speaker-0 (00:00.078)
Hello everyone and I want to welcome you to cat to catching catching foxes, a podcast whose audience was very grateful that we started recording earlier in in the morning because apparently we get to the point a lot faster. I am Luke and as always I have my buddy Gomer here with me. Say hi to the kids, Gomer.

speaker-1 (00:20.384)
Hello kids!

speaker-0 (00:22.168)
Go more and get a lot of sleep last night, so this is gonna be rough.

speaker-1 (00:25.092)
dude. Can I tell you what happened last night for me? Okay. So I'm really tired. I know this is coming early. I wanted to wake up f at five so I could get my like forty five minutes of my workout in and all this stuff. And it's like ten fifteen and I'm like, I feel it. I'm ready to go to bed. So I start shutting down downstairs. I'm walking upstairs. I had to come into my office and work on something real quick.

speaker-0 (00:29.058)
Yeah, yeah, please.

speaker-1 (00:54.008)
Dun dun dun And then I just I walk by my dad's ashes, which are

speaker-0 (01:03.274)
Aww.

speaker-1 (01:05.74)
Mm-hmm. So they're in my office. We're waiting to figure out what to do with the columbarium and stuff at our cathedral and blah, blah, blah. So my dad's ashes are in my office. And I'm I just I just really miss him lately. And so go on these long walks and I just, you know, I d I try not to always like listen to stuff and whatever, and I'll pray a rosary or just

walk with my thoughts and my thoughts have been in my dad a lot lately. And so, and I just like picture, you know, funny things that he said, different things that he said. I try to like tell stories about my dad that are like fun and uplifting and stuff. And so I came in and I was like, I want to write a song about my dad. I want to write something. And I was just I've been like

dancing around with the blues lately and stuff, listening to some blues. I love BB King. And so I did the thing that you hate, which is I went on Suno and I started working on lyrics to dump into like a blues song. And and I was like writing. I like writing. I like trying to write songs. I suck at it. I very much do, but

So I was like trying to come up with a title and the title that the AI generated like sucker punched me out of nowhere, which was the day after Father's Day, which is when my dad died. wow. And I was like, Huh. Like I never you know, and so just going through that, well, I'm sitting here, it's now eleven thirty, and my daughter Katiri walks in and she's bawling. And I'm like, sweetie, what happened what's wrong?

And she's like, just all these big things that I'm doing in my life, I was just thinking, Gosh, it would be great if I could tell pop pop. Yeah. And she's like, wait, I can't. Like it was like just a you know, he would love that we played at the Dallas Cowboys Stadium and you know, the whole family got to go and like these are the you know, and it's those things it's like these are the things you cannot get back. Like you can't get right. There's no there's no new of and I just said

speaker-1 (03:22.594)
And she's like, I just feel so bad that all these like beautiful things that I would love to do with him, he's not a part of. And I was like, Yeah, you know? And I said, But don't

You know, th reframe it. Think of it also as pop pop is like happy that you're remembering him. You know, like don't just be like, well now we're missing out forever. But also like, yeah, you're thinking of pop pop. Like you he would love this, you know. So yeah. There are different ways of like and she's like, Yeah, yeah, I know, I know. But then we just listen to the AI speak directly to our hearts and it was terrible. It the lyrics are stupid, but and then

And the music's the music's great. The lyrics are stupid. And for some reason it starts doing spoken words.

speaker-0 (04:09.024)
My friend's the exact opposite. The lyrics are great and the music is stupid because the lyrics are real and it came from you and the music doesn't exist.

speaker-1 (04:23.448)
No, it does exist as bits. It doesn't exist. No, I heard it, Luke. I heard it it exists.

speaker-0 (04:33.196)
You heard a simulation.

speaker-1 (04:35.512)
Just a

speaker-0 (04:40.184)
Quote, y you're you're becoming the bald dude from the Matrix.

speaker-0 (04:50.19)
I say that in the most lovely way about the song that you wrote for your father recently passed away.

speaker-1 (04:55.604)
I know this steak isn't real. But it is juicy. It is tender. You know. Yeah, I'm right there, man.

speaker-0 (05:05.27)
And ignorance is bliss.

speaker-1 (05:07.17)
Cypher?

speaker-0 (05:09.194)
good job. I think so. I think so.

speaker-1 (05:11.8)
Yeah. Well, I didn't get this morbidly obese body by not sitting and watching a large screen for years. gosh. can I tell you that un gosh, what do you call it? What do you call it when a food has no taste on purpose? You know, like smell. Well, I just tasteless protein in my

speaker-0 (05:22.87)
speaker-0 (05:32.808)
What?

speaker-0 (05:41.974)
I'm drinking the same thing.

speaker-1 (05:43.776)
And it's disgusting.

speaker-0 (05:45.428)
It's a taste, ladies and gentlemen. Huh? It's called collagen? Collagen?

speaker-1 (05:49.878)
Like whatever. Collagen. I don't know. You're drinking a a a collagen protein shake?

speaker-0 (05:56.322)
Yeah. That's so funny. I was about to ask you what you are drinking. I'm I'm drinking the exact same thing.

speaker-1 (06:01.474)
So so my my high protein journey, what I do is I t I have a scoop of the stuff, so I dump the scoop in, and then and it's whey protein isolate, so it's not collagen. Collagen is similar, but it's not the exact same thing. Anyway, so I put the whey protein in there, and then my s my wife buys my boys these Chobani yogurt drinks, and they're really high in protein for a drink. It's fifteen to twenty grams. So then I pour that in there, so it takes it from twenty five to

to forty and then I put a scoop of Greek Greek yogurt in there and then I take a so that takes it up a whole other notch and then I put a bunch of ice in there and then I have a handful of blueberries. So I'm like, you know, I'm doing it better than everyone else.

speaker-0 (06:47.062)
I take the protein up another notch.

speaker-1 (06:49.356)
Well, I gotta add more protein powder to my protein powder. What are the Well I love it. It feels I love it. Yeah. It's good. Fine. So then I and then I put blueberries in there, handful of blueberries for the old heart health. You know what I'm saying? Anti histamines, antioxidants. Hate all. I'm anti those things. I've been so strict of my diet. I actually feel great because my diet is like a non

speaker-0 (06:52.302)
Anything?

speaker-1 (07:16.778)
an like a it's it's a non extreme diet. It's just, hey, do these things and get a lot of protein. Right? So

speaker-0 (07:23.682)
You so it's me wait, okay, really, really quick, really quick. I love you. I love you tremendously. I love you for you during all this stuff. You just told me your your diet is not extreme and you just took a protein drink and then to you added like a lot more protein to it, yeah, and then added more protein on top of that. How's that for me? How's that not extreme? I'm not saying it's bad. I'm just saying how's that not extreme?

speaker-1 (07:42.71)
Uh-huh. But it's delicious.

speaker-1 (07:50.082)
Why would that be extreme? E getting the amount of protein that I need? Tastes yummy, it doesn't taste like ass.

speaker-0 (07:55.618)
I mean but like other protein throughout the day.

speaker-1 (08:00.3)
Yeah. Yeah. It might normally say it.

speaker-0 (08:03.106)
Sounds a little extreme. I I mean I understand your like YouTube answer and whatnot about how's it not extreme, you know, like, you know, I get it.

speaker-1 (08:05.271)
I don't think so.

speaker-1 (08:13.528)
You know, David Goggins warned me about people like you. David Goggins said that the moment you choose to be better, people will pull you down and they will question you. And they will humiliate you on a podcast that you built with your own sweat and blood. No, I love so my so I'm like wildly obese, right?

And as I start to go through all of this stuff, like a big thing, a big component of being a human being is realizing a large amount of your decisions you made on autopilot and you never really confront them because you're scared. Right. You and I know a lot about that. And and I just didn't think it would be over like donuts and cookies and ice cream. I didn't realize that that owned such a huge part of my soul. So

f sitting down, you know, trying to uproot addictions and and and self-destructive patterns out of your life, it becomes a very eye-opening thing about stupid crap too. Like it's not like you think like these like big, like, my gosh, I never realized my mother never loved me and my father never hugged me. And that's why I did all those horrible you know, it's like, but sometimes it's just like I am just lonely and I'm lonely because of this.

And I shouldn't be lonely because I'm surrounded by people I love and I can be with them instantly. But then I get afraid of being needy. And then so I don't do things. And like you just stack it up, right? Well, for me, it's like stuff like that about food that how easy it is for me. And this is why I think like talking about like Exodus ninety and stuff that we did in the past, like the the the thing itself is like, hey, we're not gonna do this or eat carnivore diet or whatever. You're not gonna do this. And all of a sudden it's like

Why do I do that all the time compulsively? Like why? Like what in my head drives me to these things? And like trying to understand the psychological mechanisms and also the physical mechanisms have really I I don't know if like it hasn't resolved it. I I still have a lot of like issues and and competencies and I don't know if they'll be with me my whole life that I need to like attain. But just being aware is like half the battle kind of stuff. And shutting out

speaker-1 (10:30.678)
Like realizing something can be physical without it being mental, something can be mental without it being spiritual, something can be spiritual and kind of assume all of these characteristics. So it's not like, hey, you're immoral because you want this stuff, right? Like there like your desires for food that's disproportionate to your nutritional needs and needs of community and pleasure. It's like, Hey, you you're gonna eat this amount of food and you're not even gonna like it at the end. You know, you know what I mean? Like a comp like a compulsion or whatever.

It's like, hey, you don't need any more food. You should probably get dessert. You know, like that next level of like self injury that is common with addiction, like, I recognize this is not good for me, but I'm still going to do it. So, anywho, processing all of that stuff has been a part of the journey right now. and one of those things, let me just say this. You helped me understand something.

Maybe fifteen years ago. You gave me a book called No More Mr. Nice Guy. And in that book, the guy, Dr. Ronald Glover, I think. Mm-hmm.

speaker-0 (11:37.742)
Glover Glover. Yeah. I think it it might be Robert. Yeah.

speaker-1 (11:42.59)
Yeah. He said he's he was talking about like this one section about giving a shit about yourself, like your appearance and your hygiene and things like that. And he's and he talked about there's an element of self-hatred woven through certain things that we do that we just think like, people should love me for me, and it's like, yeah, but you're actually hurting yourself on purpose. Like it's an act of self

Like there was a line where he was talking about hygiene. He's Why don't people brush their teeth every day? I meet these men all the time who don't brush their teeth. Why? He's like, That's not a that's not a I'm not gonna dress the way you want me to. That's just like basic table stakes to human interaction. You're doing this because you're hating yourself. Like it's a form of of self hatred. And I wonder like how much you know, you get all these contradictory messages about food and about a weight and about appearance.

And now you have the Ozempic Revolution, which kind of wiped away all the celebrities giving a shit about fat shaming. but the the the component for me is why am I not drinking enough water? Right? Like the table stake stuff. Why why like I could tell you that there were multiple, multiple days six months ago, where I did not have a single glass of water. Right? Like I had, you know.

speaker-0 (13:04.398)
Mm-hmm.

speaker-1 (13:08.076)
Zero calorie soda. I had, you know, I had stuff. I had in a liquid form. So it's like certain things like that. So if you say, Michael, how much water do you drink a day? I say, I drink a gallon. You say, Well, that sounds extreme. It's not extreme to me. I don't feel bad. I don't feel upset. I it's not like my stomach is overwhelmed with water and whatever. Although it is funny when you drink a bunch of water and then you go for a walk and you hear that squeeze, squeeze, squeeze, squeeze. but like it sounds extreme, but it's not extreme.

within my context of like I was really hurting myself. And now that I drink you know, what I would say is more than enough or enough water for my body size and type, I don't feel crappy. Like I used to feel crappy. Yeah. You know what I mean?

speaker-0 (13:51.362)
No, that's a huge thing. Yeah. Yeah. Yep.

speaker-1 (13:56.39)
Like you know when you have too much coffee and you just really want you just like drinking coffee, right? You want to have a hot, delicious thing. But like for me, like I I'll start to get like a coffee headache almost, you know? And and I have to say to myself, gosh, okay, stop the coffee. Drink a thing of water first, and then you know, it's like you're draining your you're dehydrating yourself or whatever. But there would be time like I in the past, I would keep drinking the coffee. Okay, so long story short.

Protein goals. I if you if I wasn't doing like a strict carnivore diet, my protein it would completely switch. I would be eating twice as many carbohydrates and probably fats. I never really cared about that. Then I would be protein. So the protein you should hit point seven ish per point seven grams per pound of body weight. that's the you know, the bros science is a a gram per bo per pound, but that is basically deemed as unnecessary. So the best

the the US just revised its guidelines on all this stuff after like a mountain of of like thirty years of of testing. And I know that my my father, one of the reasons why he died is he did not have enough protein. And what I mean by that is his muscles broke down really quickly. And it broke down really quickly and then he became sedentary. And then once you have a fall

It's something like fifty percent or four gosh, I just read ER stat. It's something like fifty percent of patients who have a slip and fall over the age of sixty-five where they break their hip. So yeah, it's where they break their hip, never recover. They will die within six months. And my dad had a hip replacement in March and was dead on June twenty second. So these things like it's not it's it's about my blood pressure because

My dad had sky high blood pressure. It's about my heart health. It's about my you know, so but my my whole compound the the reason why I'm saying all this is like I am being fanatical about the amount of protein that I'm taking in because I know how easy it is within three meals to not get enough. And so if I don't I'm gonna say the funny word protein max in the in my morning meal, and I feel best when I do that in the morning meal or at lunch.

speaker-1 (16:20.94)
Then I'm gonna ask dinner to take the heavy load because I need to get it. And then I don't I don't sleep well. I don't, you know, it's all this stuff. Yeah. So there is a method to the madness that's not just get more bra, get more. Right. So that was a long answer to a short question.

speaker-0 (16:42.626)
No no no, and I think that that makes sense. It it it it does make I you know to to your point about like you know like layers of stuff. I pulled up Dante's the the nine his nine circles of hell. And I always think it's super interesting that like you start with limbo, it goes right into lust, then in right in to in to gluttony, greed,

anger, heresy, then you have like violence and fraud and treachery. I know some people call it betrayal. This is just based off of a quick guide that I actually really don't like. but still know why I am like using it. But the point being I think your point about like there are like layers to this stuff is is well is well taken. And that quite often the things that a lot of us see is these deep internal things

are or like these deep horrible issues are actually not that i'm not trying to say that they are at the surface but sorry that that they are trivial but there are you they are call you're right they're caused by these deeper these deeper issues and if those deeper issues are not addressed you'll fall deeper in and I don't know and and like deeper into all this other stuff right so you end up with a thing like

Betrayal because you couldn't control your own lust, right? And you could but like you couldn't control your own lust in the beginning because you were using that to medicate, right? Or ex and i you know, I think I was I I talked about this. One of my gosh, I can't remember I think it was the gluttony part. Let me check. But when when I when I read Dante this is when I read the in

Inferno during Lent, this may it may have been like may have been like violence, but they're basically it was a part of people where they were like obsessed. gosh, this is not this is not good podcasting. I can't remember what the exact sin was, but it's the one where they're like in the mud and it's pouring down on rain and they don't realize they think they're alone, but they're not.

speaker-0 (19:07.39)
And but they're too like obsessed to go and do anything. So it's like they're actually surrounded by a bunch of people. Okay, this is a terrible example because I can't recall the thing. So my my point being is that I think ultimately a lot of this stuff like that you were s saying about you brought up a point where I for this is why I needed my coffee.

Self obsession is really at the root of a lot of different a lot of our issues, I think. And one of the big reasons why we are so self-obsessed is we're two in our our own heads a lot. Because we have a our entire way of being is within our own mind, right? I'll show you the power of the mind, right? Like that's like the that's a world in which we currently exist in is it just a world of ideas and ideas come out come out of

the mind and when you get disconnected from other people all you are like left with is yourself. And I think you break up a really good point about like you know like wanting to take care of your health and wanting to do these things. And I think you do quite often extreme things are a good way to break that. Right? Like why does Exodus like Exodus ninety is not a way of life. It's an extreme thing that you do during a period of time to like grow and like to grow in like love of God to to grow like virtue

D do you take ext you know, that's I mean that's what Lent is, right? A period of extreme measures to grow in love of God and in love of in love of others, right? I think the not that I'm not trying to say like here's the danger of Lent. I think the the challenges for a lot like okay, like great point about like drinking enough water, right? I deal with like the exact same thing.

and I feel tremendously better. Like if I in in reality, if I want to like wake up and feel better, I should just be drinking a ton of water as opposed to drinking coffee, right? But coffee is is like much more instant, it tastes good, and I am addicted. how much of you not drinking on water is is is is do you think is due to your ADHD?

speaker-1 (21:24.078)
pr I would say zero. I mean I'm sure it's there, but I don't think it it's not because of what I would say is a lack of awareness of needing it or towards towards other beverages. I think it's I just didn't like it and so I didn't want to do it.

speaker-0 (21:24.684)
speaker-0 (21:37.079)
Impressive.

speaker-0 (21:47.598)
Okay. But I'm fair. I'm wrong. I see, I think like a big thing with people with ADHD is not getting enough like enough water 'cause like what you just described for the first two thirds, at least the two out of the three things you talked about are are like classic ADHD. Like you totally know that it's the right thing to do, but impulsivity gets gets in the way of it. But then also like if you don't like it, that's that's a little bit like I actually like I like water.

Like I really do enjoy it it doesn't bother me at all. You know, but like that I so I think there's a bit of a I think sometimes the danger not okay, things like Excess ninety, things like Lent, like you know, they're good. They're good things, right? I think what I really enjoy about both is they're for a particular they're for a particular season. And

speaker-1 (22:18.646)
We do now.

speaker-0 (22:44.968)
The challenging thing is when you're trying to develop habits and different things is it's like it's getting into like that like layers where perhaps you don't unlike water or perhaps your brain just doesn't really you don't have the exact like functioning to stop and think I need to drink on water right now until you absolutely have to. So like there is the benefit then, I mean I truly do mean this, of going to an extreme on like measure, like crap, I need, I need like I need water. The

Challenge is how do you break that into you like so it becomes a daily routine so you don't have to rely on extreme measures? Perhaps it just means that like I'm gonna make these extreme things just the like this is just what I'm going to do. And that's not a bad thing. Like I I I mean, particularly I I don't think it's necessarily bad to say I need to develop this habit. I'm trying to be extreme and I'm do my absolute best to just never ever stop. what can be helpful?

Is other things like that like putting a reminder up, having di trying to make it ex external. There are I guess my my point is that sometimes I I I guess I'm I'm just try I'm trying to add to what you are s

speaker-1 (23:54.926)
You know, now that you're clarifying that, I could see where where it just doesn't become a priority or it just you know it's mindless. Yeah. And it totally makes sense. Yeah, I and and where ADHD the the other trap is it's a temporary rabbit hole, almost like a hobby, right? People with ADHD have a million hobbies, see and

speaker-0 (24:04.247)
Yeah.

speaker-0 (24:21.486)
Yeah. hyper focused. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely.

speaker-1 (24:24.946)
And you you do that, you build a rabbit hole. See that's the the things like seventy five hard and Exodus ninety and and what? Seventy five hard? Have you ever heard of that?

speaker-0 (24:32.802)
Wait, what?

speaker-0 (24:38.126)
Okay. Never mind. I mean

speaker-1 (24:40.898)
So funny.

speaker-0 (24:45.932)
And just think it's funny.

speaker-1 (24:47.426)
Would you prefer seventy five soft?

speaker-0 (24:50.378)
Shoot seventy five.

speaker-1 (24:51.758)
Because there's a pill for that. Have you never heard of 75 hard?

speaker-0 (24:59.286)
No, I'm normal.

speaker-1 (25:01.022)
Okay. It's like I'm sorry. You could say it's like a secular, secular Exodus ninety, where it's this guy. He he came up with it like maybe I don't know, ten years ago, but it was just basically like Americans don't read books, Americans don't work out, you know, there's a discipline thing, there's like a but there's also like this component of like what like if you're in a rut, you kind of forget how like you kind of forget what you're capable of.

And so doing things like an extra yeah. Yeah. So he said it like when he designed this thing called 75 Heart, he's like, This is not supposed to be your life. Do not make this your life. This is supposed to be an extreme challenge to get you to focus on these things that like you should already give a crap about, but you don't because you let life hit you. So this is your opportunity to hit back. And he's like, and this is extreme. Don't let it dominate your life.

But here's 75 hard. It's called 75 hard because it's hard. It's called 75 hard because it's not a two-week challenge. It's not an eight-day thing. It's enough that it'll ruin your year. You know, kind of that like it's a significant dent in your year. Yeah. Yeah. And so the the principles are Yeah. The principles are pick a diet. I don't care what they're agnostic, but you have to fanatically adhere to the diet. Right. So if your diet is you're keto or you're vegetarian or you're vegan or you're carnivore.

Doesn't matter, doesn't care. Just write it out, understand it, and then only do that. But you're not allowed to have snacks. You're not allowed to have dessert. You're not allowed to drink alcohol. So you have that like kind of thing. And then you have to work out. This is the thing that breaks a lot of people. You have to work out twice a day for forty five minutes minimum. They have to be three hours apart. So you can't just like work out for an hour and a half. They have to be at least three hours apart and one of them always has to be outside, no matter what the weather is.

speaker-0 (26:55.549)
I remember when you were doing this.

speaker-1 (26:58.794)
I never I talked about it. I've never done it before.

speaker-0 (27:02.166)
no, you were doing it a bit 'cause you texted the group. I'm outside, I'm all working out. I r I remember you texting us about I mean, I'm not saying like you did I I'm I'm saying like I like I remember you like trying to yeah.

speaker-1 (27:10.309)
okay. Yeah.

speaker-1 (27:17.078)
Yeah, I mean I've been doing this since September first now. So was it within that time or was this like a couple a year ago? Okay. yeah, I think I was gonna start it and then I didn't have anyone doing it with me, so it kinda fizzled out. Because the rule is if you fail, you have to start back over at the beginning. The other thing is you have to read ten pages of a non fiction book. You have to take daily progress photos, humiliate you have to drink a gallon of water a day, and you have and that's it

speaker-0 (27:22.218)
No, no, this is like a year ago plus.

speaker-0 (27:39.742)
No, don't like that.

speaker-0 (27:46.366)
I have issues with the nonfiction book part, but that's fine.

speaker-1 (27:50.124)
Yeah, so his point was you have a lot of people who can crush very easy fiction books. Like my daughter Cecilia, she can she can read a thousand of them. It's actually and she she loves reading. It's actually very hard for her to read a fiction book or a nonfiction book. Because, you know, and I was like, Yeah, you know, like back when I had Amazon's Kindle Unlimited, I would crush a science fiction book every two or three days.

I don't even remember the title. One time I was reading a book and I was like, What the hell? I've read this before. And I was like three fourths of the way through. But it's like, yeah, I d I just you there's a way of reading where you just get on autopilot. Shannon's doing that. Shannon is not a reader and now she is, and she reads historical fiction books. Right? That's like her th her jam.

speaker-0 (28:35.64)
Shannon period. Let's talk about Eric Larson, Shannon.

speaker-1 (28:39.768)
Who's Eric Larson?

speaker-0 (28:40.864)
He writes a lot of h historic historical fiction. Actually sorry, no, his was more sorry. It's no it's more historical, non f not like fiction, but it's told in a way that it's historical. So that's that's not true. Sorry.

speaker-1 (28:53.002)
Is it strike that does it is it involve r the romance that's semi Jane Austen? Okay. That

speaker-0 (28:58.976)
No. No that's what I was about to yeah. Yeah, okay. So no, no. I I just I I have issues with this like whole like like I just think that a lot of fiction is more important than non fiction. It's just what's agree the fiction that you are reading. Like you know, no, I agree. It's a bit of it's just it feels very Protestant.

speaker-1 (29:20.46)
You know what's funny to me? The more I read

Like I'm reading the Iliad to my kids. so we have I I have a couple kids in our classical school that I struggle with. But like it's funny to see how they don't struggle with Plato.

speaker-0 (29:29.015)
Yeah.

speaker-0 (29:44.752)
interesting.

speaker-1 (29:46.146)
Yeah. And right now we're going through the apology, which is not a dialogue, right? It's almost everything else is in a dialogue. This is his defense speech with Socrates on trial. And I don't get complaints that the other teachers get in that class because I think there's this component of like

the the great books r really do force you into like they do the teaching. I just do the tutoring. I'm like alongside you reading Socrates and Plato and stuff. So anywho, anywho. yeah. No, I know. Yeah. Yeah. So that's the the 75 hard thing is, you know, two forty five minute workouts. That's really hard. But the the way that I manage it is

speaker-0 (30:23.384)
That's a really good point. Yeah.

speaker-1 (30:34.296)
For rest days, 'cause I've watched like a handful of YouTube videos of people who have done it and they're like, How do you like are you can't do all the physical heavy lifting you shouldn't you know, what about r so I just go for long walks. Right? I do forty five minute walks, an hour walk, and when I do that, so I lift weights. I have a whole weightlifting routine, I have a calisthenics routine, but I don't do that every day. So every other day I substitute with two outdoor walks instead of just one. And I'll do one maybe rucking or weighted or

faster paced or something like that. But my body is in such a state of disrepair that my number one concern is staying away from injury. Like I do not want to hurt my 44 year old body that is obese because I have this image in my head of what a person should be doing. Cause I watched a bunch of elite level athletes be like, you should do this you know, it's like, no, I need to actually care about where I'm at right now.

And build the building blocks to the foundation to the you know, you know what I'm saying? So I can say that like the weightlifting, the I do a ton, a ton of mobility work that I never did in the past because of my dad and because of my mom. Like people

speaker-0 (31:53.826)
Define that? What you mean by

speaker-1 (31:55.534)
is like making sure the components of your body have a full range of motion. So Huh?

speaker-0 (32:01.358)
Practical example. That's it. Practical example.

speaker-1 (32:06.082)
Deep squats. Like can you squat all the way down without having to lift your ankles off the floor? You can lift your ankles off the floor, it's not the end of the world. but can you do that and just stay in that position?

speaker-0 (32:20.824)
So are are you doing stuff where you're like like doing like this with your arms, whatever and like like 'cause there there's some workouts that I love doing that. I I'll do a a bit of that. I've I've gotten out of the habit. I need to get back. I I used to do five minutes a day, it made a huge difference. Huge, huge difference.

speaker-1 (32:24.792)
Like.

speaker-1 (32:39.18)
You just say the word, Luke, and I'll unleash all of my YouTube isms right now. But we keep it in reserve. We'll keep it in the chamber.

speaker-0 (32:44.8)
No. No, no, no, no.

The the thirty six I can talk to you about an amazing, an amazing rap album. But I'll I'll come back to that. It's with Inspector Deck from Wu Tang and this other guy and a dude named Frankie, and I'm not gonna tell you who it is 'cause I want you to listen to it. It's incredible. It is absolutely incredible.

speaker-1 (33:11.587)
The whole album?

speaker-0 (33:13.182)
yes, but there's one song in particular that I want you to hear and I I really wish we could play it on on here so that you I could see your reaction to it. it's so freaking good. It's so freaking good. but anyways,

Mobility. No, 'cause it it just like it why I wanted a practical example was was just 'cause I didn't w I w I wanted you to keep going, but I I wanted to hear like like what type of stuff are you actually doing?

speaker-1 (33:41.366)
Yeah. Yeah. So the the the mobility stuff matters a lot for me because Yeah, you know, my par so this is what happens. So there's you know, there's what do you call it cartilage and there's this fluid in between your joints, right? Or in between your bones. And so you got a bone to a socket or a bone to a hinge, like your knee is a hinge, but your hip is a socket. If you don't like it th your body is an amazing thing. If you don't use it, you will lose it.

speaker-0 (33:48.189)
Sure, yeah.

speaker-1 (34:10.694)
And what happened with my dad was as it became more painful for him to walk, you you see there's this point with with older people, because your body stops manufacturing X, Y, or Z, if you don't like really use it, it'll deteriorate rapidly. So the that cartilage on top of the bone where the where it sits within the the socket of the hip on my dad's left side.

Well, walking became hard, so he walked less. And then that stuff began to deteriorate. And what happened was the bone shifted slightly into his hip bone. And so it was it it ground away all the cartilage and all that fluid. So it was literally bone on bone grinding. I think I've shared that before, but and it hurt him so much that he had to get the hip surgery. Okay, so this is where it's like if you aren't maintaining bone health and stretching, like all the stuff, what happens is like

Then there comes a point where you where you will need a knee or a hip replacement. And there are other reasons why people need it, right? Out outside of this. But because he had to get that, he would die. Right. Like there's his body was so exhausted from fighting cancer and end stage renal failure and like all the the all the devils that were plaguing him that that was the end that was the that was the final final move, right? That was the the fatal move.

So my thoughts is like, okay, well, where am I limited in my mobility and where am I limited? So like yeah, like when I was a little kid, I used to sit on my feet all the time, sit cross legged, but you know where you tuck your feet and you just sit on it. You tuck your, you know, your you're on your knees. yeah, like that hurts because I haven't done that in decades. Like when was the last time I had to sit on my feet? Yeah. You know, it's

speaker-0 (36:04.042)
my gosh, dude. I so I I bent down to go and like read Every book because right now she loves to sleep on the floor for some reason, which is just exhausting. yeah. So there was a book on the floor and I didn't see it and I like put my knee on it. It hurt so badly.

speaker-1 (36:21.112)
I thought you were gonna say you stepped on it and did the splits. poor Luom My both went to your groin. Got us here.

speaker-0 (36:24.93)
No.

speaker-0 (36:31.596)
Yeah. it's just I was like, How did this book hurt my knee so badly? Now I think it was just like the weight of like, you know, I don't I wasn't expecting it and what you know, but who knows, it could be that maybe I just need to start to work out again. But yeah, no, there's a really like I there is something about when you when you see a person that you care about go through a thing like that and you go, Okay, I need start to make some changes here. You know.

speaker-1 (36:55.51)
Yeah. Yeah, this one woman said it best the pain when the pain of staying the same surpasses that of the pain of change, that's when you make the decision to change. And you know, I I mean I I it's like a movie clip in my head of when I read the label of my dad's blood pressure medicine and I realized it was the same stuff I was taking and just being like, Huh. Crap.

Yeah. And I'm in a much worse place than my dad was because when he was my age he wasn't as unhealthy as I am. So it's like you know, I I mean, I'm a big fan of the minimum effective dose, but when the minimum effective dose is extreme, you have to do extreme things, you know, like

speaker-0 (37:40.952)
No, I agree. Yeah.

speaker-1 (37:42.998)
For for every ten pounds, your blood pressure goes down a few points. So if you have really high blood pressure and you're a hundred pounds overweight, you could effectively be at normal blood pressure if you were at a closer to adequate weight ratio, right? Yeah.

speaker-0 (38:01.59)
We've got a really good a long time Stephanie. If you are like hearing this and if you have a bunch of thoughts, please text me. she's a longtime listener of the podcast, big supporter on Patreon, and she works in she does collegiate medicine stuff, but like she's a PT her or I I forget, but she's got like a anytime we talk about the stuff, she's got a whole bunch of thoughts. And so I would love to get her take on stuff.

on this because she's a a per a professional and we are blind people talking about color. but Gilmar, I I I think like one thing you are t talking about that's a like

One of the benefits of doing all this stuff too is you'll start to sp particularly when you do a thing like an Ex ninety or a seventy five hard. you should Yeah. I'm just like just for my God help us all. what am I going to say? You find things that you like. Like I really like cold showers. So with Excess ninety, that was kind of like a benefit, not not a feature.

speaker-1 (38:51.713)
Emphasis on the hard.

speaker-0 (39:10.88)
Like, you know, like I was like, I love so I I'll do it. Like it's it's it's really not I mean, it's hard at first, but it after a a few times I'm like, I actually really do prefer it. I shower at night now for the most part 'cause it helps me tr transition to bedtime a little bit easier, which is one of the probably reasons why I'm tired right now, is that I didn't shower last last night. So it's it's a little bit tough then 'cause it actually like w wakes me up and stuff.

Sorry, but I'm thinking I'm getting a cold because of because I really had a cold. Has a cold. hence why I'm also exhausted. but like you find stuff that like you like doing, which for you could like I think you you're real into like rucking. It's a it's a thing that you talked about, like you return to or going on walks or different things like that, or you're like, you know, the way that you like like you find things like, like I like doing this. I like this is really this is enjoyable for me.

speaker-1 (39:46.168)
Mm-hmm.

speaker-1 (40:06.208)
Yeah. You find the things that you love.

speaker-0 (40:09.12)
Yeah. The th the hard part I I think, particularly for people like us, is integrating it into it so it becomes a habit. Because then it becomes just like a hyper focus. and again, like as well. Yeah, 100%. I know if you if you would agree with that or not, but yeah, it it is it is a real like turning of the heart and there is a thing of like, okay, then you're done with it. And

You like let it go. Right? Yeah. Exactly.

speaker-1 (40:40.578)
But you then you feast. Right? Like exactly. Not just that you you ease back or whatever, but it's like this is you fasted, now we feast. And it brings a balance that is totally absent in, you know, and I'm aware, just looking back on my life, and I think ADHD is a part of it, but how balance is like not really a thing. I just oscillate from extreme to extreme. And like trying to find

a measure of like, well, what is good, what is healthy, what is true, what is humiliating, what is embarrassing. You know, like if you never fasted before and you start to fast, you might, like especially for Lent, where you where you abstain from something. I don't know if you ever did this, but then you may of course you did 'cause we were in college together and we both did it, where you just make excuses w in order to break that thing. Where like it's Friday night.

And you order a pepperoni pizza during Lent and you're like, Well, it's almost midnight. It's close to one. Well the Jews counted it at sundown, so basically it's it's already Yeah. the gameplay.

speaker-0 (41:42.294)
You would drink on Holy Thursday?

speaker-0 (41:57.74)
Yeah. Yeah. No. And but like and it's it is like it's really tough to find and particularly for us. And this is a you know, I did I think I told you about this. I did like a huge I have a little passion pro project for ADHD and Catholicism. Who knows where it's going to go? But there is a real challenge, I think, for when you've got that about like, okay, so like my default, the way my brain works is to hyperfocus and go to these extreme lengths about things and then to completely abandon them.

Like it's not like what do you do when your brain is wired to do that? This is not just like it when it if when it impacts your behavior but not your but not your character. But I think one of the dangers though in not trying is that's how you get from like lust to betrayal. Cause if you're not trying, then you're just gonna be guided by your carnal passions. So there's a lot of things to say, I think, for just trying. Yeah. Even if you fail.

Because that at least means you're going up as opposed to just like you know being Chris Farley on the hill of being dear roots, dear little roots, please stay strong. You know, and you just and you're like, sir, you never woke up. You're not re you know, I mean like there I don't know that there's just a huge I will I won't ever go back. I will always remember the best confession I've ever had, one of the best, was I was just going through all this, it was in my

you know, mid t to late twenties in California. So like twenty let's say like twenty six. Everything's the end end of the world because I'm twenty six and hyper emotional. And I do this long confession and I'm like blah blah you know. I know me. I know, right? I had to be what an exhausting friend. and I

speaker-0 (43:53.954)
The amount of times that like you and Emily or like you and you and Maggie have like had conversations about certain people in my life just kind of being like, right? This is crazy, right? is not just It's more than one. Or like the text charts I can see you guys talking about.

speaker-1 (44:09.085)
Me right?

speaker-1 (44:16.755)
God is here.

speaker-0 (44:17.902)
He was just and and so I go through this whole thing and the priest just goes, This is all he said before he gave me my penance was to keep struggling. And I was like, Okay. I think he saw that at that point in time in my life, that's exactly what I needed to hear. Yeah. I didn't need he saw that like I didn't I'm need lecture, I didn't I'm need be told about like, you know, I just needed to be told like just keep trying. Just you're trying. Keep going.

And that's huge. So I I think like the stuff you're able to take out of this and you're able to apply to your own life and like hopefully so that you can have like a you know, be in a healthier spot when you're are your dad's age and stuff, like that's that's huge. That's and like I so I take back what I said about the extreme things. I'm proud of you. Which I always was.

speaker-1 (45:09.91)
Yeah, but I mean you have a history of you know I am a person given to extremes and rabbit holes and all that stuff. But the Yeah, yeah. still have a table saw if you want it. But Shannon's li said Yeah, Shannon said like two months ago, she's like, Mm, you know, the garage is getting pretty full. Maybe we should we should sell some of your woodworking stuff and I was like

speaker-0 (45:24.61)
Whatever define my personality.

speaker-1 (45:37.802)
No. It's too much of my identity. I'm not ready for that. Listen, I can own my morbid obesity and my awkward attachment to food. That's a bridge too far. I am a woodworker.

speaker-0 (45:54.604)
In 2017. We spent thousands of dollars on this. What? I mean, this is part of what's Okay, can I ask you a real like serious thing? If all this is attached to like you've got stuff with like you w with how you approach eating, your dad's death, like why not go to therapy about this?

speaker-1 (46:05.59)
Yeah.

speaker-1 (46:18.99)
because I think I'm lying to myself, saying that I can handle it on my own 'cause I'm the type of person that can handle it on my own, which then puts me in a cycle of not being able to handle it on my own. Hmm.

speaker-0 (46:34.094)
'Cause I mean I I'm I'm kind of glad we're in an era of like not anti therapy, but a bit of like it's not the and all and be all to t to to everything. But I do think there's a there's a real pat like it's great when it's part of like a like systematic whole, right? Yeah. When you have a good pro life, when you like have community.

And you're able to have a person like walk you. And there are some people who like there are some, I mean, actually, all of us probably have things that are extremely serious that like we need it with and we need a another therapist to like on like walk us through. My whole point is just like I think it should be a piece of a much bigger puzzle. is when it's at its best in my experience. and yeah, I I like there's nothing wrong with that, obviously. And I mean I know like you would agree with that of just like

speaker-1 (47:23.98)
Yeah, no, I'm kinda making fun of myself. I'm making fun of myself the answer, which was Yeah. Why why do I not like I have things that very much the competencies of a mental health professional could work with, but I have in my mind like I don't want to do that because I'm the type of per I want my story to be, no, he white knuckled it and everything was fine. You know, or you know, look at he pulled himself up by his own booster. And that's literally a thing. They have a there's a category that is a category in

in psychiatric circles about people who just refuse to get help even though they know that they need it, you know? And so it's like it's like why haven't I gone to the doctor? It's like why why don't you go to the doctor regularly? Well because I'm unhealthy. Yeah, that's why you go to the doctor. Yeah, but I don't it's you know, it's the same reason why my mom cleans the house before the maid shows up. Right? It's like there's like this thing where, no, I have to get right in order to be accepted.

speaker-0 (48:06.15)
Yeah.

speaker-1 (48:22.646)
Right. I I don't want to hear the negative diagnosis. So I I do the things that I think will actually help the situation, but I'm rushing to do them rather than integrating them, you know? Now I feel like, especially with food stuff, 'cause we all know and and that was one of the cautions we had a listener say, like when I first started the carnivore diet way back when she said, you know, it's really hard for me to listen to this stuff because I have like a, you know, eating disorder background and

You might not realize it, but sometimes the choosing of diets is just another expression of a disorder, right? It's not just about like, I'm choosing these healthy things. It's like an an obsessive, compulsive desire to have control in your life, and you're still using food for that control. And I'm like, dude, that is such a brilliant, a brilliant way of looking at it. and it's it's super insightful. So when I look at myself, like, why haven't I gone to therapy?

And talk through certain things. Why haven't I gone to I still have, you know, any 12 step or anything like that? Why haven't I at least attended a meeting or done these things? And it's like, I think it's because I have a narrative about myself that I really want to be true. Like I know it's not true right now, but I want it to be true. I'm the kind of guy that can do it on his own. And I acknowledge 100% that that is a tool of the devil to keep me imprisoned because I see myself imprisoned.

in certain things. And so it's like I d I don't know if therapy per se is. I don't know if it's betterhelp dot com slash C F. That's betterhelp.com slash C F. I don't know if that's like Yeah. Let me see let me see if it does. I don't know if that's the the

speaker-1 (50:13.112)
Ha, still works. But it just sends us to get dash started. But you know what I mean? Like there there is this thing where it's very easy to just be like

You can go to therapy as as a part of the ritual, right? It can become a part the talk therapy, the whatever. but you can also avoid therapy because you have a narrative in your head. I'm the kind of man who dot dot dot. Yeah. I think sometimes I get stuck in that that mindset. Also, I don't if I'm being totally honest, I don't have the frickin' money to spend on I'd rather my kids get their occupational therapy so they're set up for life.

speaker-0 (50:41.666)
Yeah.

speaker-1 (50:54.722)
Then me Yeah, I guess which sounds stupid, but then me worry about that. Isn't that but isn't that funny? It's like but then I see how it affects my kids. And so I still you know.

speaker-0 (51:06.54)
Yeah. It's it's I mean I I I'm not saying that that is

speaker-1 (51:09.914)
Self is a lifelong project.

speaker-0 (51:12.13)
You're just you know, like dude, you've got a lot going on. You've you've had a lot. You know.

speaker-1 (51:16.942)
Someone binge listened to every knee shall bow they l in eight years in like a handful of weeks. And they just went, Okay, so Michael, I am sorry about the loss of your father. I'm sorry that your son, bro. He like did this thing and it was like really sad but funny. He was like, I'm sorry about your wife's three miscarriages. my gosh, I can't believe the story about her almost dying. That's insane.

I'm sorry about your appendicitis and your son broke his back and your father's ill health. my god.

speaker-0 (51:47.086)
Over the past year.

speaker-1 (51:49.966)
It's October. So the funny the funny thing, this is you know, okay. So this this is the last time I no no it's not. This is gonna be one of many times I blame ADHD for stuff, but with ADHD there's this thing with with my whatever I have. I have a little anxiety, right? So if I have anxiety attached to

A seemingly benign thing. Read an email, return a phone call. If there's an anxiety attached to it, it becomes like an insurmountable obstacle, right? Yes. And I don't look and I don't look like if someone has a voicemail and I know what's on my phone, I will have 20 voicemails because I will refuse to look at my voicemail. Yeah. Because I know there's one voicemail. You know, I used to put post-it notes over my voicemail flashing light in my office. Anywho, so this this wonderful group out in Dayton, Ohio.

Pray more novenas.

speaker-0 (52:45.523)
yeah, yeah. I big fan of the Dead Ends. They're fantastic. So I went to high school with his twin brothers. They're great.

speaker-1 (52:53.038)
There's a woman named Heather who works with them and she coordinates all of these Praymore Novenas retreats that they do for Advent and Lent. And last Advent I did a series for them and I was one of several people as a bunch of our the Paradisis Day people, and they sent me like a twelve hundred dollar camera, a little ring light, a microphone, all that stuff.

And I had to record it by the end of by like the first first of November or whatever.

speaker-1 (53:27.99)
It's still sitting downstairs.

Because what because what had happened was my appendicitis happened and rearranged some stuff in my office for daddy to come home and the box I thought it was a box of books. It was the pre labeled box to ship all the stuff home. It had everything like foam packagings, you just slide everything into place, very well done, and ship it home. Or ship it back to wherever. And

speaker-0 (53:38.71)
yeah yeah.

speaker-1 (54:00.15)
So they reach out to me again this year and they're like, Hey, we would love for you to do an a second year. Your videos were really well liked. You want to do a second year? And I was like, Yes. And they're like, We will send you recording equipment. I'm like, well, actually, like, I have been trying to type that email for like six months. Yeah. Whenever I realize every time I walk and I get anxiety. I get such an anxiety that.

And then I look at that box, I'm like, I need to write an email. And then I try my best to forget it. Then I do forget it. Then it becomes this background. How silly. How silly. Why? Why? Why? Why? Well.

speaker-0 (54:37.228)
No, I just experienced that as yeah. yeah. And you know, and that's I mean, I'll be honest, that's probably ADHD. And it's just but that's also like human nature too. Just to want to avoid hard things. Like we who wants to let people down? Who wants to apologize? Like the ability to be humble and say this is the right thing to do is very difficult. Yeah. it's not insurmountable. And and

The bulk of the time, you know, that's I s I'm I don't know. There are times like and I'm of course like when we wait it just makes it worse, right?

speaker-1 (55:12.642)
That's the self sabotage. It's like, yeah, why am I making everything impossible?

speaker-0 (55:17.624)
Yeah. Yeah. The bulk of people understand, you know, like the Yeah. Like I I I had this thought the other day. I was like, you know, there's really not much that I could do that would cause you to like hate me.

Right? Like there's really like like we're kind of in this now and

speaker-1 (55:37.683)
All in this together. Thank you, Zach Ephraron.

speaker-0 (55:41.004)
Yeah. And I don't is it from like a thank god I missed that figure. I one. Yeah. Yeah, I didn't know I didn't really know. as I stare at like there's just a bunch of g Gabby toys on the floor here right next to me. It's these Gabby's Legos that that my mom got Everly for Christmas and then they're just she lov anyways. Ugh, my precious feet. I don't know. Okay. I've well, this was a really good chat about birth control.

speaker-1 (55:45.368)
Musical.

speaker-1 (56:10.063)
It's like I literally brought up my notes and I'm like, huh. How do I segue Luke to

speaker-0 (56:17.684)
And you we and you had this huge, very serious thing b before we before we recorded. So like, what are we gonna do here? like how are we gonna talk about this? Like w w w what are we gonna talk about? And I was like, okay, relax. But then like

speaker-1 (56:33.324)
Well, I know I didn't know where to start. I didn't 'cause we we had it's a two part show and we

speaker-0 (56:37.356)
I agree. I agree.

speaker-1 (56:41.396)
I'm just gonna share my truth with you right now. When you do stuff like that, when I try to be even sm You make me want to run away. And I'm just gonna ask you to stop making me feel so small.

speaker-0 (56:46.707)
I'm sorry, now I feel bad.

speaker-0 (56:56.042)
I'm the worst friend. Here's a little bit of leg for ya. pasty, pasty leg. Sweet, sweet, pasty. That that that is your way of telling me that actually does bother you and and I'm so sorry.

speaker-1 (57:10.314)
And let me just say, like, when I get like that, it's because I'm choosing us, Luke. I'm choosing us. Of course. Gosh, you're so gross and womanly.

speaker-0 (57:16.769)
Over Shannon.

speaker-0 (57:23.31)
With her romance novels.

speaker-1 (57:26.01)
historical fiction. Sorry. Historical One day I look over at her and I go, Are you reading female pornography? And she just was like, What? Nothing I'm reading is sexually explicit in any way, shape, or form. I was like, just

speaker-0 (57:28.91)
Historical fiction.

speaker-0 (57:42.37)
Because this man has a chiseled chest in 18 I'm sixty-two doesn't mean Shannon is there's a

speaker-1 (57:50.862)
Because he's a pirate and he captured her ship and is taking her away on a voyage into the sunset. Doesn't mean it's production.

speaker-0 (57:58.154)
L log ripping of of bun down shirts in your historical fiction whatever. okay, I need I this is the point where I need to go and get some coffee. This was a good show.

speaker-1 (58:04.087)
Yeah.

speaker-1 (58:12.918)
It's a good show. Yes. Yes.

speaker-0 (58:16.398)
Get to the birth control stuff next next week, everyone.

speaker-1 (58:19.82)
Sure. And I'm down thirty pounds.

speaker-0 (58:22.838)
Alright, good you are. Good job. I knew there was a reason why I was feeling s somewhat attracted to you. Where do go, buddy? I'm very, very proud of you.

speaker-1 (58:24.622)
Yeah yeah.

speaker-1 (58:34.69)
Thank you. The little things I do that annoy you you're down to it. Ugh ooh ooh Nope. Still double D's. Alright, bro. You have a beautiful morning. Enjoy your coffee.

speaker-0 (58:36.087)
I can't wait to tell

speaker-0 (58:48.056)
Thank you. everyone we and we will talk about birth control stuff at some point in time. So I know s there's some people who wanted to email us their thoughts.

speaker-1 (58:56.106)
I actually have the email brought up from Annie. Annie, thank you for your email. It's really great. And then Father Father Kevin wrote us a great email too. Really No, not even remotely. They're just like, let me give you some insights. One is an NFP instructor, and she has like years of experience with this stuff. And like how she talks to couples and whatnot. And then yeah, more to come. But the priest just talked about like, hey, especially when there's difficulties, you need to be

speaker-0 (59:03.874)
Were they all angry at at me? No. Good.

speaker-1 (59:25.056)
you ought to be walking with a pastor or spiritual director, not just like you tend to your soul, not just dealing with the body kind of stuff.

speaker-0 (59:33.58)
Yeah. Yeah. No, that's a really good point. That's that's a really good point. So everyone, yeah, please catching foxes dot fm, we've got a contact page. If you please if you can give us a review on on Spotify or iTunes. Helps people find the podcast. And yeah, 'cause there's a lot of Gen Z kids that don't know and they need to know. They need they need to know. They need to know.

speaker-1 (59:53.464)
They they need to know. Patreon.com slash see ya.

speaker-0 (59:58.092)
Bye. Yeah, yeah, please. Help Gomer go to therapy.