Hey. You're listening to Cut for Time, a podcast from Faith Church located on the North Side Of Indianapolis. My name is Claire Kingsley. Each week, I'll sit down with one of our preaching pastors to discuss their Sunday sermon. Cut for time is a look behind the scenes of sermon preparation, and they'll share with us a few things that we didn't hear from the sermon on Sunday.

Thanks for listening. Alright. Hey, everybody. Welcome to Cut for Time. I'm not the usual host, Claire Kingsley, because this week, pastor Nathan Kingsley preached.

And as as usual As per usual. Preaches, Claire is like, I don't wanna interview my own husband. So, Nathan, let's jump in to you preached this last weekend. We're in our Lenten series on the parables, and you preached on the parable of the Good Samaritan. So give us a a quick rundown of the story, the kind of the main point or points of your sermon.

Yeah. Interesting note, there was a few people, to remain nameless that when I told them weeks in advance, hey, I'm preaching in a couple weeks on the Good Samaritan. Apparently, it easily gets confused with the prodigal son Yeah. Because there are a couple people that thought I was preaching on the prodigal son, and then they're like, oh, I just realized it's you're preaching the Good Samaritan. Good Samaritan.

The other one. And so, yes, I preached on the Good Samaritan, not the Prodigal Son. That's in Luke 10, 25 through 37. And the you could preach the parables of Jesus in a variety of ways, but the way we kinda have this series aligned is disrupted. Right?

How does Jesus use these parables to disrupt the lives, the actions, the habits, the thoughts, in good ways of the people listening? And so I kind of looked at it in terms of how does he do that in the parable. And so I kind of a good Eddie Goodsermon. Right? Three points.

Jesus disrupts to follow Jesus means that he's gonna disrupt our pride. It's gonna defy our presuppositions. But then also what we see in the good Samaritan is that following Jesus drives us to compassion. Mhmm. So kinda took, took some time to walk through the parable in that way and see how Jesus, does that in our lives if we're willing to, like what we learned last week with pastor Jeff's sermon, if we have ears to hear and we let that what we hear, you know, enter into our lives to become what we do, then this will be some of the outworking of of that word in our life, is that we'll have to come face to face with issues of our pride and our presuppositions or the way we have judgments about people that might not be fair or we might see people not the way that god sees them.

And that ultimately, following Jesus should drive us to compassion, and we shouldn't, love others in the way that he has loved us. Mhmm. People who heard your sermon, were were there specific ways you were hoping people would then act differently, think differently? Right? If if Jesus is telling the story to to kinda confront us and Yeah.

Paradigm shift or whatever, Like, how how did you want us to to come out of this thinking or behaving or Yeah. Think differently? Yeah. Good question. So in one part, on Sunday, I I asked if Jesus was telling the parable to you, who would be the person that would cause the most angst in your life if they were the hero of the story?

Right. Right? Because that's what that's what the Samaritan like, the fact that Jesus made the hero the Samaritan and not a Jewish peasant or just some good, you know, Jewish person. A lawyer. A lawyer.

And then a lawyer went down. Yeah. Yeah. Like The lawyer in the story. Right?

So because I had him the hero. So, you know, if if we were each to consider who is that person that would cause us to just, like, grit our teeth and just be, like, I can't believe they're the hero of the story. If, like, someone in our lives and not just some world leader like Putin came to mind Mhmm. Like, what are we gonna do about it? You know, what are you gonna do about it if you, you know, you claim you wanna follow Jesus, you wanna be his disciple and yet there's this person out there whether it's, you know, maybe a family member, a co worker, someone in your life in some way is like, I can't stand this person.

I don't want them to be the hero of the story. Then what are we gonna do about it? Are you gonna just let that person continue to be judged in your mind of up. Yep. I don't need to worry about them.

I don't need to move towards them in any way or are we gonna let once again Jesus disrupt our pride, our own kind of self righteousness. We're now no longer seeking to justify ourselves and yeah. I don't know. It's I think it's a question that's hard for each of us because when we're honest with ourselves about maybe who that person is, it's like, let me think of someone else so I don't have to move towards that person. Right.

You mentioned, like, world leaders, and it's really easy to put it so far out there that it actually doesn't impact me at all Right. Or make me have to think about it. Like, how am I gonna move towards Putin? Definitely Hitler. Yeah.

Yeah. Hitler's the person that I but you bring it back home. You think it's like that, you know, estranged child or ex husband or former best friend or, like, you just go down the list and get your boss who screwed you over or fired you or whatever. Like, you can go through Yeah. Go down the list.

I'm thinking of each one of these, I'm thinking of people in the congregation who I know that's their story. Yeah. And yeah. Not I'm I'm not targeting anyone. Right.

I'm like, oh, no. All of my examples come from real life. But I guess that's kind of the way life works. Yeah. Yeah.

So what did you, what did you have to cut, out of your sermon? So Lent, you know, we have a little bit more going on in the services with our Easter offering that we're talking about every week. So you had a little less time Yeah. And you took a little less time than I normally take. So I still went over my alive times, but that's okay.

One thing that I came across actually in seminary that I was reminded of as I was, preparing for the sermon and I even came across one of the commentaries is that while we can interpret the parables of Jesus in different ways, some, in some ways, are more right than others, in terms of how you interpret them. And, nothing against Martin Luther, but he took the allegorical approach to interpreting the Good Samaritan, which is that every detail in the parable represents Jesus and his life in some way, such as, like, the man going down to Jericho is Adam, references Adam. Mhmm. Jerusalem is the heavenly city. Jericho is our mortality.

The robbers are demonic powers. Know, when it says that the man was left half dead, it means that he was dead spiritually, but half alive due to the knowledge of God. Okay. So he goes on and on. And, of course, the good Samaritan is Jesus who comes to save us out of our, you know, out of our death and brokenness.

The the beast of burden that he puts him on is the body of Christ. The inn is the church. The 2 coins are the two commandments of love, to love God and love your neighbor. Makes sense. Innkeeper is do you wanna guess?

God the father. No. Saint Paul. Oh, Paul. Okay.

Yeah. And the return of the good Samaritan when he says, hey. I'll come back is signifying the return of Christ. Yeah. Yeah.

So that was Martin Luther's I think it's very interesting to think about what it would mean to interpret this parable allegorically, but Yeah. It, of course, did not really fit in with how I would interpret what Jesus is trying to get at. Sure. But it's just very interesting to think. Someone that we have a lot of respect for had a lot of good theology.

Also, maybe had some interesting interpretations of things. When you were in seminary, did you ever read, a book called Sanctified Vision? I did not. It was about I'm guessing you did. Maybe not in seminary.

Interacted. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. I haven't read the whole thing.

I interacted with it. You know, that's That's what Joe is saying. I interacted with it. I interacted with it. There there's there's an old joke in academia that is, like, have I read the book?

I haven't even reviewed it yet. You know? Yeah. And no. So sanctified vision is fascinating because it talks about the the four different, methods of interpretation Yeah.

That were used by the church fathers and then on. And, like, what Martin Luther is doing there is an example of allegorical or apocalyptic, where it's like, what if we peel back the curtain on this? Does it really reveal Yeah. What's underneath the surface of it? And it so, yeah, it's interesting.

I mean, there's always the the, like, historical critical method is the first foundational level of exegesis, and then it it gets interesting. I think we're losing most of our audience. Probably. Probably. That's alright.

Someone's gonna look up the book, Sanctified Vision, and then Yeah. Read it and be even more confused. Or go listen to Martin Luther's or not listen, but read Martin Luther's. Luther's Sermon on the Good Samaritan. Yeah.

You could listen to it in some way. That'd be quite impressive. So what other what other, bad ways are there to interpret or apply this Or or maybe not bad, but insufficient Yeah. Ways to interpret or apply this. Yeah.

I mean, I think I hinted at a couple of them, on Sunday, and one of which is is just to you hear the good Samaritan and you just interpret it the way the rest of the world interprets what it means to be a good Samaritan. Like, oh, okay. Jesus is encouraging us all to just be, you know, more more mindfully aware of others. Right? To not be so much in a hurry Right.

That we miss people who are in need. So, hey, if you see people in need, you wanna stop and help them, kinda like what the good Samaritan did on the road and and be a good Samaritan to others. I think And then judge and condemn those who aren't willing to. Like, be self righteous Yeah. Exactly.

Selfless Yeah. Giving you are. And judge the people who are too busy Right. To stop and lend a hand even when they have plenty of money and could do it. Right.

Exactly. So I think that's kind of the the oversimplification in a way of, you know, if I wanna hear this parable and then maybe try to apply it but not really let it sink into my heart, it would kind of be maybe this like, well, I'll try to not be so rushed or I'll try to be a more concerned citizen and look out for others. I mean, it's part of the way there. Like, you're you're maybe squashing your pride a little bit if you don't turn it into self righteousness. You're maybe being a little more others focused.

Mhmm. But I think that's just a small step into the direction that following Jesus really entails which is, you know, not just squashing your pride a little bit or not just being a little bit more others focused, but really searching our hearts for who do we think is outside, you know, god's plan and who, you know, who do we purposely avoid, you know, trying to show love to, and who do we purposely avoid trying to even have conversations with, and how are we moving towards them with grace and compassion and forgiveness, when maybe that is a very hard thing to do. That's good. So so the point of Jesus is Jesus telling the story wasn't just like a, hey, everybody slow down and keep your eyes open for people in need. Right.

Yeah. Like, that's not a bad thing. Right. But that's not the extent. Like if he wanted to teach that message, he could have done it in a lot of different ways without using an a Samaritan as an example.

But I think the purpose behind him using a Samaritan is because it would have been in some ways, repulsive for his audience, specifically this lawyer to hear that, wait. You're saying, like, he's the good guy. He's the hero of the story. And, you know, like, he something else that, actually pastor Tom Macy pointed out to me after he heard my sermon is while he was listening to my sermon, he was curious about the use of the word compassion, right, that the good Samaritan had compassion. And he said, hey.

I was still listening, but, I started looking up how many times it's used in the New Testament, which maybe is something I should have done in my own research. But he said it's used 12 times. That that Greek word is used 12 times in the New Testament. Nine times, it's used to describe Jesus. Two times, in parables, one of which here.

And then one other time at a healing when, I think it's two blind men are asking Jesus to have compassion on them. Okay. So the fact that Jesus uses this word compassion to describe the good Samaritan and what moves him to actually do something for this man on the road, is very clearly connected as we look at all of scripture both in the Old Testament and New Testament as being a a word and an attribute of God himself. Mhmm. That God is moved by compassion both, you know, in the old testament, what we see, but then also with Jesus and how he did his ministry moved by compassion.

So, yes, we wanna be followers of Jesus. Compassion is a vital part Jesus. A vital part of what it means to follow him. Well, I think that gets you to the core of of the story because verse 31, verse 32, verse 33, the three guys who see the the man who was beaten, it says very clearly all three saw him. Yeah.

Yeah. When the priest saw him, he passed on the other side. When the Levites saw him, he passed on the other side. When the Samaritan saw him, he had compassion. So it's a real real clear difference in response.

Yeah. To to see to have compassion, to feel with. Yeah. It was also pointed out to me. I'm sure you probably get this.

You love it. Right? You get all this great stuff after. Right. Exactly.

Yeah. Someone else pointed out to me that, when you think about the priest and the Levite and in terms of how I was talking about it in the sermon. Right? If Jesus following Jesus disrupts our pride, in some ways, the priest and the Levite hadn't had their pride disrupted yet. That what they consider to be of most importance probably.

Right? It's all a fictitious story. But a most important is, hey, I need to be I need to remain clean. I need to be able to fulfill my duty as a priest or as a Levi to receive offerings, to offer sacrifices, to do my duty. That's what's important so I can't let this, you know, possibly dead person Right.

Disrupt that. Right. And so because of that, because with, you know, misordered priorities, they did not stop in some way. So it's like, yeah. That's a good way to think about it too.

Like, they hadn't had their pride disrupted yet to get down in the dirt. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's interesting because, you know, you use, like, the analogy of of Mother Teresa and Billy Graham on the other side.

And when you when you use that, I I was thinking, like, oh, yeah. I mean, I can hear in my head, I hear Billy Graham go you know, being like, woah. I don't have time to stop for one guy when I've got 10,000 waiting Yeah. To hear me preach. Or Mother Teresa, like, you know, I could help one person or I could go back to where they're all coming to me and I could help hundreds.

Yeah. Right? It's, like, so easy to do the calculus. Mhmm. Am I gonna help one or help the hundred?

Right? Yeah. And he's saying Biblical trolley problem. Yeah. Exactly.

But the but the, that being neighborly means helping the person right in front of you. Yeah. Right? Yeah. And not weighing them against some other, yes, some other group of of people in need.

Yeah. Yeah. And I I think the other thing that, I didn't mention at the at the top of this, but I I've been asking myself a lot is, you know, last week, the question from pastor Jeff's sermon is, are we listening? Are we willing to listen? Right?

Like I had terrible I didn't hear that. You didn't hear that? I guess you weren't listening. I guess I wasn't listening yet. But the the question that I not that I had to pick a question, but it kinda worked out, so I just decided to go with it, is are we asking the right question?

K. Right? Because the lawyer asked the question of, and who is my neighbor, when, really, that shouldn't be that shouldn't have been the question he was asking, but he's trying to put limits on the law. And the question that Jesus answers is not that question, but he says, who is the neighborly one? You know?

So anyway so I think that's even as I've just kind of been still wrestling with some of these things over the last couple days, just thinking through, okay, when I am asking questions of God or what I'm asking about, like, how I should be, you know, interacting with someone as I'm sitting across the table from them or I'm on the phone or whatever, you know, I'm asking God for wisdom, for advice, but it's like, okay. Am I asking the right question? Am I am I pursuing this in the way that Jesus would have me to do it, or am I asking a question with an answer that maybe isn't gonna be what I want? I don't know if I think that made sense. But, I think how we ask questions and the types of questions we might ask looking for answers is also somewhat indicative of where we're at with Jesus and our relationship with following him.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I I've wondered if if the lawyer is asking, you know, what's the limit on the law? And I think that's part of what he's asking.

The other one is, like, well, but if I if I have to self sacrificially love everyone, like, what's the limit? I can't I can't actually do that. So how do I make wise decisions about, like, the boundaries of who I can actually, like, self sacrifice in this way for? Yeah. There there's a there's a classic question in moral philosophy.

Here we go. I know. Right? This is why everybody loves moral philosophers. In utilitarianism, which measures, like it basically says do the math, the greatest good for the greatest number.

So if it if it brings good, do it. And if it brings pain, don't do it. And, like, weigh the differences. And, I'm forgetting the technical phrase for it, but there's a problem. Like, if you use that approach, then you have to like, and you do the math and you're like, well, if I give you know, if I hurt myself or put myself out there past the point of health, whatever, but that brings more good to other people, then I'm morally obligated to do that to the point where I'm I've basically destroyed myself, but everyone else is getting right.

So what's the limit? Like, how do you do that? And, anyway Do you think I don't think he's asking that particular question because that didn't come for seventeen hundred more years. But also, it says, like, Luke gives us a clue into his intent and then he says wanting to justify himself. So I don't feel like that, hey, I can't love everyone.

Who who should I pursue to love? Doesn't feel like the question he's actually asking. It feels more like, alright. So you tell me who am I actually supposed to love because I can't do it all. So does does justifying himself mean, like, he wants to get a thumbs up that he's been doing it right so far?

That's kind of how I take it based on, I I guess, my own study and some of the things I was Well, you you studied and I haven't. So it it seems more like that when he asked that question and, you know, he's seeking to justify himself, who is my neighbor, is that he is kind of looking for that affirmation from Jesus to say, no. You you've done it. Like, you're doing a great job, that you are not just an expert of the law, but you have been, doing just what you need to do. Because right before then, it it does seem like Jesus is content to just, like, let that conversation end.

Right? Like, okay. What does the law say? The lawyer says, here's what the law says. Love the lord your God.

Love your neighbor as yourself. And Jesus basically says, okay. You've answered correctly. Go and do it. And, you know, with all this, it's like, contentedness from Jesus to just alright.

Like, go do it. This is what you should do. But then the lawyer is the one who's like, but but okay. But who is my neighbor? And then she's like, okay.

You don't get it yet. So let me tell you a story, that shows you that you're asking the wrong question, that it's not about who and what the limit is, but, you know, how are you doing this with everyone Yeah. Not just the people you like. It's also interesting that of the two sides of the law, right, love the lord your god with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength, and your neighbor as yourself, the question is not about, like, well, how do I love god more? It's like, oh, yeah.

I got that. Right. He doesn't ask how. That's fine. Yeah.

I know. I I I definitely love god with everything. Yeah. You know? But what about my neighbor?

I'm not sure. Like, yes, if I define neighbor as a very small set of Yeah. The people closest to like me. Yeah. People who are like me and that I'm responsible for.

Yeah. Okay. Well, cool. Well, thanks. This was fun.

And, are there any, like, last thoughts or stuff you, left out or jokes you couldn't include? Or or No. I most most jokes are they are what they are. Sometimes they come to me in planning. Mhmm.

But I don't have any that I wished I would have said. I really wish I could use I I do the bald guy. Yeah. I mean, I I do feel like the, the two examples I used from college that, you know, just slightly hint that I wasn't the greatest college student. Hopefully, people don't take that too negatively or be like, oh, he's a bad example for our kids as the youth pastor.

But, I I tell the kids all the time, hey, if I can if I can get c's and still be here before you today, then you'll be fine. Don't listen. Don't listen. Don't stress too much about that question. Keep stressing and studying.

So alright. We'll have to put a disclaimer at the top of this podcast. It may not be appropriate for all the audiences. I've never I've never said follow my academic advice. Okay.

Yeah. Alright. Yeah. Just your spiritual advice. Sure.

So Oh, nice. So does your dad still keep bees? He does. We've moved our bees from where we grew up in Tennessee to Ohio, and he's still Okay. Still going strong.

There's lots of stories I could tell, and I could just form all types of So give me a fun fact about bees that no one knows. A very few people know. There is a variant of African bees that when a hornet enters their nest, the way they kill the hornet is they, like, basically, mob it and they shake their bodies with friction, increasing the heat to the point that the they roast the hornet alive. Woah. But the temperature that a hornet dies is, like, two degrees lower than the temperature that honeybees die.

So they can create this heat bomb around the hornet that kills it, but they become they come within a degree or two of death themselves. Wow. I'll let you figure out some spiritual analogy. Yeah. And, apply that to the good Samaritan.

I can't do that. I didn't go there. Well, the two degrees are the two coins. Yes. Which are the Old Testament and the New Testament.

And this is a fun fact you learned from your friend in college? No. Absolutely. This is a real this is a real thing in the Is it a real thing? I've learned.

We don't keep that variant of bees. But, yes, there there is a a that is the other fun thing about bees is there's different variants. And a whole hive of bees adopts the personality and traits of the queen. So you could take a whole hive of bees that is, you know, has the trait of a more docile queen. But if you put a more aggressive queen in that hive, then the entire hive becomes aggressive.

What's the difference between an aggressive queen and a docile queen? Oh, that's a great question. What? This is not an apiarist podcast. But, by the way, for those of you at home, apiarist is what Beekeeper.

It's the it's the technical term. Technical term for beekeeper. Thanks for explaining that. No problem. What makes an aggressive queen?

It means how aggressive they are towards, like, people and things as you get close to the hive. You know, like, if you have a very aggressive queen when you try to harvest honey, they're gonna be all up in your business. Your beesness, as you're trying to as you're trying to harvest honey or check on the hive. But if they are, you know, a little more docile, then you can kind of, you know, put some smoke in the hive and, you know, if they're not as aggressive towards you as you get close to it. When you order a queen from, I don't know, queenbee.com Yeah.

You ask for a docile queen? You yes. You get different types of queen. You can get well, it's not put in those terms, but it's like, do you want an African one? Do you want a European one?

Do you want an Asian one? Because they have different personalities based on what part of the world they come from. So I may have to my father-in-law keeps bees. And the last time I went with him, I got stung a couple of times. So I'm gonna I'm gonna buy him a docile queen.

Do you know they also just ship them in the mail? Yeah. It's crazy. You could get bees in the mail Yeah. If anyone didn't know that.

Yeah. And and I've I've heard you can rent bees, beehives to move them around to pollinate fields. Yep. You can do that. People will actually steal the hives steal the I haven't heard of anyone stealing, but that I'm pretty sure it was a this American Life podcast story about it.

So Well, for people's sake, I think we should end it here. Yeah. I was gonna say, if you're still with us, after all of that that b talk, join us next week for, Bs R Us Yeah. With pastor Nathan, the a b years. Be your best self.

No. They're not calling us that. Sorry. No. Be Be like Jesus.

Jesus. Alright. And See you next time on Cut for Time, b edition. Thanks for listening to this week's episode of Cut for Time. If you wish to submit questions to our pastors following their sermon, you can email them to podcastfaithliveitout dot org or text them into our faith church texting number, and we'll do our best to cover it in the week's episode.

If this conversation blessed you in any way, we encourage you to share with others. Thanks for listening. We'll be back again next week.