Hey. You're listening to Cut for Time, a podcast from Faith Church located on the North Side Of Indianapolis. My name is Claire Kingsley. And I'm Dan Breitwieser. Each week, one of us will sit down with the person who gave Sunday's sermon to discuss their message.

Cut for Time is a look behind the scenes of sermon preparation, and they'll share with us a few things that we didn't hear from the sermon on Sunday. Thanks for listening. And welcome to Cut for Time. Things are going to be a little bit different, this summer, because the wonderful, the amazing, the talented Claire Kingsley Oh, yeah. I agree with that.

Going on. Yeah. That's right. You know? And, you know, she says if you're a dedicated listener that no one wants to hear her, you know, internal monologues with her husband Nathan, I'm I don't know.

I disagree. You know, I've been here seven years. I don't know how long Cut for Time has been in existence, but we have not yet once had a Claire interview Nathan Cut for Time. And, I don't know what that would look like. Maybe maybe someday.

You never know. But I feel like so far up to this point, we have not done that. And I I mean, I don't mind. I I've been in I've been interviewed by Jeff, by Joey. I'm pretty sure in COVID, Steven Camp interviewed me one time for Cut for Time, and other people as well.

Yeah. And you've done it as well. So yeah. I feel like we should at least give it one shot. And then if everyone says, no.

Never again, then we've learned more. Put it to a vote at the next congregational meeting and see what people decide in terms of should Claire interview Nathan next couple of time. Because, I mean, little peel behind the curtain. I've been I've been okay with it. I think Claire's a little like, I don't know if we wanna hear that.

I'm like, oh, come on. It'll be fine. You have great quest she has great questions. I think she does a great job with it. But I'm excited to have this conversation with you as well.

Yes. Yes. Alright. Well, we are yeah. So things will may may sound a little bit differently, and but, Claire will be back in at various times.

So we're just kinda sharing the load, here this summer and going into maternity leave as well and and things like that. So To clarify that it's her maternity leave, not your maternity leave. That is very true. Yep. Yes.

That would be breaking news, and we're not doing that. So alright. So let's start you know, I think we should start as always where, you know, with, you know, a title like cut for time with. Alright. Well, I'm here obviously with Nathan, and we're talking about Cut for Time.

So, as you were working in acts and and really talking through, you know, Paul's defense in front of, Agrippa, and, you know, a a sermon titled The Appeal, you know, kinda give us a little bit of a overview of what that sermon was all about, and, we'll go from there. Yeah. Yeah. So I think, as I approach this text and, you know, I've obviously been following along with with Jeff and Tom Waltz, who've been preaching the last couple sermons leading into this. This reaction and kind of follow-up conversation between Agrippa and Paul is obviously deeply rooted in the context of what has just immediately preceded it.

The end of chapter 26 kind of marks this end of where we've been, and he starts his journey towards Rome, which is where we're gonna be picking up next week. But, yeah, I I I as I was, you know, studying this passage, the the things that came to mind is Paul is being a faithful witness to the gospel, and I think that's, kind of Luke's the narrative that he is trying to show and portray is how Paul was faithful to that. So, kind of the way I summarized it on Sunday in my sermon is that there's kind of four parts to Paul being a faithful witness. And the part was him sharing his story, and that happened the last two weeks, with pastor Jeff and Tom Waltz preaching kind of his where in his defense, Paul is sharing his story about how he grew up, his background, how he became a Pharisee, how he persecuted the church, and then how he, was converted on the road to Damascus with his, encounter with Jesus. And so then I kind of took it to be parts two, three, and four, of being a faithful witness, where we got on Sunday, which is faithful witness means withstanding criticism and mocking, which we saw from Festus' interruption of Paul, kinda just cuts him off.

Be like, you're out of your mind. You're crazy. Your education has made you crazy. part would be, Paul's faithful witness is making an invitation. So he's actually pausing the conversation to take a moment to turn to Agrippa and invite him into this conversation.

Now Agrippa doesn't, really respond in the way that probably Paul was hoping. But what it comes down to in terms of being a faithful witness, it means trusting God with the results. That even after Agrippa kind of deflects Paul's question, and asks him his own question, Paul just takes it, goes with it, and says basically, yeah. I would actually I pray to God that not just you, but every person here who hears would accept this good news, would accept the gospel, would accept that Jesus is the Christ, that he died on the cross, that he rose again. But, obviously, Paul didn't want everyone to else to be imprisoned like he was.

But yeah. So what it look what does it look like to be a faithful witness? It's kind of where we were at on Sunday, both looking at Paul as he stood before Festus and Agrippa and Bernice, and then we had some questions for ourselves as well as to what does it mean for us to be a faithful witness in our life. And the thing that I really appreciated about, what you talked about, particularly with the questions, and I we talked about this briefly. You know, I I kinda wrote down my own notes, you know, as the quote, you know, preach the gospel at all times and when necessary use words.

I mean, that is it's one of those really nice statements, but when you start to think about it, you go, wait a Like, that's not what, at least I believe, Jesus has really called us to do, and there's there's gotta be a balance. But it's really important to use words because a good moral person can look very much like, you know, a Christ follower Yeah. Most of their actions. Right? I mean, is that Yeah.

What do you think about that? Yeah. I mean, I I think that's I mean, I I brought it up on Sunday, in the context of making an invitation. Right? We see Paul make an invitation to Agrippa, and that was kind of just an example I used of maybe why we tend to maybe shy away from making an invitation at times, not just for the fear of criticism we might receive, but because sometimes we just want our actions to be enough.

Like, we want people to see our lives and see that it reflects Jesus. And I think most believers I know that's true. Like, I can see Jesus in them. You know, you have those encounters with strangers where you're like, I just there's something about them that, like, you can see Jesus in them. Absolutely.

I I agree with that. How we live should absolutely line up with what we say we believe. But I think the the reason I brought it up was to just kind of, you know, poke poke a little bit, poke some questions of, do you ever use that as a crutch as a reason why not to say something, why not to actually give an invitation, not just an invitation to receive Jesus, but even an invitation into a deeper conversation. Right? Paul's question to Agrippa was not, Agrippa, do you believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God?

He doesn't come right out. He just invites him into a conversation about Jesus. And now Agrippa doesn't exactly go for it, but there was an invitation. So that was kind of the point behind the quote. And, I know you kinda mentioned it, but you you mentioned to me that you had written down that quote before I even mentioned it in my sermon, which I I think shows kind of how well known and maybe well or overused this quote can be or maybe used in the wrong context.

Yeah. And I think it it really ties in well with even the stuff that our church has been doing the last two years with the Life to Life. Yeah. Absolutely. You know, and I think, you know, for people who have not been a part of it, I would encourage you to do so.

I will say for my part of Yeah. Going through that program, I think the thing that was really eye opening, but also encouraging and convicting I mean, it it can feel like, you know, if you're going to make an invitation I mean, if if you're gonna do what, you know, Jesus has called you to do, you've gotta do the whole, you know, you know, almost four spiritual laws, you know, get into all the rules and regulations. Yeah. You know, get into all those things where I think life to life really does a good job of describing the process, particularly in a postmodern era of how people come alongside, from, you know, you know, a pendulum from one side of, like, don't even know Jesus to fully trusting in their life with him. And it there it takes a process.

And so going through that saying, you know, like, how can I advance it? You know, it's a successful conversation, a successful interaction with someone if I'm able to advance it a step or two or five, you know. And so do not feel like you have to go from zero to 100, but if we can push the ball along, then whether it's you, whether it's somebody else at faith, whether it's just another Christian somewhere on the globe, you know, that's that's opening that's, you know, doing some of the the sowing that maybe someone else will have a chance to reap. Yeah. Yeah.

No. Absolutely. And and I think I mean, back to the name of the podcast, the the in terms of what I cut for time, I feel like that was an avenue in terms of talking about life to life or even talking about some of the, I think, helpful I don't wanna necessarily call them statistics because I'm gonna misquote them, but ideas that help frame that mindset, which is on average, it you know, someone does not come to Jesus in a night or in a week, but that it takes years of conversations with multiple people more often than not. Once again, we got some of these great statistics through Life two Life. I can't remember what they were off the top of my head, or the fact that it's gonna take, you know, somewhere around a dozen to two dozen different conversations that it's not gonna be this one thing.

And I think in some ways, it it kinda takes the pressure off to say, hey, you don't have to like like you were saying, you don't have to go from zero to a 100 in in one weekend or in one week or whatever. But also, it reminds us that with that pressure taken off of us, there's maybe even a greater desire to be a part of that. Like, I want to just be one of those conversations. Like, I'm going to open my mouth boldly and just ask them, hey, what do you think about spiritual things? Have you ever given thought to, you know, where you're at in this world of, you know, spirituality or things like that?

Like, that's an opportunity just to have a conversation. Once again, sometimes you make that invitation there and someone says, yeah, I don't wanna talk about that. Fine. But you made that invitation. And, you know, it's not not about getting people across the finish line all at one time.

It's about being a faithful witness, just like, you know, we see in Paul. Like, made the invitation. Agrippa didn't go for it, but he he trusted God with whatever happened. And that meant for him still going to Rome and, you know, ultimately dying for the faith. Yeah.

I think the other thing as he talks about Christ's story, and I think that, you know, when they say, are you out of your mind? It it makes me think of I think, so much, you know, in our culture, you know, the the shame of the crucifixion is just not a big deal. You know? It's you know, even if it was in our you know, Jesus died by firing squad or by lethal injection, it wouldn't be like, oh, that's, you know, there isn't a chain that's, you know, so, connected to that. And so I think I feel like for those, rulers talking to Paul, that's that's something that's clearly in their minds that may not be, part of our context.

Yeah. Absolutely. Alright. Let's talk about a couple things too. Is there anything else you had to cut for time, for this sermon or really that life to life?

And really, I think maybe getting into the the ways that people can connect with people is is a good Yeah. I mean, I can tell you things I should have cut for time. I think I went a little bit over, but No. No. No.

It's it's all good. Once they shut off the timer in the back, I mean, it's anybody's game. So And for those of you who don't know there's a timer in the back, pretend I didn't say anything. That's right. You just keep eyes for it at all times.

Yep. All times. One question I kinda have and maybe some others have, you know, it's I can it's very different to, you know, preach a a nice, you know, pithy verse or two in Ephesians or Philippians, but to preach a part of a story and a narrative in Acts and you're the, you you know, you're the person to be doing this and it we're not even done yet. You know, there's still one more week to go. What's that like, to to be giving a sermon in this type of way where you're sort of dependent on others to set the table for you, but, you know, then they have some very clear ideas, of, you know, you know, where where they're gonna go with it and it doesn't necessarily jive with yours.

Like, how does how does that all work? Yeah. No. That's great. If you ask me which is easier to preach, you know, narrative or an epistle, I mean, I think almost depending on the passage, obviously, nine times out of 10, it's easier to preach an epistle.

You know? It's, I mean, Paul's epistles are essentially sermons. It's, hey. Here's, things we believe about God. Here's how that should impact how you live.

Now go and do it. It's kind of what epistles are like. And narratives are historical. Right? You're you're trying to glean from it.

And then all the while you're asking yourself, is this descriptive or prescriptive? Right? Is it is this just saying what's happening? Or is this saying, this is what happened and we should do that as well? So there's a lot more things to do.

And often when you preach narrative, you get a much larger section of scripture, a lot more verses, but a lot less happens that you can preach from in that verse. Like, I can't remember exactly how many verses from 24 to 32. Do the math. That many verses and, essentially, there's basically three things that happen, you know, in that many verses. So, yeah, I would say over more more often than not, it's easier to preach, epistles than narrative, but it's a good challenge.

And as to your question about what it's like to, you know, in this section, right, the the to last stained glass window that we're filling in, you know, the gospel on trial. Yeah. I mean, it would be really hard for me to pick up where I am in preaching this if I had not heard, you know, Jeff and Tom's sermons in terms of how they set up. So, yeah, a little bit. I'm dependent on how the other people who've come before me have preached this and set this up, but they both did a great job with setting it up.

But also for my own sake and just for anyone who's been out the last few weeks, I didn't feel like I had to give a little bit of context to just say, hey. Remember Paul's on trial. He's with Festus. He was with Felix before that he's appealed to Caesar. He's headed to Rome.

They're trying to figure out what to say in a letter to Caesar that Paul will probably be carrying with him or the, his Roman guard will be carrying. They're trying to figure out why he's, you know, on trial, why he was in prison with Felix. And so, you know, but Paul doesn't just see this as his defense. He sees this as an opportunity to lay out his story and to, like, explicitly share who Jesus is as the gospel. He's not gonna shy away from the opportunity.

So, yeah, it was it was a fun challenge, and, you know, we'll probably get some more bits and pieces of it, like, you know, as we move forward where we're gonna have continue, you know, with Jeff on his trip to Poland, and then I'm, helping lead the trip to Spain, and we're both kinda in and out. We've got some other preachers coming up. We're gonna keep hearing from more voices, which I'm I'm excited about. And we almost have our own group of people from faith going to Rome. Just Yeah.

Almost. Yeah. That's true. Outside in Italy somewhere. So Yeah.

Alright. Well, Nathan, is there anything else you wanna say before we wrap this up? No. I I mean, I, I feel like there's a lot more I could have said on some of those questions towards the end. Someone came up to me after, one of the services, I can't remember which, and said that one of the more impactful things that they took away was not any of my main points, which they weren't saying as a as a bad thing, but it was something I just kind of said in passing, which is the the gospel is not incompatible with being a good citizen.

Right? Paul didn't see that. That's kind of I kinda summarized it at the end as what did Luke what was Luke trying to do here? You know, why does he include these few last verses about, you know, oh, he wouldn't be, he would be innocent, be able to be set free, does not deserve death. If he had not appealed to Caesar, we wouldn't have to send him there, that kind of thing.

And I was like, yeah. I mean, it is true. And I'm glad that that was, something. And then it's like, yeah, I probably could have hung out there a little bit more and and spent a little more time developing that thought as what does it mean to be both a firm believer in the gospel, want others to come and understand and believe the gospel, but also still be a good citizen of wherever you live. So anyway, that's, like, something that has even given me food for thought of how to think through some of those things.

But yeah. And I could honestly go on endlessly about all the random things I witnessed and encountered, while being a paper boy, in 02/2011. So Well, then you have to get give me give me at least one good story here as we wrap this thing up. I it was one of the most scared I've ever been in my life when so when I delivered papers, there were a few people that they there would be notes in this pad. Right?

This was I'm not doing this on a phone or an app. They literally give you, like, a notebook with addresses and, like, directions, like, written out. And they're, like, you follow this, you turn here, give it you know, put a newspaper at this house and then skip three houses, put it here. It's it was all very analog. But some people are older, and they, would request that you walk the paper up to their porch or something like that.

So, you know, I would do that. And, you know, I'm driving around at three in the morning. You're kinda in your zone. I'd be listening to to music or something like that. This is before the world of podcast was so popular.

And, I remember one time I was walking up to the porch that I've done this, you know, a 100 times already, to this one house. And at three in the morning, they were out on the porch smoking, and I didn't see them there because it was dark. And then, like, from the shadows, they just, like, kind of came up to me to, like, receive it from like, basically, for me to hand it to them. But, like, it oh, man. I nearly jumped off the porch because it, like, literally was just, like, this person coming out of the shadows and was like, thank you.

And I was like, oh. So yeah. It was also a job like, it was also a job that I just convinced a lot of my high school friends, that were still around, you know, were back from college for the summer. I'm like, hey. I've got this really dumb job where I drive around for three or four hours.

You wanna come do it with me? And I would pay my friends part of my meager earnings to just come and hang out with me so I didn't have to do it alone. So yeah. It was not You should get paid back then for that. So I can't remember what it was, but it was paid per paper.

So depending on the route you had and depending on how many people were subscribed to the Enquirer, you would get paid per paper. And we also delivered The Wall Street Journal to anyone who had subscriptions for that. You got paid for those. But if it was raining and you didn't bag your newspapers well enough or double bag them, and if they got a wet paper and then the person called and said, hey. My paper was wet this morning, then not only did you not get paid for that one, but it was like a $2.50 fee.

So if you have, like, two or three wet papers, that was, like, three hours of work that you just went away for nothing. So it was just, like, it was it was miserable. I I think at the end of the summer, I maybe netted between gas and all the other, you know, expenses of being a high school, college person at home hanging out with friends. I think I maybe netted, like, $300 to $500 by the time I spent the whole summer. So, yeah, not not worth it.

I don't understand. Why aren't you still doing this today? That's easy. It does. Yeah.

Yeah. But that's the other thing is at the end of the summer, I went back to college, and I'm like, you know what? I see the value of my education so I don't have to do this again. I bet you do. I bet you do.

Alright. Well, pastor Nathan, thanks so much for, this cut for time episode, next week. Nick Carter, right, is next? Yeah. Nick Carter is handling, beginning of chapter 27.

Paul set sail for Rome and, filling in that last stained glass window will be a sight to behold. So I'm looking forward to that alone. I imagine a lot of yeah. I imagine a lot of people will be, clapping as they see that last one fall into place. Yeah.

We should maybe make it a bigger deal and, like, have some, like, you know, drums or or cymbals kind of celebrate just the the filling in of that last stained glass window. I like it. I like it. Alright. Alright.

Thanks, Dan. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Cut for Time. If you wish to submit questions to our pastors following their sermon, you can email them to podcast@faithliveitout.org or text them into our faith church texting number. And we'll do our best to cover it in the week's episode. If this conversation blessed you in any way, we encourage you to share it with others.

Thanks for listening. We'll be back again next week.