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Hey, you're listening to Cut for Time, a podcast from Faith Church located on the north side of Indianapolis.  My name is Claire Kingsley.  And I'm Dan Breitwieser. Each week, one of us will sit down with the person who gave Sunday's sermon to discuss their message.  Cut for Time is a look behind the scenes of sermon preparation,  and they'll share with us a few things that we didn't hear from the sermon on Sunday. Thanks for listening. And welcome to the next episode of Cut for Time, the first episode in the lovely month of October, although it doesn't quite feel like it, right, Pastor Jeff? Yeah, yeah. We're supposed to  maybe get some rain this week and cool things off, which would be great, because it does not feel like fall for sure. I wish this weather would come back just in time for Halloween, though. Like, it can be cool and nice and fall, and then let's get some  80s back. Right at the very end of the month when we're gonna be outside.  Right, yeah. Getting treated, that's what I would really like to see. Yeah, yeah, right, because  I mean,  our kids are older, but there were years, you know, I remember where, man, they had to wear coats, right? Jackets and hats and  their costumes are covered up, because you've got to wear a parka. Yeah. Well, so if we're filled with the hot weather of  the summer and into the... October, it just seems appropriate, you know, in this sermon that was entitled, Filled with God's Fullness, focused on Ephesians chapter three, verses 14 through 21. So Pastor Jeff, why don't you just kind of walk us through your sermon. And I will say, know, it was really interesting in just the way that we introduced the passage this week with kind of Pastor Tom. I'm gonna assume this is not both first hour and second hour, but kind of praying our way through because this is a prayer. And so I think that was a really, I really liked that um thinking through just that,  sometimes it's more than just material to read, it's  the prayers of  Paul or other um Bible writers,  authors. ah at times, you know, coming through and we can kind of miss that when we have these little like numbers 14 and 15, 16, you know, going through, we just kind of, you know, read it as the rest of it. But  it was a prayer, it is a prayer. And so it was great.  So as we just think through that, I think that was a great thing. I really enjoyed that. So kind of walk us through filled with God's fullness. Yeah, so  as you pointed out, it's a prayer.  for one thing, it's just kind of fascinating if we step back and think like, man, if Paul could pray for us, what would he pray?  And actually, we have several of those prayers. And this is  one of the probably most significant, more well-known ones.  And that's what kind of got me to thinking of this is really a reflection of what God wants for us.  And it ties in, I think, with Jesus comment about, you know, I've come that they may have life and have it abundantly or have it to the full. And that's what Paul is praying here that at the summit, kind of the  climax, the high point of this prayer is this prayer for us being filled with God's fullness. And he starts with this uh posture of prayer.  I bow my knees. And then he goes, he takes us through sort of  several  kind of elements of that prayer that in a sense almost feel like they kind of build  off of one another.  But the big idea was  God wants us to know His love so that we would be filled with His fullness.  And  we see that here. First, He's praying that we would have strength. I pray that you would have strength in your inner being to be able to comprehend the love of God.  And that  knowing that love that Christ would dwell in our hearts, that Christ would  be at home, Christ would make his  residence in our hearts increasingly. I mean, of course,  Jesus lives in us by his Spirit. And yet here Paul is praying that that would actually become more and more a reality in our lives, over more and more of our lives. And then  praying that we would know this love.  And in fact, I think the  implicit suggestion there is that we would intentionally be thinking about meditating on reflecting  on what Paul talks about here as  the height and the depth and the breadth and the length of God's love for us.  And then this  amazing picture that we would know God's love that surpasses knowing,  which  in itself is just a I mean, what an amazing thought. What an amazing prayer. There's an infinite expanse of God's love that we will never be able to sort of lay hold of. And yet Paul is praying that we would actually be able to increasingly understand for ourselves the love of Christ. And that that leads to our being filled with the fullness of God himself, that our lives would be an overflow of this  love and joy and uh blessing and life that God has in himself. And then that just uh ends up together  in  this  doxology, this just, you know, expression of praise that Paul offers up uh to God's glory.  And in fact, having prayed that that God would in a sense do a couple of impossible things  that Paul is reminding us  he is actually able. Like the things that I've just pictured,  knowing the unknowable expanse of God's love, being filled with the fullness of the infinite God, and yet God is actually able to do that.  And that's what Paul wants us to believe and actually to experience.  that  out of that fullness and out of that experience of  God  overflowing into our lives that it just  results in glory uh to God in the church and the community of God's people that as we are  living this kind of life together that people are seeing something about the impact of Jesus in our lives that they can only be explained by God's work and ultimately results in  glory and praise to him. Yeah. uh  It's amazing to think too, the, I love the idea of the fullness of God and trying to figure out like how to, like, if you just had an understanding of who he was, how that would change just your perspective. um And um I mean, this is not going to be perfect analogy, but as you're talking about this, um you know, I'm thinking of, um  Jimmy Stewart  and now the movie is  escaping me. um It's a wonderful life. oh yeah. Thinking through,  you know, he's in, you know,  again, this has nothing to do with God. It's a bad analogy in that respect, you know, but, you know, he had, ah you know, his investment into people, know, his love for them.  And, you know, he's obviously despondent, but at the end it's like, he did, you know, and I think  I'm going to butcher the last line, but, know, it's something connected to like the,  um,  the power of friendship and what that,  he is no poor man who has, who has friends.  Sorry, I should have looked this. I expect to be talking about this. So didn't know to look it up as we're talking. No, I know. I get what you're saying. It's a, it's a beautiful image. Like in that movie, kind of the whole  The whole point in a sense is he's given this opportunity to actually see the  value of his life and the impact that he's had on other people. And that's what helps him realize that his life really matters. And he has made a difference when he's feeling sort of despondent, like you point out. uh So it's almost like, boy, man, if this guy in the movie could just get a picture, just get a vision of... how significant his life really is. And yeah, that's a really good analogy, I think, right? Like on a human level. And  so if I'm understanding what you're saying, like if we could just get a vision, a fuller understanding of the love and the beauty and the goodness of Jesus,  like what difference would that make in us  if we understood the deep limitless love of Jesus for us and lived out of that? And that's really what Paul is praying,  which is just amazing and encouraging, especially to hear him say, and God is actually able to do that in you and for you. You said that so much better than I did. Yes, that's exactly. Yeah. But if you had a sense of exactly,  you know, who you are in Christ and the love that. uh someone has for you who is almighty God and what he's blessed you with and the place that he's put you in and like just the  sense of purpose  and, you know, like the king has sent me to this place. Like  my job is to be the ambassador, like, you know, and to reflect his love, you know, like the ambassador of the United States to, you  Finland or, you know, uh South Africa or wherever, you know, that  You know, like that's my job is to be that emissary, ah you know, on his behalf. And so if we had that sense of calling in our place in the world, ah you know, whether that's in Nora or Broad Ripple or Carmel or, you know, choose your own adventure or your workplace or, know, those kinds of things like, like my job is to be more than just like Dan or Jeff, it's m God's child in that situation. um change how  I'm an ambassador for the kingdom of God's  limitless love. Yes.  And and I'm going there as a beloved child. And if I have this fullness, a full awareness of God's love for me, I'm actually going into that place with  a fullness of love to be able to offer to the people that I'm going to work with that I'm going to school with that I'm that I'm living in my neighborhood with. Yeah. Yeah. And that Yeah, I hope I hope people have that vision. Oh, that's great. And I love that. That's really good. That's rich. Oh, thank you. No, sorry, Jimmy Stewart. But yeah, that's that's what Yeah, anyway. All right. Well, let's see a couple things that I want to just kind of explore with you a little bit more. I love the idea and I love being practical. I think it's it's really helpful to you know, bring the theoretical and the spiritual into ways  in our own  heart and in our own lives to figure out. And I really liked how you talked about how to measure your own  love.  And  so let's talk a little bit about that. What  are the ways that we can kind of do our own self-evaluation for how we're doing? um Well, you know, a couple came to mind as I think I shared. um What does it mean that Jesus loves us?  We  are people who have nothing to offer Him,  and  we are people who really are not attractive to Him in ourselves, right? Like  in our fundamental  natural self outside of Christ, we're spiritually bankrupt. We don't have anything to offer Him. So  you put that together, and it's just thinking about, you know, the... The way that Jesus interacted with people, the kind of people that Jesus interacted with, ah the love that Jesus shows and calls us to show to the poor, the weak, the vulnerable, the needy, the people who have nothing to offer us, right? They can't pay us back in any meaningful way for any kindness that we do.  that Jesus is consistently reaching out to and loving and welcoming people who  might even consider themselves as enemies, people that don't have anything to  attract  Jesus to them, right? Sinners, tax collectors, prostitutes, I mean, the people kind of on the margins and the people that everyone else sort of, you know, hangs back from. And so that's what, that's kind of what prompted that thought for me in terms of the application.  If I'm  reflecting the love of Jesus, it's probably going to show up. in loving people the way Jesus loves, the way Jesus loves me,  as someone who  is, you know, bankrupt and needy and has nothing to offer him  and,  you know, essentially is not attractive to God. And like, God doesn't look at any of us and go like, man, that's somebody I really need to get to know. Right? Like, that's an impressive person. I mean, right. There's nobody that's in that category. And yet  Jesus loves us. So  if Jesus loves us who are bankrupt and broken and empty and have nothing to offer  and  nothing to attract him to us, that's probably what loving people like Jesus will look like for us. So  loving the people who can't pay us back and loving the people that  we're not naturally attracted to, right? Like it's no big deal to gather together.  You know, like a group of Colts fans, right? Like  you can get a club together  of people who like to hang out and cheer on the Colts because they have a common interest, right? Like, but  does Jesus love, you know, empower us to transcend that and love Patriots fans  or, you know, Steve? I don't know that I would go that far. I know.  That might be a little bit of a push.  I know.  Ken, is the love of Jesus big enough to bring together uh Buckeyes and Wolverines?  You know, that's a real, that's a challenge, right?  Republicans and Democrats, conservatives are old and young, black and white, right? Like, I mean, it's going back to what Paul has talked about,  about how Jesus has broken down the dividing walls of hostility to unite us together in his love.  And so if we're loving like Jesus, there  should be some uh experience of that flowing out from us towards people that, again,  we wouldn't naturally choose, but it's the love of Jesus that's moving us. So yeah, it's good to, you know, that could be a way to sort of  a check, a reflection. ah Who am I loving? Am I loving people that um take me beyond sort of my own natural self-interest and desires and preferences  because that's what Jesus love looks like. Well, and I think the other thing  is also not taking those for granted. I mean, it's treating people in love that we are we are friends with and we are family and we are in the same church with.  you know, those are the things where, you know, that love because I have been loved should should influence every single interaction that I have. Yeah. And I'll just be looking for the power dynamic of like, oh, like, yeah, this, you know, I can um you know, it's, you know, who are your friends with on LinkedIn because you're trying to get the next job. I mean, you're using them and you're using each other, you know, but in terms of those connections to do those things and there's nothing wrong with that, but that's not what we're talking about. It's, it's love for, for valuing them for, for themselves. I think the other thing that comes to mind, Dan, is this whole imagery of fullness and being filled to the fullness of God and that idea of ah My life is already full of something, right? Like none of us are vacuums.  I mean, our hearts, our lives, our affections, our thoughts are full of something.  And I think kind of implicitly Paul is  raising the question for us to reflect what am I filling myself with?  And what is it that I'm looking to  fill me?  And  the man...  We live in a society that has uh almost limitless opportunities for entertainment, for distraction, for things to fill our lives and our time and our minds and our hearts up with. And in a lot of ways that can, that's not necessarily a bad thing, but it's something to be aware of,  both in terms of all the temptations and distractions and, you know, things that are telling us to pay attention to them.   And to recognize in that,  there's probably a good challenge for us  to, one, not just be discerning, which is good, but also to think about priority  and what do I want to fill my heart and my soul and my mind and my affections with.  And  it's not even that it's  necessarily, you know, avoiding sinful things or  things that are just objectively  unhealthy,  but there's just  so many opportunities to fill ourselves up, just to numb ourselves, to distract ourselves. ah And  there's a challenge there, right? Because a challenge and an amazing offer, an opportunity from God.  Jesus is saying, come to me the spring of living waters  and I will fill you. and  the one who believes in me from within him will  well up water that  springs up to eternal life.  And there's just  still this part of us that  doesn't want to have to be dependent, I think, in that way. ah We want to be able to choose.  what I'm filling myself with and we want to be in control. And  you know, there's a part of it honestly that pursuing Jesus feels a little like work  because it is. It takes effort. It takes intentionality.  And I've got this little device that I carry around with me that takes no effort and no intentionality and gives me all kinds of limitless opportunities for entertainment and distraction and... You know, so I can ignore the disappointment or the frustration or the difficulty of life for a little bit. I can be distracted from it. And again, that's not to say that that's inherently bad. It's a matter of how much and what am I really feeding myself with? What am I filling my soul with? Because Jesus is saying, I have for you a fullness of life grounded in the awareness and the experience of my love for you. that will  overflow to  joy and abundance and satisfaction, but it's actually gonna require you to maybe let go of some other things  and to put some effort and intentionality into,  this, we talked a little bit about  the practice of meditating in a Christian sense  on, I think that's what Paul is getting at here. Like I want you  to understand. the extent, the immensity of God's love for you. And that doesn't just happen, right? Like it doesn't, we don't just pray that and then  it magically happens, right?  The prayer is that we'll be engaged in that process of thinking about, reflecting on, meditating, turning over in our minds  what it means that God loves us so deeply and  to what height and to what length and... And to spend time in that so that it does start to shape us and it does start to fill us more and more. I like that a lot. All right. Well, one question I have for you relates to specifically to verse 15. Okay. And the wording here is a little interesting. I bow on, you know, kind of leading up to it for this reason. I bow my knees before the Father from whom every family in heaven and on earth is named. What is that all about? You gotta help me out here. What is that? Families in heaven? Yeah. Families in heaven and yeah. What does it mean? Every family in heaven and on earth is named. Yeah. So the idea of naming is of course about identity. and uh relationship. So to have a name is to have a relationship of identity, connection, uh meaning.  And so  this idea of  every family in heaven and on earth  named uh by the Father. uh So one,  we talked a little bit about this. I think it's again just a general recognition that  everything exists because of God. There's nothing that exists in heaven or earth that doesn't derive its  source, its life from the Father. ah So that's part of it. I think maybe Paul also  has in mind the idea that he's brought up before and that we're going to get to as well when we get to spiritual warfare and the armor of God. ah  We're engaged in a spiritual battle in which there are powerful forces that are opposing us and and there's we're living in the middle of a spiritual contact  contest in which there are heavenly beings and powers and uh Principalities that  are opposed to us  and you know, there's there they have a name in a sense as well  and yet  God rules over all of them  and So I think it's,  Paul is intending for us to see this  as a reminder of the  comprehensive power and presence of God in heaven and on earth. It's maybe even an echo of,  you know, what he writes to the Romans about uh all things, working together, all things  for our ultimate good and that nothing in heaven or on earth can separate us from the love of God in Christ Jesus.  So I think there's an element of that there too. ah That it's, uh especially as Paul is going to  focus his prayer around the love of God for us in Christ, uh identification of God as our Father is significant because He's the Father who loves us and the one who is ultimately in control of all the things that are happening, even  ruling over   potentially  the evil forces in heavenly places that are trying to battle against us.  Okay. All right. Well, thank you for clearing that up. um Well, this is  the podcast is named Cut for Time and I've yet to ask you, what have you cut for time? So-  Oh man, there's- What  are, anything else that kind of came in your sermon or I should say didn't come into your sermon, you really felt like you had a cut for time?  There's so much there because  it's just such a rich passage. And in fact,  as we pointed out, the passage itself encourages us to just reflect and meditate. ah So yeah, there's a lot. A couple of things. There's interesting, there's a uh fun little play on words that uh Paul  uses even in that verse 15,  where he talks about the father from whom every family is named and in Greek it's just kind of cool because he's saying, bow before the pater from whom every patria is named. So it's just, it's this neat little, you know, just a little play on words that Paul is throwing in there. I wonder, know, if he kind of smiled to himself as, you know, as a spirit inspires him in that way. I bow before the pater, the father from whom every patria ah So it's,  if that makes sense, right? Like, so from the father,  every,  the outpouring of that, the life of everything that exists flow from him because he's the father of all that exists.  It's just kind of cool, but you know, not really central to what we were trying to get to. um It's interesting also, another little. uh linguistic thing there in verse 14 where Paul says, uh kneel before the father. uh The  construction there in the Greek again implies a continuous action. Paul keeps  on kneeling.  In other words, I  think it's intending to communicate this isn't  just a one-time prayer. It's a posture of life. It's an ongoing  attitude  and it's   Again, a reminder because of the  physical posture that he's talking about embodying, I bow before the Father, ah that in a sense, maybe we can almost say that uh fullness comes or starts from a posture of humility and dependence, right?  And man, we live in a world that  celebrates being independent and standing tall and being on our own and self-confidence and all that. Pulling ourselves by our own bootstraps. Yeah, right? Like, and I don't need to take anything from anyone, and I'm proud to be self-reliant.  And yet, Paul is not just humbling himself, uh whether literally or figuratively, you in terms of bowing, but he's saying it's actually an ongoing posture and an attitude that is itself kind of communicating that just like so many things in the kingdom of God, that the way up is the way down. Right? Like the way to be exalted is to humble ourselves. The way to find life is to give up my life, to find life in Jesus.  Just uh a great little uh insight there, I think, is that Paul  has built into this, the posture and the action and  the, um yeah, maybe the heart perspective of humility and trust and dependence. um Yeah, and I think it came across in other ways in the message, but there were a few some other ways that we could think about this. We're not talking about getting more from God, is what Paul is praying here, but he's talking about us getting more of God. That that's actually the goal and the prayer. And we've talked about this, we've  probably used this phrase before, that Jesus is the treasure.  He is the goal.  And that's who and what God is offering to us, is the very life of His Son  in us and for us. The prayer and the goal and the blessing is not to get more things from God, but actually just to have more  of God Himself, because He is life.  And so the goal of the Christian life is not external blessing as we tend to think of those things. mean, those things are not wrong. It's not wrong to call them blessings. But the ultimate goal of the Christian life is communion.  It's fellowship with the Father to know Him, to be shaped by Him, to have  His life present  and real in  every part of our being and every aspect of our experience. that's just, again, things I think it came through in other ways in the preaching, but it was just, there's just so many ways to explore and express the richness of this passage. I just, couldn't, didn't have time to share it all and went over time anyway. So it's, this was my choice. Yeah, it's fine, fine. Yeah, we didn't go over change. Well, I'll be excited, you know, with this as the background, we'll be talking about more posture and taking a different approach in the posture next week with Pastor Nathan as we, you know, in this, you know, this week was, you know, bowing continually and now, you know, coming up with chapter four, you know, Paul's gonna be asking us to urge, urging us to walk in a manner worthy of the calling to which you've been called. And so- Yeah, from, kneeling and bowing  to walking. so. Isn't that great, right? Like  walking on our knees. That sounds, yeah. Interesting, interesting mixing of metaphors. know, Paul loves to do that, right? Like rooted and grounded, right?  Yeah. It's good. It's good visual imagery. so we're looking forward to having, um again, Pastor Nathan, tell us what that's all about  coming up next week. So anything else you would like to share here  before we wrap this up? Looking forward to it, too.  No, I just  just say, you know, if it also wasn't clear, I mean, this is  something that I certainly have not perfected,  mastered at all. But I'm so thankful for passages like this that we looked at where Paul kind of uniquely just points us towards guys. This is if I could pray something for you. this is what I want you to have. This is what I want you to experience. And man, it's just, what a great reminder. What a great encouragement ah of what Paul wants us to have, what God wants for us,  and that it's not about a command or  obey or,  mean,  morality and obedience and  a good life flow out  of this fullness of Jesus living in us  and us living out of the awareness of his love for us. just, man, I just, want more and more of that. I want more and more of that for myself. I want people to see it in me and to experience it for me. yeah, uh so  this is,  this would be a great passage to memorize if  anyone's thinking about,  you know, just trying to have things that become part of the mental furniture, you know.  become  the things that are just there and shape us. This is a good one to hang on to. Yeah, may that be true of you, may that be true of me, and may that be true of all of us as we meditate and try to just have a better sense and awareness. I think that's a great word that you used of the love that God has for us  and how that can shape us and give us confidence. So, all right, well, Pastor Jeff, thank you for your time and  bringing us and. talking us through the fullness of God and  we'll uh talk with you next time. Sounds great. Thanks, Dan.  Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Cut for Time.  If you wish to submit questions to our pastors following Sunday's sermon,  you can email them to podcast at faithchurchindie.com  or  text them in to our faith church texting number  and we'll do our best to cover them in next week's episode.  If this conversation blessed you in any way,  we encourage you to share it with others.  We'll be back again next week.