Alexandra Hughes:	Welcome to season three of the ASCA Viewpoints podcast, the podcast where we talk about the student conduct profession in higher education. I'm Alexandra Hughes, your Viewpoints host.

Alexandra Hughes:	Hello everyone and thank you so much for joining me today on today's episode of our ASCA Viewpoints podcast. As you guys know, last week was our annual 2020 ASCA conference and it was amazing. There was so much happening and so much going on. I'm sure that you all have returned to your respective institutions, probably having to deal with a lot of things that you missed, so please be sure to be mindful of self-care as you move forward in this journey.

Alexandra Hughes:	Through our conference last week, we had the opportunity to laugh, to learn to network, and to build community. And it's with this community that we have built that we need to rally around each other during this time. It is with great sadness that ASCA announces the passing of its founder and lifelong advocate. Dr. Donald D. Gehring. On behalf of ASCA's board of directors, members, staff, and partners, we extend our deepest sympathies to Don's family, particularly his partner Rita.

Alexandra Hughes:	Don was a transformative leader, educator and scholar within the field of student conduct. Recognizing a need for further discussion among conduct personnel, in 1986 Gehring began discussing his idea to form a professional home to serve the needs of campus judicial officers. The following year, at the Stetson University Law and Higher Education Conference, Gehring met with others to begin the framework for what would become the Association for Student Judicial Affairs.

Alexandra Hughes:	In 1993 the new association hosted its first Campus Judicial Affairs Training Institute at Bowling Green State University, chaired by Don Gehring with an attendance of 130 professionals. Thereafter, the annual event was renamed the Donald D. Gehring Academy in recognition of his service. In 2008 Don became the first chairperson for the Raymond Goldstone ASCA foundation, which was created for the sole purpose of fundraising to support ASCA.

Alexandra Hughes:	Dr. Jennifer Waller, ASCA's executive director, shared that Gehring was ASCA, as in ASJA's, first rockstar. "When attending our events he was much sought after for pictures and advice. Don continued to be connected to the association giving generously with his time, energy, and expertise. Dr. Gehring will be sorely missed."

Alexandra Hughes:	Dr. Gehring's other contributions within higher education included serving as the president of the Southern Association for College Student Affairs, induction into the Kentucky College Personnel Association's hall of fame, recognition as NASPA's Pillar of the Profession, selection for the NASPA's outstanding contribution to literature and research award, and the Robert H. Shaffer Award for Excellence as a Graduate Faculty Member. Additionally, he was a recipient of SACSA's highest honor, the Melvene D. Hardee Award, and named a senior scholar by NASPA and ACPA. He was particularly proud to have earned the University of Georgia's first higher education doctoral degree.

Alexandra Hughes:	Fred Rhodes, a close friend and former colleague of Gehring's while at the University of Louisville wrote, "Don was the consummate professional and role model who diligently served our profession for over 50 years. Don will finally be remembered for his exceptional leadership and dedication to hundreds of graduate students and colleagues across the country. Don was the epitome of a lifelong learner and teacher." Gehring passed away at his beloved winter home in Saint Simons Island, Georgia on February 11th, 2020 at the age of 82. There will be a memorial service to honor Dr. Gehring in his hometown in New Jersey at a later date.

Alexandra Hughes:	Many of our members have asked what they can do to recognize Don Gehring. If you would like to contribute to the Raymond Goldstone ASCA foundation in his memory, please contact ASCA at TheASCA.org. Or you can also send donations to Raymond Goldstone ASCA foundation, attention Donald Gehring, in memory, P.O. Box 2237, College Station, Texas, 77841.

Alexandra Hughes:	So for those of you who may have been a ASCA Viewpoints listeners in the past, you may know that Jill, our past podcast host, actually had the opportunity to interview Donald Gehring. And so what we decided to do, in his honor, with this unfortunate news, is give our listeners the chance to hear from him yet again. And so we're actually going to play that episode for you guys for this episode. And we hope that you listen, please stay tuned, and we look forward to seeing you on our podcast in the future. Thank you so much and see you next time.
Jill Creighton:	Welcome to season two of the ASCA Viewpoints podcast, the podcast where we talk about the student conduct profession in higher education. I'm Jill Creighton, your Viewpoints host.

Jill Creighton:	Welcome to the ASCA Viewpoints podcast. I'm Jill Creighton and today's episode features Dr. Donald D. Gehring. Yes, that is the same Gehring from the Gehring Academy. Don is one of the founders of what was known then as ASJA and has evolved into the present day ASCA. So Don spent some good time talking about kind of those initial days of ASJA, how it came to be, as well as some of those first moments at the early summer academies. So I hope you enjoy this conversation with Don. It's pretty lighthearted.

Jill Creighton:	But I also wanted to share a little bit more about him. Don is a professor emeritus and past director of the higher education administration doctoral program at Bowling Green State University, so BGSU. But he's also very well published. He used to co-edit the College Student and the Courts periodical and has articles in the Journal of College and University Student Housing, the NASPA journal, personnel and guidance, The Dental Educator, Surgery, Programming, and the college student personnel journal. So he's got quite a lot of research out there if you'd like to take a look. Don was also recognized as a pillar of the profession by NASPA and spends his time now down in Florida enjoying retired life. So I hope you enjoy this conversation. Here we go.

Don Gehring:	Anybody else on the line?

Jill Creighton:	Nope, just you and me.

Don Gehring:	Just us two. Okay, good!

Jill Creighton:	Just us two. So I'm so excited to be able to talk with you about the founding of ASJA and kind of its evolution into ASCA. So I was really hoping you could share with us the story of how you all ended up gathering after Stetson and how it evolved from there.

Don Gehring:	All right. Well first of all, let me tell you that somewhere along the line I wrote a history of the first few years of ASJA and it may be in the archives somewhere. And then at one of the conferences they had a videographer interview me and videotape it all. So you may want to look for that also. Okay?

Jill Creighton:	I will definitely go looking down the rabbit hole for that.

Don Gehring:	Yeah, Jennifer may have it somewhere in the archives, but it was just an idea that came to, I was at the university of Louisville and it was an idea that came to me that I was going to ACPA, commission, whatever it was, 14 or something. I don't know. So they did judicial affairs as we called it then, and there would only be like one session at ACPA on student conduct. And I thought, well that's terrible. Because we have all these federal laws and regulations. We need to do more as a profession to help people who were doing this sort of stuff.

Don Gehring:	I mean, I was a professor. I wasn't doing it, so to speak, anymore, although I did serve on a committee to hear some cases, a conduct committee, and I forgot what we called it. But anyway. I was distraught at the fact that neither ACPA and NASPA had nothing hardly, I mean maybe once every couple of years.

Don Gehring:	So I said, we need an organization. And at the time, Bob Bickel, who was a professor of law at Stetson University, College of Law, had a law conference that brought together lawyers, university lawyers, or lawyers who represented universities, and people who did college discipline. And they both came to his conference and for some the lawyers were speaking over our heads. Not everybody. I mean, some of us understood what they were saying, and some of them like... Come on Don. One of the lawyers who was a member of ASJA, and I'm blocking his name right now, it'll come to me. Ed Stoner. Ed Stoner. Ed, he was very in tune with what we were doing and spoke at our level. But he was about the only one at that conference that did.

Don Gehring:	So after a couple of years of attending that conference I asked Bob if I could, Bob Bickel, "could I have a room during your conference at a certain time?" And he said "sure." You know, I said "I want to see about organizing a group that does college discipline. Well, college conduct." Bob said sure, and not only did he let me have the room, but he let me have another room afterwards where we could meet. So I stood up and said during his conference, one of his general sessions, "Those of you who are student conduct officers on college campuses, if you'd be interested in forming an association to deal with these problems, let's meet in rooms so-and-so afterwards." And Bob, let us have that room.

Jill Creighton:	So who was in that room?

Don Gehring:	Pardon?

Jill Creighton:	Who was in that room?

Don Gehring:	Who's was in what, the first room? The general session?

Jill Creighton:	Who showed up to the room that Bob gave you?

Don Gehring:	At the general session, where I made the announcement that we're going to meet in room so-and-so, they were all attorneys and student conduct officers. The ones who met in room so-and-so were mostly student conduct officers, I don't think there was a lawyer in the group. And I proposed to them, I said how about if we form an association or an organization for people who do student conduct or who are interested in it? Because I didn't do it and I wanted to be a part of it, so I said, "But I'm interested in it!" So we had that dual category. And therefore people like Ed Stoner could be a member because he was an attorney and he didn't really do student discipline, but he was interested in it. And of course he's was one of our best people.

Don Gehring:	And at that meeting I said, "You know, what do you think?" And there were some naysayers who said, "You know, the last thing we needed another organization. I assume you're going to have a conference and if it meets every year, we can't go to ACPA and NASPA and something else." You know, there were some naysayers but not a lot of them. And mostly the people said, yeah, let's do it. I said, "Okay. I'm going to ask a couple people to be with me. And during the year, this coming year," and I think it was in 1987 that we met at Bickel's conference, I said "during the following year, before this conference comes up again, what we're going to do is we're going to sit down and talk about the organizational structure and develop a constitution and bylaws and that sort of thing. And then we will present that to you next year." So they all said, oh, go for it, go for it.

Don Gehring:	Well, I was at the University of Louisville, so I picked a couple people who were in fairly close proximity and asked them to come to Louisville for a day when we could do this. Maybe two days, I don't know. So several people came. I can't remember everybody, but I think Felice Dublon was there because she was at the University of Chicago, school of art, and that wasn't that far away. Oh, what's her name at... Shoot. Mary Sue Hufnagel. She was at Dayton, the University of Dayton, and that's just down the road from Bowling Green or up the road from Bowling Green. And I think Tim came over from the University of Delaware. Who else was there? I think Linda Timm came, she was at the University of Illinois, somewhere, one of those regional universities.

Don Gehring:	Anyway. We sat down and banged out this constitution and we structured it along circuit lines, U.S. circuit courts, which gave ASJA a problem here a couple of years ago. But that's fine, that's what we did to begin. And the reason we did that was that if we were going to put out information, we wanted it put out on a basis of circuit courts of appeals because that's what the law would be in that circuit, and it would differ from circuit to circuit from time to time. So we said, well, let's do it by circuits. And then we decided we would have a meeting again next year at Bickel's law conference again as a subset of his conference. And I asked Bickel could we have a room to present this to the people who came, who were discipline officers? And he said, "well, of course," and set us up. And we had a room. And all this was at the Holiday Inn Surfside in St. Petersburg.

Jill Creighton:	So this is where the birth of the casual nature of the ASJA conference comes from, yeah?

Don Gehring:	Yeah. That's it. Right across the bridge and to the right is the Holiday Inn. And we met in this room and everybody loved the constitution. I mean, they said, yeah, fine, that's great. They were so happy I think to have something that recognized their work. And they said, let's make the dues affordable for everybody, including graduate students, so it'll be $20 a year. So we said, okay. And we appointed Wasn't Bill Kibler, Brett Patterson I think it was. We appointed Brett Patterson to go out and get a receipt book down the street at a drug store. He went out and got that, and somebody had a cigar box. So after the meeting he set up a table outside in the hallway with a cigar box and a receipt book and people were throwing $20 bills and $20 checks at him, for membership, and he was trying to write receipts as fast as the money was coming in.

Jill Creighton:	That's pretty fantastic.

Don Gehring:	Pardon?

Jill Creighton:	That's pretty fantastic.

Don Gehring:	Yeah, it was so much fun. And then after the meeting, my wife was with me and we went out, we said, now we're going to go out to the pool and have a celebration. So my wife made a bunch of bloody MaryÕs and we went out to the pool and I had bloody MaryÕs.

Jill Creighton:	I just want to note for-

Don Gehring:	That's how it started.

Jill Creighton:	I just want to note for the listeners that our very first minutes, say, we'll meet in Bill Kibler's his hotel room, BYOB.

Don Gehring:	Yeah, yeah. And one year, I can't remember if it was that year. No, it wasn't that year. It was a subsequent year when we met at a different hotel. Our group got so big, Bickel was having to turn people away from his hotel, the Holiday Inn Surfside, because there was no more room. We came in on a Friday and stayed over on Saturday, and his people came in on Saturday and stayed over til Sunday. Well the Saturday was the problem. We occupied a lot of the rooms on Saturday and Bickel said, look Gehring, I tried to help you out, now here you are messing me up. I said okay, we'll move down the street to the, and I can't remember the name of the hotel, it's a big white hotel opposite the street. That place, we called it our-

Jill Creighton:	The Sheraton?

Don Gehring:	The what?

Jill Creighton:	Is it the Sheraton across the street from Columbia's?

Don Gehring:	No, no, no, no, no. Columbia's a different-

Jill Creighton:	Different era?

Don Gehring:	If you came out of the Holiday Inn Surfside, you turned left and went up to that street. We had a seafood restaurant there where we all used to congregate. Aww, boy. It's probably in the minutes somewhere because we ended up calling it the official ASJA restaurant. And we would have fried fish sandwiches and shrimp. And it was just a joint, it wasn't a fancy restaurant. And we all went there and gathered there and had good food and good fellowship.

Don Gehring:	Anyway, this big white hotel, catty-corner from where that restaurant was, was where we had the conference. One night my wife and I went out and we had a cocktail party in our room and we wanted to go eat dinner at this nice restaurant somebody recommended to us. So I said, look you guys, and Kibler was one of them. I said, y'all just shut the door and lock it when you leave, turn the little handle and leave. And we had a balcony and it was a lovely room and we came back that night and we got in our room and got undressed, got ready to go to bed, and they had short-sheeted us.

Jill Creighton:	Oh no!

Don Gehring:	My friends, yeah. Well, no, as a matter of fact, at first we couldn't get in the room because they had locked it from the inside and we had to call security. And security came up and they went in the room next door, climbed over two balconies, and got in our room and then unlocked the door. And then we went to bed and got short-sheeted. All my good friends.

Jill Creighton:	Sounds like ASJA had a bit of a seedy underbelly start. Kind of fun.

Don Gehring:	Oh it was, it was. And you know, the thing about it was everybody, we all did the same kind of thing. It's not an easy job to put people out of school and to discipline people and put them on probation, all that kind of good stuff. They really bonded together because of what they did and the fact that they all did the same kinds of things and it was no fun doing it. And you were trying to teach students. Somebody had to do it. And from the beginning, from the very first meeting, we said this was going to be an organization not just to do student discipline, not just to know the law, but also to know student development and it was [inaudible] of student development within the context of the law.

Jill Creighton:	And if I recall student development was one of the pieces of core philosophy that you took through the first two years of the presidency for ASJA.

Don Gehring:	That what now? I'm sorry.

Jill Creighton:	Oh, I was-

Don Gehring:	There was a beep in there.

Jill Creighton:	Sure. No, I'm just saying that as far as I recall and I have learned from our association's history, student development was really kind of the core of your philosophy as you took the organization through its first two years of your presidency.

Don Gehring:	Exactly. Exactly. I was the only president for two years. At the end of the first year I said, "And I will be the president again!" Because we needed to have some stability over at least a two year period, not just one year. And that stability I think helped to cement the organization and what it was doing.

Jill Creighton:	So as you think about kind of maybe the first 10 years of ASJA, what are some of the best memories that you have?

Don Gehring:	Oh my goodness. One of the best memories that I have is that each year it got bigger. A very good memory is the first summer institute. And that's a whole 'nother story there if you want to hear it.

Jill Creighton:	Definitely.

Don Gehring:	Well, I was at Bowling Green at the time, and I said, okay, you know, at board meeting we said, you know, we need to have a summer training institute to help people get up to speed, so forth. We said, okay, great. Well Denise Dickerson Gifford, I think it was Denise, she was on the board at the time, she was at Louisville and she was doing campus discipline. And she's now the vice president for student affairs at Widener college in Pennsylvania.

Don Gehring:	And she said, well, I think we ought to have it someplace that's really beautiful and nice. So we said, yeah, well, okay, what do you suggest? Somebody, I don't know if it was Denise, somebody suggested University of Colorado. Oh, that's gorgeous, you know. So I said, yeah. And I think the Denise was in charge of it. She said, "And we'll put members of the board as the faculty." Well, members of the board aren't always as knowledgeable as they ought to be about the law and such as that. But anyway. Said, okay. But we didn't have names of anybody except the board members and we didn't have any big names because there were no big names on the board. There was no Gary Pavela, no Ed Stoner, there were no Pete, Charlie Carlettas, nobody liked that.

Jill Creighton:	Everyone's emerging still.

Don Gehring:	Yeah. I took a map and I took a compass and I drew about a 200 mile radius around Bowling Green. And I sent information about this upcoming conference that's going to be at Bowling Green, and it's on student conduct, and we hope you'd come, and here's the price, and this is what you get. What you get in terms of two days worth of instruction. But nowhere did I say anything about who was going to do the instructing because I didn't know. I didn't say what the topics were going to be at that time because they hadn't told me. So I just set this thing out and 'cause I figured at 200 miles people could drive in and we'd have kind of a drive-in conference. Well we didn't get enough people to sign up to pay for it.

Don Gehring:	I was working with the continuing education director at Bowling Green and she said, Don, you got to be more specific, you got to do this in a better way. So the next year I told the board, rather than Colorado, why don't we have it... I could do it... Let's try it again. I'll do it at Bowling Green. I said, "There are no beautiful mountains, there are only corn fields you can see from the third floor of my education building all the way to Chicago, I mean it's boring as hell, but maybe that's what we need for an academic conference." So everybody said, yeah, okay, go ahead and do it. I said, all right.

Don Gehring:	So that year I sent out the brochure, I think I extended it to like 250 miles or something, and I put down who was going to be there, what the topics were going to be that would be discussed, and so forth and so on. Sent that out and we got all kinds of responses. Well the continuing education director and I, I said I don't want a... I need a room, I need some rooms to have a bunch of people in and do lectures, but I don't want to like a lecture hall in the chemistry building or the math, science building, you know? We had these theater type things. Said I don't really want that, I want a more intimate environment. So she said, well, the only thing we've got open is the top floor of thus and such a dormitory. It's a big open room. I said, that sounds a whole lot better.

Don Gehring:	So we scheduled the conference, or the institute, for up there. We got a ton of people who came. There were too many people for the room, and it was probably the hottest day in July and the building was not air conditioned. I mean we've had our ups and downs.

Jill Creighton:	We've come a long way since the first summer academy.

Don Gehring:	Oh yeah. Yeah. Absolutely. But we were trying to get our foot on the ground and we did. We got fans up there and everything else. And finally I gave in, I said, okay, let's go to the theater in the chemistry building where it's air conditioned. So we went over there. I mean, we were all soaked with sweat. It was so hot up in that top story floor. And heat rises.

Don Gehring:	Anyway, the rest of it came off fine and everybody was delighted to be in an air conditioned space whether it was theater style or not. So we said, okay, let's do it again next year. Another thing. I had a keynote speaker for dinner on Friday night, and her father was very ill and she couldn't make it. So I went to my office file and I pulled out a speech that I had made somewhere else. I was the keynote speaker.


Jill Creighton:	You're the accidental keynote speaker.

Don Gehring:	Right. Okay, next year we said, let's do it again. And we said, okay, we'll do it again. It was so successful and the board loved it because it brought in all kinds of money.

Jill Creighton:	So thinking about where the academy is today, it's named the Donald D. Gehring Academy, in perpetuity, and in our profession, when you just say I'm going to Gehring, people know what that means. They know that it means it's the premier educational experience in student conduct, they're excited to go. So what does that mean to you now that you're retired, to know the impact that you left on the field?

Don Gehring:	It just means that I'm eternally grateful that it worked out well and that people are benefiting from that summer learning experience. And I can remember even after the first one, people said, you know, I didn't mean to pay this much money to get this kind of information. That wasn't what they say, they say I'm getting more than I paid for. That was it. I'm getting so much more than I paid for! 'Cause we worked their tails off. And even today I think people are told, you're going to Gehring Academy, you better be ready to work.

Jill Creighton:	Better be ready to work and listen.

Don Gehring:	'Cause they're going to work your tail off.

Jill Creighton:	For sure. It's not a conference, it's an intensive learning experience.

Don Gehring:	Right. It's a school, it's an Academy. In fact, it used to be the institute, summer institute, and I think it was at Maryland. John Zacker, who was president, he said, you know, this is more than an Institute and let's change the names of the Academy. He first asked me, Don, it's named for you, what do you think? And I said, I think that's a great idea. You know, go ahead.

Jill Creighton:	Excellent. Now looking at where the association is today, obviously we went through a name evolution. We're now ASCA. We also went through a restructure, kind of moving away from circuits, especially as we've added international components. What do you think of where we are now?

Don Gehring:	Oh, I think it's great. I think we're in a good position. You won't believe this, but in the beginning I told my friend Parker Young, I said, "Parker, I'm thinking about trying to get much people together and create this organization for student conduct, people who do student conduct." And I said, "And I think it could be the kind of thing that advances, evolves," wherever you want to say, "until, one day we're going to be like NASPA and ACPA, we'll have our own office in D.C." Now we have an office in D.C.

Jill Creighton:	Yes we do.

Don Gehring:	And I'm no great prognosticator or anything, but I just saw the need and I told people one year, it's like the movie about the baseball team, you know, you build it, they will come. And so we built it and they came.

Jill Creighton:	And they stayed.

Don Gehring:	And they came and they came because we fulfill the need. So obvious that the need was there. It was obvious to me. And then, you know, here it is.

Jill Creighton:	What do you hope for the association as it grows and moves forward?

Don Gehring:	Well, what I've hoped for from the very beginning. I hope that someday and I think we're getting there, we're almost there, we've got a foot in the door now, but when the federal government starts to think about laws and regulations dealing with student conduct, that they contact our leadership and have them talk to 'em about whether it'll work, whether it won't work, why it'll work, why it won't work, so forth, and ask our advice, which they never did before. Now they're starting to, in a very small way, but we've never been recognized before like we are now, and having that presence in Washington I think will contribute to our being called upon to give our advice of the people who were doing what they're talking about rather than bureaucrats sitting back making regulations.

Jill Creighton:	I think we hope for that too.

Jill Creighton:	Yeah, I agree. I think that starting with past President Chris Loschiavo, he was really the driving force of getting us into D.C. And it was carried forward by President Matt Gregory and President Laura Bennett. And as we've seen a change in the U.S. Presidency, we are hoping that we can continue to have a relationship with the Department of Education and Office of Civil Rights.

Don Gehring:	From the beginning that's what I always wanted. That they would call on us and ask us, 'cause we were the experts.

Jill Creighton:	We like to think that we are, and I think that we do a good job of that, but, you know, we're all still learning as professionals. And that's one of my favorite parts about ASCA, is that everyone comes to the table all the time, willing to learn from each other.

Don Gehring:	Yes, yes. You know, I had a professor in graduate school. My outside area was management and he was very revered professor of management and he said one day in class something, and this has been umpteen years ago and I'm never forgotten it, he said, "We all exist in a state of relative ignorance. You know things that I don't know and I know things that you don't know and the best way to learn is from each other."

Jill Creighton:	That is really sage advice. Do you have any other tidbits of wisdom for the current members or the listeners?
Don Gehring:	No, no, that's my favorite right there.

Jill Creighton:	I appreciate that so much. Is there anything else that you'd want current members to know or up and coming conduct officers?

Don Gehring:	No, I can't think of anything right off the top of my head. I think I've told you some of the cultural stories, historical things that make up part of our culture. And I think that's what we have that is going for us, is that culture of bondedness and people who bond with each other and can understand that you're going through the same thing I am. And when new people come to the conference, I think it's so neat that we have senior officers or people who have been in the field for a while who kind of take them under their wings. Not even in a formal way, we do it formally also sometimes, but informally. I've just seen it happen and it's so good. Here, I want to help you learn and this is what we do and who we are and how we operate. I think it's great.

Jill Creighton:	We are so glad to have you active and around in our association still. Very few organizations get the opportunity to spend time with their founders, and so it's just a really great opportunity for us. So I really appreciate you being willing to talk to the current folks.

Don Gehring:	Well, thank you. I enjoy it. I was in the Navy after I got out of college and my captain wanted me to stay in the Navy. He said, "I'll get you an executive officer job, which is right under the commanding officer of a ship." And I said, "No, thank you sir. I really appreciate it. I know that's a great opportunity for me, but I want to go back to school and be a teacher." And he said, "Well, you're not interested in making a lot of money." I said, "No, that's right. My father has been telling me that for years." I guess I just always wanted to be a teacher, and I were one.

Jill Creighton:	I absolutely appreciate so much that you know what you've done for the association and the teaching that you have offered to conduct officers all over the world at this point. So again, just so grateful to have you on the podcast.

Don Gehring:	Well thank you, I appreciate that and be sure to look for the history. I think in one year we put out a directory and the history was on the front inside flap or something. But then there's a video that was made. And I don't know where the two of them are. The history that I wrote, of course it's going to be an older history, because I wrote it years ago,

Jill Creighton:	I believe you are referring to the monograph which was released at the 25th anniversary, the blue book, and so I do have a copy of that, but I've never heard of the video. So I'm excited to go back and ask Jennifer what it is.

Don Gehring:	Delighted to do it and I'm so glad to be able to share those kinds of moments that I and the association had over the years. It was just truly a blessing, to me anyway, and I think to a lot of people to have this organization in their lives.

Jill Creighton:	Well thanks again.

Don Gehring:	Thanks. We'll you take care of now and have a wonderful day.

Jill Creighton:	You too. Thanks Don.

Don Gehring:	Alright. Bye, bye.

Jill Creighton:	Next week, on the ASCA Viewpoints podcast, we welcome Laura Egan. Laura serves as the senior director of programs for the Clery center. The Clery Center is a nonprofit organization that partners with lawmakers and higher education campuses to work through technical assistance and training on the Clary Act. For those of you on U.S. Based campuses our annual security reports are coming to you October 1st, so we'll be talking all about those as well as how the Clery Center can partner with your campus on how to engage with the Clery Act in ways that you may have not thought of before. We hope you come back and join us.

Jill Creighton:	This episode was produced and hosted by Jill Creighton, that's me. 
Produced, edited, and mixed by Colleen Maeder. Special thanks to New York University's Office of Student Conduct and Community Standards and to the University of Oregon's Dean of Students team for allowing us the time and space to create this project. If you're enjoying the podcast we ask that you please like, rate, and review us on Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. It really helps others discover us and helps us become more visible in the general podcasting community. If you have suggestions for future guests or would like to be featured on the podcast yourself, please feel free to reach out to us on Twitter at @ASCAPodcast or by email at ascapodcast@gmail.com.