The G.E.M. Series Episode 16: Cultivating a Life-Long Dream With Kristin Aquino-Pham
[00:00:00] Blake: Welcome to the G.E.M series powered by rocket level. On this podcast, we empower entrepreneurs to succeed by setting big goals, executing like a pro, and having a fearless mindset. The G.E.M series is all about investing in yourself. We're here to share the path to getting what you want out of life. By sharing the stories of entrepreneurs who have done this themselves, providing thorough research from our team on what careers and habits are yielding the best.
[00:00:29] And discussing the mindset it takes to overcome the obstacles that all future entrepreneurs will face investing in yourself, starts with putting in the work every single day. And this podcast is here to help you do exactly that. My name is Blake Chapman. I'm the vice president of the ambassador program here at the rocket level.
[00:00:46] And I am thrilled to be your host for the G.E.M series. Hello everybody. And welcome to the G.E.M series. In today's episode, I have an amazing guest. It is Kristin Aquino fam. Hi, Kristen, how are you doing today? 
[00:00:59] Kristin: Hi, doing great. Thank you. 
[00:01:00] Blake: Great, great. For anybody that doesn't know, Kristen Kristen is currently working in the legal world doing business and immigration law and has started up a startup in the past.
[00:01:14] And additionally is currently working to build a fully functioning working farm on 40 acres. Amidst several other things, I guess that's kind of the thing that I'm really excited to talk to you about. Kristen, you have consistently been adding on new things that you've been interested in and diving into so many different areas.
[00:01:33] I I'd love to turn it over to you to kind of tell the audience a little bit about some of the things that you've got going on right now and, and a little bit about yourself. 
[00:01:40] Kristin: Okay. Well, that's a. A very open-ended question. So I am a lawyer by training. I should start with that. And I currently work for a large law firm representing companies in their immigration matters.
[00:01:56] And that's what I've been doing for the last I've been practicing law for 10 years now. And I have been in this field for. 16 years. So that's my day job, as you say, but as Blake mentioned, I'm also starting up a farm and the way that came to be is that you know, during the pandemic, some folks decided they wanted to get a pet.
[00:02:20] And I decided I wanted to pursue my retirement dream a little bit early and buy some farmland. So I started out with just a little under two acres. And use that as my incubator to figure out what aspect of farming I liked the best, whether it was animal husbandry or producing fruits and vegetables.
[00:02:40] I learned a lot in a very short time, which I'm sure you can imagine going from, you know, being a lawyer to being a farmer to very different jobs. But I I did keep my law job in, you know, in the mean. But I treated the farm as, you know, a sort of hobby, I guess at first.
[00:03:00] And I decided that I really enjoy animal husbandry. So what I learned quickly is that the way to make money off of farming is to have and especially off of livestock is to have sufficient land so that you can sustain the livestock without having to buy too much supplemental grain or supplemental.
[00:03:18] And so I took the next step of buying 38 more acres of land. And we'll be working on the building, we'll be working two to 38, two to 38. It's a big, big change. But I, what I've learned is that cows and cheap, they need a lot of space. Otherwise, you're going to be buying them food all the time. And so and so I, you know, bought the other acreage and I'm working toward building You know that side, building the farm into a real business that will produce meat.
[00:03:46] That 
[00:03:47] Blake: is so, so cool. Kristen. I my, my wife, I just got married three weeks ago, so I'm getting used to saying it. Oh, congrats. She's a, she's a farmer. Thank you very much. She's a farmer. Not, not on, you know, that's a dream of, of hers. So I was like, oh my gosh, I have such a rare opportunity to get at, to ask Kristen all these different questions since.
[00:04:07] Dove in head first about what it's like starting your own farm, but I think that's so exciting. And it sounds like something you've thought about for, have you for a long time and maybe been marinating on, on this idea. You mentioned retirement. Yeah, retirement plan too. 
[00:04:20] Kristin: Yeah. I always wanted to have, a farm to visit and to go work on after I retired.
[00:04:28] I mean, my idea was to have a farmhouse that was sort of like run by other people that I could go and pop in on weekends. And then maybe like a house that's a little place in the city that I could go to. And I felt like being there. I mean, that's, that was always the, you know, sort of my dream and every, even when I was little, I liked to play farmer and I would like pretend that.
[00:04:49] You know, milking cows and things like that. I always thought it was so interesting. I think I really just like the self-sufficiency aspect of it. I like to be able to produce my own food, my own, you know you know, dairy and even flowers, you know, if I can produce a flower and like make a beautiful flower bouquet out of.
[00:05:09] That's always, that's always been really intriguing to me. And so I think the farming, you know, that has, that kind of goes along with that retirement dream for me, is that idea of being able to have a farm that produces things that people need, right? Like yeah. The food, you know, people need food.
[00:05:24] Absolutely. So, so yeah. Well, I'm happy to talk. I could talk about forming all day. That's absolutely 
[00:05:29] Blake: incredible. No, I think that. I think that's so cool. And you mentioned even growing up, you still had this passion too. What was yeah. What was growing up like for you? Did, did anything, you know, what inspired you to get to the point where cuz a lot of people talk about taking on a passion project and you know, fulfilling a dream.
[00:05:47] But I guess what blows my mind is that you executed and you knocked it out relatively quickly. Once you got started. Yeah. What was it like growing up? Did you have any influences that kind of help with that mindset at all? 
[00:06:02] Kristin: Mm, I would say with, well, so with farming in particular, not really. I mean, I grew up in still mountain Georgia, like suburbs of Atlanta, and I have no farmers, or I had no farmers in my family at the time, at least that I knew my mom likes to garden.
[00:06:17] But the self-sufficiency. You know, has just always, I guess, been part of how I grew up. I mean, my parents were immigrant and I was, I was born kind of like accidentally, I guess I should say. So my brothers were already out of the house when I was born. So I very much was kind of like left to my own devices a lot.
[00:06:35] Oh, wow. 
[00:06:36] Blake: So there's a big, a big, probably a big age gap there. 
[00:06:38] Kristin: Yeah. Huge. Yeah. My brothers are 17 and 12 years older than I am. And so when I was a child, you know, I was doing a lot of things on my own and, and my parents, I think at that point, You know, and I'm a parent to three kids now, so I know how it feels.
[00:06:52] It's like, by the time you get to that last one, you're kind of like, okay, just figure it out. And so that was definitely my life. Mm-hmm, let's just figure it out. So I think that's where that driver towards self-sufficiency comes from. Yeah. And then, so, you know, when it comes to the execution, you know, like actually having an idea, but then going for it you know, I would say.
[00:07:14] Partially my parents instilled that in me, but also it's just sort of I guess part of being left to your own devices as a kid is you're also like, you know, you're not really asking anyone for anything. And so if you want something to happen, you have to make it happen yourself. Mm-hmm. And um, and so there was a lot of that for me growing up.
[00:07:30] And so I think the farm is definitely just another example. Of course, you know, I have to, I should say that I also wanted to be a lawyer when I was little. So that was something that I was gonna ask that too. and so I've done that and you know, it's not I'm fortunate in that that has provided the means to be able to execute on the farm dream, you know, and it's, it's definitely not an easy path or one that like, you know, everyone necessarily even wants to do.
[00:07:58] But, but that for me has been a big help just having that second, that other career. 
[00:08:04] Blake: Yeah, absolutely. I mean, I feel like it's just such an a, I, I, it's something that I get really excited about because I know there's so many different dreams that I've had, but it gets me really excited to think about you holding onto these childhood dreams and executing on them and getting to the point where now you're.
[00:08:21] Full-time farmer and a full-time lawyer. I mean, it's, it's, it's pretty neat. I'm curious about the legal side too. What was the thing that, you know, attracted to you, attracted you to that as a, as a kid, you think, you 
[00:08:35] Kristin: know, I may be a desire to make my parents proud. I mean, I think that's a very, that's very inherent in my culture, you know, getting the approval of your parents and doing something that.
[00:08:48] That your parents can brag to their friends about. I mean, and that's a very, that's a very honest answer to that. So that might have been part of it. Yeah. But what I, you know, what I've found as I've been practicing law this long is that I do like solving problems. I'm definitely a problem solver. I have, I have pretty high frustration intolerance.
[00:09:08] So I like to, if there's a problem, I wanna try to figure it out and nip it in the bud. And that is what lawyers do, you know, on a day-to-day basis is we're solving other people's problems or other, you know, businesses problems. And so that's, you know, I think why it appealed to me And, and has kind of gone well with my skill set.
[00:09:27] And it's interesting because farming is also a lot of problem-solving. And I've seen how they 
[00:09:32] Blake: relate every single day, probably. Yep. 
[00:09:34] Kristin: Every day. And it's, I mean, it's different kinds of problems and honestly, I mean, they're just much more tangible. Problems, you know, sometimes in the ones that I solve as in the field of corporate law, but it's the same sort of skill set, you know, of being able to identify what a root cause of the problem is, you know, for farming it's like, is the fencing just not adequate for this type of animal?
[00:09:56] Whereas in law it's like, well, did we, you know, fill, not fill out the documents in a certain type of way that could have, you know, prevented this problem. Yeah. It's, it's interesting, you know, think of them too, as being relevant to one another, but they have, they share some, some, some skills Harding and lawyering
[00:10:13] Blake: Yeah, absolutely. I, yeah, I mean, I was talking to somebody who came from a marketing background and then wanted to be a nutritionist and wellness type you know, She was saying something similar, which is that the skillset that you develop, even though it may not be as direct to where it's quite literally telling you how to, I don't know to tend to cattle or, or, or the, you know, something like that.
[00:10:37] There are a lot of parallels that, you know, you can pull from other places and, you know, I'd be curious. How about the other way around? Is there, is there anything from farming that brings, that you bring back to being a lawyer now? 
[00:10:50] Kristin: Yes. I definitely am much more practical. I mean, I think farming, you know, it's very, it is practical, no-nonsense.
[00:10:58] I mean, you just don't have time to Dole on, you know, certain decisions, you know, because in farming or thinking about animals living or dying, right. Mm-hmm, or you're thinking about animals getting out and being at risk, or even with your plants, you know, you're thinking about You know, whether your plans are actually going to make it through the season.
[00:11:17] And so in a way I think that is, that is, has been a good thing, is that I've brought, I've become a lot more practical. However, I will sort of caveat that with, you know, one thing I've learned being in the corporate world for so many years is that it's not always practical. You know, the things that corporations are doing, aren't always the most practical.
[00:11:38] And so. Yeah, I have I've, I've had to try to, and I'm still working on trying to temper that like I have to remember that, you know, sometimes the decisions in corporate settings are going to take longer even, and, and, but thankfully there's no, you know, lamb or sheep dying on the other side of the decision.
[00:11:58] Sure. So if they can take a little longer but I've definitely had to, I've definitely been working on trying to balance that. So, so, you know, I think, I do think though I work with a tech company as my main client. And I will say that because, in technology, everything is so fast-paced that that sort of practical approach has, is actually helpful.
[00:12:21] So that farmer approach is helpful because things move so quickly with tech companies and they, they don't want to dot on decisions. And I think there's more of a trend toward that, but it's more of a matter of getting. Like the internal law firms, you know, law firm or, you know, to sort of understanding that as 
[00:12:39] Blake: well.
[00:12:40] Yeah. Yeah. I, I also think it's kind of interesting because yeah, I think of almost whenever you function the way a farm function very heavily relies on the way that nature functions and nature. Cuts out anything that's excess to an extent. Right. Mm-hmm so I'd be curious, you know, maybe if that mindset ever trickles into whenever you're advising a client or anything like that, you know?
[00:13:03] I, I, I always, yeah, I love, I love thinking about how those connections happen too, 
[00:13:09] Kristin: you know? Yeah. It does. It definitely trickles in, and I think you know, some clients appreciate it. I mean, it's. Some, you know, sometimes when you're in lawyering, it's, you know, you, you deal, you have to sort of have master the art of, you know, you know, what the best advice is, maybe mm-hmm or, you know what the, you know, what the advice is under the law, but the client cares about what's best for their business.
[00:13:34] And then, the true art of practicing law is being able to communicate to them. You know, what is best from a legal standpoint, without disregarding what is best for their business. And then, you know, sort of like, so if you need to tell them that, like, you know, as you said, the laws of nature will kind of cut out the excess.
[00:13:52] Similarly, in some ways the law itself will sort of tell you what you can and can't do, or sometimes will just, yeah. Jump in and say, Nope, you know, this is not going to work out and may not make any sense to you. It's just not going to work out. But it's that art of being able to tell you. Okay, this isn't going to work out, but we're going to look at these different options for you.
[00:14:13] And so, you know, that is It's up to the client, I think, to decide if they like that style, you know? Yeah, sure. But it's a free market if they don't like that style of advising, they can always go to another lawyer, you know, that's, that's 
[00:14:26] Blake: exactly right. Yep. So that's exactly right. 
[00:14:29] Kristin: So yeah, that is it's, it's definitely been really interesting over the past 18 months to see how I've evolved as a lawyer and as a farmer, as a result.
[00:14:37] Trying to juggle both at the same time. 
[00:14:40] Blake: How do you do that? By the way? Because you're a full-time mom. , you're, you're a full-time lawyer. You're a full-time farmer. Plus, I have a hunch that you're doing any number of other things. So how, yeah. How do you, how do you do that? 
[00:14:54] Kristin: Well, so I have a farm manager.
[00:14:57] Who's amazing who manages the that's a great farm. Cause my farm is not in Atlanta. It's in Ella, J mm-hmm so about an hour and a half outside of Atlanta. And you know, having a farm manager is really, I mean, that's the only way I could do it unless I lived there. So I don't live on the farm. And so but it does, I mean it costs money.
[00:15:15] I mean, being very practic. I mean, that is, it is probably, you know, half of my, what I can have as disposable income is going into. that's a pain, for the farm manager. But you know, it's been a great experience for me to have that person, well, I've had a few of them actually, but the one I have now is full-time.
[00:15:37] You know, he knows much more than I do about farming. And so in a lot of ways, he is. My boss and he's telling me, this is what we need to do with the pigs that keep getting out, you know? And so, and I, I appreciate that.
[00:15:54] no, I never thought you'd be saying that sentence a few weeks ago. I know. No, I've said so many sentences in the last 18 months. I never thought I would say. But he's been, you know, without him, I couldn't do this. And then, and his family helps because they, he they're all in L. And they all you know, really run that farm for me.
[00:16:11] And it's been, it's been wonderful. I mean, it definitely takes a level of humility. Mm-hmm, sure. To go into something and be, you know, you know, I feel like I've done fine in my career as a lawyer, but then to be able to go in and say, I know nothing about this and you know, maybe I am paying this person, but that doesn't mean that this person, that, that I'm not the one who's actually deferring to this person.
[00:16:34] and it's been really good to have that. I think that you know, a lot of times too in the legal career, you know, we start to think, get kind of like, oh, we know what we're doing. You know, everyone should listen to us. We have our degree and our license and all these things. And we forget that there's still a lot that we don't know, you know, mm-hmm and I encounter a lot of people in the legal profession who get to who get stuck in that.
[00:16:56] And. I hate to see that because then they will, you know, disregard other types of people or other types of careers and they might pass up some really good opportunities because of that. And yeah. It's definitely been, you know, very humbling for me to be taught by someone else about something I know nothing about.
[00:17:14] You know like I'm a child. I often feel like a child when I talk to my farm manager, but that's how I balance the farm. And then work, of course, you know, is work and, you know, I think the, I think that it'd be difficult to balance if I were a newer lawyer, I don't think I'd have been able to do the farm thing if I were still a, a young lawyer.
[00:17:33] But I'm not so young anymore. So I'm able to sort of, you know I kind of know-how to work efficiently. And kind of focus on the things that really matter at work. And then with family, of course, family comes first and the farm is an opportunity for all of us to work together. So my kids run the egg selling business, part of my farm, you know, they do farm chores.
[00:17:54] My husband builds he's really good with woodwork. So he builds a lot of the stuff on the farm. And so really as a family endeavor, 
[00:18:01] Blake: Wow. That's, that's really amazing finding a finding something, a passion that brings a whole family together to, to get to work on it. And are you going out to the farmer's markets and things like that 
[00:18:11] Kristin: yet?
[00:18:13] Not yet. Not yet. We so we're getting our license to sell eggs on June 23rd. So you actually have to take a class and pass this little egg handling test. So then we'll be able to go out to farmer's markets. I don't know if we'll do that because that's not really gonna be the focus to get to be we wanna sell meat.
[00:18:29] So the focus the, the process for getting there is a little bit more intense. And so we've gotta, you know, keep, start, keep working on building that. And that's another thing I was gonna say is, you know, patience. This process has taught me a lot of patience. I mean, I know you know, we, someone, you know, get an idea in your head and you want it to happen immediately.
[00:18:49] Mm-hmm and you know, you want to start, you want to execute it and then you wanna see immediate results. And that's just not, I mean, in farming, that's definitely not gonna happen. no. And in law, it's not that definitely didn't happen. Right? You wanna become a lawyer. You have. Take the LSAT and then you have to like apply to law school.
[00:19:06] Then you have to get into law school and you have to take a bar exam and it's all. You know, a process. And I think having patience with the process is good, has been a really good lesson for me. 
[00:19:15] Blake: Yeah. Yeah, no, I can I can imagine, I mean, a lot of times with patients too, I, I, I see people do different ways too, to find that patience.
[00:19:24] Some people are able to, you know, maybe stare into the void and just be like, I just gotta go. I just gotta keep moving forward. Some people do little micro goals. Do you have any advice on how to, how you navigate, you know, getting to that next step, or have you ever had like a, do you have certain ways that you do goal setting and things like that?
[00:19:43] Kristin: That's a really good question. I do both of them, I've definitely stared into the void before. 
[00:19:51] Blake: Maybe that's kinda a silly way to put it, but I, I guess you get what I mean by that. I totally 
[00:19:55] Kristin: get what you mean. I've definitely had my days where I've just, you know in fact, the most recent experience I can think of with that was that I had a farm manager, my very first farm manager.
[00:20:05] Was wonderful. She had some family things that brought her back to Atlanta, so she couldn't work on the farm anymore. And I definitely had a moment of just staring, you know, into the void and wondering how, you know, at that point, I had maybe 12 animals and I was like, how who's going to take care of these 12 animals.
[00:20:22] But I like to, I do like to write down goals. I, I do believe in the power of writing things down. Only also because I might, you okay. I was gonna say my memory is also pretty terrible. I mean, it's gotten worse. I feel exponentially over the years, but I like to write things down. I do believe in micro-goals.
[00:20:40] So, you know, I, and, and it can be tough. I think the hardest thing for me with the micro goals kind of goes back to what I said about wanting your parent's approval. You know, my, mother is still alive and she is excited about the farmer. She's like, well, when are you gonna start, you know, doing this and this and like these big grand dreams and, you know, and it's like, well, I, today I just wanna focus on getting through this one thing yeah.
[00:21:05] On these two things. Yeah. And so it, it can be tough, you know? Because sometimes you've got alcohol, this outside noise, I can only see, you know, Just a little bit of the picture, but you're, you're in the weeds trying to get, get to, you know, each point. And so so I do think though that there's like that personal sense of achievement, you know, when you do micro goals and you feel like, okay, I, I deposited a little bit of like validation into my, my bank and so I can move on to the next day.
[00:21:37] And so I, I do agree with doing that. 
[00:21:39] Blake: Absolutely. Have you ever wanted to give up on the process ever? oh my goodness. 
[00:21:45] Kristin: While you're doing yes, I, today yesterday, it just asked me which particular process, I mean, today was definitely a, I think I, you know, it was like a, definitely a, I don't know if I should be a lawyer kind of day, you know, but yes.
[00:22:05] Um, you know, we have, we have them I have definitely wanted to give up. And in fact, I have failed to be very honest. I tried to start two businesses prior to the farm tech startup, which I, I did co-found with someone, but, you know, I had to step out of that. And, and it still hasn't taken off, you know?
[00:22:26] And it, and my, my former partner actually did a pivot. So now that are the original ideas that I had. Are not really even there anymore. Mm. And that doesn't feel terrific, you know, but at the same time, I know that I learned a lot in that process and now I learned what not to do. And, and then prior to that same thing, I tried to start something on my own.
[00:22:46] It didn't work out. Luckily I had a lot to fall back on, you know, in both situations mm-hmm, but you know, it is, it's really tough to keep going after that. I think that's why the micro goals are important. then, you know, as I said, sometimes you just need a win, you know? And so oh, absolutely. If we keep getting LS, then we just start getting bogged down.
[00:23:07] Right. 
[00:23:08] Blake: yeah, yeah, exactly. I, and you know, I think it's all perspective too, because a lot of people, you know, if, if we were just more willing to, to own our places where we're like, Hey, this didn't work out the way that I had envisioned it, but I learned so much. I think that would give everybody a lot of confidence to be able.
[00:23:27] You know, not beat themselves up so much. Yeah, so agree. Yeah. , 
[00:23:35] Kristin: it is it's tough. You know, I spoke to some elementary schoolers a couple of weeks ago about well they'd asked me to come in to talk. It was for career day and I was like, well, which career? So, but we ended up talking about just entrepreneurship in general and a little bit about law and it was interesting.
[00:23:50] Cause like half the. Classes, you know, half the students were interested in law and half the students were interested in asking questions about farms. Oh really? That's cool. Yeah. It's kind of interesting. Yeah. And then they would say very astute things, you know, they'd say, well, don't, you make more money as a lawyer than as a farmer, you know?
[00:24:06] and these are like third graders. But one of the things that I did make sure to say was about, you know, failure, because I think it, it becomes such a taboo word and then people get so afraid of it, then they don't end. Taking, you know, risks, even small ones because they're so afraid of failure. And, you know, I think you're right.
[00:24:27] If we can just like, look at us at a failure as an opportunity to learn things and to do better the next time, then it wouldn't, you know, people might not, people might be more willing to step out and try things. Yeah. 
[00:24:40] Blake: Yeah. Cause I mean, I think that's so great that you spoke to them about that by the way.
[00:24:44] That's really, really that's very cool. You know, for me, I just feel like I, I just realized a while ago, you know, I was lucky talking to a mentor and helping me realize that if you don't fail, then you're probably not pushing your threshold either. Do you know? true. Yeah, yeah. To do something, especially like what you're doing, you know, and, and diving into so many different areas.
[00:25:07] What were some of the kind of takeaways that you got whenever you, you know, tried to start your own thing and, you know, went into the, went into the next cuz I'm sure it informed so much, so many other things and everything sort of this, you know, bunny trail effect where you bounce around and it gives you all these new ideas.
[00:25:23] Yeah. What, were some of your takeaways you think? 
[00:25:24] Kristin: I think the number one for the two endeavors that, you know, didn't, didn't turn out the way I planned. And, I actually did quit my day job in order to pursue them. And so I think that that, as I said earlier, patients kind of, it, it sort of reminded me that I have to be patient.
[00:25:45] It's tough though because you know, even with the farm, you know, there's so much that I want to do and that, I know that if I didn't have another full-time job, I'd probably be able to move forward with, but then, you know, I just have to. I think I've learned. And, and this is, I'm not saying this is true of everyone.
[00:26:03] It's more true for me because I also have financial obligations to my family. You know, I have three kids and my husband is an entrepreneur. And so, you know, I what I learned though, is that I need to, you know, sort of first and foremost most think about the financial stability of my family. And so that exercising patience and knowing when to make the jump from corporate to owning my own business is something that I've learned from those two experiences.
[00:26:32] And then the second is listening, I think more too. Your team. So the businesses I tried to start, you know, I, I went into and I was like, I'm full of ideas and I just wanna share them with the world. sure. Yeah. I think if I had more and, and that's not bad to be full of ideas, but I think in hindsight, you know, if I had just maybe taken a little more time to say, well, what do you think?
[00:26:55] You know, mm-hmm then you know, I could have gleaned some different ideas. And so I think the farming. The farming thing has been really good because I go in knowing nothing. mm-hmm so, yeah, it's almost like I'm just a baby and I'm going in know nothing. All I know is that I have a little bit of, you know, capital, and I've got ideas, but I don't know anything or whether my ideas will work.
[00:27:18] And so there's something very, very like liberating about that to go in as a blank slate and to be willing, to just accept new knowledge. 
[00:27:28] Blake: Yeah. It's cuz it's so. It's so vulnerable and it's such a place where I feel like you would have the opportunity to consider perspectives. You never would've encountered it in your entire life.
[00:27:41] Otherwise 
[00:27:43] Kristin: 1000%. I mean, it's really, I mean, even just from a, like, you know, I grew up in Metro Atlanta, I've got, you know, I, I did the whole, you know, school, college thing in Metro, Atlanta, and the city. And farming has brought me to areas of Georgia that I would never have gone to. It's put me in, you know, great conversations with people that I might never have met.
[00:28:08] And I think there's a lot of value in that. And so I, you know, I feel like that's that hasn't just made me, you know, just a better business owner. It's real, it's maybe a better lawyer as well. I think in the sense that I, you know, you know, empathy, I think is one thing. Now, you know, a lot of law schools are trying to figure out how to, instill that, in future lawyers.
[00:28:29] And I think that that is something that, that this whole farming experience has sort of, you know, honed inside of me is that ability to, to see the commonalities and other people and to, to empathize, too, to just get along with them. So yeah, it's been really, it's been a really nice experience. To, to have that.
[00:28:48] So I'm happy for the failures. Hoping this third time is a charm and it doesn't fail. , 
[00:28:55] Blake: you know, I think it, I, it sounds like it's, it's gonna be great from two acres to now you're at 40 acres. Next time it'll be another 100 acres. I'm excited to see have What's the craziest thing that you've encountered on the farm so far, is any, anything super, super bizarre that you've dealt with out there.
[00:29:17] Kristin: oh my gosh. There are so many, let's see. Well, the most recent thing. So I've decided that one of the types of meat that I'd like to focus on is. And just to, I'm gonna give my farm a little bit of a plug. We're not ready to start selling meat yet, but I'm very committed to raising pigs on pasture, and wow.
[00:29:36] You know, not locking them up in some kind of like, you know, some kind of housing, some kind of shelter, and then putting the sows and in a farrowing cage where they live and can't even turn around. I mean, that's. Commercial farming is like, right. So depressing. I'm sure. Very depressing. I mean, for me doesn't fit my values.
[00:29:55] So, you know, I'm very committed to raising pigs on pasture and I've learned so much about pigs in the last 18 months and finally have my breeding, the breeds that I wanted and sort of like my breeding hairs and I got this beautiful 500-pound boar and him. Is he wonderful? He's a, he's a full-bred Hamshire boar, which is like good for making bacon.
[00:30:19] He would be our, you know, like ours, our herd sire. So he'd be like the head of that, that breed. And we'd never process him, but you know, definitely have underestimated how smart paints are. And we had him in this 10 and he He was able to, it was all locked up. It was hog panels, which are like stronger.
[00:30:39] They're made to keep hos in. Well, he went under the gate, lifted it up and removed himself from the pan, let out the Sal who and his, he has one child pig. That's his, his, his child. They all got out and then proceeded to let out the goats and the cow. Oh, are you serious? yes. And not. And the, and two bunnies so oh my gosh.
[00:31:04] I, gosh, I wasn't there, but thankful. I mean, I wasn't there, but I'm getting calls and my office and people are, you know, my farm manager's like this, the paid got out, you know, he's a 500 pound bore. He's about two and a half feet. 
[00:31:17] Blake: Huge. Oh my gosh. I think I, and 
[00:31:19] Kristin: then Sal was standing in the middle of the street.
[00:31:22] And so anyway, in the middle of my day in my office, I'm kind of in also fielding calls about that. And so that was, you know, those were things that I never really imagined I would deal with, but then it was kinda like, you know, it's not really that different. We have. Problems, you know, in law I feel like we have very similar, similar, not related to animals, but you know, just, just things that just feel like you can't, you can't believe that this is happening 
[00:31:48] Blake: And you're like, you're like, I have so little control over this right now.
[00:31:52] There's like so much going on. That's yes. That's pretty incredible. I, I never would thought would think that pig. He was like going full animal liberation mode on you. You know, I 
[00:32:03] Kristin: don't even know how to let the cows out. I mean, it was just, it was just crazy, but, you know, they're, they're, they're really intelligent animals, very emotional.
[00:32:12] And that's why, you know, some people will say to me, how do you feel? How can you, you know, butcher, your own animals? And you've got the knowledge, and I said, Ashley, I feel like I'm doing a good service toward them because I treat them well. In life. I respect them. Yeah. I wanna make sure they have the best life possible.
[00:32:30] And I recognize that in the circle of life, you know, this is just how, at least if you need me, you know, this is how it is, but at least I have control over how it's done and how they're raised. Yeah. And so, you know, that's, that's really important to me. So I have a lot of respect for pigs. They are, they're pretty, they're very crafty animals.
[00:32:50] Blake: Yeah, they really are. No, that's, that's really cool. And it sounds like you're doing it in a way that's so sustainable and you know, giving, giving them a shot at, at you know, having a, you just want, you want the animals to have a happy life and you know, that's something. My yeah, my, my, my wife is always, always researching and looking into some of the farms that have some of the best practices out there.
[00:33:12] And it's really neat to see what people are doing in terms of like, I don't know, just taking this whole more natural way of living for animals and recognizing the real circle of life, how that would, how that would work, you know? Yeah. Have you heard of white Oak? Oh, sorry. Go ahead. White Oak 
[00:33:27] Kristin: pastures.
[00:33:28] Yeah. In Boston. They're amazing. Yeah, I would, that is definitely their goal for me. Why don't past I mean that, I think they have like 176 or 200 something acres. So, but, but they are totally about sustainable farming regenerative. Mm-hmm, giving, putting pigs on pasture, like giving, you know being all-natural, not pumping animals, full of chemicals to make them grow.
[00:33:53] You know, unnaturally fast, things like that. And I, I appreciate that a lot. 
[00:33:58] Blake: Pretty cool. Yeah. So you're talking about fielding calls in the office too. Are your colleagues pretty supportive of you and, or do you, do you, do you share that part of, or you do, you kind of keep it church and state kind of situation?
[00:34:11] Kristin: I share it with them. I, I think. I, I guess I, and I don't know if this is a, you know, I say this now, and maybe after I finish this, I'll get off and HR will call me and say something, but I, I tend to not hide who I am at work. Yeah. In the corporate setting. I spent, you know, the first 5, 6, 7, and 8 years of my career as a lawyer, trying to mold myself to be what a law firm wanted me to be.
[00:34:41] Trying to be, you know just, you know, not cause trouble trying to overachieve and I've found that that doesn't always lead to anything mm-hmm good. and so now I've, you know, decided that you know, farming is part of me and I've told my, my boss that, you know, someday I will be a full-time farmer. And I've, you know, tried to put pieces into place to move toward that.
[00:35:07] I know it won't happen now and, but I, you know, I, you know, they understand that as long as I'm doing, I'm doing everything I can to get the work done that, you know, there, that I'm going to have this farm and I'm gonna keep on working toward it. So my colleagues are really supportive. As long as I'm not putting more work on them.
[00:35:24] To do it. I think that they are, they're fine with it. You know, some of them think it's interesting or they ask a lot of questions or these things I'm weird, which is fine. 
[00:35:34] Blake: yeah, I can, I can deal with that too. 
[00:35:37] Kristin: I mean, yeah. I've kind of gotten to the point where it doesn't, it doesn't matter, you know? It's yeah.
[00:35:42] I I don't know. I feel like we spend a lot of time trying to turn ourselves into something else, you know, for the benefit of some. Organization or some corporation and yeah, I don't, I don't know why, so I hope that you know, as we build the farm and I'm able to build my own business, I'd like to incorporate into my business that, you know, you should be yourself, you should bring your best self to work and be your best self, or be your authentic self at work, you know?
[00:36:09] And then really like have that, not just say it, but really have that in the organization. 
[00:36:15] Blake: Absolutely. Yeah. I mean, it sounds like you really have consistently bet on yourself you know, with that, like, what's your, what's your, I guess mindset or I, I, cuz I guess what I'm thinking about right. Is people that never get out of that realization or do they never find that realization that Hey.
[00:36:34] I can try to mold myself all I want, but at the end of the day, it doesn't really lead to anything, anything better for me necessarily. And probably the best, you know, this is gonna be like an after-school special here, but the best, the best version of yourself you can bring is your exact self who you are, you know?
[00:36:53] So, yeah. What, do you think has always propelled or led you to kind of bet on yourself? What do you think? Hmm.
[00:36:59] Kristin: I think having the supportive, like the village of people around I've become and not just like, like people who always say yes like I don't want yes. People. I mean, people who really care about my, you know, my growth as a person and who give me constructive feedback and who like really take time to give me like thoughtful.
[00:37:25] Guidance. I think that has helped a lot. Because, and then I think I've also, you know, as you get older, hopefully, you know, you start to identify, who's not going to do that for you, and you kind of cut start to cut that out. And so that has, that has sort of given me the confidence to, to bet on myself and, and you know, I also think that, you know, having.
[00:37:47] I'm very like involved, obviously with my family and then with my community and sort of having that sense that like there's a, you're part of a community and that community relies on you to be a productive part of it. You know, when and the same with my family, right. My family relies on me to be a productive part of my family and have that accountability.
[00:38:07] I think it kind of forces you to, to you, become accountable to others, but you also become accountable to you. And so I recognize that like, I'm trying to think of it. Like, so for example, with the farm, a lot of my disposable income is going into this and I have to continue, you know, putting into it, even if it's not easy, which it doesn't continue putting into it and trying to build it because now I recognize that whatever I've taken.
[00:38:36] You know, financially my family really is going back into this farm. And so I'm, I'm betting on myself, which means, and I'm betting on this farm and I'm, and I'm, you know, maybe sacrificing a little bit of what could be given to my children. And when you look at it that way, then you think I have to go forward with this, you know?
[00:38:55] Yeah. And then I also have to know when, when not to go forward, but you know, that, I think that sense of accountability helps a lot for me. 
[00:39:02] Blake: No, that's, I think that's, that makes so much sense, you know, a healthy sense of accountability because it just changes the perspective and allows you to, to, to look at it from a, from a, a viewpoint where you're gonna be like you know, the stakes are, the stakes are big, you know, and, and lets you know, and, and there's no reason for me to there's.
[00:39:20] There's. No. There's no reason for me not to, you know, not to thrive. When I look at the O when I look at, you know, exactly what I have got going on right now, I don't know it, it gets me. I, I, I always get so excited thinking about it. Holding yourself to a higher standard like that, because I think that it just, you know, it it's something that can bring about a lot of really amazing change.
[00:39:43] You also talked a lot about community and that's something that obviously I think is so special. So it sounds like you have a pretty good group of peers around you that you can rely on and, and talk to 
[00:39:54] Kristin: I do. I do. I, you know, I think one of. My favorite thing to say is that you know, I had a choice whether I wanted to come back to Atlanta to practice law or go elsewhere.
[00:40:07] Sorry about that. Oh, no, no. And so I came back to Atlanta and I'm so glad that I did because I have a community here. And you know, the legal community that, especially the Asian legal community has been really wonderful and close-knit. Some of my best, you know, my best friends are in that. And. Some of the places that I've worked, I'm still in contact with, you know, paralegals that have worked for me.
[00:40:28] I still, you know, are now lawyers who are far exceeding anything that I've ever done. Wow. And I still talk to them, you know, and it's just, that's incredible. It is, it's really, I feel fortunate to still have those connections. And now this farming community, you know, I've kind of started to find friends in the farming community and, but then, you know, the community as a whole You know, I've been involved in like community service work and set on boards and all these things.
[00:40:54] And, you know, I feel like once you start putting yourself out there like that, you know, it creates that sense of accountability, right. Because you're actually now you're in it and you've committed to being in it. And so now you feel. You have that you've like already, you know, you're sort of have to do it, not in a, in a bad way, but in a way that says, okay, these people are betting on me and they're relying on me.
[00:41:17] And so I need to bet on myself and yeah. And so it's just, you know, and I, I do wanna say though, that there's a balance, you know have you seen the movie and con. I, no, 
[00:41:29] Blake: I have 
[00:41:30] Kristin: not. No, I have not. No. Well, there's a song in there. Sorry. If I'm like going off on a tangent, there's a song in there called no, this is great.
[00:41:37] It's about one of the sisters having a power of like extra strength. Anyway, she. She has a song called service pressure and she talks about how she's always, you know, she's always under so much pressure even because she's the strongest sister mm-hmm. And I do think that there's a balance of strike there, which is just because, you know, it is great to hold yourself to a higher standard.
[00:41:56] Great. To be, to feel accountable. , but it's also good to be kind to yourself. Right. And understand that you can't, sometimes you're going to fall short. Sometimes you're going to need help. Mm-hmm often you're gonna need help. But, you know, I think that it all kind of comes together because what I found is that when the people who, you know, who I feel accountable to, you know when I go to them and I say, you know what?
[00:42:20] I actually really need help right now. I'm kind of struggling, right? It's not that they then turn their back. So they're like, oh, you know, Kristen is weak. I don't wanna talk to her anymore. It's actually quite the opposite. They fill you. Mm-hmm, you know, they fill your cut back up when it's empty. And so, you know, and I think a lot of I've met people who don't realize that you know, getting, having a village, you know, isn't just like a, you have to present yourself as like always the person who's strong and who's winning and winning all the time.
[00:42:51] They actually do appreciate when you are, or they're there for you and they can help you when you are actually not winning. Yeah. Yeah. And so, you know, I think that's really, that's really important to me. And that's why community is so important to me cuz they really filled me up in times when I've been running on empty.
[00:43:09] Blake: Absolutely. No, that's I think that's So incredible. And also something that I rely on so much too. In the sense of, yeah, absolutely. I mean, I, I. Just think about what life would be like without that. And I mean, you know, when you just try to figure out the meaning to life or whatever, that's probably one of the biggest reasons to, you know, to me to exist, you know, is getting to, getting to, you know, not only support others but then, you know, know that there's somebody that's there that, you know, it will at the drop of a hat help you out.
[00:43:43] If you say anything, you know, it's really, it's really pretty incredible. But, you know, I, I, I think that I think that for you, I, something that I just wanna say is you do so much. I, I think you even just mentioned you do volunteer work as well. And you're, just from this conversation, you're extremely humble about it all.
[00:44:02] You know, I, I, I think it's pretty cool that you've done so much in your life and, and gone down so many, so many different, different avenues. What would you say is maybe your. I guess favorite part of what you do right now. I know that's kind of a big, big question, but is there, is there anything that stands out even in the top, the top three things, and maybe more specifically, what's your favorite?
[00:44:26] Yeah. What's your favorite reason for being in the legal world? Do you think in legal? Yeah, that too. 
[00:44:31] Kristin: Okay. So legal, my favorite thing still is to this day
[00:44:37] Collaboration with really innovative and open-minded people mm-hmm I, I get to do that, especially with the particular technol with technology clients because they, you know, that's what they do, right. They innovate and that's still one of my favorite things, you know, trying to find ways to address efficiency.
[00:45:00] But then it's just that it's that, that sort of, that energy that you get in a room when people are, they're like, okay, we have a problem. We're going to tackle it together. Mm-hmm and I, I do work best in situations where people are coming together, like in a war room. And then they're like, okay, what's our problem.
[00:45:19] Let's like, have a whiteboard session and sketch out, you know, that that's, that's the way that I work back. So you thrive 
[00:45:26] Blake: under 
[00:45:26] Kristin: high-pressure scenarios. Definitely. definitely. This is why both, I guess, farming and lawyering are good. Good. good matches for me. Yeah. And then on the farming side, I mean, you need specifically ask about legal, but on the farming side, I mean, my favorite today is when something is born, when animals are born.
[00:45:43] So we just had our first litter of piglets put on the farm. We had nine. Oh, my gosh. And yes, there they belong to the big pig that escaped but has nine healthy piglets. And, you know, we've had chicks born on the farm puppies lamb, baby goats. And that has. That just never gets old, you know?
[00:46:08] No, that, that, that, that feeling that life is being created there. And, you know, of course, then there's the anxiety of making sure that they stay alive. Mm-hmm, sure that that will never, ever get old to me. And I think, you know, it's, it almost like rejuvenates me when it happens. So, so I would say that's my, you know, those are my two sorts of favorite things with respect to the.
[00:46:29] Careers, I guess I'm wowed. I'm doubling right now. 
[00:46:32] Blake: Yeah, no, that's, I, I, I can't even imagine being a part of seeing so much new life born around you. I think that would be. Yeah, really special. You know, and I think something that I was you know, whenever, whenever I hear this too, I'm gonna bring it back again.
[00:46:47] You know, what would you, yeah, I guess what would you tell to somebody who's curious about doing life, sort of the way that, that you do? Is there any kind of insights you could give to somebody? 
[00:46:58] Kristin: Yeah, I would say. I would say that it's important to see opportunity in places where you wouldn't normally think it's there.
[00:47:09] So you know, I have so many examples of this. My life. And, you know, I, I mean, sometimes I'm like maybe, you know, some, is it luck or is it just perspective? Like I saw it as an opportunity. Whereas someone else might have not even seen it as anything, you know? But I I do think that trying to.
[00:47:31] Look at, you know, whatever happens to you on a daily basis as a particular opportunity, it can be really helpful. So I guess if I can just give a, like the most recent example of that would be the additional 38 acres that we are that's part of the farm. You know, the reason. So I ended up getting a lot more out of that transaction than I expected.
[00:47:53] And the reason that I did was just that I happened to get stuck in a truck in the pasture with the owners. Of the land and they, I got stuck with them for about an hour and a half. And, you know, spent that time, you know, I didn't wanna leave them because they were a little older and I didn't wanna leave them alone in the PA you know, in this truck, in the middle of the pasture.
[00:48:14] So I waited with them till a tow truck could get there. There was no tractor nearby that could pull them out so I and I ended up spending a lot of time with them and talking to them and they had always dreamt of turning that land, which had been passed down through them. They always dreamed of turning it into a farm, but their kids didn't want to.
[00:48:31] And, you know, they weren't, their grandkids didn't want to, and, and they couldn't do it anymore. And so it turned out, working out really well for me, because that's that, you know, that that's exactly what I wanted to do. Yeah. And so, you know I know it's very, and you wouldn't happen, right? Like, so it's, so it seems so lucky and it's not like they just gave me the land or anything like that.
[00:48:52] Like, you know, but it was sure, sure. It was just. , you know, as it, you know, in that conversation, you know, when I was talking to them, it's just that, you know, well, it wasn't that I was in there and I was like, well, let me see if I can try to squeeze some Goodwill out of these folks. So that they'll sell me there later.
[00:49:06] I mean, I was already looking to buy it. Yeah. But it was that opportunity to spend some time with some people who I probably would not have met otherwise. Right. Mm-hmm and to try to. Things that we have in common and, to ask them what their dreams are or what their goals are, what they're up to in their own lives.
[00:49:23] And I think all of that, you know, it became itself, became an opportunity. And so, you know, I think a lot of times folks might miss opportunities. And I tell this to my husband all the time. Cause he's not quite as he doesn't wear the same rose colored glasses that I do all the time. Yeah. But he, you know, I always say, you know, this was an opportunity, like, you know, maybe go for it and.
[00:49:43] You hear this a lot, but what's the worst that can happen. Someone says no, you know, and then you move on that's yeah, no, not a terrible word. 
[00:49:52] Blake: no, so no, absolutely. No, I like that. You said the rose-colored glasses, I think is what you said and just, you know, I think of SOC you know, in sociology, you can have, they call it the sociological lens, which is essentially looking through the world through the viewpoint of, you know, recognizing that there are different structures.
[00:50:10] Make up the way society functions and all that. But I think that applies to really anything and especially with opportunity. And when you have a mindset that is able to view opportunity and is open-minded, it is, it is kind of like wearing a set of lenses, having some sort of lens in front of you.
[00:50:27] And it, it, it opens up a lot of doors. So I, no, I love, I love that. , 
[00:50:34] Kristin: it's very, it's been, it's been really helpful to me and, you know I think like, even if it, cuz I recognize and we're all built differently. Right. But you know, I'll tell some of my mentees this, like maybe, you know, cuz they'll say I don't want, you know, I don't, I'm not good at networking.
[00:50:49] I'm shy. I don't, you know, like to just talk to just all these people about like, you know, random things and small talk, you know, which I get, you know, not everybody likes that, but then it's like, okay, well. Then go into it like this way, like, look at your, think about who's going to be there. See if you can, you know, a lot of times you can get a guest list or something mm-hmm, you gotta get a sense of who's sponsoring and who might be there and then make it very targeted and almost approach it like a, you know, like an experiment or like a science experiment or something where you are, you've got a very specific question or goal, you know, questions that you need to get answered or goal that you need to ATT.
[00:51:25] And then go into it that way with a, you know, and keep it sort of like micro level so that you don't feel like you have to go in and shake every hand in the room. And that makes it a little bit more you know, a little bit more doable for some folks. and, and so, you know, and I tell 'em that, and I think that helps.
[00:51:41] And so, you know, that's kind of the way I approach things is, you know, I don't, if I'm going to go, if I'm going to attend something, I'm not necessarily going to think, oh, if I attend this, then someone is going to buy my startup. You know, it's not usually that that happens to some people that certainly never happen to me.
[00:51:57] Sure. But it's more like if I attend this, I might meet somebody who maybe will know somebody later. Who might buy my startup or something even more removed than that? So but yeah, that's been, that's been, my that's been my greatest lesson so far, I think is opportunity is everywhere. Yeah, 
[00:52:14] Blake: that is a, a great lesson.
[00:52:16] It also just makes life a little more exciting, I think. Right. 
[00:52:19] Kristin: doesn't it.
[00:52:23] I think if you go into each day, cause they start to all run together, you know, I feel like eventually, but if you go into each one thing, there is an opportunity for something to happen today, then, you know, it can, it can make it a little bit easier to get out of bed when the alarm goes. 
[00:52:40] Blake: Absolutely. Well, Kristen, it has been an absolute pleasure getting to talk to you.
[00:52:45] I really appreciate you sharing so much of this with everybody and with me, it's great. 
[00:52:50] Kristin: No problem at all. And I hope that you and your wife can come to visit the farm. 
[00:52:54] Blake: I, I would love to, I would love to. I was about to invite myself. So thank you. I would, I would, I would love to come to check it out. Is there anything that, that you'd like, to plug in or announce to anybody?
[00:53:05] And, you know, I'd love to share that with the audience too. 
[00:53:08] Kristin: Not yet, not yet. I will say that, you know, like I said, on the farming side, we'll be making meat products, but it's going to be a little bit of a process. So just, just keep an eye out. And you know, when there's an announcement to make, we'll definitely make it.
[00:53:25] Blake: Absolutely. All right. Well, Hey, thanks, Kristen. It was greasignificantgreat to chat with you. Thank you, you too. 
[00:53:31] Kristin: Thanks, bye.
[00:53:37] Blake: Thank you for joining us on this episode of the G.E.M series, the podcast for anybody dedicated to investing in themselves. If you'd like to see the resources mentioned in this episode, learn more about what we are up to at a rocket level, or come over and join our team. Just click on the links below until next time.
[00:53:53] This is Blake Chapman, and remember to be awesome and do awesome things.