Athena :	00:00:04	Have you been zombified by natural disasters?
Dave:	00:00:10	You know, fortunately, I have only ever gotten like snow days 
where we get to like stay in or like a hurricane would hit, like, 
and then we would- you know, up in Pennsylvania, we'd like our 
power would go out and we'd sit around and play board games. 
So I've never really had to be in the middle of a true natural 
disaster. How about you?
Athena :	00:00:31	No, not really. I mean, I, you know, we had snow days, I grew up 
in the suburbs of Chicago. Um, so we had snow days and- but 
there was never really a time where I was really worried, um, 
about my health or safety. So I think, you know, I'm super lucky, 
especially given how so many parts of the country are being hit 
by natural disasters right now.
Dave:	00:00:54	That's true, right now it's like all over the place. So, um, but- and 
we're gonna, we're gonna go into talking about some of the 
ways people help each other during these natural disasters. But 
first [Athena agrees] we should probably say who we are.
Athena :	00:01:07	Yeah. Well, welcome everybody to the Zombified Podcast. We 
are your source for fresh brains. I'm your host, Athena Aktipis, 
psychology professor at ASU and chair of the Zombie 
Apocalypse Medicine Alliance.
Dave:	00:01:21	And I am your co-host, Dave Lundberg-Kenrick, Media Outreach 
Program Manager at the psych department at ASU and brain 
and apocalypse enthusiast.
Athena :	00:01:31	Yes. Brains, apocalypses, um, they go together. They go 
together well, cause you know, in an apocalypse you need 
brains.
Dave:	00:01:38	That's true. You do, you need brains and you can sort of use 
your brains to help other people, um--
Athena:	00:01:43	Yeah.
Dave:	00:01:43	--which is sorta what our guest does, right?
Athena :	00:01:47	Yeah. This, this episode definitely leans slightly apocalyptic. Um, 
we're- we talk with Clyde Kane, who is, um, one of the people 
who runs the Louisiana Cajun Navy, which is a group of people 
who are, um, civilians that have decided that they, uh, want to 
risk their lives and spend their time and resources and money 
helping to rescue people, uh, when hurricanes hit. So they're a 
really interesting group of people who are, um, you know, really 
motivated by, um, well, you'll have to listen, I guess, to hear 
what motivates them.
Dave:	00:02:25	Well, it sounds both inspirational and a little scary, so it sounds 
awesome.
Athena :	00:02:30	Yeah. Yeah, it is. Um, both like, you know, if you want to feel 
optimistic about human nature, um, listen to this episode and if 
you want to be terrified by, you know, the realities of real life 
apocalypses, you should listen to this episode.
Dave:	00:02:45	Sure, it's like the upside of human nature and the downside of 
nature nature.
Athena :	00:02:50	[Athena laughs] That's a great way to put it.
Dave:	00:02:51	All right. Cool. Um, what's your favorite part of the episode?
Athena :	00:02:56	I-I love when Clyde gets into his storytelling mode and, you 
know, really kind of paints a picture of what it's like to be in 
these really challenging weather conditions, trying to rescue 
people, sometimes people who might not want to be rescued 
actually.
Dave:	00:03:13	Oh, interesting. All right.
Athena:	00:03:16	Well, let's hear from this week's fresh brain: Clyde Cain.
Intro:	00:03:21	[Psychological by Lemi]
Athena :	00:03:59	Clyde, would you introduce yourself in your own words for us?
Clyde:	00:04:01	In my own words?
Athena:	00:04:03	In your own words.
Clyde:	00:04:03	I won't use anybody else. [Athena laughs] Uh, my name is Clyde 
Cain and I am CEO and founder of Louisiana Cajun Navy and 
Louisiana Storm Patrol, our nonprofit 501(c)(3) from Hammond, 
Louisiana. And, uh, now I kind of roll where the storms, are sent 
for a down season, like we are right now, but, uh, kind of 
recover from all that stuff.
Athena :	00:04:30	Yeah. And you got a background in lots of different things while 
you were in the music industry for awhile and--
Clyde:	00:04:37	Was the music industry during the nineties or early nineties, uh, 
was a merchandise, um, for I-I managed merchandise person or 
merchandise manager for, uh, several companies. I worked 
with, uh, one of my best friends, uh, Herman Chrome, who 
worked for Broka Merchandise in great Southern- completely a 
big conglomerate vendors and, uh, and merchandisers. And 
they, they brokered bands like Poison, Great White, um, Iron 
Maiden - I think Iron Maiden was the first band I worked for. 
And we just hauled their merchandise from show to show. And 
sometimes we actually vended and we had to sell the 
merchandise too, but for the most part it was management on 
the road.
Athena :	00:05:18	And now you're bringing that together with the--
Clyde:	00:05:19	Yeah.
Athena:	00:05:19	--Cajun Navy work.
Clyde:	00:05:19	Well, I've always, since then, I've always had my own apparel. I 
made my own apparel, uh, also worked for t-shirt shops and, 
uh, became a graphic designer that way, printing, uh, color 
separating and getting, you know, just coming up with my own 
designs. I worked for the Superdome for about a year or so 
selling, uh, selling and managing the merchandise there. And, 
um, that didn't last too long because I didn't like the designs 
they were selling and kind of offered myself up as a person to 
help redesign. Well, they [Athena agrees] don't take kindly to 
you not having a degree, which so I told him, I'd see him in the 
parking lot. And from 2006 to 2010, um, I sold t-shirts the Saints 
fans and New Orleans, uh, fans, um, my own designs I made, 
which one of them was Storm Patrol which is now my 501(c)(3).
Athena:	00:06:13	Awesome.
Clyde:	00:06:14	So art life does imitate art.
Athena :	00:06:16	Yeah. Right. Well, so can, can you tell us a little bit about what 
the Cajun Navy is just in the first place? Like w-what is it?
Clyde:	00:06:26	The Cajun Navy, um, well several, uh, several definitions. First of 
all, the Cajun Navy, let's start with how the Cajun Navy started. 
Cajun Navy, a bunch of guys, women, and men from all walks of 
life. We're talking doctors, whoever that would vote on it. So 
Louisiana got in a boat and they went down on a action call, call 
to action by a state representative I believe to aid the- the 
rescue of thousands of people in, in Hurricane Katrina in New 
Orleans. And the media quickly dubbed everyone that was in 
the boats, Cajun Navy. Um, so as time went on several more 
instance in fact, there was another hurricane right back to back 
with that was Rita. And some more guys got in boats because 
that's what they have access to, and they do, and they rescued 
their neighbors. And we went on to, um, to- we helped them 
long-term. Fast forward to 2016. We had the big, great flood of 
new- of Baton Rouge and, uh, surrounding areas. And I kinda 
just, this kind of happened to me this part, where I got into the 
boat and started doing the, the boat end of, of rescuing, uh, 
and, uh, doing long-term. At that point, the Cajun Navy name 
had actually several groups that tried to organize it, and, uh, we 
also, uh, organized our group, which has now grown on going 
up to have, uh, about 309,000 followers. And a lot of people 
have misconceptions of who the Cajun Navy is. They think it's 
just one big, large group, or, um, or you have to be Cajun to be 
in it or just stuff like that. But it's really, what I believe it to be 
and what it's, what it's, it's very apparent that it is, is it's a 
mindset, you know, of people that, uh, that wanting that- if they 
have the, the ability and they have the equipment that they get 
out there and they, they aid in the rescue of, um, their 
neighbors and any of the surrounding areas. And now traveling 
abroad also to do the same thing. Um, it's just, uh, like I said, it's 
a mindset. Cajun actually is a mindset. If you move down from 
where you're from and, uh, got there, you know, after about a 
year, maybe you would be hanging out with your neighbors and 
someone has a pot of gumbo, whatever they didn't invite you 
over. You know, it's just a, it's a, it's a fellowship type view.
Athena :	00:08:47	I spent a bunch of my adolescence part of, um, a little sort of 
pocket of Cajun culture in the suburbs of Chicago. [Clyde 
agrees] Cause my best friend, um, was in a family band that was 
a Cajun band and I would go along on their shows and guess 
what I was doing? I was selling them t-shirts. [Laughter] So, so 
that was my, like, um, adolescent introduction to like partying 
was, you know, eating gumbo and listening to zydeco. That was 
my--
Clyde:	00:09:23	Zydeco, jazz, blues.
Athena:	00:09:27	Yeah.
Clyde:	00:09:28	Yeah, it's a different culture. And, and, and, uh, Louisiana of 
course, you know, we're still under the Napoleonic law and- 
which allows a little bit more looseness for what's allowed.
Athena :	00:09:37	Yeah. Can you, can you explain what Napoleonic law is and what 
the implications are?
Clyde:	00:09:41	Yeah. It's French law, you know, and, um, just like in France you 
have parishes. We have parishes instead of counties, we have a 
parish and each parish has course parish president. It's pretty 
much the same as far as when your, your political, um, tiers go. 
But it's different in a sense that it's always just been a little bit 
kind of outside of the regular laws, uh, especially when it comes 
to drinking and being out in, you know, in the public with that, 
there's a lot of loose knit laws there. And a few other things, uh, 
we won't go into the political part of it because I don't like 
discuss politics, especially when you're from Louisiana. [Athena 
laughs] Everybody knows about that. You know, we don't use 
that "c" word, the "corruption" word, but it, I mean, that's, 
that's everywhere. Um, it just allows for a little bit more when 
you're separate and, you know, Texas is same way. Texas, like 
they say, it's its own country and, uh, for most places, but with 
us, it actually is. I mean, we have laws that are, if, if you 
compare them, um, are that, uh, like you're a little bit more gray 
scenarios and stuff like that. Especially like I said, in the, uh, in 
the drinking and a lot of the other stuff that goes on as far as 
the partying goes, um, there's a lot of looseness there. But for 
the most part, the traditional part of it all is, you know, is the, 
uh, the attitude, the welcoming attitude, we welcome 
everybody in and, you know, even in football, you know, just, 
we have, when people come down here, we treat you, I mean, 
especially if you lose and you get drinks bought for you all night 
long, uh, if you went even, you know, if you don't come down 
and just kind of be one of those people that rubs it in, but, you 
know, and then we go someplace else and we expect it to be 
that way. And we don't experience that like in Chicago where 
we had batteries thrown at us and snowballs, and yeah.
Athena:	00:11:20	What?
Clyde:	00:11:20	Yeah. So you get different regions and different people have 
different mindsets. And I know you don't go up north and just 
start talking to people and hug, hug the wife and kind of hug the 
husband, we're all huggers down here, you know? [Athena 
agrees] "Hey, how you doing?" And, uh, you have, there are 
people kind of like, "Whoa, what's wrong. Why are you hugging 
my wife?" [Athena laughs] But, um, it's- it's definitely a 
different, a different culture when it comes to food music and 
to just everything.
Athena :	00:11:44	Right. And so down here, you've got all different groups that are 
sort of loosely organized or more or less organized that identify 
as part of the Cajun Navy, but it's not one big organization.
Clyde:	00:12:01	It's not one big organization. And, you know, a lot of the groups, 
uh, they- each year they do like we do an off season. We try to 
see what we can do better. And we do better than we did last 
year, if we're going to stay in it and do it, you know, we're going 
to respond. And it was kinda one of those things. Once you 
respond, you kind of feel not obligated, but, you know, uh, 
prepared to. And it's kind of something you don't just jump out 
of. Um, it's if you feel like for me, it's like, it's a calling, you 
know, I feel it as a calling and, um, it, it takes all of the talents 
that I have and I can use them in one arena. And it really helps 
me out to be able to use all that energy and those talents and, 
uh, as well as those benefiting from what we do, but it's 
actually, there's, there's gaps. We've shown, we've shown 
emergency agencies that there's gaps in their, and their, uh, 
preparedness as well as their, uh, their relief efforts. So 
hopefully it hass inspired them to fill those gaps. It's also 
opened the eyes of a lot of, uh, of Americans, as well as around 
the world, as the, you know, that we can make a d-, we can do 
something that doesn't have to rely on waiting on the people 
that are supposed to show up.
Athena :	00:13:07	Yeah. So what is that relationship like between FEMA and 
government and institutions that are in place that are, you 
know, they're performing some role in the disaster and then 
were you and other, you know, Cajun Navy has kind of come in 
and how does that, how does that roll out?
Clyde:	00:13:27	Again, that rolls out that usually works out depending on the 
individual group, you know, and their, and their attitude. Um, 
for us, it's always been we're second responders. We just 
happen to be, those tables turned on us in Houston because the 
first responders were inundated and flooded in. So we were 
actually rescuing both, you know, and then-
Athena :	00:13:47	When you say rescuing both-
Clyde:	00:13:48	We were both, rescue both, uh, civilians and first responders--
Athena:	00:13:51	Really?
Clyde:	00:13:51	--to get out, to help, you know, and, and making a way, and 
actually, uh, aiding them with our equipment and our boats to 
help them rescue, um, you know, their citizens and, uh, uh, in 
Texas. So, and it, it, it really- you either accept, or you're not 
some places, you know, of course they don't, they don't want 
your help. Um, are, they're just, they've got a bad taste in their 
mouth cause maybe a different group or something did 
something that this was like, you know, they just generalize it. 
So we just don't want any Cajun navies in here. And, uh, and it's, 
it's also an opening. They have to be careful with the groups 
they let in because there's openings for people that do looting. 
You know what I mean? It's not hard to get you a boat and go 
in, and this guy's yourself as one of the rescuers at this point 
and go in and loot as well as, you know, maybe possibly even 
abduct someone.
Athena:	00:14:40	That's really scary.
Clyde:	00:14:40	It is. It is a very scary thing, but you know, I've seen things, you 
know, seen bodies in the water and, you know, they've been 
shot and, you know, these kinds of things, they, it's not 
mainstream media. You're not gonna see it on there. And we 
don't really talk about it for the most part, but it happens. I 
mean, we were shot at in Houston, uh, not by not by one of the 
rescue. Obviously it was just people that were looting and, uh, 
they didn't want our boats over that way. So they shot in the air 
shot towards I'm not really sure, but you know, shots were fired 
and you hear shots fired a lot when you're, when you're out 
there, things are going on. So it is, the world is like the wild 
west.
Athena :	00:15:20	Yeah. And it must be hard to be working in that space where 
people are potentially wary about like the disaster scams or 
there are people who are taking advantage of the situation to 
do crime [Clyde agrees] and you're trying to operate in that 
space to help people.
Clyde:	00:15:37	Yeah, it's, it's, it does make it a little more difficult. Of course, 
you know, being seasoned. I mean, this is my fifth season, full-
time, being out there actually in the hurricane when it's 
happening thereafter. And, uh, so our team's always alert. 
We're, you know, we all wear a certain color shirt. So we looked 
around and we see other boats we'll question them, you know, 
we'll police them and, uh, and make sure that they're not doing 
something, especially in an area we're in the zone we're in, 
because we don't want to fall back on us, but also to protect the 
citizens.
Athena :	00:16:07	Hmm. Yeah. So what for, you brought you into not just being 
part of the, this Cajun Navy, but actually, you know, being in this 
position where you're, you're managing so many people's effort 
and energy and helping to kind of direct the operations. What 
was that progression like for you?
Clyde:	00:16:37	Um, it was gradual. I-I really, you know, a lot of times, you 
know, you read about biblical figures, they were put in positions 
like Moses was a stutterer. And imagine being told to go tell the 
emperor, "Free my people" when you stutter. And so I feel a lot 
of times, you know, um, I feel, I'm being pulled into a situation, 
whether it's because I'm qualified, most qualified, or there's just 
no qualified people around. And you find that a lot, a lot of 
people are, um, they don't have the confidence to lead, even if 
they are leaders, or- or the confidence taken on, or sometimes 
just have that much guts to just jump in and say, "okay, I'm 
going to do this." And, uh, it does its good points its bad points, 
especially when it's st- start talking about your health. But, um, 
for me it was, it was a gradual thing. And as, as we grew, I just 
adapted to, this is a different type of leadership. I've always 
been in a leadership role in all my jobs, either been a manager, 
credit manager, uh, managing merchandise, managing, um, a 
drug rehab center and all these different types of levels of 
people. And so for me, it's just a matter of, um, uh, just induce 
that into what I'm doing and, and use all my skills. Um, then 
have to, you get positions like in, uh, Rockport, Texas, it was 
decimated, uh, for Harvey. We got there and, uh, somebody 
dropped off two 18 wheelers full of everything, um, pretty 
shrunk wrap. Like they went down the dog pile and everything 
from, for a dog, from a crate to a dog food and all was shrink 
wrapped and dropped off. And I assumed that when the drivers 
got there, they saw there was no place to drop it and not 
wanting to assume a role or make sure that it gets in or go the 
extra mile to talk to someone with a building, they just dropped 
all the pallets to two truckloads. When we got there, we ended 
up having to, first of all, perform security all night, keep people 
from looting, and then getting it in and setting up an operation 
from scratch with the people around us. And everyone's willing 
to help. You just have to, you know, they're looking for 
someone that's leading and if you're the one that's out there 
and you're leading they're gonna follow you until you're just not 
leading right now, take a left turn or right turn. But, uh, I try to 
establish, you know, who the other leaders are around me, 
empower them, empower the people around me. Uh, for the 
most part, the volunteers, just people around, they want to 
help. Again, they're looking for leadership and their leadership, 
and there's all this fear and they don't trust their mayor. They 
don't trust this person out there. They're going to trust a local 
leader or someone that's in the community. And those people 
step up. I find them a lot and, uh, but that's what we go in and 
do we look to empower other people to get things set up and 
then get it flowing and roll out. But for me again, it's just been 
my skill sets. You know, I know I have the skill sets and they just 
fall into place. And when it's happened in the heat of it, you 
know, you're that one, that just knows to go and everyone's 
following you. So you're kinda like, um, I'm it.
Athena :	00:19:26	Yeah. So what does that look like from, you know, you get the, 
the call or the notification that like, it's go, like there's a disaster 
and you're needed to actually being there on the ground. Like 
what's the- what's that process and, you know, who's getting 
mobilized and what's getting, you know, what resources are you 
calling on? And--
Clyde:	00:19:51	So for us, that's pretty easy, pretty easily. Um, I'll make the call 
for our, for our group. And it's usually based on not, you know, 
Clyde thinks we should do this. It's, I've talked to my CFO, I've 
talked to my logistics, I've talked to my boaters. We all decide 
where we should go station up in the event of, you know, 
normally it's hurricanes. So then hurricane coming in-
Athena :	00:20:18	Is there a recent one you could tell us about?
Clyde:	00:20:18	Umm, well there's- there's the last two that came in was, uh, 
Barry, was coming into that was Tropic Storm Barry, and all of 
our Mississippi River was kind of like where everything is right 
now. The Pearl River was staged up to where it was- it was 
going to go, you know, it was going to, going to crash and, uh, it 
was going to be bad, and if Barry would have came straight up 
like it was coming in, it was definitely going to flood everything. 
And then, uh, we all got set up and staged up and set out, made 
a call out, everybody kind of respecting which Cajun Navy's 
where, which group is wearing covered. And of course it came 
in and it was kind of like the coast just aided. It never actually 
came over, so was the traumatic rate of it was supposed to be. 
So again, you know, we don't ever count that as, "Oh, we got all 
ready for nothing." That's a good thing [Athena agrees] in our- 
in our- in our line of work, getting all ready for nothing is great. 
Second, we got ready for, we all got in position. We were here 
in, uh, Mississippi getting ready for, um, hurricane to hit the 
homeless stuff, avail them hurricanes right now. Uh, not Dorian, 
was it?
Athena:	00:21:30	I don't know my hurricanes.
Clyde:	00:21:30	We had Barry? Hrmm, I'm stopped. The last, the last big 
Category 5 that did not enter into the Gulf and set there, tore 
up the Bahamas and took a ride. You know, for the first time I 
watched something go as predicted by the meteorologist, which 
baffled me and will still always baffle me how Category 5 can 
come into Florida. And we called the, you know, the Gulf is the 
hot tub for- for hurricanes. I mean, once it hits it, that Category 
5 would get their life strengthened to something we'd never 
seen before. And it did exactly what the meteorologist said it 
would do. It would just kind of sit there and just kind of skirt off 
up the coast and head back out to the Atlantic. Again, we were, 
we, we were out ready for it to come in and we, again, we 
positioned in stages and we're ready to deploy whichever 
direction it went to. And, uh, I usually ride the dirty in, I go in 
and I watch everything and then tell everybody where to come 
in for the destruction. And now that happened. So this past 
year, it's just been flooding, like it's kind of starting now. But it's 
always call to action. We see it come and we all get in 
agreement that, you know, who's going to be able to go out. We 
get our core group together and then it's all about volunteers in 
that area that are stepping up and on standby. So we try not to 
carry too many people with us and, uh, unless they just strictly 
want to volunteer and have the time, we try to, again, employ 
the people that are- are residents are in the area or that have 
those or whatever they're willing to, to get ready with us and 
begin, uh, stage up with us.
Athena:	00:23:02	Yeah. So the topic of this podcast is zombification-- things that 
kind of take you over. And I'm really curious about how it, how 
it feels when there is a disaster. And you know there are people 
who are in need and you know that you've got the skills to help. 
Do you feel like you have no choice but to go, are you like 
zombified by that situation knowing that you can help? Or is 
there, what is that like psychologically?
Clyde:	00:23:40	Mm hmm. How do you put that words? Um, it's first, it's the 
wrestling with yourself. I mean, you know, at the first season, 
the second season, nothing, you know, to just get out there. It 
was because it was happening to us. It was happening in our 
state. And then right next door, you know, with Harvey, but as 
it's going on again, it's going into my fifth season, full-time, um, 
there's a wrestling, you know, with yourself, as you know, "I 
don't really want to do this another season." Um, you know, uh, 
"I've rescued enough people," uh, you know, and it's, it's, again, 
I'm just wrestling with myself because I know like everyone 
knows when it comes down to why I'm going to deploy, uh, I'm 
going to go where I'm needed, uh, where I'm called to. And 
once you're in it, it's just, it's like anything else, like either the 
game, you don't think about it too long after it's all over with. 
Once you get in there, it's just go and you go and you know 
what to do. And you don't second guess yourself, especially 
after five seasons, but there is that- that preparation time 
where you have your downtime and, you know, sometimes just 
gloomy outside, you get a little depressed and you may think 
about some, you know, some of the things may flashback to, 
well, you know what you've been through and I've been in some 
pretty, uh, well some, some things that shouldn't, I should be 
here today, I shouldn't have made it through. Yeah. So you think 
about those things and you think about, you don't ever think 
about, you know, is it worth it? Uh, it's- it's is no greater love 
than lay down your life for your friend, you know? And when 
you do that, then you get out there and you do that and you 
come back from it. There's that overwhelming sensation and 
feeling that, "Hey man, I was, you know, my existence helps 
help someone else out of a situation that otherwise they might 
not have got out of," but there's that downtime. And I've had 
those moments where I wake up and night terrors and just, you 
know, thinking about it when you, my brain actually starts to 
process everything you've gone through because you're not 
processing a whole lot when you're in there. It's think and move 
all the time. The only time, the only, yeah, the only thing you 
have time for us to think and move. You can't second guess 
yourself, you just got to go with what you know, but, um--
Athena :	00:25:54	And how much of that is like you're sitting there, you're in, 
you're really making a decision versus you're just, you know, 
you're taking it in and you're just, you automatically kind of 
know what to do or the environment is just telling you what you 
need to do?
Clyde:	00:26:09	A combination of all three, you know, you're looking at your 
environment. When we got to Newburn, I got there, and it was 
very apparent that, uh, that everybody that had been told to get 
in their attics weren't going to make it. Um, so we had our boats 
come in right behind me. And I just took off walking into a 
neighborhood that the, uh, water was the storm surge coming 
in it, as I walked into it, it went from high to above my waist.
Athena:	00:26:35	Wow.
Clyde:	00:26:35	And we did get to the one guy I was looking for. There's only 
one that they'd wrote as they wrote down anything more than 
an address. And, uh, you know, went there to get him. He was, 
he was, he wasn't leaving. He, um, he had a messed up ankle, 
but he had gotten managed to get to the second floor, which 
we all knew the water was going to go higher than that. But, 
you know, you can't force somebody to leave on, you know, I 
against their own will, even though you know it's the best thing 
for them. Those are the hard ones we leave behind. And, uh, as 
I was walking out and walking back, I'd realized I had gone 200 
yards with no life vest on. I'd given my life vest to my, uh, fellow 
rescuer. And, you know, started realizing that the water had 
come up higher, the power lies were whipping, and even 
though they're not charged, if one pops loose, it's going to be 
like a whip. It- it can do some damage to you, if not cut you in 
half, cut off a limb.
Athena:	00:27:29	Wowww.
Clyde:	00:27:29	And at that point, you know, you, some of those moments like 
that, when you realize, say, am I going into deep? You know, is 
I've just--
Athena:	00:27:40	For real too deep. [Athena laughs]
Clyde:	00:27:40	Right, right. Way too deep. And, uh, I started putting my arms 
out to stabilize my self because your- your, um, vertigo starts 
setting in when you see the water move and houses and you 
start to get real disoriented. And then on top of that, again, you- 
you start to realize I've just put myself in a very, very dangerous 
situation, um, with my I'm-going-to-go-rescue-this-guy-one-
way-or-another attitude. And, uh, it- it makes you later, I've 
second, I've stopped and second guessed is that the right thing 
to go into? But in the moment it's just like with anybody else 
that runs into a burning fire. So you just do it because, you 
know, you- it's innate instinct just tells you, "Hey, I can do this. I 
can make it out." It doesn't always work out that way, but I have 
not been in those those situations. So yeah, it does. It has 
changed the way I think over the years, but, uh, at first it's just, 
you know, you just go, go and get and rescue, and you don't 
think about your own safety except for be careful. And, uh, the 
last thing you want to think about is, you know, calling moms 
say "mom this is probably last time I'm going to talk to you," just 
that things. Although you realize that when you get out there 
like mass, or to go with mom on this one, those things cross 
your mind. But, um, it's, it's definitely not something that I've 
advised anybody to ever just do with this, but in a situation, 
someone that has a rescue mentality or has that- that passion in 
their heart, or that compassion for another person, they're 
going to do it, whether it be going, grab them out of a car fire 
on the side of the road, you've heard people doing all the time, 
uh, to doing it, you know, non-stop.
Athena :	00:29:15	Yeah. I want to ask a little more about that because for a lot of 
people, I think it's hard to understand why someone would just 
not even think twice about putting their lives on the line for a 
stranger. And a lot of people who maybe are, you know, trained 
in academia and economics and in evolutionary biology, the, 
you know, the, the first assumption is kind of that self-interest is 
the guiding principle. And then, and maybe you can have 
preferences to take care of others that feed into your, you 
know, satisfying your own needs economically or evolutionarily. 
But this idea that there are a group of people who organize 
themselves and their time and energy and resources to go out 
and save strangers and put their lives on the line too, it's- it's- 
it's I think, uh, a concept or a, just a reality, it's a reality that's 
happening there that might be a little harder for people to 
understand who are from trained in that kind of perspective.
Clyde:	00:30:35	For me, it's harder to understand why they don't understand it 
and I'll tell you why. A soldier does everyday. I mean, he joins 
up, doesn't know where he's going and ends up in a foreign 
country, you know, protecting people he doesn't know, they're 
not even in the same nationality, uh, or her same nationality. 
And, uh, and yet they serve our country to protect people they 
don't know. They're just Americans. To them they're not 
something, I mean, they protect their family, but, but what 
about all the people they don't know? And, uh, so it's, I'm going 
to always say it's in our nature to do that. And some people 
have been just so desensitized by whatever, whether it was the 
way they were raised, you know or, uh, ideals, they were taught 
or just- it's just your personality. You know, you know, 
obviously, you know what I mean? We all have the choice to 
other care or not care. We all were given a choice in all areas of 
life, uh, freedom to choose. And so for me, it's, it's just, it's the 
way I've always been. Now I've always been that person that, 
you know, as a kid, I gave away my toy because he didn't have 
toys, it might have left me without a toy, but I knew he didn't 
have any toys and I would get in trouble for giving away my toys 
or stuff like that. But again, it's hard for me to understand that 
this- this country was founded on biblical principles and the way 
it worked back in the fifties, it was great. I mean, everyone was 
happy to a degree, the way family life was. And suddenly we- 
we- we got away from the, it became, it wasn't small anymore. 
It was bigger. And as we became more populated, ideals and 
things changed, uh, people changed, and we got away from, 
um, that the neighbor- our neighborhood isn't a neighborhood 
anymore. A lot of people, just a lot of people don't know their 
neighbors until the hurricane comes and they meet Joe down 
the road, four houses down, or five houses down. And, uh, then 
after afterwards, I find that there are great relationships in 
these neighborhoods because they've already rebuilt together. 
But, um, again, I- I guess if you think this way, it's hard to 
imagine not thinking this way. And then, you know, I'm sure 
other people that think the other way think, you know, "Hey 
man, it's me or them, it's going to be me" then, you know, I 
mean, again, that's, that's the, uh, uh, afforded choice that 
they've been given and if you're okay with that, then I guess 
that's okay. You know, but I think that, uh, in order, uh, I say this 
all the time, man, America's going to be great when Americans 
make it great again. And, and the world too. You know, when 
everyone gets a hold of that- that thought that, uh, you know, 
my existence can make a difference in someone else's, uh, life 
or death. If I, you know, get outside of myself from it and my 
own little world [Athena agrees] and, uh, you know, make the 
population maybe two or three in my own little world and- and 
begin to look past my issues and my circumstances and what I'm 
going through. And I know one thing that my life, everything I've 
gone through has helped many, and a lot of things I do, behind 
the scenes counseling, uh, whether it be drug counseling, or 
just, you know, uh, marriage counseling, I pretty much authority 
in all that stuff been through it. Might not have a doctorate and, 
uh, on paper, but I've definitely lived it. So I make my time 
available to a lot of people, besides what I do in voluntary 
hours, you know, friends I was just home with one of them now, 
we got together. And, uh, and it's that one thing is, you know, I 
have a lot of friends who they know I'll be there to listen, I'll be 
that iron that sharpens iron. I'm not going to tell you what I 
think you should hear. I'm gonna tell you what you would, the 
truth, will tell you what you need to hear. And, you know, 
people really genuinely want to know the truth and want you to 
tell them the truth and that's, you know, and that's what I do 
when I get to, "Hey guys, no one's showing up here in this 
neighborhood to help you. We didn't have to help each other." 
So I get everyone to help Mr. Maguire help me help you. And 
that's how it works. And people are inspired and hopefully they, 
that carries on, it's not just through that event, like Christmas, 
everyone gets inspired Christmas. And everybody's in that 
loving, giving feeling. And then Christmas is gone. It's funny. 
Everybody just goes back to the way things were.
Athena :	00:34:47	Yeah. So is there a sense of sort of comradery among all of the 
people who are helping during these times, people who are 
identifying as Cajun Navy and working together to save people, 
is there a sort of sense of collective identity that emerges, or 
not so much?
Clyde:	00:35:12	Mmm it once was and we wanted it to be, we even attempted 
to have it to where it was, you know, everyone kind of, if you 
had your own team we still kinda bounced off each other. And 
then it became like a school playground where you know, we're 
the real Cajun Navy, you know, and it, it really got, and I- I 
fought Facebook a lot for that because, you know, it's such a 
social platform that everyone can get on live and do whatever 
and voice their opinions. And so I, I tend to steer clear the social 
media except for the using it of it. Um, there has been times 
where it's gotten really petty and they actually started 
undermining the very thing that we're about, you know, getting 
together, helping each other, yet the groups were divided and, 
uh, spent a lot of, you know, background drama about that. But 
I- I stay clear and clear because that's not the mission, said 
mission behind it, and a lot of the other groups, they just, they, 
they, they did it for this amount of time and they get out and 
then they, you know, everyone's finger pointing at who did 
what and where, and it's, it's not like it's really governed. Um, 
the state tried to govern it, but it's, again, it's a grassroots 
organizations, mine's actually a company. And, um, so there has 
been some bickering amongst the tribes, you know, it's, it's, 
that's typical, but, uh, for the most part, I've been able to stay 
neutral and- and talk to all the guys. Of course, they all voiced 
their opinions about everyone else, but they never tell- tell each 
other, you know, it's fun.
Athena :	00:36:43	So it's kind of a decentralized set of groups. And so within the, 
these particular groups, is there a sense of camaraderie within 
them?
Clyde:	00:36:57	To a degree and you- you, and- and those groups that you see 
that are- are the bickering groups, they usually don't keep 
volunteers too long because they're the bickering goes all the 
way down into the roots of the group. And there's no standard 
set there and that's, you know, one thing, it's like any- any 
company you work for, you go to it. Uh, if you're not a part of 
the solution, you're part of the problem. And if you're negative, 
they're going to get rid of you real quick. You know, if you're, if 
you're behind the scenes talking about the boss or it gets 
around to the boss real quick. So, um, the groups that are succ-, 
I'd say this, the groups that are successful are the ones that 
don't practice those, those, uh, principles of allowing, you know, 
this negativity to go on. The ones that practice good business 
sense, like any company that is successful, they're successful.
Athena :	00:37:42	Um, yeah. I want to circle back around to the zombification 
question. I want to ask you whether when a storm comes and 
it's clear that you're- you're going to have to jump into action, 
you're going to have to get your team and everyone who's 
attached to your extended group to go move into action, is 
there a sense that the storm is in charge? That you're zombified 
by this need to, to deal with what is kind of coming in from- 
from the environment? Or is it more of a- a give and take 
relationship? I w-what does that feel like when you got that 
storm coming? Is it, is the storm driving you?
Clyde:	00:38:31	Storms? Yeah. Storm's definitely driving you, and you're paying 
attention to it to where you're engrossed. I mean, you're 
engrossed with, I've learned more about weather and what it 
does in the past, uh, 13 years, but really vividly in the past five 
years just watching radar and, um, watching. So there's no, 
there's no constant, you know, it's going to do what it's going to 
do, and you have to be prepared and on all levels for what it's 
going to do. Um, but you- you definitely- that week before 
wants to storm forms, everyone's just watching and planning 
and, you know, getting everything ready, checking everything, 
make sure everybody's ready. We're all state. We stay on the 
same page. Um, and we actually deal with a big influx of people, 
you know, "Hey, where are y'all going?" So we have the, uh, the 
general public and our volunteers to deal with also. And then 
once we have a good point of where it's coming in, we go, we 
try to get there. Actually, we do a lot of this the week before, 
right there where it's almost solid projected path, uh, which I'm 
on hurricanes for the most part. I just started responding to 
tornadoes and stuff. They're unpredictable. Uh, with the, uh, 
with the hurricanes we get in position and then it's, it's just 
watching and see what it's going to do. And, uh, of course, you 
know, it can strengthen or it can die down. And, um, so a lot of 
praying going on right around then, and, uh, a lot of anxiety. I 
mean, you know, you really start reliving some of the other 
stuff. And when I start reliving that stuff, I start thinking about, 
"okay, what did I do with that situation I could have done 
different." So there's a lot of re-rehearsing, um, and just gut 
checking advice, checking themselves, are you ready to do this? 
Are you sure? Uh, he didn't want to get in the middle of that. 
And that would break down. I don't want to, you know, and it's, 
uh, it press, but again, in the heat of the moment in the game, 
you're just in it, you know? [Athena agrees] So, um, but yeah, 
you definitely, you feel zombified, you're just, you know, you're 
staring at this image that's coming in and, you know, prepare 
for the worst, praying for the best.
Athena :	00:40:40	Yeah. So in that moment, or once, you know, you or, you know, 
you've seen your, your people like go in, "okay, we're, we're all 
in we're, we're doing this." Is there a sense that you've kind of 
given up some of your autonomy at that point, and you're just 
doing what needs to be done and you're not really totally you 
anymore? You're like--
Clyde:	00:41:06	Definitely not me anymore.
Athena:	00:41:07	Really?
Clyde:	00:41:07	Yeah. That's where I get the nickname at 'The Admiral'. It 
doesn't mean I run everyone got this idea it was because I was 
the Admiral of the Cajun Navy who was, I'm the admiral of my 
group, as same as called, being called the CEO or captain of the 
team. You know, I go into this whole different, uh, my voice 
even changes. I start to go into this Moses voice it's really deep 
and- and I'm like "where did this come from? I want my voice 
back." You know, it's really weird. And, uh, a lot of it has to do 
with I'm talking a lot. I'm interviewing a lot. I'm dealing with 
everybody from CNN to local news to local authorities. And, uh, 
my voice actually gets a lot deeper. It's really weird. And, uh, 
and then I just get in this, you know, it's really, um, automated, 
you know, I've got to lead, no feelings here. No, you do this. No, 
we can't do that. And just clear cut decisions being made on, uh, 
uh, you know, the constants, there's a constant there, because 
I'm basing them, basing everything off of the right thing to do, 
what we're supposed to do. What would you want? We've got 
to do for all. And everybody, everyone work as a team, even 
though I'm the boss or I'm the leader. You know, we're all- I ask 
everyone, "Hey, are we doing this? Are we going to stop? Let's 
go." And because, unless we walk in agreement, we're going to 
have an issue. So the team walks in agreement and if the plans 
change, then someone audibles and they have to all out there, 
they know, they pretty much know me and know what- what I 
would say or do. And it's going to be, what is the right thing to 
do? What is, you know, is it- is it the right move, you know, is 
there any other option? So weighing out our options and uh our 
choices, uh, as a group is a big thing. We definitely work 
together really good as a team.
Athena :	00:42:57	Yeah. So you have seen some pretty catastrophic, almost 
apocalyptic kind of scenarios in your day.
Clyde:	00:43:06	Yeah. Talking about zombified when I was in that water coming 
back and realizing, you know, everything was not good. Hoping I 
could make that 200 yards back. Um, I- I saw it was really like, 
um, army land because you see, you know, everything's really 
getting really dark, hurricanes coming in and you start seeing 
heads pop out of windows, just silhouettes.
Athena:	00:43:31	Really?
Clyde:	00:43:31	Yeah. They're looking, looking, popping in and you're like really 
creepy. It's really creepy. And you know, you look at these 
people and there's no eye contact because it's like, there's just 
dark. You see. And silhouettes of people on second stories and 
stuff, you tend to looking out, people look in and, and it's really 
creepy. I saw that. And, uh, that was, that was a jarring moment 
where it was kind of like apocalyptic, like this is, and then of 
course it got worse from there. But then I've been to places like 
after Hurricane Michael, where it just looks like a Godzilla just 
stepped, you know, right there, uh, on that whole area of 
Mexico beach and, uh, Panama City beach and all were just 
wiped out. I mean, houses were just toothpicks. Category 5 
you're not going to survive that. And a lot of people stayed 
behind. So that turned into more of a search than search and 
rescue and I'll do that. I go recover, live people for the most 
part. And that's what I try to find. And we have a lot of 
craftspeople that haven't, but, um, there's other people that are 
more, you know, I guess, skilled in that area. I don't definitely 
don't want that in my mind, in my memory I've got enough. 
[Athena agrees] That's enough.
Athena :	00:44:44	Hmm. So when you think about where things are- are going in 
the future in terms of storms, and even just in the case of this 
region, what do you see? What's your-
Clyde:	00:45:02	I see a lot of reconstruction happening. Umm, right now, 
looking at the weather and just it's signing of the February thing 
that's flooding Texas and May flood in Louisiana. So this is a 
yearly events. Now it's not something that, you know, it might 
flood, hasn't flooded five years, 10 years, it's flooding a hundred 
year plains, hundred years is up. And those are flooding and, uh, 
Nebraska and all those places, they experienced the very worst 
of anything I've ever seen. I think last year, St. Jo, Missouri, 
other states have their Tennessee flooding. Um, it's, it can only 
get worse, you know, it's not a less, and even if we rebuild our 
levee systems and, uh, anything we can do proactive at this 
point, if the weather's worsening, um, it's, there's the water's 
rising. It's, it's just time to accept that. And, uh, you know, a lot 
of people like along this way here, you see, they haven't moved 
back. People relocate. Um, I think it's probably a big game 
changer in real estate as to where people are deciding they're 
going to move to relocating as well as people selling their 
homes and mass exiting areas. We see that a lot too.
Athena :	00:46:22	Yeah. So if things keep going the way they've been going in your 
mind, um, I mean, are, are we facing a zombie apocalypse kind 
of scenario in the future?
Clyde:	00:46:35	We're definitely facing, uh, you know, whether changing the 
way of life or for most people as they know it today. Um, you 
know, it's, uh, I don't know how everybody deals with it up 
North. I-I've been there on tours and I've been up there, but I 
don't know that I could, I could actually mentally just handle 
being inside for so long. I lived in Denver. I know snowed in for a 
week. I was, that was very trying. Um, and how people cope 
around that, but the same goes for the South and for all the 
flooding, um, you know, some people rebuild they build higher, 
but, uh, again, when you go through a storm and you survive it 
and let's say you make it through the hurricane, there's all the 
aftermath, which is lack of resources. Um, the way that the 
South is designed with the one highway, there's only one way 
through, you know, Louisiana takes, unless you go up and 
through, and then again, all that's going to be flooded to you. 
You do a lot of washed out roads. We- we dealt with that going 
into Harvey before Harvey even hit we got there and it was 
flooding,a nd we had to cut up through top of Louisiana, come 
back down through top part of Texas that- that straight 10, 
which those from coast to coast, uh, floods out, especially in 
Beaumont area and all that. I drove through it, it was called 
Lake. I followed Lake I-10, because the lake from Houston had 
flooded the freeway. So it's definitely going to change 
transportation if the, if the Mississippi River ever breaches and 
breaks, it's definitely gonna change, you know, everything even, 
um, even the way we transport goods up and down the 
Mississippi River. So it- it's definitely, I mean, times are changing 
due to the weather and, uh, and so is production movement of 
goods and stuff like that, and then, uh, then the government 
wants to even- even put any money or anything into those 
areas, you know, for them to just flood again. So, um, I think it's 
something that's, you know, the craziest thing is- is that this 
happens right next door to you. You don't know. I mean, 
Mississippi for 13 years hasn't had a hurricane, so they've really 
kind of heard about Harvey and they know about this, but they 
don't know much about us because we haven't done anything, 
but show up here in their, um, in their state to- to disband.
Athena :	00:48:53	Yeah. So if things get worse with weather events in the future is 
the infrastructure that you know, we currently have going to be 
able to hold up to- to that? I mean, or, you know, do we need to 
change anything fundamental about how we're- we're 
operating as a society to deal with the changing weather 
patterns?
Clyde:	00:49:26	First, um, I guess some of the biggest changes that need to 
happen is just in the evacuation because it is happening more 
and more. Um, they need to restruc- restructure that they 
expect people to, um, evacuate. Biggest issue I always see is 
with the animals and with the pets, people stay home with their 
four dogs, uh, their five cats or whatever. They don't have a 
place to bring them to. They're gonna stay home and they're 
going to ride it out. And that's sometimes that's a death 
sentence phone, especially if it's flood, you're not going to make 
it through. And you ended up being rescued with your animals if 
you're lucky. Now, there's so many people out there willing to 
help with that. And, um, the government local city state need to 
seize the moment on that and seize a hold of that. And, uh, we 
do it through social media. There, they have just as much access 
to social media too. And, uh, if they just employ the people and, 
you know, had a, just started it, I know they don't want to deal 
with any more than what they have at the officials to deal with 
unofficial people, but to have these groups come in is a great 
thing and they'll help tend to the pets. And that's just one of the 
small problems with just not having to deal with aftermath and 
deaths and- and whatnot. And then as far as recovery goes and 
that's, we don't have enough time. [Athena agrees] The 
infrastructure of what needs to happen with the emergency 
management agencies, um, it certainly all needs an overhaul. 
There needs to be more accountability, especially when it 
comes to the funds, uh, where they're distributed, how they're 
distributed, um, the waste that goes into the- the mobile home 
units that are built and, uh, that don't get distributed properly. 
And by the time they're built and everything that people will be 
the recovered moved on. So it's, there's a big chunk of money 
wasted and, uh, also resources, as far as volunteers and people 
that volunteer for that. Now someone gets rich, someone along 
unit company that's produced and gets rich, but the people they 
don't get help. So a lot of that has needs to be restructured and, 
uh, whoever on the political level gets on board for that will be 
a very popular person with the people when it comes to 
restructuring it, uh, geared towards the people and not for the 
government. And right now, you know, we've got DEA agents, 
SAR teams that deployed with us and, uh, have joined with us 
and all because they don't get deployed by the- by the agencies 
that are in place to not only buy a new bus. Um, and there's a 
breakdown in that system. Uh, it's- it's- it's broken system 
[Athena agrees] and it definitely needs to be revamped. And 
that is something going forward that I hope that we inspire 
people to see is that this really needs to be- be given a look over 
by everyone, not just, you know, cursing live group, that's 
supposed to do it, but how- how can we change this? How can 
we be a part of this where we propose these, uh, these ideas? 
Who's listening? And, uh, and getting onboard with that 
because as quick as the weather's changing, we need to be 
modifying what we do, you know, adapt and overcome. And 
right now you don't see that, you see everyone being, um, 
reactive rather than proactive. And, uh, I'm praying that- that 
switch comes, you know, that's why I stay in it for the most part 
vocally on Facebook and other areas, and do what I do as far as 
giving the guest speaking and stuff is to just look, you know, to 
the intel, dies with me if I die in this storm. So I try to get out as 
much of the intel that I've learned so that it can carry on and go 
to the right people. And maybe it's a voice or somebody that 
hears it and takes it, heralds that message out and it helps 
future generations, the youth of America going forward. They 
don't have any idea what's really coming because they've been 
taught a certain ideal about things. And unless they get involved 
with people like us or watch what we're doing, which is why the 
Facebook it's right in your face, then they'll- they'll wake up one 
day to "this is a problem and we don't have solution."
Athena :	00:53:26	Yeah so what can we do as the sort of civil society? You know, 
people that are not necessarily top-down government, but 
[Clyde agrees], you know, folks like you organizing to help 
people who are in need or even, you know, what can people do, 
maybe they don't have all the skills that you guys and your team 
have, but what can people do to be a little bit more prepared, at 
least for--?
Clyde:	00:53:54	Um, I guess look at, first of all, it's regional, you know, everyone 
lives in a different region and weather's different and we all 
deal with rain events. Uh, we don't deal with snow and, uh, you 
know, cause when it snows down here, it's crazy. People, you 
definitely know, they've never seen snow much. Everyone's off 
the road or, you know, um, they want us to drive out in it and 
it's like, you know, it's Christmas for them when you guys have 
North y'all like, "Man, so, and shut the, shut the barriers." But, 
um, so regionally, I think first and foremost, community leaders 
should be more, um, disaster, uh, minded, you know, as part of 
a, um, a yearly discussion, if not, you know, uh, trimesters and, 
uh, and what seasons we go through. Um, not only for the good 
of the people, you know, having a plan, having a better plan 
than just let's evacuate, stick people in the building until it 
passes, um, to what is the structure? What is the, what is the 
budget set aside? What is the protocol? Most people don't, you 
know, people don't find out about FEMA until it's time that you 
use FEMA. Then they found out, "Oh my God, it's a loop. And I 
had to pay this, I do this." And then everyone's confused. So 
they're learning, it's kind of like on the job learning when they 
really should, you know, become familiar with what's available 
in your, in your city, in the event of something happened to you. 
I mean, in any event, uh, your- your- your shelters, what's your 
plan? So the community's got to get involved and ask the 
questions, because if we're not asking the questions, then 
they're not volunteering and the answers or volunteering those 
platforms up, you know, all's quiet and no one's asking any 
questions, we can go home for the day. And the- the civilians 
and the, uh, the general public needs to become more involved 
with, uh, asking those questions, someone, and then from that 
leaders will emerge. Groups will emerge and then calls to action 
will start to happen. Um, but you know, a closed mouth, doesn't 
get fed. If you're not opening your mouth and not asking 
questions, now I'll just power. If you don't know, you gotta get 
your notes, the wrong time to find out, you don't know is when 
you're in the middle of it as just a long time.
Athena :	00:56:00	Yeah. So when it comes to also this desire to- to help, right, like 
when a disaster occurs, um, and, a response is- is needed, I 
wonder if there are ways that we can do a better job as a 
society of actually leveraging for good, this zombification of like 
people wanting to help? Right? Because a lot of people, when 
things get bad, like if they have the ability to help, they- they 
want to get in there and help. But sometimes people don't 
always know exactly--
Clyde:	00:56:37	What to do.
Athena:	00:56:38	--or how to, you know, figure out what they should do. And 
sometimes people end up not being helpful or being unhelpful 
or making things worse because they're trying to help and 
haven't worked out how to actually use so- so- so how can we 
take that, you know, that zombification of like, "Oh, something 
bad happened. I want to help," and channel that for, for good 
outcomes?
Clyde:	00:57:04	Well, that's where you go on our page, 
louisianastormpatrol.com. We have a volunteer place where 
you volunteer, you fill out a volunteer form and I just, uh, 
peeked into that last night. And I've got a lot of, you wouldn't 
believe the amount of people and, uh, their, and their skill sets 
from nurses to mental health, to firemen, to retired police 
officers. I mean, there is a plethora of people there that I had to 
go through. So the painstaking task of going through these 
people and vetting them is going to be on my shoulders and a 
few other people, because everyone wants to volunteer. You 
always have to, first of all, you know, look at their skillset. What 
is their motive? You know, I-I look at the motive real easily 
when I can read through this, the way you fill out application. 
But for the most part, again, I don't- I don't want someone 
that's running from a disaster at home, coming out in the field 
and- and helping with the disaster and then the next thing you 
know, that disaster at home is causing them to act irregular out 
here. It happened too many times. And again, the best- the best 
tactic for this is to have people from the local area working 
together. Because when you leave and if I brought a bunch of 
volunteers they will tell you those volunteers wouldn't be you're 
left with nothing. But if I got everyone working together and our 
teams are all working together with empowering you to do, 
then that carries on and then we can leave comfortably feeling 
like, okay, what we started here, they're either going to finish or 
not, but they know that it's- it's up to them as their community. 
And that keeps us from enabling. Both, um, both the people 
from just, you know, rely on everybody from outside source 
coming in, they start to resource within each other, and of 
course outside sources still come in, but they start looking out 
for each other when it comes to donations. You're not going to 
steal from each other, but other people will steal from you 
coming in. And, uh, that's- that's a big deal. When donations 
start rolling in a lot after a storm, you know, uh, "oppors", we 
call them, they come in and they'll set up fake, uh, you know, 
uh, donations, supplies, and next thing you know, they're 
shutting down and you see a bunch of, uh, quilts sets. And I say, 
someone comes, "Hey, I need to quilt." "Oh, we gave them all 
away." "Overnight? You were closed," you know, so you see this 
kind of stuff happening and it's- it- it doesn't care. It doesn't 
matter if it's a church or whatever. I've seen it happen in all 
spectrums of- of- uh, of the business world as well as the church 
world. So it's- it's just gets down to the individual, but, um, 
getting everyone to work together again in the areas, the 
volunteers, again, with my cue that I have, I looked through 
everyone in Texas. I don't like their advice in the Texas Q and, 
uh, and start to call them and let them know we're coming. "Are 
you still interested? Uh, we'll have ever usually here, do you 
want to report here?" And then we play it by ear.
Athena :	00:59:53	So keeping it local, kind of, then not just gives you the long-term 
viability and resilience, but also you have those reputational ties 
that are already there [Clyde agrees], which kind of help keep 
people honest and keep them from trying to take advantage of 
each other.
Clyde:	01:00:09	And we get the- when the trucks come in for us, I don't set up a 
donation center where I get that stuff unpackaged at all. That's, 
first of all, that's time consuming and I don't have the 
volunteers for that. Uh, we have set up donation centers within 
the regions versus a church just starts to supply them. But if we 
find that someone's not letting the stuff out, we hear something 
that's, you know, that's shady, we'll shut that down real quick. 
For us the best thing is we get it in and we put it in a few trucks 
and we bring it like, uh, for me, I like to bring it to the fire 
departments. I like to bring it to the police departments 
because then it reestablishes their relationship with the 
community. Um, you know, and the police officers get to meet 
the people on a different basis rather than, you know, I pulled 
you over whatever. Everyone's there working, you know, it- it- I 
think it actually strengthens the community ties, um, in the 
sense of, you know, that's what, um, that's what a hurricane, 
that's what disasters do. It brings people closer together. Um, 
what, you know, what you would think would be an adverse 
effect of as people, but it actually brings people closer together. 
You know, this racism is just not there. You know, the absence 
of racism. In fact, we have a lot of officers shocked and stuff 
before the 2016 flood. And, uh, we had a real racial divide going 
on and then next thing you know the hurricane came and that 
was gone. Or the- the flooding, the three-day flooding that was 
gone. Last thing that you were hearing about was anything like 
that everyone was helping. Everybody, didn't matter what color 
race, what your religious background, any of that stuff was it all 
just kind of suddenly went away and, uh, and people are pushed 
together and they have to serve one another help each other. 
Um, they got to get through it together. It is to still, you know, 
become an individual in a storm. You become part of a unit 
really quick.
Athena :	01:01:56	In a storm like that, we're all in the same boat.
Clyde:	01:02:01	Yeah. [Athena laughs] You're all in the same boat as everybody. 
I don't like, our job that I don't check what your religious order 
is or if you were a part of Antifa or KKK or whatever it is when 
you don't have that special card, that works, only card you need 
is that you need to be rescued, get in here and you're, you 
know, you're in need and that's it. It doesn't matter whether 
you were on drugs last week. Doesn't. I mean we go to 
neighborhoods that are the drug neighborhoods, so they call 
them, but, uh, nobody's on drugs for that next, once it's all 
flooded out, everyone's on a level playing ground, everyone's all 
equal. At that point, you start to find out that guy you thought 
that the street was just a crazy drug head, he comes, he's the 
one that knocks on the door and puts you on a air mattress and 
pulls you out of that- that flooding trailer. So it's a, it's, like I 
said, it's definitely a game changer for everyone. And, uh, the 
floods and the hurricanes will definitely push the people 
together.
Athena :	01:02:55	Yeah. And then I guess, ideally that experience then makes that 
community better able to deal with future challenges or--?
Clyde:	01:03:07	Definitely that was a stay behind. There was a stick it out. 
Definitely. I've seen it, uh, you know, from everywhere from the 
low income, um, neighborhoods to the, you know, all the way 
up. And again, it's a level playing field. What happened in 
Houston wasn't even, you know, rich or insured, uninsured. It 
doesn't, I mean, the, uh, the storms don't, they're not partial. 
They're just there. They don't judge. They just do. And so 
everyone gets together, um, on, uh, it's not it's, it's on a 
common denomination level now, you know, we've all been in 
effect. They all share one common denominator. Now we've all 
been affected by a flood. And, um, it definitely, uh, you know, 
I've seen it change for the better, and then I've seen it, this, the 
neighborhood just leave, you know, the people that didn't come 
back, maybe because this neighborhood used to be there 
forever moved off, then this neighbor move off. The close knit 
neighborhoods either go away or they become closer. But I 
have seen it push neighborhoods together where there was 
crime and all kinds of things going on that just kind of change 
because everyone found out, you know, "Hey man, we gotta 
live together here."
Athena :	01:04:12	That's interesting. So you have kind of almost a bifurcation 
where the neighborhoods can become closer and better able to 
deal with problems, or they can just break up and everyone 
leaves and walks away from it.
Clyde:	01:04:32	And disintegrate. And then, you know, if 10 houses live on a 
block and there's two left, those people that are like, uh, they're 
looking around and the citizens are like, "Oh, do you want to 
know who's going to move in next door?" We kind of didn't 
really have fun with the last ones are, you know, are we miss 
our great neighbors and they end up move- you know, most 
people move off. I suppose people move off from those areas, 
uh, especially if it happened back to back, back in Louisiana, 
there was a March flood and then there was an August flood. 
And so, you know, you just finished rebuilding. In fact, my, uh, 
my mom was somewhere where the, uh, the man that owns 
the, uh, the mobile home park said, you know, that if it comes 
through again, I'm just handing the keys in my house and I'm 
leaving.
Athena:	01:05:15	Wow.
Clyde:	01:05:15	So, you know you get that, I think like this season, a lot of 
people have already made those types of decisions. This 
happens again, I'm out, you know, I'm going to move here and 
others have moved off and moved off to other places where, 
you know, dealing with the Arizona sun. That anymore, let's just 
go over there, you know, [Athena laughs] it's like, we used to 
one, two hours, people sit out there in the desert, but you 
know, everybody understands that.
Athena :	01:05:39	Yeah. So there's something about that. Like two seasons in a 
row, you know, you just got, you just recovered from the last 
thing and you're hit again, that kind of takes the wind out of 
your sails for--
Clyde:	01:05:51	Cause you know what you're going to have to go through and 
you just went through it. And it's like, I'm not dealing with the 
insurance company again. Um, you know, let's just roll and, uh, 
you'd pick up the pieces. And he goes, so when some people 
met, I mean, that's the start of a new life. And that's, you know, 
that's really what they were probably living for all along, uh, 
spoke with many, like a lot of people that came out of the ninth 
ward. You know, I made a statement one time in a group. I said, 
you know, Hey guys, you can't say at least under your breath, if 
not loud, out loud, you ever say, "God if you just get me out of 
this, I'll do it better." I'll say, tell me, y'all man, y'all need to 
flood the movie. You aren't moving, [Athena laughs] you know, 
you you're saying it off. I can't just change everything. Well, 
don't question how God moves you. So, you know, a lot of 
people sat around and they wanted, they were going to wait on 
FEMA and back in 2005 and then there was the people that 
made decisions. I don't want to go with what you're saying 
though. There's people out there offering us a place to stay, a 
heads up, a new start, a car. And I started, it was families, 
adopted Americans, adopted Americans. And I just started 
plugging people into each other and that moment and getting 
them to meet each other and did stuff like that, setting 
expectations, and that worked out for a lot of families. And then 
there was elements that just said, you know, we're just going to 
go with what the government's going to give us. And they took 
the FEMA trailer park and some still some still live there now 
it's- it's not a bad place, but, um, you know, that's what that 
was their decision. [Athena agrees] But ultimately got them out 
of that place they were in.
Athena :	01:07:14	Yeah. So the storms can have these really, really long lasting 
effects on people's lives.
Clyde:	01:07:23	Yeah. Do a lot psychologically, uh, you know, phone calls from 
people that after that happens, it's, uh, uh, it's just like a 
domino effect for them. They- they just can't seem to get back 
on their feet. Just can't seem to get a job. They just can't seem 
to be in one place. And, uh, it's and I think for me to understand 
them best because I've been through it- it's- it's the trauma of 
it, you know, it's really, you're unsettled. Um, you're not really 
yourself after that. Um, as far as, you know, if you were, oh, this 
guy's always kidding around all the time and suddenly life got 
real for you and you're not in your comfortable setting of the 
neighborhood you grew up in, or before you around, certainly 
thrown out there and you're just trying to make ends meet. It- 
I've had, um, talked a lot of people out of suicide. Um, talked t-
to a lot of people who've lo- were families and broke up. You 
know, husband called me wife left me, uh, I've changed. You 
know, I don't know how to deal with this. Um, you know, I've 
always been a working man. I can't get a job or it's not the same 
job or it's not the same area. You know, they- they call me 
because they feel like they know me or I've talk to them on the 
phone or I'm relatable cause I'm on a video. And uh, and I give 
them that time, but it's- it's a common denomination also 
amongst men, dignity, pride, you know, being able to take care 
of their family, said that they can't, it will cause a relationship to 
go down hill real quick. Um, then of course we always forget 
about the children and I was taking all this in that, um, maybe 
only two or three, you can't really talk with, they're take it all in. 
And, uh, they're traumatized. A lot of children are traumatized 
from the floods that we've rescued on. Uh, so it's very traumatic 
and I don't know how they deal with it on a psychological level. 
And I don't know that- I do know things happen after that. That 
really is, uh, is sad because you know, this guy may have never 
you know, had a criminal record, but you know, it gets a 
desperate situation, steal some diapers, steal some things got, 
gotta have it for his family. And next thing you know, he's, you 
know, he's going, he's going to court and he's, you know, he's 
got death charges against him and that's a downward spiral that 
will take someone that's not on drugs and drive them to drink 
and drugs, you know, those other things. And uh, and if you're 
already in that situation, you're just going to, it's going to 
become, uh, a bigger habit, you know? So, so many levels that 
affects everybody from psychological physical, uh, you know, 
you've got the people that get really sick most all from the 
water, being in the water. There's so much chemicals in those 
waters. So, uh, yeah, it's it affects everyone.
Athena :	01:09:58	Yeah. Yeah. How can we take the positive parts of the storm, 
how it affects people and it's impossible to amplify those to-
Clyde:	01:10:13	Yeah, I- I've- I've always told everybody on my videos, I'm gonna 
show you the good, the bad and the ugly. So I like to show the 
good stories, um, the things where someone, even though like, 
for instance, Doug, calm dog man, he, uh, he was guys stay 
drunk all the time, you know, but he joined up with us and 
started in that neighborhood. He pushed, uh, he pushed the 
grocery cart and delivered, um, donations from what we had set 
up in an easy up tent, but blue tarp around and people came 
and tried to give him new tools and stuff for him to do his job 
that he was doing before the storm, but he just wouldn't take it. 
"No, I found a job," he pointed over with the tents are like, no, 
that's just volunteer. And, uh, uh, you know, I watched a man go 
from somebody that everyone was just, "Ah that's just Doug, 
he's the drunk," to they depended on Doug show up and there 
was stacks of pizzas come in, he would get out and deliver 
those. Uh Bibles. He was out delivering Bibles. He really, he 
worked himself to death. He really did. And, um, he had cancer 
and it just ate him up. But in the end, you know, uh, he's one of 
the 11th hour workers, you know, in the end he showed his 
compassion for the people. He got out there and when- when 
called into duty, he- he did what needed to be done no matter 
what his status was in life, in the neighborhood or whatever 
else. And then when it was all said and done, you know, the 
whole- the whole, uh, neighborhood kind of rallied up, came to 
his home and they did a candlelight vigil. And so you see this 
guy who was, like I said, he was just a couple dollars on a dog 
magazine, about five dogs. And he looked like a Harley Davidson 
biker, uh, in the end, uh, he brought a community together, you 
know, with his actions and as far as well, if Doug can do it, we 
can do it. You know? [Athena agrees] And so he was an 
inspiration and, um, you know, see God using those things and I 
see the people, a mindset change over a whole neighborhood. 
You know, it can- it can easily happen just by the actions of one 
person. So, you know, we might not immediately save 
everybody, but everybody can save somebody and, uh, with 
who you are. And again, it's just, I think it's just getting outside 
of your own little world. And I mean, it could be just a little old 
lady down the street and had a flat tire for a week and everyone 
just drove by. Like never thought, you know, I wonder why her 
tires flat knocked on the door and just asked. I find myself in a 
lot of those positions because I'm looking for them, so I try not 
to get on the road. Everyone's giving me these light flares, "Here 
Clyde, you may need these." I'm like, don't give those to me 
cause I'll be behind the next wreck [Athena laughs] out there, 
flagging traffic. So, um, but it seems like the more you get out 
there and do this, the more it appears and you see, it's not that 
it's happened to me. It's already what's happening around me. I 
just wasn't aware of the circumstance. And until I got to that 
level of perception to where I started looking around and 
saying, yeah, people really do need help around me from every 
level.
Athena :	01:13:17	Yeah, well, Clyde, thank you so much for sharing your brains 
with us on Zombified.
New Speaker:	01:13:19	You're welcome.
Outro:	01:13:27	[Psychological by Lemi]
Athena :	01:14:38	Zombified is a production of Arizona State University and the 
Zombie Apocalypse Medicine Alliance.
Dave:	01:14:44	And we would like to thank everyone who makes Zombified 
possible, including the Department of Psychology here at ASU.
Athena :	01:14:53	And the Interdisciplinary Cooperation Initiative funded by the 
President's Office at ASU.
Dave:	01:15:00	And the Lincoln Center for Applied Ethics.
Athena :	01:15:04	Of zombies and the apocalypse.
Dave:	01:15:06	Yes. [Dave laughs] And maybe other things too, that are less 
important. [Laughter] And, uh, we'd also like to thank all the 
brains that help make this podcast.
Athena :	01:15:16	Especially Tall Rom who does our awesome sound.
Dave:	01:15:20	That's right. And Neil Smith, who's made so many great 
illustrations for ZAMM and Zombified.
Athena :	01:15:28	Yeah. He's really, uh, filling out the world, the zombie 
apocalypse world that we're all living in now with the amazing 
illustrations.
Dave:	01:15:37	Actually, you can see a lot of his illustrations if you go to 
channelzed.org, which [Athena agrees] has all our shows from, 
uh, and then also we'd like to thank Lemi who did the song, 
""Psychological.
Athena :	01:15:49	Yeah. Cause there is something psychological with you, Dave
Dave:	01:15:53	With me so, [Athena laughs] and you and-- [Laughter]
Athena :	01:15:57	And our whole Z-team for that matter they're, they definitely 
have, uh, some mad zombification skills behind them. They're, 
uh, the ones responsible for the amazingly zombifying, um, 
social media that you might have seen on, uh, Twitter, on 
Facebook, on Instagram, on Spotify.
Dave:	01:16:18	It might be the reason you showed up. You might've been like 
must learn about brains.
Athena :	01:16:25	[Athena laughs] Exactly. Yeah. We're also on a, on TikToK now. 
We're all over the place. So.
Dave:	01:16:29	Oh! There we go. [Dave laughs]
Athena :	01:16:31	Speaking of which you can, um, follow us and, um, support us 
by getting on social media and, um, sharing Zombified. You can 
also, um, become a patron on Patrion and support us that way. 
You can also buy our merch. We have some amazing t-shirts 
and, um, stickers and everything now available on, um, on 
TeePublic. So.
Dave:	01:16:55	You can get it for yourself or you can infect your friends cause 
our t-shirts make great gifts. So--
Athena:	01:17:01	They do. Yes.
Dave:	01:17:01	If you know someone who loves brains or zombies or the 
apocalypse, we got you set.
Athena :	01:17:10	Yes, we definitely have you covered.
Dave:	01:17:13	All right. Well, thanks so much, Athena, this was really fun.
Athena:	01:17:16	It was really fun doing this episode with you, Dave, and thank 
you all for listening to Zombified: your source for fresh brains.
Outro:	01:17:25	[Psychological by Lemi]