Hey. You're listening to Cut for Time, a podcast from Faith Church located on the North side of Indianapolis. My name is Claire Kingsley. Each week, I'll sit down with one of our preaching pastors to discuss their Sunday sermon. Cut for time is a look behind the scenes of sermon preparation and they'll share with us a few things that we didn't hear from the sermon on Sunday.

Thanks for listening. Alright. Good afternoon, Jeff. Hey, Claire. Hey.

Well, I'll just start off by saying something that someone said to me on Sunday. Really wrong, true. And she said this was not the sermon that I wanted, but it was the sermon that I needed. No. I I totally get that because on on the one hand, as I was thinking about this and looking at the passage and praying through it, I'm thinking this is, I think, at the same time probably gonna be hopefully both hard but encouraging and helpful.

But that's kind of the Christian life in some senses. Right? So, yeah, this passage we're looking at from acts 21, it's really interesting little couple of scenes from Paul heading back towards Jerusalem with this offering that he's taking that he's collected, from the gentile Christians to give to the Jewish believers, in Jerusalem. And, he's already had this already told the elders in Ephesus that, the holy spirit is testifying to me that trial and imprisonment await me in every city. And then sure enough, he lands, in a the city of Tyre up in Northern Syria, along the Mediterranean coast, and a group of believers there, through the spirit, are urging Paul not to go to Jerusalem.

And then he gets to Caesarea, like, the the place, the port closest to Jerusalem. And, again, this prophet shows up and enacts this kind of lived lived prophetic foretelling, right, of, the the takes off Paul's belt and says the man who wears this belt will be tied up and handed over to the Jews. And and again, they're just like Luke even includes himself at this point. It's like and we were urging him not to go to Jerusalem. And and Paul says, why are you weeping and breaking my heart like this?

I know that's what it's going to mean, but I'm also willing to go and suffer and die because I really believe that's what Jesus has called me to. Yeah. So we spent some time sort of exploring that. I mean, one was just this, interesting dynamic of, you know, what does it mean when good, godly, you know, faithful believers come to really different conclusions about what they think God is doing? And the the text isn't really answering that question for us.

I think in a sense, it's really just raising a question for us to wrestle with, which we explored, which is what if God's calling lies on the other side of pain and suffering? Mhmm. Right. What if God's calling for us is taking us through pain and suffering? And and then we just talked about a couple of application points for us.

One is that we're we have to follow Jesus wherever he's taking us, and we need to be a community of people who are encouraging one another to follow Jesus no matter where he's taking us. So interestingly, a guy grabbed me after, I think after second hour and said, you know, I had a question about that because it seems like from the text that the spirit is telling the one group of people one thing and almost like he's telling Paul something else. Right. Yeah. Because it's like through the spirit, they're telling Paul, don't go to Jerusalem.

And we sort of talked through that a little bit. I I think the way I understand it anyway is I think Luke is intending to communicate. The spirit is helping Paul and and these people around him. They're seeing the same thing. I think they're seeing suffering and imprisonment and difficulty and pain for Paul.

And the one group of people is seeing that and saying, so don't do that. And Paul is seeing, I think, the same thing and saying, okay. Jesus is letting me know what I'm gonna be going through as part of following him. Mhmm. So I don't think the the spirit is not telling him different things.

I think we maybe could say they're maybe just looking at it from different perspectives, And, they can see all the suffering and the pain and the loss on the one hand and on the other hand, all the good that God is doing through Paul. And why would you give that up to go to Jerusalem to suffer and be imprisoned when there's so much good that God has for you to do. And so many people are being blessed by what you're doing here. And Paul can hear that and appreciate it, but also still has this conviction from the same spirit that, yeah, that's what is marked out for me, and I'm I need to follow God through it. Mhmm.

Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Well, on the topic of, that second point of application, which is, like, what does it look like to be a community to support that support somebody who is going going through this hard thing, the subjectively good but subjectively painful thing, Mhmm. What does that practically look like?

I I felt like that's what I was wrestling with as I was listening to your sermon. Mhmm. That was really hitting me because I am walking with somebody through doing something hard and painful and choosing it. Yeah. I just don't want that for her.

What does it look like to really somebody through that? Yeah. I think we got hints at that in the text where, the the people that, you know, Paul's interacting with, Luke says, when when Paul realized when we realized that he would not be dissuaded, we said, okay. Let the Lord's will be done. And and then again, they they kneel and they pray with him together.

There's there's some of them who go with him up to Jerusalem, so they're even physically present in literally walking walking with Paul through this hard reality. So they're supporting him not even just in their prayers, but in their presence. It's not like I mean, you could imagine that scenario, right, where, somebody says, boy, I really think Jesus is calling me to do this, and it's hard. And it could be natural to say, like, well, okay. Good good luck.

I hope that works out for you, and you go do that, and we'll be over here. Yeah. Especially if you, like, disagree with them or you don't like that calling. Again, we're not talking about anything sinful or selfish. Just like, this is hard and sacrificial, and there's gonna be a cost to it.

And I think the thing for us to, you know, if we're the community of people around those friends who are doing that, it's an opportunity for us to live out Paul's command that we are to bear one another's burdens as we walk together in Christ. So that means there's gonna be a cost to us. Right? Like, you're bearing some of the weight of that with your friend because you carry the concern for her and the longing for things to go better or the the longing to see things resolved or healed or improved or, and and to continue to walk by faith with that person even if you for their sake you don't like what it's, you know, what it's doing or what it looks like, you take that to the Lord for yourself Mhmm. And and talk to him about that for yourself, and part of your prayer becomes even for your self.

Okay, Jesus. Help me to be able to genuinely support my friend in this because I I don't like it, and I don't like that it's it's hurting me, and it's costing me, and it's hurting and costing them. But I do believe that they're sincerely trying to follow you and I want to support them in that. I I wanna I wanna even be able to beyond just care and feel for them. I I wanna help in practical ways if I can.

Mhmm. Like these friends walking up to Jerusalem with Paul. I mean, they they literally made themselves available to help him live out this thing that they didn't like, but they had to say, okay, but God's in it. So, Paul's following him, and we're with Paul in it. Yeah.

It's not saying, Paul, don't do this. This is not the right thing. It's more of saying, like, I don't want that for you. I don't know. Yeah.

I I think I mean, maybe we're we're, you know, we're kinda trying to put ourselves in their shoes and guess what they were maybe thinking or how they're responding. Maybe they initially started out with, like, no. That can't be right. Mhmm. And and then as they're hearing Paul interact with that and saying, no, I I get it, but this really is what God has called me to.

So then maybe they're maybe they move through that to the position of saying like, okay. We don't like it, and we don't like what it's gonna mean for you and for us and for the ministry and, you know, for all that. But god's will be done. And and ultimately, we are as being part of the community who are supporting those people in that, we're recognizing that, ultimately, they belong to the lord. And they're trying to follow Jesus in what they believe he's called them to, and our calling is, again, not to, like after we get through the discussion and the dialogue and, you know, kind of praying and seeking the Lord's will together, then our calling is to release the desires and the outcome into the Lord's hands and, and to walk with those people even through the hard thing that he's called them to do, that we don't like.

And yeah. But but it's, it's where God is taking them. Mhmm. Yeah. Our friend is, in a sense, dying to maybe a kind of desire, maybe for a more comfortable life, or or for an easier outcome or for things to not be as just difficult and painful as they are.

And we have to die to that desire too. It's not a wrong desire. It's not even putting to death sinful desires, but walking with Jesus at times means having to surrender good godly desires, and saying, okay. I maybe in myself, I don't even like this, but I really feel compelled that this is what God is calling me to do. And and and if I prayed through it and sought the spirit through it and sought the wisdom and input of other people for that decision, and I really believe this is what God's calling me to, I'm I'm gonna lay the desire for a, you know, an easier life on the altar of, you know, worship to the Lord and and trust that he'll take that offering and accomplish a good purpose through it.

Yeah. Yeah. That's great, Jeff. I can I can take that wisdom and I need to, like, apply that to my life? That's really helpful.

So thank you. I mean, it's it's challenging for all of us, whether it's big things or small things. And sometimes, yeah, like like I said on Sunday, it can be harder when it's people we love that are going through hard things than it is ourselves, right? Like as parents we get that, right? Like I would rather be sick than have my kid be sick.

I would much rather be injured than have my child be injured. And there's something good and right in that, right? Like that's Christian. That's that's the heart of of Christ, right? Like of self sacrificing love on behalf of others.

And it's just it can be harder when we see people that we love feeling like they're called to self sacrificing love, and we'd rather them not go through that. Right. Because sickness or injury, that's just happenstance. Right? Yeah.

But choosing to enter into hardship, that's when we're like, No. You know? Yeah. So much harder to just stand by. And I and I think, yeah, if anything, you you know, if I had anything that I had left out, I mean, I think it's the the one thought might be it it's particularly hard for us to to experience this because we are literally walking by faith.

Because what I can see in front of me is just the sacrifice and the pain and the difficulty, and I don't really even know what God's gonna do with that or what he's accomplishing through it. I'm just called to trust that this is the thing that he's led me to. And and what I have right in front of me that I can see is suffering or pain or difficulty or loss or cost of some kind. And I don't know what the payout, in a sense, is going to be. I don't know how God's going to use that.

And and he hasn't maybe told me. He's just told me to trust him to step into this need or this ministry opportunity or this situation or this person's life. And that's what makes it hard because, you know, I I it's one thing if I know how much it's going to cost me. Mhmm. Right?

It's something else if God says, I want you to do this thing, and you just have to trust me. And he deserves nothing less, and yet it is so hard. Yeah. We're getting a little, far afield from the passage itself, but it's almost now kind of the image of, you know, any of us who've been parents or we had younger siblings, you know, the the toddler who just has a death grip maybe on some thing that they found that's not even good for them. Right?

Like, sometimes maybe it's just my mom loved to embarrass me with the story that, I had 2 older brothers and that when I was like a, you know, toddler or baby, whatever, that they would come in from playing outside and I would pick leaves off their shoes and eat them. Oh. That's just right. And and I could imagine. Right?

Like, my mom sees this and she's, like, horrified and has to run over and grab these muddy dirty leaves out of my mouth, which I think is, like, for whatever reason in my toddler head is like, oh, this is great. This is gonna make me happy. This looks really delicious. And, you know or the the kid, you know, decides that the favorite toy of the week is, you know, like a piece of broken ceramic that, you know, plate fell on the ground. And, oh, that looks really interesting.

I'm gonna go grab that. And God is very and it's not always objectively, obviously, bad things, but I I think part of growing and trusting Jesus has got us slowly often peeling our fingers away from the things that we're gripping that maybe are not in themselves bad things, but they may be the things that we need to let go of to follow the calling that he has on our lives and and to surrender those things and entrust them to him in the belief that, again, it's not just all it's not sacrifice or pain for the sake of sacrifice or pain. I mean, Jesus says those who have given up homes or families or treasures in this life will not fail to receive a hundredfold in the kingdom. Mhmm. And and so there is I mean, the reason we're following Jesus is for the promise and the hope of blessing and joy and satisfaction and fulfillment.

Yeah. It's just that we may not receive them here and now. Yeah. And and we're walking by faith that, if God has called me to this thing, that the pains and the suffering and the losses will one day will be able to look back at it and say, not only was it worth it, but, I mean, Paul even talks like the the troubles that we're going through right now are not even gonna be worth comparing to the glory that's going to be revealed in us. Yeah.

And I don't see the glory right now. And right now what I can see are the pains and the sorrows that are gonna come from letting go of this thing. And that's what makes it hard to let go sometimes. And and the need we have to be reminded of that promise that the glory that we will experience and the beauty that we will be surrounded with as a result of walking with Jesus and treasuring him is going to so far outweigh the the troubles and the difficulties that we experience that Paul says you you can't even compare them. Yeah.

Yeah. That that's what we need to remind ourselves and remind one another of. That right now, the the things that we're going through, they're real and they matter. And yet Paul, in another sense, can say they're light and momentary troubles that are just gonna be totally eclipsed, totally eclipsed by the glory and the beauty, of what God will reveal that he's done in us and through us. Yeah.

That that we'll get to I really think we'll get to see and understand and experience eternally, which is really kind of amazing. Yeah. Yeah. Hold on to that hope. Alright.

Yeah. Yeah. Thank you, Jeff, for your time today. Yeah. Thank you, Claire.

Alright. We'll be back again next week with our last cut for time before we take a break for Advent. Yeah. I'm looking forward to Advent. It's gonna be good.

It's hard to believe we're getting getting close to Christmas. So hard to believe I'm not there yet, especially on a 60 degree day, but I'm not I'm not unhappy about that. I'm thankful for that. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of cut for time. If you wish to submit questions to our pastors following their sermon, you can email them to podcast at faith live it out.org or text them into our faith church texting number, and we'll do our best to cover it in the week's episode.

If this conversation blessed you in any way, we encourage you to share it with others. Thanks for listening. We'll be back again next week.