00:00:00.180 We're not going through with this guy and we're recording. I think it's how we start regarding how we are though yeah actually. Great. Perfect. Yeah okay. Maybe we start by saying. I don't know why we have a format for the show because we just always throw it out the window twice.

00:00:30.510 He usually we're like I have our next guest book and it's very on format. It's a very format so I won't know what the guest is. No. Yeah yeah yeah. Well I just felt cruel to bring you into this. Yeah. Well it's good to see you. What is it like. Yeah yeah. I am very grateful to know what we're going to talk about today. Yeah. Do we want to do though. What did you first. Did you learn anything.

00:01:01.300 I just got back from a trip to London. I learned tons of stuff I've done tons of stuff. Did you know that Winston Churchill was born two months premature in a coat closet at his. His family is of titled and stuff. He's like one of the. Younger descendants. So he they didn't live in the big house but they were out on a hunting party and his mom took a fall. And then it's a little late. Yeah.

00:01:26.560 Well then it's a little shady because then instead of resting they think she may be like they were like having a ball after the hunting party and was dancing a lot too after a while. Anyway give birth you know in a very very small room in the sort of families day two months premature with no point. Yeah. No. Like none of the special doctors they were supposed to have just the country doctor that was close and no anaesthesia and two months premature now is like a lot. Yeah. And so then he was fine healthy fine.

00:01:56.780 Oh and his mom was American. Did you know Winston Churchill's mom was. Well OK I think she was totally farfetched and I don't believe it's true. But we always thought it was always rumored that we were related. Winston Churchill. Oh that's it. I didn't yellow to the correct MOM. WE ARE. WE ARE. YEAH. YES. I'm a direct descendant. I did. Before we went. I think I told you this. Maybe I told us on the podcast before we went. I tracked my lineage to William Patton. So like the people who came over with William Penn.

00:02:26.590 All right. Yeah. So we'd have got lots of good days. Oh well. Well on the American side or Princeton. Yeah. Yeah. There you go. I'll tell you something about your family. Well I mean obviously I knew that we talk about everything and yes. The Churchills are actually the Spencer Churchill's too. So Princess Diana ties into that family as well. So I'm related to everybody. That's why I couldn't marry you. Harry you know that is that was the one that doesn't actually. Does that give me a better shot. Yeah.

00:02:57.670 Yeah. Leaving who you're related. OK. Probably your best and probably your best shot. Honestly think it maybe if you write him a letter and he would correct that. Oh right. Sorry my bad. No I don't want to break it. Now you're out of a beautiful day here. Just let him have it. I just this morning was reading about that New York. State I believe hate this I read things and then I think they.

00:03:30.030 Passed a law that you can't send your children to school unless they're vaccinated. Oh really. They had like a grace period of 14 days which is running out now. Yeah. Because that school has been in session for three weeks or. Oh yeah. So these kids are now kicked out of school. Oh wow. So. And the ridiculous part. Well they could go to weird school at home. Yeah but you know only homeschool. Yeah. It's all like charter schools everything you know local schools period. You don't have interesting educational institutions.

00:03:59.790 And then. But. The. Ridiculous part because I I think I would support that. I don't want my nieces and nephews. I do want to be with them. That's not something I feel like we should have a choice. Now I was in California when measles broke out of Disneyland. It's scary and it's ridiculous. It's 2019 and you should not have to fight these diseases that we have already figured out how to stop now.

00:04:22.320 But anyways so the parents though you know of course are freaking out and they're comparing it to Anne Frank in the Holocaust. Oh yeah sure. That's a logical. So either the mayor or the governor some jump I can't remember was like Stop here. This is the thing. And her children can't go to school. Get them vaccinated. Yeah. So I just I just watched.

00:04:50.700 There's a new Netflix documentary about Bill Gates and one of the episodes is about he's trying to eradicate polio. There's still places in the world where you get polio right which is. Yeah. And he they get so close and then it's like sort of these terrorists like Boko Haram and like these terrorist organizations come in and make it really hard for them to finish eradicating polio. So polio cases are actually up again because he's there he's so close it's really infuriating. But they're like 33 cases I think in 2018. So they're so close.

00:05:22.480 But yeah. Polio still. Well good luck Bill. I guess I'm rooting for you Bill. Bill and Melinda are equal partners. That is the documentary is very clear about that. Yes I think they kind of always have been. Which is great. Yeah it's nice. OK. So onto the topic. Yeah. Super light. So our guest today is my mother. And we're going to talk about. Not really the medical side of it but just the.

00:05:53.140 Kind of life the emotional process of. Knowing that you're dying. And I mean we all are dying but. You know we all have this someday down the line you know like years and years in the future versus. For the last year and a half. You know we've all kind of operated with this.

00:06:19.370 Like how do we get through the next two months and is always afraid of it waiting for the other shoe to drop waiting for them to say this is it. This is the last few months. And. I've been. Continually amazed by. The grace that she's had. I'm going to handle this like a champ. I can tell you she's always been a very faith filled. Woman.

00:06:48.240 Especially now that it matters Catholic or non Catholic. But she didn't grow up Catholic. She she converted after she married her before she married my dad on. And she. Still is one of the best examples I have ever seen. And it just is crazy to me because I think that a lot of times there are some parts of the Catholic faith that if you're not used to it I think you kind of step back anything you know and think wow you know I don't know I can be a lot to digest.

00:07:17.830 And I think. From our conversations I think it was a kind of a process and a lifelong more so than I knew of accepting all of that. But regardless of any sort of. What religion it is. Just her faith and her relationship with Jesus has always been so. Personal and evident and strong that it's probably the biggest reason that I've never questioned it in my life. Because it's just always been there.

00:07:48.380 I relate to that very strongly. So anyways. On my end I feel like I go back and forth constantly. I'm always like. Some days I feel really strong and I'll feel think you know like this sucks but we're gonna be OK. And I've always had that sense. I have no. We just talked about this a couple weeks ago and we are doing one of our kind of Bible study talks.

00:08:19.560 I've always known everything will be OK. You know like there's never been a time that something has shook me so much in my life that I've ever. Like not knowing it's going to be OK. I've always known that. And I think that that's a real gift. I don't think that everyone has that. I'm not saying I don't freak out. I absolutely freak out but I know that. In the long run it's going to work out. Everything's gonna be fine. And I think that comes from having the family that I have.

00:08:49.310 And from the faith life a little bit. But. Anyway this has probably been one of the hardest. Times for that because I think sometimes I think like. It's going to suck and but. I. Even if it's only for 36 years you know I've had this mother is like this. So. Some days I think like. It's a blessing what a blessing I've had. And then some days I think no you do this I know I'm being guided thinking that is not right.

00:09:22.000 Yeah yeah. So. But I and I and I know she probably has moments like that but I don't see it as much in her. I think that everyone else struggles more. Which is. Crazy I think because it's a different. I don't know. How you internalize that. I don't know. So anyways. Yeah. Very light like super really tough. Why do you think you want to talk about it now.

00:09:52.570 I don't know. And maybe why here. In general white why do you want to record it. Why do you want to you know what is that. Officially I want to record it just because I think you know after this is all over you know I like well I was very close to my grandma very very close with my mom's parents and I have so many things of hers that remind me of her.

00:10:21.370 I don't know what I would give to be able to listen to a conversation if to hear her voice you know. Sure. So I think that's why I wouldn't want it recorded. You know and I know I could just record like. That but I think stuff like that. Like you know kind of in perpetuity like something like this is a much more accessible. You know it'll always be there.

00:10:47.880 So and then I don't know as far as the timing I really don't know the other day I just was driving home and I thought it's weird to me because we've been doing this for six months almost four months. I don't know some amount of number eight. So for my four months we were talking about it for a six probably you know. And it's never crossed my mind not even one you know and not at all.

00:11:14.220 And I was just driving home one day and I thought Huh maybe maybe we should talk about Diane and and I mean it was like Oh no I can't. I want to that like that sounds too hard it sounds too personal. And then it just kept kind of coming into my mind and so finally like that next morning I said something you know to her just like you know we can you know how to do this just tell me no know but I was wondering if she just.

00:11:46.630 Oh sure. Yeah. So that. OK well I guess we're gonna do it. And so the guy never doubted from the minute that I decided to do it I was like I'm going to tell Darcy objectives because it feels duped. Yeah. I know. And so what I guess from a medical standpoint what are you guys looking at right now. I mean what what's the sort of setup for where we're after.

00:12:17.410 I feel like this is just another example of how God has shown that he's really working in our lives because I think it was like a few days before her last appointment that we talked about this. And at that point I thought everything is kind of looking up. She has had shingles but she has been better the shingles weren't as extreme as they could be you know a lot of times shingles can be pretty bad and painful and she didn't have that much pain.

00:12:50.470 It was pretty short lived. I mean all in all to mean not having it. I felt like the shingles went much better than I would have expected. And then she just hasn't been as maybe not quite as sick with this chemo. She still is tired she still has pain but the symptoms that I see of the throwing up and just having no energy has maybe been a little bit better.

00:13:18.990 And so in my mind I'm thinking like we have three months we have this great plan everything's you know then she'll go back into remission and so then she goes to her appointment. That week and it was one of her cousins had wanted to take her so it was the first appointment she was going to go to by herself. Her cousin was going to go to lunch while while she did that and. There is a number that they show in the bloodwork that.

00:13:53.130 Sometimes can be reliable sometimes is not. And it's just like a marker for how active the cancer is. And. I I'm trying to think of any other time in the last year and a half that he has referenced this number and I don't think that there has ever been much emphasis put on it to my room. I mean my recollection however this time the numbers had increased dramatically.

00:14:21.740 So he said it could have been because of the shingles that sometimes when people are fighting off sort of any sort of illness that it can mess up those numbers or it could be that the cancer is just that much more aggressive and if it is the marker then it's we're close to the end. So this has all been. Oh it's always such a rollercoaster.

00:14:54.350 Like night when the shingles came on I thought oh my gosh this is going to be terrible and then it wasn't that bad and then we get over the shingles and I think everything's kind of okay and we're gonna have kind of a calm moment. And then the floor comes out from under you you know. And so then we fell in with this and then this was her best round team from my viewpoint. You know she was only sick a few days.

00:15:18.480 She I think the Monday or Tuesday after her chemo she went to a game which is unheard of in her other treatments that she would even want to voluntarily leave the house on those days. So like if that's an indication I feel like the track the number is wrong you know. But we don't know his thing that the first time anyone's ever read the results in mentioned the timeline at all or even a potential timeline or not.

00:15:50.580 I'm. He is. He's never gonna really use it. Yeah. He doesn't want to commit to that. I like in our very first appointment with him he said you know it could be three months or it could be ten years and all of us are like it's not three months and he is like no I don't think you know. But he also definitely always kind of emphasizes at the beginning he's like but get your stuff in order. Figure it out because it could be you know I don't think there's any way to know.

00:16:20.210 So there's been times and that's I think kind of always the punch to the gut that you don't expect where you know a handful of months will be mentioned in some way where basically I think he just is kind of trying to keep us grounded a little bit to do to you know like yes great. The cancer responded to this chemo perfect but she still has terminal cancer that is spreading that we can't do anything to actually eradicate all we can do is kind of stop it maybe.

00:16:51.800 And then it's going to still come back. So I don't know. Find out next week so she'll have a scan and we'll go to the doctor two days later and find out their results. And that's just kind of exist in this mental space you know just kind of waiting to find out what's the next step. Mm hmm.

00:17:24.820 I think you know I outside of this kind of synopsis which I think is good. I really want to focus more on just like the because I think the medical stuff eats everything up in a corner can be so easy to just make that the focus and then it's so you know like there's so many details to it like you know I could sit here and be like and then this drug and this drug and I could tell you the drugs and what the side effects were.

00:17:51.370 And you know yeah it's crazy the intricacies of all of that that has been my life for the last year and a half her life for the last year and a half. You know it's unreal. But anyways outside of the ugliness there are some blessings and I know maybe we can touch on all of that.

00:18:22.350 Well I suppose we might as well talk to Nancy. All right. No no. We will be right back with our guests today. Nancy getting it. All right. OK. So I have my mom here. Who. Any anyone else into the park has heard about it repeatedly. Hi Mom.

00:18:49.730 I came well I don't know. So you just heard us do a little intro and everything about this is just different than our usual protocol or the format. But so I guess first of all is there any thing I know I said I didn't really want to focus on the medical side of it hearing it.

00:19:16.450 My synopses of the medical situation we're in now is there anything you want to add or correct. Probably just that there are so many unknowns. I mean even an oncologist you know. He can predict you have so many months to a year whatever. Then it'll be different the next time. You know it's just like you said Katie roller coaster up and down we really so many unknowns but that's life too.

00:19:46.040 Doesn't matter what you're dealing with. And I guess just real quick I'd like to say too. That we don't pretend to set ourselves up as my look what we're going through. You know this is. That is what I'm doing. Yeah. I wish you all the time. I guess I thought I was very clear and I've tried.

00:20:11.630 It's really opened my eyes to how many people go through pain or some kind of suffering and just don't want to minimize that you know and learning how to not let that be the whole focus of your life that you go on from there. So you know he's talked for months he's talked probably not a year but then again next it may be a little bit different. You know just don't know.

00:20:40.660 So yeah that's it that is the thing is we could be totally different position this time next week right. We never have any idea it can either be the lowest of lows or we could come away from it dancing through the hallways and we've seen both sides. So yeah it's fun so far.

00:21:07.230 Well I guess let's start with maybe to just jump into the hardest part. What do you think is the hardest what has been the hardest for you. Well and thankfully this is getting easier but probably the limitations on my life.

00:21:30.630 I've always been very I want to be do going where the action is you know doing something every day planning social events. Driving whatever it takes to watch my grandkids. And. Even though Katie and Tom and Pete Namie have been great about facilitating that kind of thing as much as possible you know my body just doesn't always facilitate and to watch my friends still do that it's hard to admit but there's been it's not been easy to think.

00:22:03.150 I remember what that was like. I wish I could do that you know. And to not we've had to change some traditions you know we always did birthday suppers with the grandkids and we're four behind on that and shopping with them we do that online more now and been involved in my church in music I've always done music and have had to give that up and that's that was really hard.

00:22:33.320 But then again time helps all that and that's much easier. I'm just realizing I didn't I didn't even tell Darcy. About the music. Oh what a surprise. So I've been thinking about this and there's been a lot of times that you know a song all kind of us you know you always apply it to your life.

00:23:01.730 And growing up my mom was always my accompanist. You know we would everything from church to fun things to school song contests. You know what was it called it was a song so-called Song Contest. Yeah it was our song contest at school. What was all talent shows. I don't know like that I would do anyways as a writer. Now with that I would prepare for with Mrs. York to contest district music district music.

00:23:30.710 Yeah sure whatever. Anyway it's it's just always been a big part of our relationship has been music and you know her behind the piano and I've been so spoiled that at any time I've ever had anyone else play for me. It's like you do it you're not doing it right. Oh me if I screw up and I'm like so yeah it's music is hard sometimes you know. So anyways we've recorded a song.

00:24:03.290 To do it you know. Can I go just one verse of it and if we can fit it in here somewhere I think we'll make it work cut for time. Now I you imagine what a monster but yeah it is. It feels almost normal in those moments.

00:24:31.590 And I think why don't we do that more often. You know even yesterday when it's kind of a depressing first time in my marriage you know. Yeah. And then we're both kind of dead inside so yeah Amy would not have been able to do it. She would have been. Nick would have been crying. It would be yeah. Do you guys is that the your family dynamic. Are you the the two that. Maybe are emotionally more fortified are you that or 44.

00:25:02.790 Yeah we really are. We. What a nice way to say that. Yeah. It so much better than dead inside you feel me searching for her. I would say it would feel like you're not going to make it through this. Like oh but I'm dead inside. So we don't cry that much which. Part of me thinks Oh I don't want people ever think I don't care because I'm not a crier but I'm not. You know it just we can't force it if it isn't. I said my friends. That's just your gene pool. You know that's the way we're made. And I'm thankful in many ways.

00:25:33.910 I know I think there's a lot of times I'm glad that I'm not right. Yeah. And then there's I Oh I also am an angry crier. Oh yeah. So I do still cry but it's in the weirdest when you don't mind you you know. But yeah we definitely are there. You probably I used to be less emotional even than you are I think maybe now I've kind of caught up or worried about the same.

00:26:00.950 But we're nowhere near nowhere near my sister could cry at the drop of a hat and my dad. Yeah. I don't think. I don't know if there's ever been a time anyone on our family has sang in any sort of function did not cry in some way.

00:26:23.960 I remember I went to lame is with a bunch of our Cunningham cousins and my uncle also went and everyone is just just you know pools of tears down their faces and I'm sitting there you know nothing. Right exactly like Oh it's moving but I'm not going to cry and I look in even my uncles on my side and he's sitting there just bawling and I'm like well.

00:26:51.890 I don't know. So yeah just not that emotional. Yeah I'm a little I sometimes feel guilty about. You see people feeling things so deeply and you're like Yeah I don't know you know. I mean that's just not the same experience. And then I'm like it. Is there something broken in me. Should I should I feel something more or am I just processing better slash differently. You know I mean I don't know.

00:27:19.940 Yeah I am a cry I've become a crier in the last decade really. Yeah but I. It's a weird experience. You know when it's not all right out there all the time. Right. That's something we really control. No. OK. Well back to the subject again huh. Now let's just move on now. Let's talk about emotional responses.

00:27:52.940 When you think about you know dying I think what people always the number one thing I think probably people think is you know like do you look back and you think I wish I would have done this.

00:28:10.960 Do you have regrets do you have things that you know are there weird things and oh I know like when she first got the diagnosis the biggest thing that she was stressing out about was we need to get that star room clean now. I'm not done but also I just found out that my felt like just like five right Oh independent mother is dying and I pray she wants to clean out the store room I like that.

00:28:40.990 I do not care about the store room. So out that I write so deeply a thing just becomes paramount and I fix am a fix. Yeah. Yeah of course. So I mean outside of the story. Let's move on from that. I know you regret it lately organize you would be it daughter my file cabinet know exactly where to find everything right outside of that. Are there things. Well you know I think that is you know I heard you say Katie there are blessings and I keep. Going to the fact.

00:29:10.900 Cancer really really does provide you with time. You know I know there are some people where it moved very quickly and they're not given that but I've been given so much time to one of my highest priorities especially right first was I wanted some one on one with every member of the family. You know Tom and of the kids and each of the grandkids and we've really been able to do that.

00:29:40.360 You know whether it was a half hour drive in the car or. Really had to make a pointed effort to have someone on one time we have been able to do that and I'm so thankful and I am so thankful that Tom and I have been able to that he is he's at peace with this too. You know you don't know all of us what's the last thing we want to do is leave our family and for him to be able to feel that too.

00:30:11.860 You know we don't want to leave each other you have dreams of doing retired things forever. Tell your nightie. But. And seeing how he has grown and independence is giving him time to do that too. You know he does so much more without me. And I feel like. He's going to be OK. He's got good family around him and.

00:30:39.560 So that that's really been a really gift I feel to have the time. There'll be times I'll sit back and I'll go through my lessons OK who haven't I seen for a while. Who do I really want to sit down this week and make sure we have good conversation and. So I've been able to do that. I also nanny camp.

00:31:05.850 We do devotions in a year ago which I thought was gonna be the last Nanna camp and we had another one this year. But a year ago I made them do a project with writing down or portraying somehow the five truths of my faith that I wanted them. To know I felt were the truths of of our faith and feels good to have been able to do that and they have a visual representation that they made that summer.

00:31:35.820 It's also been a blessing you know I don't want to leave any of them and especially you know you think of the youngest grandkids and what I won't see. But truly I look back at all the things I have been able to do with them and have seen and through getting old enough that I can see where their interests are where their talents are their personalities.

00:32:01.170 Let's try one of the greatest joys is just a little James who's for you know you start seeing that personality and what kind of little guy and big guy he's going to be. So for going on 15 the last time I thought you know was his last statement. No it wasn't actually it was oh than that. His new thing is speaking of whatever it is that you have and a lot of times he uses it correctly sometimes.

00:32:27.460 Well actually we weren't talking about pivoting. Yes. Yeah. Mm hmm. And there's been that's one of the good things about Facebook. There's been old students. I'm a retired teacher and students from years ago. You know they'll reach out and there again I think when you're faced with knowing that your time is limited. Not only am I more open but people are just so much more open to meaningful conversations.

00:32:58.010 And what's really important and not that has been a huge we have a tow out there that I hadn't seen until I moved I just got these baskets to put on that shelf just full of cards that people have said I mean hundreds of cards. And they keep. There are some that keep sending it there and it's just at the beginning there was like five a day. I mean I was concerned. But still yeah. They're really regular to get yeah the importance.

00:33:27.690 I haven't done that and I wish you know I still keep them and try to. That is something that I've learned through this is that those little things matter you know the little things you can do it doesn't have to be you don't have to take someone a full meal. You don't have to take them. Right. Something that costs a lot of money. You don't have to. You know you can send a card. You can just go see him for 20 minutes something that just shows that you think and of them and that they matter. You know that that what they're doing matters.

00:33:57.120 So and people even for me have done really nice. Yeah I've had friends send me stuff out of the blue. I've had friends of my mom's on me stuff you know I have a massage gift certificate. I still need to use that I just got for no reason and I am not for no reason. Well I'm quite a caregiver. I don't know. Sometimes you think I'm sassy. That's good. It's on the record line.

00:34:28.400 Yeah. If you're all sun generated buzz and get really annoying. That was I think kind of something I struggled with at the beginning for me I don't know. And I think we kind of had to talk about this is you know my dad is constantly you know we're not going to dwell on anything everything's fine. There's no reason to be upset and male aspect and I remember sitting and talking with you and thinking you know like sometimes you just have to be sad.

00:34:57.470 We're just going to have to because otherwise we're not going to process you know and it has been. There has been times when it just happens without us wanting to you know and then there's times that it's all full of joy somehow. You know. Yeah. Yeah. Lots of meaningful conversations. It's been Katie moved in with us last December in.

00:35:28.150 Which to be fair I lived here before that too. Basically I was always hearing me so much. Yes. I just also had a house that I was spending money on here and not in her house but anyway. Sorry. Well it has been a real gift. There's been months this girls had to do things I'm sure she didn't think she'd ever have do with her momma.

00:35:56.690 And it's been again a gift for us to have that time together. There's been times with all the family. But when you have somebody who has a little more time like Katie has had it's really been good. How lucky are you as a mom to have somebody kids so close to have all three of them right here. Exactly. Yeah. Yep. Very much so.

00:36:24.980 Yeah. Which I also think doesn't happen by chance to you know. You stay close to your family if you want to kind of you know and I'm not saying that I God for the kids that move away because you know even Grady my brother's daughter is talking about her dream is to go to New York and I want that for her I would love that for her.

00:36:50.150 Me personally I think I used to have those dreams and sometimes I think you know how much my life would be different if I had done it but then I think every time I even thought about it it was so the poll was too strong. You know with my brother and sisters kids and just what I would miss out on I just couldn't do it. And now there's no way.

00:37:15.490 A month or two ago I was a half hour away for three days and it was like torture execute well I like God knew what he was doing. And he made it so that I'm here with you because I can't. It was painful for me to know she wasn't feeling good and I wasn't here. And two days later I got home and I was here for 10 minutes and then I was going to work and she text me while I was on my way to work and said you know she didn't want to add stress or responsibility on my shoulders but she was glad I was here.

00:37:48.910 You know I mean it's not a chance. There were in this situation so I didn't it didn't happen. You can say guess what I know that you are worried that a lot. A big factor for you is pain. You don't want to have pain. Outside of that you know I don't. I don't think that you're worried about the actual dying process.

00:38:18.560 You know like what is there anything you feel anxiety about or fear. You know you seem strong but I don't. I just don't know how realistic that be that can be that you actually don't feel that you know. What do you think I am very thankful that from the beginning. I've had a real deep peace and not a fear of dying.

00:38:42.150 And I know that comes from the belief that eternal life is there and that it will mean joining Jesus in Heaven and there's so much good literature out there I'm reading one now about how it's just another way of looking at heaven you know how we say it's not just gonna be floating on clouds we know that there's a part of you that isn't that what's it gonna be. And this book points out he says it's like our our commission does not end.

00:39:14.020 And that will people still be writing music. Yes. I never thought about that. You know. So maybe my accompanying and playing the piano will be something I'll enjoy again. You know. Sure. So I really don't fear it. We just lost a dear brother in law to cancer and it's he had a pretty peaceful passing and that's very encouraging.

00:39:42.560 And his wife wanted me to know that you know because you do in fact I felt real guilty. Our first meeting with our oncologist he said What do you fear the most. And I said pain felt so selfish afterward it should have been this wonderful statement leaving my family. How dare you be selfish. Your point well I guess it's all about you. I was I think pain was the important thing.

00:40:11.340 So he knows that you collaborated with making sure I can handle that pain as best as we can. So. So I guess that probably is the only thing we just don't know. And there again I'm so thankful because you read of accounts and hear about people who really go through terrible process of dying whether it's cancer or something else.

00:40:38.840 And I don't have any reason to think it will be that way for me. And so that's probably why I think the unknowns you know you just don't know. I guess I know I feel real sure what's going to be the next step but to get there that transition you know that's what we just don't know what it's like. Well let's talk about that for a second from that Catholic perspective.

00:41:11.380 What do you think that timeline looks like. What do you think happens. You know that's you pass and then and then what. I know. Well of course I've explored purgatory a little bit more and that's of course one of the subjects that between our Protestant faith and as I grew up as a Protestant in the Catholic faith and what that really all means. And I have some different views on that now.

00:41:40.630 I think. And one author put it well that it's like we picture like this holding place like like you're almost in a cell and get out there you're so good you know and I don't look at it that way at all anymore. I think my priest has been very kind in saying the suffering we do here makes a difference to that maybe.

00:42:07.360 I do believe that there is a purifying process and whether that happens on Earth or whether it really will be a state of time or place like we try to think of but purgatory might mean I'm not sure. But I've also. Heard a speaker talk about are deceased and haven't been able to see us and see what's going on and that's comforting.

00:42:38.770 You know I like to think but I think those are some of those things we really don't know we really have no idea when my dad passed away. I was. It was like the next morning I remember just yearning for some assurance that Dad you're out there you know you're with Mom everything is good. And the speaker on that radio at that time said there's so much we don't know about heaven but that Scripture does say this day I will see you.

00:43:11.220 I wish I could quote where it comes from. It has always since the other day said oh no it's not. I'm pretty sure it's not I take it. So that was reassuring and I felt like that was Jesus saying you know you can be assured your dad is if he's not there now you will be. So have you had moments.

00:43:41.360 When grandma probably died. I do. I'm trying to remember this is something I should probably know. Shirley I've told you I don't know if you remember when I left grandma's house. The last time after release you know we all were there and then I spent the night and I watched go gone with the wind. And the next morning you know I kind of just had to drag myself out and sitting in my car and trying to keep it together and wanting to leave but also just knowing like this is it for me in that house and I finally start my car.

00:44:12.860 And you are so beautiful place and it's just starting. And on the radio and somehow you know I think in most situations something like that I would sit there and I would listen I would cry and I'd be you know but I started driving. And it took exactly it's a short song. So I pull in the driveway here as it ends and I just felt like it was one more thing from grandma. And I guess I didn't mention this at the beginning.

00:44:42.980 That's the last thing I remember Grandma saying to me you were in the hospital. Yeah. Because at the end you know she wasn't speaking. And so the last coherent sentence I remember her saying to me was that I should I mean I was like You know I was 19 and I had this. It's like you know I felt like it was Grandma. Have you ever had anything like that Did you have anything with grandma or pop here. I don't know.

00:45:12.440 Others that have been close to you while I was there and my grandma died. That was the first experience I had had that I was most close to. And we were all around her and holding your hand and just the. Peace the reassurance and then being with both my parents when they passed away was just just a real blessing you know to be there in that transition and I think that helps when you see that there's was so peaceful now there are times my dad would say Come on darling you gotta help me you gotta help get me there you know so.

00:45:50.770 Which is interesting you know. What was he experiencing. My grandma. Yeah. Or him. Yeah. Yeah. So. And then I can't really say that I have had any aha yeah moments but I've also wanted to explore a little more. And this is a little more Catholic viewpoint of communicating with them.

00:46:20.600 We believe if you're in heaven you are a saint and we can ask the saints to pray for us so that I can be conversing with them and I really. That is still not easy for me because of my Protestant background but I'm still trying to explore that a little bit. Yeah because that is going to be a grand part of the transition you know to know that they are there and I will be able to be with them.

00:46:49.660 Yeah I think there's something to be said for setting the example of dying. You know I am. My grandfather died about three years ago and just to experience that for it for someone to set the tone for a family and this patriarch that we had all now in our whole lives and growing up very close to it can be really powerful and really impactful to those younger generations and you know I mean to show how it's done a little bit.

00:47:21.520 It's kind of something that's always stuck with me from having that experience you know. Good to hear. Yeah it real. It really is powerful to see. And I had never experienced it that closely. I don't think before. So you know it's something. I mean you're a teacher and you're always teaching and I mean I think even in that there's opportunity there maybe and I don't think of it as a sad thing when they went.

00:47:52.090 It's it's really is sort of a benchmark and oh I really want to get to that place of comfort with the idea and peace with the idea and you know I mean when you have a small child. Oh yeah. You can't be. Yeah. Everything feels like the worst thing in the world. Exactly. Yeah. How would they ever caught alone without their mama you know. Oh yeah. Horrifying actually. Well yeah and like when we travel we just got back from that trip.

00:48:16.020 You know you think I was so selfish to have you know I mean what this all feels so stupid to me was I don't you know that's just the guilt back and forth here but yeah I mean isn't being a mother enough for you. Yeah I know. Yeah I was if I was a better mother I would have been happy staying home and not risked even a certain death on this airplane. You know I oil that I also have flight together. If that ride together. Yeah. Georgie we said well the day before we left.

00:48:47.540 Yeah yeah. So I mean there are those people that like they would never know Travolta either. No. Yeah. Yeah. One of them has to be a Jet. You know there's there's a lot of ways to go. There's people who you know think it's truly horrible to travel. Well but I will say this. I don't know of any better mother than mine and I know everyone thinks I'm. Accurate. Wow. And I have people that are great Mom man moms always go Oh no no no.

00:49:16.020 I do have some people that are like Oh yeah your mom is you know like I know I know. Yes yes. But she would be on that plane in America right. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. Over. Yeah. I can't really think of the what you would be missing at home that would make you look like it ever said no to. No she would have been on that plane.

00:49:41.070 So one of the things I and you know this founded on nothing is just a revelation that came to me one night that I think about when I think about heaven is you know you get to thinking about that cloud thing. And my grandma had an experience after her father died and she got to see him up singing and worshipping and music was a big part of it. But to me I'm like oh my gosh I don't want to go sing for all of eternity on a cloud that the of all sounds miserable to me.

00:50:08.810 But then when you start thinking about inheriting the Earth and you know that and you think about oh you know maybe I can travel maybe I can see these and that's more I feel like you know maybe there's things I can do. And writing music to me that that thing I like a lot too because I like to create you know I'm always that sort of I'm like oh I can please can I please be doing something like you know I'm not just sitting around. That's a really nice thought. Yeah. And not just sitting there think Oh what are they doing today.

00:50:37.880 Oh you shouldn't have done Oh. Oh yeah. We won't be seeing him anytime soon. Yeah yeah well. And I also like I don't know I also like the thought of time being very different there. You know so I like the thought of knowing that I'm going to be there and then you know everybody is gonna be there kind of instantly. You know I always like that thought rather than oh I've never thought that.

00:51:04.370 Yeah it's got to be there are years here isn't gonna be. Yeah it's gonna feel longer here I think than that and we won't feel that separation. Yeah his time is. Yeah. Mm hmm. So that balance is really helps me too. Yeah. We thought about that. Does it make your time here any faster Katy. Does that help my perspective. But I do think about the especially with like James you know just that he's still our little one.

00:51:37.720 Yeah but because I think for you it's you know because he'll adjust kids or you know earlier so he'll miss out on a lot but he won't know you know. And you know what you have to have good memories and now that's sick man. I remember we couldn't do stuff good. I don't think that's what I remember. Yeah but that does help to think that you won't be up there thinking what you're missing James is like you know so.

00:52:09.420 You know I know. Know another blessing is the other grandmas that my grandkids have. You know you have a whole different I have a whole different view on that now to appreciate what they will be for my grandkids and B for my kids you know you're that support and so does it help you out. Yeah sorry Cody and dad. Well I like you a lot. Yeah.

00:52:40.050 I have to say when I you know we talked about I'm not a crier and I really have cried very little through this but there was finally one night and I think I kind of had to make myself do it because I thought it was healthy where I just. This sucks I hate cancer. I don't want to go you know and the comforting thought you know I don't think oh this grandchild needs me and this grandchild needs me and Tom needs me.

00:53:11.060 And the thought that came to me at that point was the relationship Katie has with them. You know she is so close with her nieces and nephews that I know they'll miss me. But you know what. And I don't mean this as a martyr but they're going to go on. It's real comforting to know how close all of them are and they're gonna go on and have good good relationships and you'll be fine.

00:53:43.730 So you miss me a little bit now and then I think I'll figure that out. Hmm. Cooking is funny. My oldest grandchild does my mom was such a good cook and so that's some of their good memories. You know are those good meals at grandmas and one timer. Jeff my oldest said Nana one thing I could always count on is you'd have that variety packet chips.

00:54:13.660 Chips recently during one of my good weeks. I had that bag of chips and it was either him or Nick cameras at Nana's bad Chip. My mom and her siblings are that way. That's what they remember about their grandmother's house is that they she would always give him a Dr. Pepper and a recent peanut butter doesn't allow that there. That's funny. That's the the little things you hang on to.

00:54:41.000 Yeah but that's good. Maybe it's better that it's something simple you replicate. Yeah yeah. You know I have I had the weirdest thing but Grandma always had wild cherry Pepsi and she had swans me and American cheese. Oh yeah. And so I haven't for a while but when I you know sometimes on her birthday or different times that you know kind of all you get like a pang or you miss her and I'll go buy that expensive American cheese is you know like four dollars for a said Yeah.

00:55:11.830 And a wild cherry Pepsi. Yeah. And that's always available for me. Those those multi pack Yeah bags which are that deejaying they are always delivery there. So every weird function that has those little chips you gonna walk by. Brian I think that is for you. Hannah. While we're laughing It is funny the different things I think that we just laugh about.

00:55:41.740 I don't like. I had some friends here on New Year's Eve. We're playing cards and my mom was not winning New Year's Day the next day. And she turned away from me that and she goes. Don't you know I have cancer. Oh really try to help right. Yeah. Oh yeah yeah yeah yeah.

00:56:14.280 You picked the right target. How it really a real goal. Yeah. But there have been a lot of times that we laugh about stuff and now I'll pull that card every once while you know that commercially I'm on TV with. If your mother was diagnosed with cancer you know you know. What how would you want her to be treated. Tourniquet. I would let her win every game. I'd bring her a soda right now.

00:56:44.510 Oh. So tell me I have. I have a Catholic question a Catholic procedural question. Tell me about the rosary. Oh I'm so glad you asked that because it's probably one of the other big things between our Protestant Catholic faith. For a long time. I couldn't say parts of it because I felt like I was worshipping Mary. Oh yeah. And I was praying to Mary to do this for me.

00:57:09.700 And when I retired it was so good that I finally had time to explore that because the rosary is so simple in that. It's asking Mary to pray for us. Mm hmm. And who to be an inner censor to be any SS or who. Who better than your mother you know but the other thing I love about it is that there are four different sets of rosaries.

00:57:39.780 And the first one focuses on Jesus the Annunciation that means when the angel proclaimed to Mary that she would have the son of God and then and it goes through that process of that and then his birth and his childhood. So that's the first set of rosary. The second would say if I can get this right without having a really stop and think about it. Second one then is his life.

00:58:08.520 They're called the luminary mysteries where his baptism his. Proclamation of the kingdom and establishing the Eucharist. There's two others but. And then it goes into his death. And how you know that now time in his resurrection and in the final set is the resurrection and how. We believe Mary then was crowned the Queen of Heaven.

00:58:38.490 So it's not and it's not worshipping Mary it is not that she is going to bring about these things but that she is our inner censor and that it focuses on the life of Jesus. I love that he walks you through the whole thing right. So do they do you do a service. There's a prayer service typically you know rosary. Well I don't know I know I'm at the role. I mean just in general but you know there is a can like of the the the viewing the visitation that night.

00:59:09.990 Yeah. Is there. There's a prayer service that ties in. Yes. Right. You have a rosary. Yes. Usually. Now some families choose not to. It's not like you have used to always it was called the wake and they would always pray the rosary. And then my other neat things about is to that they have a storytelling time if the family wants to know where they are. Do you say the one that is so that there's like certain days of the week so like Wednesday would be the Joyful Mysteries or whatever. Right. Right. So does that.

00:59:40.110 Is that how it works for awake or do you say this are awful. No. Good question Katie. I'm not sure if they go by what day of the week it is or if there's always a certain one they do for. Good question. Well I've asked father that my Catholic friends out there shout it out at home. Mm hmm. Because that yeah. So like if you were gonna say a rosary on Tuesday night that sorrowful sorrowful. Yeah I mean that's how they say all they have each day is assigned to one of the four.

01:00:12.470 All right. But yeah. And not like it would matter. You know I've you know personally wanted to say right now you have to say to because you do get that is part of you do want to have a rosary right. Yeah. That's been hard for me and I know that.

01:00:37.690 That's probably for you it seems like it's something that maybe has helped you. Right after the store room. Right now it seems like she has a binder. You that's all we have to do we want. And I say no kids in town you can do whatever you want to but I a very detailed.

01:01:04.640 No I would like that I would do with the funeral home and church. There is no. Which is great. I 100 percent I'm glad because especially at during that time I'm we're not going to want to have to worry about that. We're going to want to have everything my family's funeral planners like we're all we're very much. The hymns are picked. The verses are like everybody knows where we're very detailed instruction givers and that way to my grandma my girlish share and used to take us in Oxford.

01:01:36.380 They bought. I don't know if they got a discount they bought a big plot in this hemisphere. And she would take us as you go. OK. Here's what Grandpa Cork is gonna be. Here's where I'm going to be here's where your dad's gonna be. Here's where your mom's gonna be. Here's where Taylor is gonna be. That's my brother. Here's where Taylor's wife is gonna be. Oh and I'm like excuse me is Darcy you gonna be You're gonna be with your dad. Yeah. I'm like. Where am I going to be issued with your husband's family. I don't know about that. Everyone I know is here.

01:02:06.530 It's horrifying. There's no really dramatic I I don't know why she did that several times to us showed us the plot a family plot. We saw it a lot. I don't know what kind of field trips these were but. You know this was I was too young. We have not done. I was alone I have gone through. I mean I know where I will be buried. I wanted to know. I wanted Ashley would like to go to the cemetery and look at it one more time. That anatomy course.

01:02:36.200 Yeah. So it depends on the day for me. Sometimes it's fine. Sometimes I sit in the kitchen. You know those moments where it'll affect me different than I think that. Yeah. Well and I don't think for me I don't drive by that evil cemetery a lot which is where my dad's parents are. My mom's parents are in the military cemetery and I do drive by on my way to my brother's house and I sometimes feel kind of kiss or think about grandma on poppy as they drive by.

01:03:05.180 But to me I it you know I don't think to be close to them that I have to be there. I don't feel like that's not where they are you know. So yeah I feel that way about cemeteries. I don't have any particular like I don't anticipate maybe I have no idea if this has taught me anything it's that I've no idea how anything is going to affect me right now. I would say do not anticipate like going and sitting at your you know gravestone and just feeling like that's how I am close to you.

01:03:37.080 What's. Yeah. Right now there are hardy or alive it's just such a short moment that you see that they're right. I don't know but there are still you know maybe it's more just like a TV thing to really like depict it but that it does seem like there are. Yeah that is some same time. No I'm like I don't want cremated and I want a monument people like my virginity like I want a place to be. You know I don't know which I don't know what that's about either not not what I meant all by myself.

01:04:04.870 I only do this by the block next door but it is. Have you been to a lot of funerals. You know growing up I never I was always the one watching the kids.

01:04:21.260 I remember one of the HA I had remember who it was but there was someone and I was way too old and I was like you know this is the first female I've actually gone to as I always went but I always was watching kids or I say yeah I never actually sat at a funeral until grandma and pop or your grandma Kenyans know you know I.

01:04:47.190 I was at my grandma for yams I don't remember you know I was into you know I just like my a lot of my great aunt and uncle's died or you know I remember like Darrell Bachmann's for some reason stands out to me just because he was probably one sided view at your age that died.

01:05:08.650 But yeah I really maybe aren't tortoises but I the first funeral I actually struggle with was grandmas for sure but otherwise I think and it could just be that they didn't affect me because like I said What is it emotionally for to me I have already I that I might be dead inside. I would I've probably been to more funerals than weddings honestly.

01:05:36.540 Why had I mean I had six great grandparents alive when I was married. So I yeah. I still have three grandparents alive so that's great. But yeah. And I we just went to a lot. Ross Ross's dad is an estate attorney. You know they go to a funeral for every client. I think about being a tax accountant and you go to every clients funeral you know. And so Roscoe's and Ross for his clients goes to every few you know I mean it's it's just what they do. They think it's part of their business. Yeah.

01:06:06.410 I mean which is good. I think that that stuff adds up more than anything. You know it counts. If you feel it. Right. Like when grandma died and I just keep going back to that. Remember how many swans men were like. There is another way. You know it's in the grandkids. I think it was three wasn't it. I mean now I know there was more than one because we're like it's another one. You know I don't know. I do it.

01:06:35.340 I think that it was the one that had retired before the current one. And then there was one that was the sub or something. I think that's something really great about and unique about where we live to the communities are so small and close the funerals tend to be very large. But yeah you know I mean they really do.

01:06:53.010 It's it's you would get a get a good turnout which is I think comforting to you that you know to the family certainly in my experience has been that I don't know what I guess a couple of things. I would add maybe.

01:07:19.160 I think so many times when we have friends or family going through a bad situation whether it's cancer or whatever. We think what can we do. And I guess a couple of things that my family's done that just there again it's trying the teacher and me that is really appreciated this. But I thought a year ago in November it was a really tough time really tough time and.

01:07:51.900 Every time there's been that choice of do you do chemo or what do you do. You know they've really had to push me sometimes as you can do another round you know. And last November they each wrote on a piece of paper an encouraging statement whether it was just love you Nana you got this Nana or a scripture. And then they put it into one of those chain links you know like you do for. Christmas or whatever you take out the taste.

01:08:20.550 And every morning I got to take one of those off and read it. And that was just really encouraging. And and there's still put together Katie put it together now and like sheets that are hanging Eisenman friend by my bed and one of the three in a hallway. Yeah. And it's just been a neat concrete thing you know that they did that really. And then last February and I had actually forgotten about this. And uh our birthdays are in February.

01:08:48.190 Tom and mine and they each recorded them reading a devotion 4 or so. That's great for me. And so now I've been going back and I won't know whose it is because it's just by the day and get to go in and listen to them read you know devotion to me that's just been. Such a special thing. That's really nice. And kind of like K. said to.

01:09:18.480 I don't think people who have a sickness mean to be overly selfish with this but short visits are good yeah. You know I think sometimes people think oh I want to take Amelia. We want to spend two three hours and there are just times you just you can't handle that you know. And just so to keep that in mind it doesn't take a lot of time. Like Katie said 20 minutes to an hour sometimes tops depending on how the weeks going on is enough.

01:09:47.970 Yeah I'm healthy I don't want people in my house that you never know and and you do feel kind of selfish you don't want to say yeah please do come visit. OK yeah yeah. And I feel selfish in saying that now. But just to keep that in mind you know it doesn't have to be a long visit. While the food has been tremendous. People have been so. Generous and not that we don't have like to have meals with our friends family and friends too.

01:10:20.870 That's been really good. But it's not gonna be one of the biggest blessings up for me as finding the relationships that you know you can really count on. You know she has some friends or family members there's people. I have some friends that no matter what I know I can you know it's like even little things that there's been a time that I was like oh I don't wanna go back to the pharmacy and I'm just like who can I.

01:10:52.870 And I'm like oh I'll ask Ashley she'll do it you know. And as long as it's something that if she's into you know there are some people that you know they'll just do it and they'll do what they can to help you take me to my appointments sit at me with my appointments or come here and when I know that I'm going to be gone. And they just feel better if they know if it's a week run. And I used to have to kind of arrange that and say oh I've got this set. Oh yeah. Oh they're really coming to Virginia.

01:11:25.220 That is the best this last month or two. She's done that on her watch. And honestly I think that you've been doing so well that I haven't been as worried about. I feel like you're probably going to be fine and then selfishly to I kind of see it as an opportunity I'm going to visit with this person for a long time I wonder if they've come. Yeah yeah yeah. So now I think it's people are probably relieved to be asked to help heal and they have sure responded that way.

01:11:55.880 Yeah well it's like oh this is something concrete that I get I get right now. I hope that you know that you do you want to be like to feel like you can do something to help. Yeah I know. For me I feel that way and sometimes the harder time for me. Like when. Last spring when it wasn't officially it didn't feel like remission but it was kind of you know and then I think it did become remission for the summer.

01:12:25.050 That was like one of the hardest weeks for somebody because I think a lot of it was in that appointment. Somehow it came up that he said something about this many months and then we said oh until then. And he didn't say no. You know it. So it was kind to hold on to it all you know. So I think that just stuck with me that I was like great we're walking out of here happy that she gets to enjoy her summer. But maybe this fall etc.

01:12:51.360 You know and but then also it's just that you know when we leave there and we have like this what we're gonna do this is the steps we're gonna take. And there's things I have to do like I have to get her to the appointments I have to keep her eating. I have to make sure that you know she has the medicines that she needs then it's a distraction. Yeah. And when it's just just enjoy your life like that.

01:13:22.750 You. I can't. I don't know who you are. No not me. But anyways we're kind of veering away. I feel like back to the fear aspect. I just think that's amazing. And I know you're my mom and everyone thinks their mom is amazing. But to really not have fear of dying I don't know because I think I feel pretty close to God most of the time.

01:13:53.230 And I don't know the thought of dying freaks me out a little bit scared to death obviously. And I and I see that you really do and you try to self correct but right. But I I yes I've seen you at your raw true you know and it's not there. The fear is not there. Do you think that you've always. I mean do you think that's just your faith. Do you think. Where do you think that comes from. I think it probably does.

01:14:22.180 I think it's been a journey. I think I heard you say that it's not something that happened overnight. Which when we're talking about faith that's the biggest lesson I learned. It's not like oh OK I have eternal life as well. Yeah yeah. Then just switch on and you're good to go exact right and that you know it is a process. It's a continuous journey and choosing. I also have wondered a lot about how much my ancestors did pray and maybe they're still praying for me because I can't find it either.

01:14:57.230 You know how can I. How can I feel such peace and I really think of my grandma Jeffrey Grandma me. She was just such a. She was a widow from the time she was very young and. A real woman of prayer and scripture study and my most comforting. Things did your grandma do that. Yeah that's your hand. I just I do as my grandkids remember that just you know and I know I'm very thankful for it.

01:15:27.340 I have a wonderful circle of Christian friends that are there in the middle of the night with the tax or you know because sometimes you feel like Katie and I have gotten to a point where we really can be quite blunt and I can tell her which. There are times I think that's my daughter. I don't want to make her hurt more but that's been a real blessing.

01:15:53.530 But there are still times you think I don't think Tom or Katie or Peter Amy need to know this is what I'm feeling right now you know and and to know that there's there's that group out there that I can. This is what I'm feeling. And even though I know it's not easy for them to but there's just a little more freedom I guess to have that and the prayers from people just been unveiled to.

01:16:28.760 Yeah. There is something all this time together. There's times I feel like I kind of have to like preface it but I know I don't worry like this I don't want to hear any sense. But you know like I just after this last appointment I know the weird things that stick in your mind.

01:16:50.400 I started thinking and I think maybe it was with Mark's funeral too I started thinking What am I gonna wear. Because the last thing I'm gonna want to do during that time is go shopping. No no I'm not. And you just can't incarnate anymore. So I started you know. So how morose is that. I mean Google you know online shopping for something that for mother's funeral. Right. I mean it is just an honor having to get a daughter of the deceased guy.

01:17:22.290 Like mother right. Like that. I remember when grandma died that I had to go do that. Yeah. And I don't want to do that with you know because I don't know how and a B what kind of state I want to be in and I also don't want to look back and think because you hang on to weird things like oh sure I had that ugly cardigan. You know like I don't want to think about that. So my dress that you know you're gonna wear. I do. And I don't know if I which was hard to think about that I were able to. Yep. OK.

01:17:50.880 Check that at Dulles. You got Tom's. Yeah. So. Mm hmm mm hmm. Yeah. The thought of two years ago thinking like What are you gonna wear to your mom's funeral. I have no idea because when I'm 57 I'll be wearing you know basically windbreaker sweat suit. That Holder was like Yeah you should have picked out the dress.

01:18:22.950 I did sure but that's the thing that feels it. That's. It feels cruel like I can't imagine saying yeah Darcy you know you have cancer but what do you think is this what I should wear to care for you. Yeah sure. You know I like that kind of. Absolutely. Let's focus on me about this. Yeah you know but on the same time I don't know. I think that's kind of a gift that yeah we can do that. I can.

01:18:48.850 Once I do order it I think that I can show her one time and I can put it away and hide it and it'll just be in the back of my closet and never think of it again. And but then I can pull it out and no you know mom like this or I showed mom this or you know. So if you don't like it you should tell her that they're not mine. Oh yeah. It's the conversations that we have sometimes.

01:19:19.080 Like is this really where we are. But you know I like mail to do that and I like being able to do that with not just my closest family but I'd rather people talk about it than to feel like they have to avoid this subject. My therapist Nancy says that's that's a thing to do things I mean a really good way to tackle anxiety is to do everything you can within the preparation that you can imagine. Right.

01:19:47.100 So you know whatever you can do to feel like you've covered every angle you can see and then you let go and then everything else is chance and out of control anyway. And that's something I do. We talked about being less makers than our notes NGS and I always find that really really helpful to really surround it with preparation. That's why I like hands. I can see that you know drop it. Yeah. I could see that being a real gift honestly that that time to play in that. Mm hmm.

01:20:16.050 This feels hard to talk about and this is something we've never discussed. What do you think about that and how will be for him with that and. You know and with him really area. I touched a little bit upon how independent he has become.

01:20:42.240 And it's so good to see that because five years ago I thought this man will never make it without me you know. But just eat a it just takes off. He is completely in charge of his health. You know I hear wives talk about the boy how we know so you have to take that take care of Tom's medicine I'm going. Absolutely. He is so self-sufficient that. He has a good circle of friends at Tubbs Pub. That's a real gift for him every morning he can be with those guys and play cards.

01:21:15.210 And the kids and the grandkids he he lives to watch those grandkids. And so I you know I don't like to think of not being with him and just like we were with some friends this weekend that just bought an RV a little one they can drive everywhere and Tom and I kind of. Oh yeah. You know I mean like he said you can't. And I said we we can't do that. You know we've had wonderful trips. And he said absolutely this is no time to be feeling jealous you know.

01:21:45.480 And he talked about we have had so many good times. The thought of him remarrying is probably the hardest thought and yet the thought of him being alone is very hard too. So. I guess I just have to give that to Jesus. We've talked about will we be married in heaven. And I think we will.

01:22:14.210 My belief right now is that but it'll be such a different concept of that what that relationship is. But I do believe will recognize each other as husband and wife and there again and we've talked about the time element. So maybe. So I guess I would say he has my blessing. He finds even though it's not.

01:22:40.150 We've joked a little bit of course about that perfect for many as I'm not in the market but I didn't mind here and that we will have been married 48 years this December. So that's a long time yeah. We've had a lot a lot of good times so. I think I can wrap my head around a little bit in the right setting you being gone now.

01:23:15.250 I still hate it but you know what else could come here. You know you have to move she is going to have to build a tiny house. Across the street. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. He's got a really strong family too. He's got. Sisters and brothers that are.

01:23:45.990 Very close and I can see that only growing more. You know that relationship. One sister has been a widow for since 89 and so she knows what it's like. And you know she's very available for all of us and now his other sister just became a widow like I said our brother in law. So they'll have each other.

01:24:21.590 So you talked about what's hard and your lack of fear kindness Dad. What is it. That you would like.

01:24:40.940 Let's talk about the grandkids specifically the grandkids to know about you. I mean what is it that you want to make sure when they listen to this ten years from now. Good question mercy compassion. I think they'll never understand how much I love them until their grandparents and. Business just like being a parent. You just. You don't realize that until you're in that situation.

01:25:09.970 And I'm very thankful for the good memories we have that even at age 17 15 13 they come to nanny camp. You know we had so many. Good experiences with that. And I'm just so I guess I'd want them to know how much I appreciate their respect of me. I and I guess that in the love goes hand in hand but I truly feel if I ask those kids to do something what time you want it done and you know I mean just.

01:25:44.080 Just like we go to the care homes still and perform at that age they will still do that. Yeah you know those are good kids good kids. Oh yeah. Folks have done great and and I guess no one of course I keep telling him it's a crazy world out there and you're gonna hear crazy philosophies and you have to remember Jesus is I mean on John 14 6 I am the way and the truth in the life no one comes to the Father except through me.

01:26:14.150 And I really want them to hold on to that truth. You know that he is the way. And so my love of them and love of their poppa and their parents and good parents. They have an Aunt Katie and. So those try would be the main thing. And Tom early on said it at family prayer time or I mean it was at a meal.

01:26:42.980 He's I don't remember how he worded it but a hold on this and I would like us to. Pray that more consistently and that is. That you know we have unknowns and we don't know the timing of all this but that no matter what it brings us closer together and doesn't cause divisions and I want that my kids and my grandkids and that they can always rely on each other. And their Poppa.

01:27:09.460 And that relationship how important it is to always have that. To build on it. So thanks for asking. I remember when Ty Trey's dad died it was you know a friend Ty and he battled cancer.

01:27:33.980 So when I went to the funeral I just remember always being struck how many people would say he was so positive everything and I just thought well you know like wow what a legacy to feel like that one word. I mean it was constant. Every person that came in and talked about how positive he was all the time. And and I remember thinking like what would the word be.

01:27:59.970 Then people would say about me if I died. So what do you think. What do you think your word is or what do you think you would want it to be that's a big question. And he didn't get I didn't tell you this. Anyway I'm sick no. I guess the desire would be believer and I feel like it is the grandparents and the parents responsibility to to how they were then leave a legacy.

01:28:37.740 Of faith. And so I guess baseball would be. Something I would desire that they would see that I think I need to work on hope. Sometimes I think sometimes it's all dependent upon how I'm feeling physically that the hope is usually there when I'm feeling bad. It's not hard to get into that.

01:29:08.500 I love you all but you know this is enough. Yeah we're done. Heaven is good. And so but I know how much hope affects you know that longevity too. So. I want to be. I have a group of friends this is ones that I can. Text in the middle of the night and we start calling ourselves a hopeful quad. And that girlfriend text Jane is the best thing in the world isn't it.

01:29:40.620 It really is. They are and they're not the only ones of course. We've got lots and lots of good friends. Can do that with but so know so faithful faithful I guess. I think that people honestly realistically a lot of people see that anymore. I hope so. Strong. I think that you're stronger than you. There again the ink the gift of cancer.

01:30:09.390 People have been so complimentary. Like I say this is indicated I'm going wow I'm glad she's interviewing me. Huh. She thinks I'm OK. But you know how many people get to have praises right. You know instead I use that. And I had a friend look at me like that's a little different thinking but. Another special thing the family did.

01:30:38.970 Was a year ago I went into remission. And we were just elated. And what better thing for a music teacher to experience than when be your own personalized talent show. And a lot of you will be listening know that. But they had an evening.

01:31:00.810 Where the grand kids saying my friends saying my kid's saying and did different things and I said in one of my friends I felt like I just went to my funeral I didn't have to do it my friend looked at me like Oh my God what is wrong. That's a little different thinking that's kind of the opposite of what they were going for. I don't know why I feel like you know wow you know what and even you know everybody they're fairly lifting you up and you were still alive and kicking.

01:31:35.250 You don't get to be celebrated like a day off. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know why that higher for some reason to. It felt like it took a lot of nerve on my part. I don't know. I think like Pete made me went along with it. But Pete at the end he's like well I guess you were right. That's a good idea. There's something about this guy who's like good job decided to do this. Like you didn't tell me that the whole time you were thinking I don't know what he's thinking.

01:32:04.800 Yeah we'll do it at my building but fire at a yeah there's a fire. Do you think though people think we're is totally outside I think I felt that I felt like like you know you know. Yeah yeah but I don't think if people felt that way they wouldn't have come. Yeah. So it was great. Are we having one in October this year. They got slapped together. Yeah. We got to do it now it's easy. Been there done that.

01:32:36.560 I've been there done that. So last year Brenda won even this will be hard to talk about too. But I guess I think another thing that I've I've always had this kind of looming over me for some reason and I think I was part of the reason I moved home my mom's dad and aunt.

01:33:02.090 Yes. And and both had Alzheimer's. So in my mind of that that's what's come. You know that's what was going to come and it's what's coming for me. And you know and so cancer was like this out of left field but I think I think for you it's easier for you to look at it as a blessing that you do have your your mental capacity.

01:33:34.830 And I think most that I might feel that way selfishly sometimes I think Okay but what if it meant like ten more years of some good times you know. You know but I think there we are. When I actually think about it you know really think about it. You are still here. 100 percent of the time even when you're tired even when you have no energy.

01:34:02.490 No I don't want to eat that. Yes I took my pill. You got because you have had your moments you know with the with the medicine. Yeah. Where it made you know where I was. Yeah. And it was scary. And it it. You know it shakes you more than you would think so in that way you know when you say cancer is a blessing.

01:34:34.620 Sometimes I can't say that. But yeah there are some aspects of it. Well it make it easier and that is the thing to you know people will think Oh what a horrible thing. You know whatever we're going through whether it's cancer or Alzheimer's or. Rheumatoid arthritis or chronic back pain.

01:35:04.600 How can a good god do that. You know. And I'm thankful that I don't feel that way. And it's hard to know how to respond to people because you don't want to come across as as. Pious. Look at me you know I've got it together. I don't have resentment or. But yet you want to put that reality out there that these bodies are not meant to last forever.

01:35:33.500 And we don't choose what just normally. How it's going to deteriorate. And I also hold on to a quote by Matthew Kelley. That not only are we to accept God's will because that's such a common thought with people is how what a good God allow these bad things to happen but that not only are we asked to accept him but to embrace them with all.

01:36:02.870 And not that that's easy to do but. As a mystery of life and I kind of jokingly said to I'm sure glad I like variety and mystery and I do I like that you don't know for sure what the next day is going to bring. Because that's the way it is. You know especially with. Cancer I'll think I'm doing good and in the next day. Know I'm not a good one. As with what many people have to go through. But don't know if I'm on the right train of thought that happens once in a while.

01:36:35.820 It's my chemo. Nothing like this ever happened before the chemo. Yeah that kind of feeds into the. So the lyrics to this song that we recorded. We only did the second verse. I don't know if you really need to listen to me sing in four minutes. That's right. But it's it's it's a little bit more fitting but it kinda just talks about.

01:37:07.950 I feel like being ready to go in and then your body isn't gonna last forever. Right. And even if I don't know. That it's or it says something about it still leaving me saying goodbye. Yeah so that's hard to think about but. I always think of it Reba McEntire which I'm not a country western.

01:37:37.430 Oh no I know what you're thinking. How can I help you say goodbye after songs. Not that comes to me a lot and even though I don't like Tanya and I don't like. I know the song. Yeah but there is a lot of like we've talked about Amy being so tender hearted and she cries quite a bit which is probably healthy. But Patty Loveless she's one who did that. Oh really. Okay. I remember you listened to it a lot when it first started.

01:38:07.160 Yeah that was this was too hard for me when I first started feeling like something's not quite right before I went to the doctor and got the prognosis. That song came to me and it was another one. What was the oh if I get there before you do or if you get there before I do I can't remember those two songs came to me in the middle of the night and. I honestly thought are you sending me a message. God you know. And I kind of felt like he was like This isn't just a minor thing we're dealing with here.

01:38:36.890 You know you don't just think of Patty Loveless songs out of yeah. Yeah. But so you just want to make it easy for. I don't know how you can do that with your loved ones. Because it hurts to be separated just to know. Hey I'm 66. You know I go to the cancer center and I see kids and I see. Teenagers and young moms and so little to regret and to experience wonderful wonderful things in life.

01:39:20.530 If any other questions. I don't know. I don't think I do kind of feel like our typical questions don't really work in this setting. Wrap up sort of thing think you know what about you.

01:39:47.530 What do you think. How are you Katie Yeah. What do you think is the when you think about life without your mom. What feels like the hardest thing to you. Don't know.

01:40:17.490 Um oh. Yeah. My grandma. I don't know. My grandmother and when she lost her mom her mom was 93. So my grandma was in her 70s and she said you know this is. That was maybe 10 almost 10 years ago now and there's still days you know she's like it's still your mom. You know you still want to call your mom.

01:40:44.150 I feel like in the little things it seems impossible but you know that when I'm frustrated about something you talk to your mom. You know when you're happy about something when you're proud of something you talk to your mom. You know there's the person 100 percent that for everything and I think maybe that's harder than thinking about the big things because it you know I feel like I'm 36 so maybe I will never have kids but that used to be hard for me to think about that.

01:41:20.750 She would never. She wouldn't get to see that if I did. But that doesn't bother me as much anymore. Those kind of things. I guess I don't know. But it's. It still sounds terrible. But can I just the support that she provides. Even how you know that constant unconditional.

01:41:49.350 She's my mom. There's you know I know that she loves me no matter what. I know that if I need something she will give it to me if it's worth it in her power. And I feel that with my dad I do. But it is a different relationship. So she never way. I don't know.

01:42:17.710 You always feel I've always felt very close to my mom. But especially in this last year and a half she truly is my best friend and I don't know what life looks like without it. So I have good friends and good family. And I know I still have that in side where I know I'll be OK.

01:42:43.530 I know it will be but does it mean that I want to be. I don't know how I want to be able to. Talk about things to. Vent to you about the things that you know. I feel like there's there's an understanding there where you know it's easier. Are you a person who would find comfort talking to her after she's gone or does that not feel like you. I don't know.

01:43:16.710 I feel like I've never experienced I've. Never experienced anything like this and I probably never will. You know I think you know one mom. Yeah. Yeah. I think maybe because I think there is sometimes even with Grandma that I thought maybe I don't say it out loud or maybe in the beginning I did.

01:43:35.780 I don't remember but where I've thought you know like Grandma would like this or what do you think about this grandma. You know like kind of that kind of thought process. So I think I could maybe see myself doing that. I also think I would feel like I was a little crazy. One of my best friends talked to your mom and dad all the time. Patty. Your godmother. You know that's just part of her.

01:44:07.460 We need to talk to her about that. Pennsylvania anyways I don't know. I don't think I have any other questions for you. Anything for you that feels left unsaid. Well I just I really feel honored that you would let me do this because.

01:44:34.070 There again as you think about what would be what would I want my grandkids to know. What would I want my kids to know what do I want to save. I want to write them one last letter. Do I know. And I feel like you've given me the opportunity maybe to say to all my kids my grandkids Tom and friends and family what's deepest in my heart. And so I really appreciate that. And again just to say we know we're not alone in going through a difficult journey.

01:45:08.320 And just praying and hoping that more people get opportunities to be able to express their wishes and what's in their hearts and so thank you. It's been your opportunity. I'm OK with that. I think Katie's going to saying OK.

01:46:13.320 Spirit very warm and Rusty. So many small. Thinking sturdy and strong.

01:46:32.990 See means the cool. Girls and boys.

01:47:20.650 You.