What I wanted to do with the Robina campus was build a campus that would incorporate sustainability into all aspects of running a campus.

Welcome to Focus, a podcast dedicated to the business of Higher Education. I'm your host, Heather Richmond, and we will be exploring the challenges and opportunities facing today's higher learning institutions. In today's episode, I had the pleasure of speaking with Karen Dickinson, the general manager for TAFE Queensland Gold Coast about taking a holistic approach to sustainability with our newest campus. Welcome to our podcast, Karen. I've been really looking forward to having this conversation with you.

It's great to be here, Heather. Thank you.

Wonderful. Well, you know, sustainability is a topic that gets brought up frequently in discussions that we have when really talking about innovation in higher education. And for sure, it's a hot topic with the next generation of students. But let's start by learning a little bit more about you and your background.

Well, I'm the general manager for TAFE Queensland Gold Coast, which is in Queensland, and it's a beautiful part of the world. We have gorgeous beaches and amazing ancient hinterland. There's about 650,000 people living on the Gold Coast. And we have 22,000 students, 650 staff, six campuses, and we offer everything from diplomas to degrees.

Wow, that sounds like a place I'd like to come to school.

It's gorgeous.

I bet. And then can you expand a little bit on your role there?

Sure. So I'm the general manager, and I have oversight and responsibility for the 22,000 students, and for all six campuses on the Gold Coast. So that's a fairly big role and keeps me pretty busy.

I bet. Thank you so much for that overview. So now let's go ahead and jump in talking about sustainability. And so can you expand a little bit on what's been going on, this topic throughout higher ed, specifically in Australia?

Look, I think there's a lot of conversation around sustainability. And that has increased in the last couple of years. Certainly, we participate in a lot of communities of practice, where there's a conversation about sustainability occurring, and that is with our higher education partners. And there's a lot more focus on how do we incorporate sustainability into our curriculum, into our operations, into the facilities, the infrastructure. And there's a lot of conversation at the moment in terms of how we prepare ourselves for the green transition, and preparing ourselves for the new renewable technologies. We certainly recognize that there's a long journey ahead. And I think that there aren't a whole lot of holistic examples of where we're able to do everything well. But I think the higher ed sector is taking on the challenge of incorporating sustainability into parts of its business and moving towards more holistic models.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I think you have a very unique opportunity in being able to start from scratch, we'll say it's different to have to edit your operations. But let's dive into the Robina campus and kind of what you've talked about being able to start from scratch there.

Look, we were so lucky. About four years ago, we had a campus that was being built. And it was our opportunity to look at how we could do things very differently. And I guess about the same time I was having conversations with my nieces and nephews who are all in their early 20s. And they were asking me questions like, what are you doing about sustainability? What is TAFE doing about sustainability? That had me thinking about, well, maybe this is something I need to investigate a little further, because maybe this is something we need to integrate into our operations, into our curriculum. And so I did a whole heap of research about what was happening in the world. And I think there was a lot of really good practice out there. But there weren't a lot of holistic models. And so what I wanted to do with Robina campus was build a campus that would incorporate sustainability into all aspects of running a campus. So that would include the build, the fit out, the classrooms, the student life, procurement, culture, every aspect of delivering training to students would incorporate sustainability. And so that was the broad concept for Robina. 

Yeah, that's really interesting. We often talk a lot of times about really the two sides of a campus and the academic side versus the business side. And oftentimes, these big initiatives happen at either one or the other, but generally never both at the same time. So what an awesome, unique opportunity.

Yeah, it was so fortunate that the timing lined up. And there was a lot of emerging literature on what best practice was looking like.

So let's talk about what went into the planning around this new campus.

I think that was part of its success was spending the time and doing an immense amount of research to find out what best practice looks like around the world, but then also consulting locally, and really we engaged our staff early. They've been on the journey for many years. They contributed to shaping the curriculum, the environment that we're in, we spoke to local experts, we spent a lot of time in the planning phase. So, when it came to what did the fit out look like? What did the curriculum student engagement or procurement, what did that look like? We had a pretty good idea of what we wanted to put in place.

Yeah, that's great. When we talked before, I heard you say that really, sustainability is part of Robina's DNA. So can you expand on that?

We really made sure that every aspect of what we were doing included sustainability. So if we look at the fit out, if you look at the way in which we've incorporated sustainability, you'll see it ever present. We've used recycled timbers, the carpets are all made with recyclables. The learning spaces are all multi-purpose. We have skateboard and scooter storage, electric charging stations, we have organic composters, and we have recycling. Every aspect of the curriculum, absolutely embeds in every unit that we deliver something that relates to sustainability. When it comes to the procurement processes, making sure that we engage carbon neutral and ethical suppliers. When it came to student engagement, the minute you walk in the door at Robina campus, it's a very different experience than walking into other campuses. As soon as you walk in, it's a very big sort of atrium, like setting. And there are lots of images around you, environmental images, social images, that prompt you to start thinking about a world beyond the campus. And I think that's exactly what we wanted to achieve, to prompt people as they walk throughout the campus, particularly students, that there would be messages, there would be information that would stimulate, that would excite them. And that's the environment we have created. So it is part of our DNA. It's ever present wherever you go. And in the mindset of both our staff and students.

Yeah, it's just really interesting that it's such a top of mind for students these days. And again, I think it's just this generation right now. It's just so important, isn't it?

It certainly is, and increasingly so, the more research we do, the more we know that we've made the right decision in terms of making sure that the campus creates a sense of belonging for the students. And certainly, millennials will want to come into an environment where there are broader issues being discussed. Even if you're studying commercial cookery or business, whatever the subject is, your building those technical skills, but people that are coming to study with us will want to understand what's happening in the community around them, they will want to have a conversation about social and environmental issues, because it's part of their lives. And that's the environment we want to create on the campus.

Yeah, I think that's great that you're educating both the book smarts, if you will, but also the environmental smarts. And when you leave, you have just that extra level of education that you wouldn't get from probably another campus. I know when we were talking even about your event venues, can you talk about how it's almost like start to finish, and you have this real holistic view of being very sustainable from an event standpoint?

So I'm going on about whether we would get a third party in to run our facility as a live training venue. So we have a cafe, a restaurant, a gym, and a very large event center. And we decided that we would run them ourselves so we could absolutely control how we ran those facilities. So we are able to run all of those facilities in a very eco-friendly way. So that everything is biodegradable, everything's compostable. Waste management is present with all of those venues. So the business itself is really mindful about sustainability, the cafes, and restaurants, they are serving locally sourced food options, very healthy food options, more organic and vegan options. So we only engage with the carbon neutral and ethical supplier. So we really look at our supply chains, make sure that we're engaging, either locally sourced or people that are absolutely committed to being carbon neutral, or a commitment to sustainability. So that provides the students an opportunity to do their work experience in those venues, they get to build those sustainability skills. And increasingly, industry is wanting those sorts of skills when people arrive to work in a hotel, for example, they have those skills already. And they're really able to go into a business and add value to taking that business forward. And its commitment to sustainability.

That's very true. ItÕs almost a train the trainer approach. They're leaving campus, and they're training the new businesses, right?

Yeah. And I think it's one of those evolving areas. So what I find most interesting is the students are constantly coming up with ideas, I think we can improve this if we do this. So I just think it immerses people in an environment where they can actually come up with ideas for doing things differently, and doing things more sustainably. So I think that sort of empowering environment is where students thrive.

They absolutely do and they are never short of ideas. Something that gets brought up a lot is just thinking about the technology on campus. And so can you talk a little bit about how you're approaching technology from sustainability? 

Again, we looked at a lot of best practice that existed, we had, particularly in Queensland, we went for the universities, we had a look at the technology, and the classrooms that they had, and we tweaked and improved things. So all of our learning spaces are fitted out with the high resolution cameras. So we live stream everything, we record our sessions, where the teachers use the latest tablet technology, which allows them to move around the room and engage in very flexible delivery. And we stream to multiple screens. All the furniture in the rooms is it's highly flexible and can be moved around. And the desks can go up and down, they're operated on a guest strat so they easily move around. And the room is designed to have multiple screens. So there's absolutely no front of class. There's lots of collaboration spaces and breakout booths. A lot of our learning is very much project based learning, collaborative based learning, and just really takes advantage of the latest technology. But I think what's really important is, whilst we have the best technology, I think in Australia at the moment in our campus at Robina, you've got to take staff on that journey. And they've embraced it, they love it. But there was a lot of time spent here building their skills, building their confidence in being able to work with the technology. And particularly if you're not standing in front of the classroom, and you're using the whole of the classroom, it's really important to support staff in providing the right level of professional development.

We talk a lot about it's not technology, I think there's sometimes this mindset, especially hearing the words Ôdigital transformationÕ, and what are we doing? And we think about, itÕs the tool, and we're going to get new tech. But somebody has to run the technology, right? It's really more the people and how are we transforming the people?

Yeah, it's so true. And just one small example, because we're doing a lot more virtual delivery, how you set up the classroom, and even supporting the teachers doing some drama classes, so that they can, there's a little bit more theater to how you provide education. It's not just chalk and talk standing in front of the classroom, that is not as contemporary as finding ways to facilitate differently today.

Absolutely. It's all about engagement. 

Yeah, absolutely. 

You know, it's interesting, because I know one of the areas on campus that we at TouchNet are exploring is how do we help facilities management run more efficiently so that less energy is used. And so obviously, that's part of the sustainability build out at Robina, right?

Yes, we have, I think that 300 solar panels up on our roof, so we generate our own solar power. At the moment, it generates about 50% of our power usage. And we put about 12-15%, back on the grid. All of our power, water, and wastage is monitored. And all of that is fed into Power BI. And then we monitor, we can look at any point in time and see the usage that can be in a day or week or a month. So we can see how we're doing in terms of reducing our overall carbon footprint.

Wow, that's impressive. And talk about data. You're definitely being very data centric. 

Well, that's the intention, I think it's great to have these sorts of initiatives. But you really need to have an evidence base to demonstrate that it's being effective. So it does help us monitor. And it does help us identify that we might have pockets. One example we had in the cafe, we were leaving on the coffee machines where we do some barista training, and that was actually chewing up quite a lot of power. So now we turn them off. So it does highlight where there are pockets in the business where you can reduce your power consumption.

Yeah, that's amazing. And you think about the data that it takes to look at all that and understand it. And obviously, it took research. So what was the data and research and inspiration that you took from when you were designing Robina?

We really wanted to build a holistic model. And to start with, that was largely me doing a literature review of what existed in the world. So it's a lot of great things coming out of the United States, you call it colleges. So we looked there, we looked at what was happening in Europe. And we really took all of the best ideas, and tried to learn from that, and incorporate that into the design for Robina.

That's great, you get to take the best of all worlds into one campus.

Yeah, a lot of the institute's will have a particular focus, like greening the environment. And they'll do that really well. But we tried to just pick all of the good ideas, and then blend them all. And I think that's the uniqueness with Robina is it hasn't focused on one aspect of being green. It's tried to incorporate sustainability, across all of its operations, both academic and operational.

So have you won any awards for this great work you've done?

We were thrilled to win another silver award this year at the World Federation of Colleges and Polytechnics for our work with these SDGs. So last year, we won silver in our construction of a campus that was committed to sustainability. And this year, we won silver, for our work with the sustainable development goals. So we're really very, very happy with that, winning two silver awards on a world stage. So we're thrilled with that. 

That's impressive, I would be thrilled too, congratulations. So thinking about that, how are you measuring your success?

Yeah, we have in place, a tracking system. It's called STARS. It's very well known in the States. And it's the Sustainability Tracking and Assessment Rating System. It's incredibly rigorous. It's used by higher ed providers. We're the first TAFE in Australia to be using it. And there's a whole range of different categories. So have an academic, operational and infrastructure, whole range of different areas, and it goes down to a finite level. And in some areas, it's going to be measuring your carbon footprint. So we're really on that journey at this very early stage of collecting baseline data. We will be applying, and you use a self-assessment process, but you have peer assessment that's involved in that then you do self-assessment, and then you make an application to the STARS people. And this year, we're aiming to go for this bronze, silver and gold. So we're going to start off applying for the bronze designation and hope that we're successful there. And then over the years, gradually move up so that we position ourselves as satisfying a broader range of those measures in the STARS rating system.

That's awesome. So you're shooting for a gold STARS. That's wonderful. Do you get to see how you're ranked accordingly with other groups or organizations who are doing this? 

Yeah, absolutely. So it has all the universities across the world that are participating, and there are hundreds. And it's a self assessment process. So you can actually see those that have achieved a gold rating through silver. And they're terrific because they facilitate lots of conversations. We have lots of conversations in communities of practice with other hiring providers in the country. And it's a wonderful forum for sharing ideas and for supporting each other on that sustainability journey.

Yeah, it sounds like another place to get new ideas and to make it even better.

Yeah. But it's so new. And I know we've been talking about sustainability for many years, but actually putting it into place in higher ed, and in tertiary institutions is new. And particularly more holistically, it's new. So the more conversations we have, the more we can share good practices. And it is a very supportive environment.

Yeah. And I think it's going to be one of those things eventually, that it'll be a student expectation. 

Absolutely, I think that increasingly, students are wanting to come and study with us. And they really love those aspects of having conversations around something outside of their curriculum. So talking about social environmental sustainability is important to them.

Yeah, so the response so far of your students has actually been really positive, right?

Yeah, absolutely. So we exceeded our target. We've only been open since July last year, and our student numbers have grown phenomenally. So that's great. It's just students satisfaction is going through the roof, so that's terrific. And what I find comforting is when I go there, and I speak to the students, there's a real sense of belonging. And I feel like I'm talking about things that matter. So I love the fact that they're involved in their campus, they're involved in the community, because we connect a lot of the student activities with the community. And that's what they really enjoy.

Yeah. And it's something again, that's learned outside of the classroom, but that they can take forward with them in their life.

Yeah, absolutely.

That's really cool. But a lot of that, while you have that in place, a lot of it really is still around education and understanding sustainability. So can you talk a little bit about some of the programs that you have to educate not just students, but even visitors?

For our staff and students, they'll go through an orientation program that provides them on a high level overview of what sustainability is about. And certainly what we're trying to do at the Robina campus in a living and breathing our commitment to the SDGs. You'll see the signage, there are wall displays, and there are super graphics everywhere, conveying messages in relation to sustainability. We do a lot of storytelling, we do a phenomenal amount of tours. And we're very happy to do that, because we want to be able to walk through and tell the story of the campus. So there are every week, Wednesdays at lunchtime for a couple of hours, we have a whole range of student activities that are dedicated to sustainability. And they can vary, some of them are going out to visit community partners committed to sustainability. Some of it might be just bringing in a person that will provide some information, or there's a whole range of student initiatives. So they have closed exchange programs. And we may have several activities occurring but Wednesday's the day that something happens on campus. We do a lot of collaboration with local farmers, so that they take our waste. We grow our product at the community gardens, we collaborate with the schools. The school students come up to the campus and join in some of the activities that are occurring. So there's not one strategy, but a whole range of ways that we try to inform our students and visitors and working together on projects of interest is was always a good thing.

I think that's great. And being able to have that Wednesday timeframe where people just know and have that consistently available. That's going to have great attendance, I'm sure. Well, I know that a lot of our listeners, a lot of our higher ed leaders from all over the world are really looking at making sustainable spaces but a lot of times we hear what are the costs? And so can we talk about from the financial standpoint, what's the investment needed to really get started? And then long term?

Yeah, I guess I would say, moving forward to the future, it's just, the way to do business moving forward. But certainly, in Queensland, the government, and the institute that I work for, TAFE, Queensland invested in the facility. And so, that was great, that makes it achievable. If the government and if the organization has prepared to put money into something that, which they may not usually, but they absolutely saw the value. I think that, for us to make that value proposition, we had to very much provide information that would influence them and thinking about, we argued this would really make a difference to the student journey. And it would attract more students, it certainly would retain more students. So that was one of the scenarios that was presented or information was provided. As well as a way of engaging our staff that we wanted, and also how we would use technology in this campus. So I think all of those factors, and considering what was right for the environment, and social issues. But it also I think, is just where conversations are headed into the future. And TAFE Queensland is absolutely committed to those social environmental issues. And I think increasingly, I know that moving forward into the future the higher end providers in Australia will need to demonstrate how they're reducing their carbon footprint. And so this is just one step in that right direction. So I think we will have no choice in the future, but to be making the investment in these sorts of campuses.

Yeah, and like you said, you definitely, backed it up with a plan. And so this wasn't an overnight initiative. And as long as there's planning, you can plan the budget from an investment standpoint.

Absolutely. And it was rigorously project managed at the time, so that there was a demonstration that the board and the government were getting good value for money. And then the government, because it's like the flagship for sustainability in the vocational training sector, they're very proud of it. And so they do come down, and they do like what they see in terms of this holistic model.

Yeah, that makes a lot of sense. And I think about, in building this business case, the financial side is one side. But another question that we hear is, what is that driving force? And so maybe talk a little bit about the driving force with your approach to the Robina campus?

Well, I just think that the there's just a tidal wave of interest around the world, and in Australia. And I think you see it with businesses now, everyone is gearing up and thinking about the green transition. And if they're not, they're going to be left behind. So I think everyone is positioning, how do I maneuver into position my organization or this campus so that it is able to better meet the needs of learners into the future? And so being able to provide information to students on climate change on social issues are just part and parcel of the new world that we work in, and this will just accelerate into the future.

I love that green transition, that's going to be the next buzzword that you'll hear at conferences everywhere.

Yeah, well there's a lot of work. I mean, at the moment, we're doing a ton of work in terms of renewables, looking at hydrogen, solar, wind and really starting to explore those spaces. And I'm sure that's happening around the world. But in that transition, in terms of how you deliver training, there's many more remote options, more online, virtual options, and all of that is being explored in terms of blended delivery. But I think one of the other things there, is leadership is key to establishing a facility like Robina campus. It's clearly been a labor of love for me. But I also had the commitment and support of my boss, and TAFE, Queensland and the board of TAFE, Queensland. The team that immediately supports me really got on board early and really love this concept. So, we had three years to educate, to bring on board all of our staff. And I can tell you now, the minute you walk in the door at Robina, it feels very different from most other campuses, because there is such a vibe of creativity, because everyone has stepped up and owned that responsibility for sustainability. And everyone is encouraged to make a contribution to how we shape the campus in a very different way.

Yeah, that is so key, you've got to have those champions across campus. Who keep pushing it. And then with that, you have built this community of pride and being so proud of what you've accomplished.

Yeah. 100% they're really proud. And I'm really proud of the work they do down there. Yeah, it's really super impressive. 

That is so wonderful. Well, it sounds like that in a really short amount of time, you were able to accomplish a ton, and taking this green transition to a whole different level.

Absolutely, but it's an ongoing journey. So all the things that are important in terms of how we support our students. That's an ongoing task in terms of finding activities that they will find engaging, working, finding ways in which we can work with them that's empowering, so that they have a voice. And also our staff, finding ways that we can collaborate, work with our staff, so that they equally feel empowered to take responsibility for driving the activities to the campus board. I think there's lots of things and we are continuing to tweak and improve.

That's a wonderful. Well, Karen, thank you so much for joining me today. This has been such an enlightening conversation.

Thank you very much.

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