, and this idea of the fellows is that since they've been around a little while, you can.

See success there, you can see where those folks have gone on. But also too, I love this idea that you've done the work, you've done the groundwork, right? And so there's probably some real [00:25:00] authenticity when you're talking to folks on the policy side of like, you know, sometimes. Some of those folks aren't on the ground doing the work.

And so to be a connection there and to say, okay, this is how it really works when it comes to implementation or even the value of collecting that data. I mean, that's like, know not something people always wanna invest in. Because it's, it's harder to see, it's slower, there's less of a payout.

But to be able to say, no, I did that work. We collected that data and this is how, you know, this is the difference that it made there. So, so we're excited to have you, Donna, your your program stint is a year, I think.

Donnie: Yeah.

Simone Maloz: Yes.

Donnie: the fellowship is for one year and you know, after that, just gonna see what opportunities there are. But, you know, for now, just really focused on learning as much as I can from y'all and just trying to be a part of the team.

Simone Maloz: Yeah. Yeah. Well, we're so excited to have you. So wait, you don't get away without the fun question either. I don't know if you heard us [00:26:00] ask Charles, like that was kind, I knew the answer to that really too, but are. Are you a pumpkin? I don't, I wouldn't think you're a pumpkin spice guy either. Might not.

But you did come, you did come from the, the northwest over there. Y'all actually have seasons. Probably have winter up there, so

Donnie: I was on, I, no, I was on the West Coast, so was the, it was the nine months of rain and the three

Simone Maloz: Yeah, that's right.

Donnie: like it's the most beautiful place in the world. So, but no pumpkin spice, you know, has not infiltrated my life in that way. I, I'm

Simone Maloz: Yeah. Your daughter doesn't make you stop for a pumpkin spice drink.

Donnie: know, might be the year we'll see.

She, she just turned 16. Is that, you know, maybe that's the year her pumpkin spice credentials are bestowed upon her.

Simone Maloz: She might still be into pink drinks and, and whatever though they drink.

Donnie: Yes, yes. You know, just being adaptable, right? Both in

Simone Maloz: Yeah.

Donnie: and in our professional life.

Simone Maloz: That's a whole nother show. That is a podcast. I cannot host Donnie as a parenting podcast. So, [00:27:00] we're so, you're such been such a great addition to the office already. We love having you, Donnie. We'll check in with you again at the end of your run. See. Still think good things about us and how the work's going, but otherwise we we're so happy to have you.

We hope that we can you know, learn from you as much as you learn from us all along the way. So we appreciate that.

Donnie: kind. Thank you so much.

Simone Maloz: All right, so we are hoping to have another guest on the show to ring in our 200th episode. So hang tight and we'll see if we can get, if you can recognize the voice that comes on the line.

But, uh, until then, thank you Donnie. Thank you Charles for joining us. Um, we appreciate your time today.

Donnie: Thank you, Simone.

Simone Maloz: So we've teased it, we've talked about it, but the moment is finally here. It is our big 200th episode. Who would've [00:28:00] ever thought

we would make it past? 10. But, but they've let us keep talking to until we hit 200 and there is no other voice that I wanted to join this episode other than Jacques p Abert to make his comeback one time, only one time Special appearance.

One time only comeback on Delta dispatches. Welcome back to your show, JPH.

Jacques Hebert: my goodness. Lordy Lordy. Delta dispatches is 200. Hello, Simone. It's so great to be back with you.

Simone Maloz: Over the hill and ready to roll.

Jacques Hebert: Remember all this? I mean, it has been a while and you know, 200 episodes ago, where were we? What were we doing? What was going on?

Simone Maloz: Jacques, you. So a couple things. , I showed up late as usual for this recording, so that's very on. Brandand showed up. No homework. It's, it's Jacques, we can, we can do this. We got it. Somethings never [00:29:00] change. But you, first of all, you are the number one question people ask me is, is. You know, it, it's a little bit of a dig, right?

Like, you know, oh, you brought the show back. Where's Jacques? Like, like, okay, well but everybody asks, like, everybody, you are definitely the most requested guest. You know, it, it, it just, everybody wants to know, where's Jacques? How is Jacques doing? So why don't, why don't you kick it off that way?

Why don't you tell everybody. Where, where you are, what you've been doing. And then, and then we'll get to be our usual selves after that.

Jacques Hebert: will, I will answer that question, but first I just want to say I saw recently, like many people did that Delta dispatches was in fact back. I saw it in my Instagram feed and I went nuts. I was texting everyone. I was so excited. So. kudos to you, Simone, and everyone, for bringing back Delta Dispatches.

I know [00:30:00] it's what the people want and you have to give them what they want.

Simone Maloz: It's what the people want. Definitely.

Jacques Hebert: co-host to now the person who has became your number one most loyal fan and supplanted.

Simone Maloz: Oh.

Jacques Hebert: People out there, I won't name names. I'm very happy with this development, but yeah, I'm doing well. I honestly, right now I'm literally two blocks away from the Mississippi River. It's just a Mississippi River that's a little bit further upstream from where you all are.

Simone Maloz: It's little skinnier like, like you, not me.

Jacques Hebert: It's a little skinnier people like Kayak in it, which is, I was like, what are you doing in the river? But, you know. But yeah, I'm in Minneapolis. I've been here since 2021. And I currently work for the McKnight Foundation, so I lead our communications at the foundation. We are a private family foundation that has operated in Minnesota for close to 75 years, and we work across a wide variety of program areas, you know, arts and culture, climate vibrant and equitable communities, [00:31:00] neuroscience, global foods and our foundation's really focused on helping address, you know, climate change and also helping ensure. Everyone can live healthy, meaningful lives. So it's been, it's been great to be on this side, I think. But I certainly, I, I have to say I've been experiencing some severe fomo, seeing all the great work that's happening in Louisiana, and I know you all just commemorated the 20th anniversary of hurricanes Katrina and, and Rita's coming up. And so it's just Louisiana's always, always, always in my heart and the work of the MRD team and restore the Mississippi River Delta. You know, it is probably, I don't know if I'll ever have a professional and personal experience as rewarding as that. And I still am deeply an admiration of all the incredible work you all are doing, and I miss you all tremendously.

So that, that's what I've been up to. What have you been up to?

Simone Maloz: You know, Ryan had said, our producer Ryan had said, you never curse on this show or haven't yet amazingly enough, but, you know, same old shit, [00:32:00] different day, Jacque. Right. You know, so in so many ways, so many things are the same. Like, and, and the milestone anniversaries. Brought a lot of that up. Like how do we create the successful coastal program in 20 years since these terrible tragedies and 15 years after deep water horizon?

And, but, but then the thing that's different is talking about why we still need that, why we still keep uh, those principles true. And why we wanna uplift those things that, those hard things that we had to do when things got really hard around here. So in so many ways so many things are the same, which is good.

And and then of course, always things are different. We invoke your name. I'll probably daily around the office. Like it was either, oh, Jacques did that, or, oh, you, you know, where did Jacques put that? Those kinds of things. But I had a very funny conversation, even at the Saints game on Sunday. So you've crept into, into our football schedule as well.

You probably, [00:33:00] you probably need to do something about your Saints team.

Jacques Hebert: Well, you know, I was

I know that was a little disappointed. The Mississippi River is two blocks that way and US Bank Stadium where the Vikings play is two blocks in the opposite direction. So it's been interesting being a who at in Vikings territory. One thing I will say is at least the Saints have won a Super Bowl.

I can't say that for the, but my I'm gonna stay quiet before I get kicked out of the office, but no, I'm waiting. The saints that come up to, to Minnesota, and I don't think it's happening this season, but, but you know, I'm always a Huda. I just have to say Simone. You know, I obviously, I follow a lot of the great work that happens with MRD and Louisiana's coast and have so many fond memories of being out on a boat with you or flying over the air and.

Simone Maloz: Losing your cruise.

Jacques Hebert: Out of a boat onto land that had been built by the Mississippi River. And it's just really remarkable in this day and age, you know [00:34:00] there's a lot that people disagree on and it was always, it's really remarkable to me to think about. In Louisiana, there's just widespread agreement about the importance of restoring Louisiana's coast, about how to restore Louisiana's coast people across divides, across geographies, across political belief systems like you know, and now being on the other side and working across a whole range of issues.

To see that level of sustained dedicated support decade after decade, you know. It's just really remarkable. And so I think it's testament to the work you all are doing, but testament as we've shared on this show, how interconnected Louisiana's coast is to every single aspect of our lives. And so I know you all are making sure that that is heard loud and clear, and I hope that people can find a way to recognize.

That this isn't an issue that's up for debate. You know, the world simply needs more Louisiana and the Mississippi River is the key to getting there. So that's all I wanted to say on that [00:35:00] matter. But but yeah,

Simone Maloz: You, you'll just mic drop that on the 200 episode and be like that. Yeah. I appreciate that.

Jacques Hebert: t-shirts. I love my t-shirts. Yeah.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, yeah. We had to get those reprinted. That was another Jacque conversation about how that went, how that happened, et cetera. We, we of course, miss you terribly. You needed to bring all your talent and skills somewhere else to someone else and, and share that even with a greater world.

And so we, we, if you love something, let it go. I know that I can still tease you about your spear snowballs. And, and all those things. We still have a, a healthy, active text chain that pops off about, about good and random stuff. So I appreciate that, that you've been our cheerleader from afar to especially, you know, seeing the other work that you do and, and it feels sometimes like when we work on coastal issues, we are kind of.

You know, on this island or that this is a place where Louisiana is so [00:36:00] unique that there maybe aren't solutions for that, and that's simply not true. I think going back to your McKnight mission of like building a, you know, healthier person, right? Like all of it, you know? So I think that's important to see from a different place.

Jacques Hebert: Yeah, and I mean, I honestly just how, I mean we would say this a lot right when we were doing the work or when I was there, but it's true, like Louisiana is truly innovative and the work that is happening is so advanced and beyond so many other places, many other states. And that needs to be celebrated.

And I think the other thing, that has been really clear and apparent is it isn't just coastal issues. It isn't just environmental issues. Like these are issues that touch communities, families, generations. It's every aspect of our culture. It's the economy. It's the incredible wildlife that we know and love in Louisiana.

And so it's just, you all do such a good job, and that's what the show has [00:37:00] been all about, right? Is like helping people understand how this touches every aspect of their lives. And I think there are many organizations and nonprofits and issues where people are trying to get to that level of, perva, like I would say pervasiveness, where like, it just, the issue just con completely to every issue of their lives.

And I feel like the work on Louisiana's coast really does that because people know and see and experience how the coast matters to them. So keep it up.

Simone Maloz: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I, I wanna reflect again on these like milestone anniversaries. You know, we were talking about you know, I think Deep Water 10 was maybe COVID, right? You know, so just to kind of have all these things come full circle you know, deep water 10. And then hurricanes Katrina, hurricane Rita for our friends in southwest Louisiana, and all that happened, you know, and remember that.

Four years ago was Ida and that, you know, we still have folks [00:38:00] experiencing recovery from that. My, my husband Billy re remarked last night that I was like, do you think it's weird that we haven't had any hurricanes or threats, you know, this year? And I was like, great. Now that you've said something, but you know so, you know that, or high water, high River. There are always these like really important education points, and that is something that I think you would agree that we've tried not to take for granted is that everybody understands our issue, that they understand the solutions to the challenges that we face.

And so it does feel like sometimes more than ever, you know, are, are people getting the message? Are they hearing that? And, and really as, as we live here, are they feeling that change? Are they feeling the challenges, but also are they feeling like we're making real progress to achieving some of those solutions?

And, and yeah, some of it's simple reconnecting to the river. Right. You know, that's really easy to think about. That's what built us, you know restoring [00:39:00] natural processes. Again, really important when we kind of physically alter our landscape. So all those education points still feel the same, but when you've done it for a little while, it's like, is anybody out there?

Is anybody listening? So thank you. Thank you for your reiteration of, of that, that that's still top line messages, if you will.

Jacques Hebert: you know, I'll just say we know people that are like maybe in our parents and grandparents generation that felt this way, that understood this because maybe they went through storms or, you know, it was their livelihood. They saw what happened as their families had to move, like up the bayou with each storm or you know, up the parish and my family's case. At the same time, like I've been seeing so many younger generations, like people college age and younger who are like deeply invested and deeply care about Louisiana's coast. Like there's a whole TikTok community. I don't know if you're, you've seen them. I'm sure you have.

Simone Maloz: You know I have it. You're just rubbing it in. You're just telling me.[00:40:00] 

Jacques Hebert: only on Instagram.

She needs to get with the Times. Well, Simone, you need to, when you get on TikTok or when you see it on Instagram, like three to four weeks later. There are all these, I'm just inspired by these people who

Simone Maloz: Yeah.

Jacques Hebert: you know, young, kind of deeply understand how important Louisiana's coast is, are doing work to advocate, to restore it or telling stories and volunteering you know, out in the marsh and the swamp.

And I think that just shows to me that like people, like it's gener, it's generational, and that like you all are helping. Bridge the gap to that next generation so that even if maybe they're not, they're not even from Louisiana. Maybe they are, but they care, right? And they're invested in the future, their future and in the future of Louisiana.

So that I've seen recently, and it's just an incredible sign of hope for, for me.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, and I love that. And, and it, it does, you know, how they carry their message is a lesson to us, right? Like how people receive their information and, [00:41:00] and you know, what they see and feel and what they're passionate about is. Is really important as we think about it. So little shock. We only had you for a couple of minutes today.

We wanted to just bring, bring the fans what they've been demanding. Viewership will drop off dramatically. Listenership could drop dramatically from here. But thank you. Thank you for always being my partner in crime, and thank you for being a cheerleader from wherever you are.

Jacques Hebert: I always am here and you know, I would say be careful what you wish for. 'cause you might just me back a little bit more. But I was just gonna say, if you ever want to do you know, a headwaters episode of Delta

Simone Maloz: Ah, that you mean that in person, right? Right.

Jacques Hebert: up here, you know, we can, we can find a spot along the river and, 

Simone Maloz: if I could not see you in, in almost winter, I'd appreciate that, like maybe a nice fall episode, but.

Jacques Hebert: be able to walk across the river in, in February. So but yeah. Thank you so much Simone and to everyone for the incredible work you're doing. Keep it up and then I just have to say, please go and get me some Rocky and Carlos [00:42:00] because I am like,

Simone Maloz: Well, since you taught me, since you taught me red gravy, brown gravy, you taught me how to order at the counter. Like I, that is a, a life lesson a cultural thing that you taught me that I will always carry with me. Thank you.

Jacques Hebert: that's, I mean, we, Minnesota has great food and wonderful places, but you know,

Simone Maloz: Hot dish. Hot dish.

Jacques Hebert: we would've to do a whole on that. Um, But yeah, you can't, you can't replace your Rockies. Um, And you can't replace uh, snowballs. So 

Simone Maloz: welcome. Ladies are welcome.

Jacques Hebert: Well, great to

Simone Maloz: Thank you, Jacques. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Jacques Hebert: Um, Take care.

Simone Maloz: So that is the end of the 200th episode. So that's it. That's all we got. A big thank you to our guests, Charles and Donnie, and of course Jacques for finding his way back to the show. You can find all the past [00:43:00] episodes@deltadispatches.org and subscribe to wherever you get your podcast. Thanks for listening.

After a while, crocodile.

So we've teased it, we've talked about it, but the moment is finally here. Um, it is our big 200th episode. Who would've ever thought that we would make it past? 10. Um, but, but they've let us keep talking to, uh, until we hit 200 and there is no other voice that I wanted to join, uh, this episode other than Jacques p Abert to make his comeback one time, only one time Special appearance.

One time only comeback on Delta dispatches. Welcome back to your show, JPH.

Jacques Hebert: my goodness. Lordy Lordy. Delta dispatches is 200. Hello, Simone. It's so great to be [00:44:00] back with you.

Simone Maloz: Over the hill and ready to roll.

Jacques Hebert: Remember all this? I mean, it has been a while and you know, 200 episodes ago, where were we? What were we doing? What was going on?

Simone Maloz: Jacques, you. Um, so a couple things. Um, I showed up late as usual for this recording, so that's very on. Brandand showed up. No homework. It's, it's Jacques, we can, we can do this. We got it. Somethings never change. Um, but you, first of all, you are the number one question people ask me, um, is, is. You know, it, it's a little bit of a dig, right?

Like, you know, oh, you brought the show back. Where's Jacques? Like, like, okay, well, um, but everybody asks, like, everybody, you are definitely the most requested guest. Um, you know, it, it, it just, everybody wants to know, where's Jacques? How is Jacques doing? Um, so why don't, why don't you kick it off that way?

Why don't you tell everybody. Where, [00:45:00] where you are, what you've been doing. Um, and then, and then we'll get to be our usual selves after that.

Jacques Hebert: will, I will answer that question, but first I just want to say, um, I saw recently, like many people did, um, that Delta dispatches was in fact back. I saw it in my Instagram feed and I went nuts. I was texting everyone. I was so excited. So. kudos to you, Simone, and everyone, for bringing back Delta Dispatches.

I know it's what the people want and you have to give them what they want.

Simone Maloz: It's what the people want. Definitely.

Jacques Hebert: co-host to now the person who has became your number one most loyal fan and supplanted.

Simone Maloz: Oh.

Jacques Hebert: People out there, I won't name names. Um, I'm very happy with this development, but yeah, I'm doing well. I honestly, right now I'm literally two blocks away from the Mississippi River. Um, it's just a Mississippi River that's a little bit further upstream from where you all Are.

Simone Maloz: It's little skinnier [00:46:00] like, like you, not me.

Jacques Hebert: It's a little skinnier, uh, people like Kayak in it, which is, I was like, what are you doing in the river? But, you know. Um, but yeah, I'm in, uh, Minneapolis. I've been here since, uh, 2021. Um, and I currently work for the McKnight Foundation, so I lead our communications at the foundation. We are a private family foundation that, um, has operated in Minnesota for close to 75 years, and we work across a wide variety of program areas, you know, arts and culture, climate, um, vibrant and equitable communities, neuroscience, global foods, um, and our foundation's really focused on helping, um, address, you know, climate change and also helping ensure. Everyone can live healthy, meaningful lives. So it's been, it's been great to be on this side, I think. Um, but I certainly, I, I have to say I've been experiencing some severe fomo, seeing all the great work that's happening in Louisiana, and I know you all just [00:47:00] commemorated the 20th anniversary of hurricanes Katrina and, and Rita's coming up. Um, and so it's just, uh, Louisiana's always, always, always in my heart and the work of the MRD team and restore the Mississippi River Delta. You know, it is probably, I don't know if I'll ever have a professional, um, and personal experience as rewarding as that. And, um, I still am deeply an admiration of all the incredible work you all are doing, and I miss you all tremendously.

So that, that's what I've been up to. What have you been up to?

Simone Maloz: Um, you know, Ryan had said, our producer Ryan had said, you never curse on this show or haven't yet amazingly enough, but, you know, same old shit, different day, Jacque. Right. You know, so, um, in so many ways, so many things are the same. Like, and, and the milestone anniversaries. Brought a lot of that up. Like how do we create the successful coastal program in 20 years since these terrible tragedies and 15 years after deep water horizon?

Um, and, but, but then the thing that's [00:48:00] different is talking about why we still need that, why we still keep, uh, those principles true. And why we wanna uplift those things that, those hard things that we had to do, um, when things got really hard around here. So, so in so many ways, um, so many things are the same, which is good.

And uh, and then of course, always things are different. Uh, we invoke your name. I'll probably daily around the office. Like it was either, oh, Jacques did that, or, oh, you, you know, where did Jacques put that? Those kinds of things. But I had a very funny conversation, even at the Saints game on Sunday. Um, so you've crept into, into our football schedule as well.

You probably, you probably need to do something about your Saints team.

Jacques Hebert: Well, you know, I was

Simone Maloz: I don't.

Jacques Hebert: I know that was a little disappointed. Uh, the Mississippi River is two blocks that way and US Bank Stadium where the Vikings play is two blocks in the opposite direction. So it's been interesting being a who at in Vikings [00:49:00] territory. One thing I will say is at least the Saints have won a Super Bowl.

I can't say that for the, but my, uh, I'm gonna stay quiet before I get kicked out of the office, but no, I'm waiting. The saints that come up to, to Minnesota, and I don't think it's happening this season, but, but you know, I'm always a Huda. I just have to say Simone. Um, you know, I obviously, I follow a lot of the great work that happens with MRD and Louisiana's coast and, um, have so many fond memories of being out on a boat with you or flying over the air and.

Simone Maloz: Losing your cruise.

Jacques Hebert: Out of a boat onto land that had been built by the Mississippi River. Um, and it's just really remarkable in this day and age, you know, um, there's a lot that people disagree on and it was always, it's really remarkable to me to think about. In Louisiana, there's just widespread agreement about the importance of restoring Louisiana's coast, about how to restore Louisiana's [00:50:00] coast people across divides, across geographies, across political belief systems like you know, and now being on the other side and working across a whole range of issues.

To see that level of sustained dedicated support decade after decade, you know. It's just really remarkable. And so I think it's testament to the work you all are doing, but testament as we've shared on this show, how inter interconnected Louisiana's coast is to every single aspect of our lives. And so I know you all are making sure that that is, uh, heard loud and clear, and I hope that people can find, um, a way to recognize.

That this isn't an issue that's up for debate. You know, the world simply needs more Louisiana and the Mississippi River is the key to getting there. So, uh, that's all I wanted to say on that matter. But, um, but yeah,

Simone Maloz: You, you'll just mic drop that on the 200 episode and be like that. Yeah. I appreciate that.

Jacques Hebert: t-shirts. I love my t-shirts. Yeah.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, yeah. We had to get those reprinted. That was another Jacque [00:51:00] conversation about how that went, how that happened, et cetera. Um, we, we of course, miss you terribly. Uh, you needed to bring all your talent and skills, um, somewhere else to someone else and, and share that even with a greater world.

And so, uh, we, we, if you love something, let it go. Um, I know that I can still tease you about your spear snowballs. And, and all those things. We still have a, a healthy, active text chain, um, that pops off about, about, uh, good and random stuff. So I appreciate that, that you've been our cheerleader, um, from afar to, um, especially, you know, seeing the other work that you do and, and, um, it feels sometimes like, um, when we work on coastal issues, we are kind of.

You know, on this island or that this is a place where Louisiana is so unique that there maybe aren't solutions for that, and that's simply not true. I think going back to your McKnight mission of like building a, [00:52:00] you know, healthier person, right? Like all of it, you know? So, um, I think that's important to see from a different place.

Jacques Hebert: Yeah, and I mean, I honestly just how, I mean we would say this a lot right when we were doing the work or when I was there, but it's true, like Louisiana is truly innovative and um, the work that is happening, um, is so advanced and beyond so many other places, many other states. Um, and that needs to be celebrated.

And I think the other thing, um. That has been really clear and apparent is, um, it isn't just coastal issues. It isn't just environmental issues. Like these are issues that touch communities, families, generations. It's every aspect of our culture. It's the economy. It's the incredible wildlife that we know and love in Louisiana.

Um, and so it's just, you all do such a good job, and that's what the show has been all about, right? Is like helping people [00:53:00] understand how this touches every aspect of their lives. And I think there are many organizations and nonprofits and issues where people are trying to get to that level of, um. Perva, like I would say pervasiveness, where like, it just, the issue just con completely to every issue of their lives.

And I feel like the work on Louisiana's coast, um, really does that because people know and see and experience how the coast matters to them. So keep it up.

Simone Maloz: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Um, I, I wanna reflect again on these like milestone anniversaries. You know, we were talking about, uh, you know, I think Deep Water 10 was maybe COVID, right? You know, so, uh, just to kind of have all these things come full circle, uh, you know, deep water, uh, 10. And then, uh, hurricanes Katrina, hurricane Rita for our friends in southwest Louisiana, and all that happened, you know, and remember that.

Four years ago was Ida and that, you know, we still [00:54:00] have folks experiencing recovery from that. Um, my, my husband Billy re remarked last night that I was like, do you think it's weird that we haven't had any hurricanes or threats, you know, this year? And I was like, great. Now that you've said something, but you know, um, so, uh.

You know that, or high water, high River. There are always these like really important education points, and that is something that I think you would agree that we've tried not to take for granted is that everybody understands our issue, that they understand the solutions to the challenges that we face.

And so it does feel like, um, sometimes more than ever, you know, are, are people getting the message? Are they hearing that? And, and really as, as we live here, are they feeling, um, that change? Are they feeling the challenges, but also are they feeling like we're making real progress to achieving some of those solutions?

Um, and, and yeah, some of it's simple reconnecting to the river. [00:55:00] Right. You know, that's really easy to think about. That's what built us, you know, uh, restoring natural processes. Again, really important, um, when we kind of physically alter our landscape. So all those education points still feel the same, but when you've done it for a little while, it's like, is anybody out there?

Is anybody listening? Um, so thank you. Thank you for your, uh, reiteration of, of that, that that's still, um, top line messages, if you will.

Jacques Hebert: you know, I'll just say I, I. We know people that are like, uh, maybe in our parents and grandparents generation that felt this way, that understood this because maybe they went through storms or, you know, it was their livelihood. They saw what happened as their families had to move, like up the bayou with each storm or you know, up the parish and my family's case. Um, at the same time, like I've been seeing so many younger generations, like people college age and younger who are like. Deeply invested [00:56:00] and deeply care about Louisiana's coast. Like there's a whole TikTok community. I don't know if you're, you've seen them. I'm sure you have.

Simone Maloz: You know I have it. You're just rubbing it in. You're just telling me.

Jacques Hebert: only on Instagram.

She needs to get with the Times. Well, Simone, you need to, when you get on TikTok or when you see it on Instagram, like three to four weeks later. There are all these, I'm just inspired by these people who

Simone Maloz: Yeah.

Jacques Hebert: you know, young, kind of deeply understand how important Louisiana's coast is, are doing work to advocate, to restore it or telling stories and volunteering, um, you know, out in the marsh and the swamp.

And I think that just shows to me that like people, like it's gener, it's generational, and that like you all are helping. Bridge the gap to that next generation so that even if maybe they're not, they're not even from Louisiana. Maybe they are, but they care, right? And they're invested in the future, their future and in the future of Louisiana.

So that I've seen recently, and it's just an incredible sign of hope [00:57:00] for, for me.

Simone Maloz: Yeah, and I love that. And, and it, it does, you know, how they carry their message is a lesson to us, right? Like how people receive their information and, and you know, what they see and feel and what they're passionate about is. Is really important as we think about it. So little shock. We only had you for a couple of minutes today.

We wanted to just bring, bring the fans what they've been demanding. Um, uh, viewership will drop off dramatically. Listenership will drop, will, will, uh, could drop dramatically from here. But thank you. Thank you for always being my partner in crime, and thank you for being a cheerleader from wherever you are.

Jacques Hebert: I always am here and you know, I would say be careful what you wish for. 'cause you might just me back a little bit more. But I was just gonna say, if you ever want to do, um, you know, a headwaters episode of Delta

Simone Maloz: Ah, that you mean that in person, right? Right.

Jacques Hebert: up here, you know, we can, we can find a spot along the river and, uh.

Simone Maloz: If I could not see you in, in almost [00:58:00] winter, I'd appreciate that, like maybe a nice fall episode, but.

Jacques Hebert: be able to walk across the river in, in February. So, um, but yeah. Thank you so much Simone and to everyone for the incredible work you're doing. Keep it up and then I just have to say, please go and get me some Rocky and Carlos because I am like,

Simone Maloz: Well, since you taught me, since you taught me red gravy, brown gravy, you taught me how to order at the counter. Like I, that is a, a life lesson, uh, a cultural thing that you taught me that I will always carry with me. Thank you.

Jacques Hebert: that's, I mean, we, Minnesota has great food and wonderful places, but you know,

Simone Maloz: Hot dish. Hot dish.

Jacques Hebert: we would've to do a whole nother episode on that. Um, but yeah, you can't, you can't replace your Rockies. Um, and you can't replace your spearmint, uh, snowballs. So welcome. Ladies are welcome.

Well, great to

Simone Maloz: Thank you, Jacques. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Jacques Hebert: Um, take care.

Simone Maloz: So that is the end of the 200th episode. [00:59:00] So that's it. That's all we got. A big thank you to our guests, Charles and Donnie, and of course Jacques for finding his way back to the show. You can find all the past episodes@deltadispatches.org and subscribe to wherever you get your podcast. Uh, thanks for listening.

After a while, crocodile.