Episode 5
[00:00:00] Vince: [00:00:00] all right. Welcome back to the summits podcast. Here we are episode numero five Cinco. Yep. Um, good friend, Julie drew joins us today. 
[00:00:24] Daniel: [00:00:24] Hi, how are you? Good. 
[00:00:25] Julie: [00:00:25] How are you doing? I'm good. 
[00:00:27] Daniel: [00:00:27] Good, good. Thank 
[00:00:28] Julie: [00:00:28] you. It's been a while to me. I know with this COVID thing. 
[00:00:32] Vince: [00:00:32] When was the last time we saw each other?
[00:00:37] We didn't get together December. Did we? No, no, 
[00:00:39] Julie: [00:00:39] we didn't. We usually have our annual Christmas get together and COVID put a wrench in all of that. Yeah. 
[00:00:48] Vince: [00:00:48] Almost a year and a half, essentially. Wow. 
[00:00:51] Julie: [00:00:51] That's crazy. Well, heroes, I saw you last year at heroes, 
[00:00:55] Vince: [00:00:55] right? Yeah. Okay. So January of 2019. Yeah, [00:01:00] no, 2020, 20, 20, 20.
[00:01:01] Oh yeah. It was 2020. We didn't get that 
[00:01:03] Daniel: [00:01:03] one off right before it was 
[00:01:05] Julie: [00:01:05] right before like the last event. Yeah. 
[00:01:08] Vince: [00:01:08] Oh, it's still seems like forever. I know, 
[00:01:11] Daniel: [00:01:11] I know crazy time crawled there for like eight months or whatever. 
[00:01:15] Vince: [00:01:15] Yeah. Cross a generous word. Yes. Well, we'd like to start out by, uh, just introducing, introducing us to Julie drew the early years going back to motor city.
[00:01:27] Julie: [00:01:27] Oh my gosh. The earlier, uh, yes. So grew up suburban Detroit area, um, in a town called Plymouth, um, kind of in between Ann Arbor and Detroit. And so lived there all my life, went to an all girls Catholic school, mercy high school in Farmington. And, um, um, And then applied to you didn't even really know what you was, Indiana university, 
[00:01:56] Vince: [00:01:56] anything in 
[00:01:57] Julie: [00:01:57] particular?
[00:01:57] No. At the time, no. Okay. A [00:02:00] friend of mine had an extra application and I literally filled it out in the cafeteria in pencil, in pencil, not even official. I didn't know anything about it. So I applied, you know, that was. You know, the early years when you could just fill it out like that. So, yeah. Um, and then got accepted and I think we were driving around, um, in the spring time going to the schools that I had gotten accepted to and with my parents.
[00:02:28] And it was you versus duke and the final four. So that was spring of 1992. 
[00:02:37] Daniel: [00:02:37] And were you born yet? By the way? Uh, yeah, I was two 
[00:02:40] Vince: [00:02:40] years old. 
[00:02:41] Julie: [00:02:41] Yes. Oh gosh. But, um, so we visited that weekend of final four and, you know, spring and Bloomington and the games and the, oh, it was just a magical place. So then I was like, that's where I want to be.
[00:02:57] And ended up most of your friends going [00:03:00] Michigan, state, Michigan, um, somewhere in state for the most part. I wanted to go. Yeah. Really Michigan state was my last choice and Michigan was 15 minutes away. Didn't even apply. Yeah. So, um, I wanted to kind of get away a little bit and um, so yeah. Who's your bound and you're better off for it, right?
[00:03:24] Well, I came here and I never left, so yeah, yeah, yeah. 
[00:03:29] Vince: [00:03:29] I don't know the F I don't know if we met at, are you I'd like to think that we probably did, but those are kind of fuzzy. Um, what, what were you studying at? Are you 
[00:03:40] Julie: [00:03:40] kinesiology? Exercise science. Yeah. 
[00:03:43] Vince: [00:03:43] And were you in a house? 
[00:03:44] Julie: [00:03:44] I was a Kappa. You were a Kappa Kappa 
[00:03:46] Vince: [00:03:46] gamma.
[00:03:46] Oh, I should've known that. I, uh, I coached the Kappa flag football team for two years. Oh, you did? That was awesome. By the way. 
[00:03:53] Julie: [00:03:53] Well, I did that one year and it was Vila and biscuit. The, they took [00:04:00] over for me. They were our coach. 
[00:04:03] Vince: [00:04:03] Yeah. Well, and she threw out nicknames that I had to like, 
[00:04:06] Daniel: [00:04:06] oh yeah, I remember.
[00:04:07] Julie: [00:04:07] Yeah, I know. I still see Bila at, um, St. Luke. Oh, yeah. Yeah. Sometimes I have a hard time remembering what his first name, right? 
[00:04:16] Vince: [00:04:16] Yes. Well, we had kind of a side sidebar here in the summertime. You come back from school and you would call up. Yeah, this was before cell phones. I know it started, I imagine. I know, but you'd call it, you know, your fraternity brother's house, his mom would answer you and you'd say, oh, it's, so-and-so there.
[00:04:34] And you by their nickname, she's like, I don't know who that is. And she knew, I mean, she's like, you need to call him by his real name and then. Oh, crap.
[00:04:46] I forgot. 
[00:04:48] Julie: [00:04:48] Oh yeah. That's funny. Good times. Yeah. 
[00:04:52] Vince: [00:04:52] So Julie and I have known each other for a long time. So like I said, we I'm sure we probably crossed paths at NYU. Um, if not, [00:05:00] uh, it wasn't long after that. Um, we've so we've known each other for 12 or 20 years, right. Um, in fact vividly, remember. I mean, shoot, I remember your wedding day.
[00:05:11] Like it was almost yesterday. There's things I can't remember an hour ago. Um, but I remember that, um, cause it for some personal reasons, but, um, so we've known her for a long time. We've, we've experienced co experienced a lot of different things with, um, you know, both in our different families, but our surrounding core group of friends as Julie noted earlier, Every December, uh, we, some of my, uh, Shatara friends and, and their spouses get together.
[00:05:39] And so we have a holiday party every year and some of those are fuzzy too. Um, but we always had a good tradition of whoever gets this big plastic, like 1970s looking Santa decoration, and it's like blow 
[00:05:53] Julie: [00:05:53] up mold 
[00:05:54] Vince: [00:05:54] four, five foot tall. Yeah. Yeah. And of course, early years, no one wanted the thing. Cause it's not the most [00:06:00] attractive thing in the world 
[00:06:01] Julie: [00:06:01] and you have to put it out at 
[00:06:02] Daniel: [00:06:02] Christmas.
[00:06:03] Oh, you have to put it in your, you have to put it out in the yard and everything. Okay. All right. 
[00:06:06] Vince: [00:06:06] And then it got to a point where no, everyone was trying to avoid it. So we would then like sneak it over to someone's house and they would wake up the next morning. And there was a to now it's kind of. I'm not say cool.
[00:06:17] It's probably cool. Yeah. People will actually now say, oh yeah, I'll take it as a wine. Yeah, it is cool. I don't know if it still works like 
[00:06:23] Daniel: [00:06:23] it does. It'll still 
[00:06:23] Julie: [00:06:23] light up. Oh yeah. Jen Caplin fixed that a couple of years ago. There you go. Now it's still working, running 
[00:06:29] Daniel: [00:06:29] tradition now 
[00:06:30] Vince: [00:06:30] the little things. Yeah.
[00:06:33] So there I go again, try to catch 
[00:06:36] Daniel: [00:06:36] myself every time. Just does that 
[00:06:40] Vince: [00:06:40] right there for Tali. Yep. We've got the Sotalol. Okay. 21 plus years ago, a hot summer day in suburban Detroit, the Pacers are playing the, the Lakers. 
[00:06:58] Daniel: [00:06:58] I think it was. And 
[00:06:59] Vince: [00:06:59] the NBA [00:07:00] championship, um, at Julie and Dave's reset wedding reception.
[00:07:07] Uh, I think I weighed about a whopping. Buck 40 by the last time I ever would, last time I will ever weight one 40 and that I, this is right on the front end of my personal experience. Um, going at the reception, you guys hadn't arrived yet. What kind of wait around? Just get, just gotten to the place where the reception was.
[00:07:25] And I started, I had not been drinking, but I had got, I was borrowing to pass out. Yeah. Um, but that's kinda what led into to my situation. Um, Sick weird twist of fate that, you know, as we've talked about and it all these episodes, everyone has a cancer story. Um, some of us have multiple we'll go into Intuit.
[00:07:49] The first one. So with may, may is, um, one of the cancer awareness months for brain cancer. Um, so Julie, if you would tell us your cancer story relative to that. 
[00:08:00] [00:08:00] Julie: [00:08:00] Okay. So your good friend. Um, is my husband David. That's why we connected so many years ago. Yeah. David and 
[00:08:10] Vince: [00:08:10] I went to Shatara together. 
[00:08:12] Julie: [00:08:12] Okay. Okay.
[00:08:13] Um, and uh, I met David at , um, but he was diagnosed with glioblastoma in 2016. So it was, um, a strange event. He, um, Had just run an errand come home. Um, went upstairs. He said he wasn't feeling great. And then he called me up and he said, something's wrong. It's really wrong. And then all of a sudden started speaking jibberish and couldn't understand him.
[00:08:49] Didn't know what he was saying. I thought it was a joke. So knowing, knowing David he's a jokester, like he likes to make people laugh. So I'm like, this is a joke, right? This is a joke. Speak, [00:09:00] normally speak 
[00:09:00] Vince: [00:09:00] one of the best wedding reception dancers.
[00:09:06] Julie: [00:09:06] Yes. Um, and so I finally said. You've got 10 seconds and I'm going to call nine one one. So I eventually called nine one one. I thought he was having a stroke. Was he at home? At home? Okay. Yes, he had just gotten home and, um, found out that night that he had a brain tumor, um, didn't know exactly what type it was at that point, but, um, all things were pointing.
[00:09:37] In the wrong direction. So he was diagnosed February of 2016, uh, with stage four glioblastoma. 
[00:09:45] Daniel: [00:09:45] Wow. It's just no, no signs, nothing. Just kind of like anything like that, looking back. Is there, was there anything? Sure. 
[00:09:53] Julie: [00:09:53] Yeah, definitely. Um, the interesting thing about the brain is it's so pliable and [00:10:00] so it can cover up the tumor and um, so by the time.
[00:10:06] You start having symptoms. It's usually stage four. Okay. So those small symptoms you could think of getting older loss of memory, um, more tired. Um, yeah, just forgetfulness. Yeah. Um, you know, you attribute to different things, right? So he would have headaches, but he also had a neck injury. So. Kept treating the neck injury, thinking it was going up to the head who knows, you know, looking back, could all of those have been assigned for a few years?
[00:10:39] Probably. Yeah. But we just didn't know it. Yeah. Yeah. So depression and you think, you know, change the mood. You think that, um, okay, we'll try this. We'll try this. And he would try medication after medication thinking one would work. And they just wouldn't work. [00:11:00] Um, so unfortunately with brain cancer, once you get diagnosed, it's usually terminal.
[00:11:08] Vince: [00:11:08] So when they, when they made the diagnosis, um, what was. The plan of attack at that point. 
[00:11:16] Julie: [00:11:16] Yeah. So, um, initially in the hospital they say you need to have surgery right away. They don't say for sure, it's Cleo blastoma, and they won't diagnose it until they surgically remove it and, um, and biopsy it. So, um, we knew it was a brain tumor, most likely cancer, not officially anything yet.
[00:11:38] So the first course of treatment was to have surgery. So, um, We ended up going to, um, duke and, uh, for, um, cert Dr. Friedman. Was one of the best surgeons that we had heard about in the country and through the brain tumor network, they connected us [00:12:00] with Dr. Friedman. There's two Dr. Friedman's, uh, one's the surgeon and one's the oncologist within the same program.
[00:12:07] Um, and so both of them are world renowned. So, uh, the brain tumor neck work actually did everything for us to get us into the, into the system, uh, sent all of our information. Um, within a couple of days, we had the oncologist, Dr. Friedman, call us on the phone and say, you know, this is where you need to be.
[00:12:30] We want you to be here. And, um, here's what we can do for you. And the thing about going to duke for us was the biggest thing was not the surgery. It was being at a university. Um, setting that also had brain tumor research. Yeah. So that would allow for options of clinical trials and, um, different procedures that maybe we didn't have locally.
[00:12:57] Yeah. 
[00:13:00] [00:13:00] Vince: [00:13:00] So when did you guys had to do for the first time? 
[00:13:02] Julie: [00:13:02] Um, his surgery. So he was diagnosed February 6th and his surgery was February. Oh, so that's, 
[00:13:11] Vince: [00:13:11] I mean, in that world, that's pretty quick. Yeah, 
[00:13:13] Julie: [00:13:13] really pretty quick. So, um, went down there a couple days ahead of time, just for some tests and pre-AP things and, um, had surgery and then he recovered there.
[00:13:26] We stayed there, uh, an additional week. After his surgery, um, actually he recovered mostly in the hotel room. He stayed in the hospital for two nights and then recovered in the hotel room, uh, for a week. But we had to go in, um, for doctor's appointments. Okay. So at that point they thought, you know, they got with glioblastoma there's cells all throughout the brain.
[00:13:53] So there's the main mass of the tumor, which the doctor. Uh, surgical Dr. Friedman [00:14:00] w Alan Friedman was able to remove the, the major mass, but there are these fingers of the tumor of the cancer that go throughout the brain. So even though you can say you have 95, 96% of it removed, there are still those cells throughout the brain that are in there that you need to address with chemo and radiation.
[00:14:23] Okay. So he came home and that was the next step was to start him on a chemo regimen and, um, radiation. So we did that here locally, um, with an oncologist that I knew. And, um, so it was great that we could go to both universities, do our local treatment here, um, but have surgery there and also put him in the system for clinical trials.
[00:14:50] Yeah. If the. Standard protocol. Wasn't working as well as we had hoped. Yeah. [00:15:00] So he did, um, oral chemo for, I think, six weeks. And then he had, um, radiation every day, I think, 35 treatments maybe, um, of radiation. And, um, so that causes, you know, with your brain it's. I say it's the worst cancer you can get, because you know, there are a number of different cancers that are terminal, but when it affects your brain, it affects who you are.
[00:15:34] Right. So it can change you, it can change your mood, it can change your happiness, your temperament, your, you know, just even being awake. It just made him so sleepy and so tired. Um, and then there's a number of other issues that affected the radiation affected his hearing and his sight on that side. [00:16:00] Um, um, yeah, there's just a number of things that yeah.
[00:16:05] That it damages in doing the treatment, but, you know, it's the best course of treatment and it's the protocol that they do for everybody who gets diagnosed with, with glio. 
[00:16:16] Vince: [00:16:16] Yup. Um, at what point, I guess, during treatment. So maybe I'm trying to visualize back at that time. Uh, I remember we had our holiday part of that year, 20, December of 2016.
[00:16:32] So at that point you're nine, 10, 12, 11 months in, um, how, how would you say things were going at that 
[00:16:40] Julie: [00:16:40] point? At that point we already knew it was growing again. So, um, Um, he came, you know, came back to Indy. I think it was March 4th and then started immediately on chemo and radiation and did that whole, um, treatment.
[00:16:59] But then [00:17:00] by the end of October, I think we found out it was starting to grow again. So we had gone back to duke for a follow-up and MRI. That's where he did most of his MRIs. And, um, It had started to grow. So then they looked through their system and looking at all of his criteria of his tumor. So the different, um, I forget what it's called, but the, uh, you're going to edit this out.
[00:17:34] Um, you know, just the different, um, 
[00:17:40] Vince: [00:17:40] Tumor markers 
[00:17:41] Julie: [00:17:41] or markers that affected the tumor and what he would be eligible for. So they found a treatment that he could start in January. So, um, we went back in January and he. Had to go for an infusion every two weeks, was that a clinical 
[00:18:00] [00:17:59] Daniel: [00:17:59] treatment clinical 
[00:18:00] Julie: [00:18:00] trial clinical trial.
[00:18:02] So, um, he started that and we would go back every two weeks for this clinical trial. Um, and you know, we just maintained hope, you know, with a terminal diagnosis, you just hope and you just pray and you hope that something could be the breakthrough. Um, And he was such a trooper. I mean, he, he wanted to try everything and anything possible.
[00:18:29] And he said, give me more, give me more, give me more because he just wanted to extend that time that, um, he could hopefully be here with all of us. So, uh, we did this trial and it destroyed him from the inside out. It basically burned him from the inside out and he knew. He knew the risks, but he wanted to try it because he said, if it doesn't help me, maybe it'll help somebody else.
[00:18:59] Maybe they'll learn [00:19:00] something from this. Um, and, um, I mean, he just went through so much. He literally had hematomas all over his skin, all over his body. And, um, it got to the point where. He got, um, hospitalized here at the burn unit at Eskenazi because they didn't know how to treat him because his skin was so bad.
[00:19:25] Wow. So bad. Yeah. 
[00:19:28] Vince: [00:19:28] I remember that. That was not, not a good time. Not 
[00:19:31] Julie: [00:19:31] a good time. So, um, oh my gosh. He was just such a fighter. He just wanted to try anything and everything and, um, For a while. It seemed like that was working. And then it hit a point in early spring that it just started, you know, killing everything on his body.
[00:19:57] Um, so [00:20:00] obviously we had to stop that treatment. Um, also at the same time we had, um, heard about a doctor Roger stoop who was coming from Switzerland. So the standard protocol. Of glioblastoma is you have surgery first, and then you do, um, chemo and radiation. So this whole protocol is technically called the stoop protocol.
[00:20:24] So he was the one that developed it and he was moving from, um, Austria, from Geneva to Chicago at Northwestern. So I contacted him in December hearing. He was coming and, um, David was basically his patient one here in the U S and it was closer for us, and it was easier for us to be up at Northwestern than it was to go back down to duke.
[00:20:53] Um, and I think both universities are great. They both have brain [00:21:00] tumor centers and Northwestern was really pushing to try to build their brain tumor center. So that was a big deal to have him come here. But the difference was just, he treated him as a human, you know, he saw, we had a notebook with all the pictures of the kids and then the picture of the whole family from prior to him being sick.
[00:21:22] And he said, let me see that. And he took it when he looked at it and he goes, this guy. I want you to be this guy, and that's my goal. I want you to be this guy again. So, um, that's huge 
[00:21:33] Vince: [00:21:33] now. Not all doctors are like that. That's great. And I will say real quick sidebar. So we kind of glossed over this. Um, they have triplets, so I have a set of twins.
[00:21:44] Your, you have a set of twins still baking, um, that she, they went up to say it. They had triplets. How old, how old were the triplets at 
[00:21:53] Julie: [00:21:53] 10 years old? Yeah. So it's been a [00:22:00] challenge for them. And honestly, I'm so thankful they have each other going through it together. Um, so, and they're just amazing kids. And that was, that was really his main purpose in his fight was to be there for those kids.
[00:22:17] He just wanted to be there for, for us as much as possible and as long as possible. So, um, you know, unfortunately, He, he had another surgery so that the cancer was coming back. We ended up doing more treatment after, um, his treating the skin. He had another surgery for the tumor that had developed at Northwestern and they removed again, most of it, 95, 96% of it.
[00:22:51] And he was doing amazing. I mean, they transferred him right to the ability lab in Chicago, where he was doing physical [00:23:00] therapy. He was doing things I hadn't seen him do in years. Like running backwards, going up the stairs backwards, doing the karaoke moves, just. He was feeling good, looking good, everything was amazing.
[00:23:15] Um, and unfortunately in the middle of the night, while he was there, they called me that, um, he had had a stroke and it was a tiny little blood vessel, like the size of one in your eye that, um, burst in the back of his brain. And, um, he was paralyzed on his right side and had speech aphasia. So couldn't really speak.
[00:23:40] So he had lost everything. All that, that he had gained was now worse. Um, and really at that point, so that was an October of 2017. Um, he came back home after therapy and tried to continue [00:24:00] therapy here, outpatient. And, um, he ended up passing away December 30th of that year. So it was a quick. Two months.
[00:24:10] Yeah. Of, um, being home after that and really in talking to Dr. Soup. After the fact I said the tumor, but we took the tumor out and he said, you know what? At that point he couldn't talk, he couldn't move, he couldn't speak sometimes cancer patients. You just, you know, lose your wealth. He couldn't be the person he wanted to be.
[00:24:35] It may not have been the, it was the cancer that ultimately killed him, but, um, he couldn't be the person he wanted to be and, and, um, and passed on. And December, 
[00:24:48] Vince: [00:24:48] sorry, vivid. Really remember our last visit with Dave was, uh, prior to Christmas, I don't remember the exact day, but call it mid December. Um, [00:25:00] And he was in hospice care at that point in time.
[00:25:02] And, and he was, I mean, he couldn't really communicate, uh, then we, we knew he, he could still hear us, um, understand and understand. Right. Cause I also vividly remember. Uh, another good buddy of ours was staying with him and would keep like his, one of his feet was exposed, you know, figuring out his foot's probably it's just tells her cold.
[00:25:27] Right. So I'll take a blanket put over and all of a sudden, like 30 seconds later, you'd be reading something or whatever, and he'd look up and like, it's uncovered again. It was like, oh, that happened. Yeah. Covered it back up. Two months go by uncovered again. It's like, okay, wait, what the hell is 
[00:25:41] Julie: [00:25:41] going on?
[00:25:42] Well, he never slept with his feet covered. Yeah, it was 
[00:25:46] Daniel: [00:25:46] crazy. Like how, 
[00:25:46] Vince: [00:25:46] like somehow the ma it still works something still working. Cause it's, he's kicking it off the blanket off somehow. Um, and the, the one thing I remember is, uh, so coming back when, [00:26:00] when David passed, uh, two, two of his closest buddies out of our group, but with him.
[00:26:06] Um, I was at the night before, maybe two nights before, and it was the middle of the night or something and they were talking and I can't, I don't remember what they were talking about. Some, something that happened in the past some memory and they were talking about it. And Dave. Like laughed or chuckled or did, did something like where he actually physically showed a reaction and you just knew right then and there, like he was, he was saving that for that particular moment.
[00:26:35] Yeah. And that fricking cool. It's not, it's taken me a while to be able to, to talk about it. Um, but that wow. It was, 
[00:26:42] Julie: [00:26:42] yeah, it was a good one. As much as he couldn't communicate, he still could. He still had a way of communicating and just even. Just even through his eyes, you know, he could communicate, 
[00:26:54] Vince: [00:26:54] I will back up what Julie said.
[00:26:57] Having unfortunately watched this all [00:27:00] transpire, which is, you know, that's what helps fuel continues to fuel our fire, to keep doing what we're doing is watching someone go through as knowing that there's nothing. I mean, you always say, well, what can I do to help? The one thing we all want? I, oh, here's this magic pill.
[00:27:13] It'll make everything better, like or helpless. Um, What the treatments and whatnot he went through. And I know it's, it's just part of it, but literally he went through freaking hell. Yeah. Um, I mean, I had some bad moments, but it was nothing I can't compare, um, to the things that he went through and, and, and I think what to Dave's point.
[00:27:36] Yeah. Give it to me. Give, give me whatever you can, for two reasons. One hope, maybe I'm lucky. Maybe I'm the one that turns the corner for two. God forbid if I'm not, but maybe you guys learned something from this to help. The next day drew down the road. Yeah. Um, exactly. And that's 
[00:27:53] Julie: [00:27:53] exactly, he would say if it could save somebody else's dad.
[00:27:56] Yeah. 
[00:27:59] Vince: [00:27:59] Yep. So those [00:28:00] times sucked for sure. Um, that's why we keep pressing on and trying to do what we can do. Um, but unfortunately the story doesn't end there does it. 
[00:28:09] Julie: [00:28:09] No, we haven't had a very simple, um, life. No, no. So would expand on that for us. Right. So, um, So he passed in December, almost the end of the year, almost the last day, but then, um, in October of the following year.
[00:28:26] So just 10 months later, I was diagnosed with breast cancer. Wow. So actually stepped back to July. My mom was diagnosed with breast cancer and then a couple months later I was diagnosed. Um, 
[00:28:43] Daniel: [00:28:43] did, did it feel at that point, like you couldn't escape it kind 
[00:28:46] Julie: [00:28:46] of thing. It was like, You've got to be kidding me. I mean, that's the comment everybody said was you've it doesn't seem real.
[00:28:55] Yeah. 
[00:28:55] Vince: [00:28:55] I think the first time most of us heard it, like, this sounds weird, but like almost like, oh, [00:29:00] you're joking. Right? That's like, they would joke about that, but this can't be right. 
[00:29:04] Daniel: [00:29:04] Right. 
[00:29:04] Julie: [00:29:04] It was, it was, you just keep piling it on. And we're a very faith-filled family, you know, we turned to God and, and our church and our.
[00:29:16] Church community and, and hold on to that faith. And you're like, what did I do wrong? What have I done wrong? How can you give this to me? How can I have this? You know, how can my kids go through this again? It was awful, awful. So my mom was diagnosed with, um, she was. ER PR positive and her two positive. So estrogen receptor, progesterone receptor, and, um, her too.
[00:29:47] And I was triple negative. So all of those were negative receptors. So we had completely different breast cancers, but breast cancer at the same time. And with my family up in Michigan and me [00:30:00] down here, my mom was getting treated the same day I was getting treated. So we couldn't even be together. Yeah.
[00:30:08] Getting our chemo treatment, because we were both going through it at the same time, which was so wrong in 
[00:30:14] Daniel: [00:30:14] itself, 
[00:30:14] Vince: [00:30:14] real negative aspect of not being able to be together. It was horrible, but, well, there are some, maybe silver lining going through the process together. You can certainly lean on each other and each other's sounding board.
[00:30:25] Yeah. Perhaps 
[00:30:26] Julie: [00:30:26] going through the similar thing. Yeah. Yeah, definitely. 
[00:30:30] Vince: [00:30:30] How different wore her was her treatment protocol from 
[00:30:34] Julie: [00:30:34] yours. So, um, She was post-menopause so she just did a lumpectomy. And then, um, I think she did her chemo for, or chemo first. I want to say. No, no, no. I did the chemo first. She did her surgery first and then did chemo where with [00:31:00] me, uh, they wanted to take the tumor first and I did a bilateral mastectomy and then I started chemo after that.
[00:31:08] Okay. So, um, I think with triple negative, it gets treated differently than triple positive. So usually they do surgery. Um, or chemo first for triple negative, just to see if it even responds to the chemo because triple negative sometimes because it doesn't have those hormonal receptors, doesn't always respond, um, to the chemo treatment.
[00:31:34] Okay. And thankfully mine responded really well fairly quickly. So it was virtually, um, gone at that point and, um, um, Had surgery after that and removed everything. So then after surgery, I, um, had radiation six rounds of [00:32:00] radiation where my mom also did radiation as well. Um, so pretty much a similar protocol just in, um, different cocktail.
[00:32:09] Yeah. And, um, different order. Yeah. So, but, um, you know, it, looking back, I was still doing Pilates up until my fifth round and of chemo and tried to stay active and busy as much as I could. And, uh, just be a regular mom, you know, because my kids were still grieving and still, and scared to death, really scared to 
[00:32:38] Vince: [00:32:38] death.
[00:32:40] To the extent that you can, what, what was going through their minds at that point in time? I can only imagine. Yeah, 
[00:32:45] Julie: [00:32:45] just, I just fear just huge fear 
[00:32:50] Vince: [00:32:50] and I'm sure in having three and there, I mean, while they're triplets and have a lot of similarities, there are different people. They probably reacted 
[00:32:58] Daniel: [00:32:58] different 
[00:32:58] Julie: [00:32:58] ways.
[00:32:58] It's completely different. [00:33:00] One of my daughters would talk a lot about it and ask me a lot of questions. And I think the other two were, um, More quiet. You know, it was good that I had one talking, so then the other ones would listen, but not necessarily ask the questions. Um, but they could hear, my sister had also had breast cancer when she was 28.
[00:33:21] So about six years before. My diagnosis, she had breast cancer. And so I, and she's doing well and doing great and it hasn't come back. So I was able to tell them, look what you saw Katie, go through. That's what I'm going to go through. And I'm going to be fine. And you know, we're going to get through this and I'm going to be fine.
[00:33:42] And I think that was the most important, just so they knew that, you know, I wasn't. I was still going to be here for them. Right. That goes 
[00:33:51] Vince: [00:33:51] back to that attitude thing we've been talking about. Yeah. Well, whether it's, yeah. You know, you're telling yourself that, or at least conveying that to others, it's all part of the process.
[00:34:00] [00:34:00] Um, we were talking about earlier that, you know, it sounds cheesy, but that the attitude aspect is as huge. 
[00:34:06] Julie: [00:34:06] It is huge. It's the hope and it's the attitude that you're going to beat it. And, um, I think you have to have both the fight and the hope. 
[00:34:18] Vince: [00:34:18] Yep. Agreed. Uh, we did have some, some baldhead comparisons during that time.
[00:34:23] Not exactly. She was, she wasn't real thrilled about it, but we did, 
[00:34:27] Julie: [00:34:27] it was cold. I didn't realize how cold it is to not have hair and yeah. In the shower, it's freezing. Like you want to wear a shower cap because it's so cold. You probably don't even realize that now. I don't know, but I would sleep with a little beams, even though 
[00:34:43] Vince: [00:34:43] I could cut my hair this morning.
[00:34:45] No. No. Okay. 
[00:34:48] Daniel: [00:34:48] Missed 
[00:34:48] Julie: [00:34:48] that one. Let's see. I remember Vinny with hair with hair. 
[00:34:52] Vince: [00:34:52] Does this is true. True story. Yeah. And now here's the, here's a funny story. Real quick sidebar. Uh, [00:35:00] at one point when our kids were younger, um, they put the video tape of our wedding in and they looked at it and they see me up there with hairs, like, wait, why is it called Joe 
[00:35:09] Daniel: [00:35:09] Lou?
[00:35:13] Julie: [00:35:13] That's cute. 
[00:35:15] Vince: [00:35:15] And then, and then at one point, one of them actually hit the record button on that videotape. So there's now our wedding video that has a two minute section of. Like the wiggles or some cartoon or something. 
[00:35:29] Julie: [00:35:29] Yeah, 
[00:35:30] Vince: [00:35:30] that's cute. I thought 
[00:35:31] Daniel: [00:35:31] sunny wasn't have a hard time. It takes you out of the moment when you're rewatching, you know, the, the wedding exactly.
[00:35:38] Julie: [00:35:38] The wiggles, right? 
[00:35:40] Vince: [00:35:40] Yeah. What time, what was the date when you were finished with treatment and, and at that point considered cancer-free 
[00:35:49] Julie: [00:35:49] so finished with treatment July of, um, I don't even remember, uh, 29, 19. 
[00:35:58] Vince: [00:35:58] Yeah. Diagnosed October [00:36:00] 18. 
[00:36:01] Julie: [00:36:01] Okay. And then I S I had my reconstruction planned for the first week of April 20, 20.
[00:36:10] I had to wait six months to recover. Yeah. Or after radiation. And so April 20, 20, everything got shut down March. It got shut down. So my surgery then I, I just had it last fall, um, in September. So kind of extended things a little bit, but yeah. Yeah, 
[00:36:32] Vince: [00:36:32] but our 12 year old high school, or sorry, 15 year old high school humor, we were trying to give suggestions 
[00:36:40] Julie: [00:36:40] and the 
[00:36:40] Vince: [00:36:40] reconstruction side.
[00:36:42] Yes. And it wasn't really 
[00:36:44] Daniel: [00:36:44] listened to, but it's not 
[00:36:48] Julie: [00:36:48] just saying. No. So, um, we didn't listen to the guys. No, 
[00:36:54] Vince: [00:36:54] no, no. I think the, the answer was you don't have to carry them around, 
[00:37:00] [00:36:59] Julie: [00:36:59] so no, not interested in that. That's too 
[00:37:03] Vince: [00:37:03] many DS.
[00:37:08] Julie: [00:37:08] Um, yeah, so I do have one more surgery as a touch up after the fact surgery to do, but, um, You know, at this point, I'm 
[00:37:18] Daniel: [00:37:18] not starting to get in the rear view 
[00:37:20] Julie: [00:37:20] mirror. I'm trying to, yeah. Yeah. 
[00:37:23] Vince: [00:37:23] So how, how would you say the kids are doing today? You 
[00:37:25] Julie: [00:37:25] know, I just talked to them this week. I was driving in the car with somebody they're teenagers now, freshmen in high school.
[00:37:32] Um, and I said, Just how lucky I am to have these three amazing kids. I mean, they're all a little bit like Dave in different senses, you know, a little bit of the humor. Yeah. Just, yeah. Um, and they're just awesome. They're amazing. And they're so, um, grateful, [00:38:00] um, humble, fun. Um, love each other. Usually love me sometimes, sometimes the door slams and it doesn't seem like it, but they're really just awesome kids that, um, have been through so much.
[00:38:17] And I just cannot say enough how proud of them. I am. I am with how well they're doing at this point with all that they've been through. Yeah. 
[00:38:27] Vince: [00:38:27] Well, I think that's a Testament to you guys as parents. Number one. Um, and to just that, I'm not gonna say it's particular to Indianapolis by any means, which is that community around you?
[00:38:40] Yeah. I mean, everyone comes in and supports however they can, whether it's simple stuff like leaving a thank you note or bringing over dinner to, Hey, I'm there, or, and down the road too, I mean, five years from now, your kids have an issue. And for whatever reason, some I can help out. Then call me I'm I'm [00:39:00] I'm in.
[00:39:00] Yeah, I think, I think we're all like that. Right? Um, this, this core group of friends and that's, that's what it comes down to is just having that support network to help out. And that's it. 
[00:39:09] Julie: [00:39:09] And that's what you realize in this time of tragedy is you realize how fortunate you are with the circle of family and friends that you have.
[00:39:17] Because so many people stepped in to do just the simplest of things. Um, You know, coming over and cleaning my house when I was at the hospital to going grocery shopping, to picking up kids, to keeping them overnight. Um, just so many things, even just sending me a card monthly from somebody that didn't even sign it.
[00:39:42] And it's just an inspirational card. I have no idea who sent it, but would get it monthly. Um, and just it's phenomenal, the outreach. And you really feel like. I don't know if you felt this way, but when you're going through your hardest times, [00:40:00] it's sometimes hard to pray. And that's why when people say I'll pray for you, it's great.
[00:40:06] Because sometimes I just would be so exhausted and so angry and so upset that I couldn't, I couldn't, and just those prayers would help lift you up and that support. So, um, I think that was really important. But even to this day, there are so many people that I would have never expected to reach out to who would in some form or fashion.
[00:40:31] Yeah. And it also tells you so much, um, you know, when Dave passed the number of people that showed up to his funeral and, um, visitation, do you remember? It was freezing like negative degrees in January and. We ended up having it in my kid's school gym, because I didn't want anybody to wait outside at one of the funeral homes.
[00:40:55] So we had it in the gym and all of these friends set [00:41:00] up the gym. So it didn't look like a gym, you know, for him to be their friends brought Oriental rugs, and Sullivan's brought trucks of Christmas trees and lined up the walls. And, um, I mean the flowers, it was just. Beautiful. It really was the drape, you know, draperies.
[00:41:21] It was beautiful. Um, so you didn't feel like you were in a gym, but, and all of this happened without me being part of it. You know, I think Cindy was instrumental in that in helping in organizing that. So, yeah, it was amazing. But also with all those people that show up, I tell my kids this year legacy is, is how you make people feel.
[00:41:47] Right. So if, if you're kind and you're nice and you're friendly and you're fun that tells other people, you know, that they're important and that [00:42:00] you enjoy being with them and just that impact and everybody else, um, of just the simple smile or working with them, um, Is so important because everybody walking through would say, he said this to me, or he was so nice to me or he made me laugh or he did this and that.
[00:42:21] And that's your legacy. It's how people remember you and how you make people feel. Yeah. That's so important. And you don't even realize, you know, your day to day, how important that is 
[00:42:33] Vince: [00:42:33] well said. Yeah. So remember that Daniel Sowell, I will. Uh, it's almost bad Indy 
[00:42:41] Julie: [00:42:41] anyway. Oh, we do. We do. So, um, my husband's family, they're big race fans.
[00:42:50] Um, the family, I think, has been going since the beginning. They've had tickets for where. Probably a hundred years. [00:43:00] Um, and so usually family comes from all over the country for race weekend. This year, we have a smaller crew, but we are going. Yeah, we have the best lined up and, and, um, the bus bus, we always get a bus and head down, everybody piles in and tailgates.
[00:43:21] And, um, yeah, it's a great weekend. It's bigger than Christmas for the, for his family. 
[00:43:29] Vince: [00:43:29] Yeah, I like that answer. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. 
[00:43:33] Julie: [00:43:33] So that the texts have already started. The text chain of yes. So that was one really awesome thing is Dave was able to take my son Davis to his first race. Okay. Um, before he was, um, sick.
[00:43:49] So yeah, and my girls have now been going for the past couple of years while they didn't go last year, but I think they went for two years prior to that.
[00:44:00] [00:44:00] Uh, They do. They enjoy the excitement of it and they like being there with everybody. Um, you know, so they like the first 10 minutes in the last 10 minutes, but sounds familiar. Yes, but they wouldn't miss it. They really wouldn't miss it. Yeah. Good. 
[00:44:18] Vince: [00:44:18] Yeah. So let me ask you this, um, going or having gone through what you've gone through, uh, on both sides personally, and with Dave, um, When you talk to someone else who's in a somewhat similar situation, either, you know, separately.
[00:44:36] Um, what, what do you feel like you want to share with them?
[00:44:43] Julie: [00:44:43] That's hard because you don't want to give fear and, you know, we've had both sides of it, where it was terminal and where I'm I've recovered. So, 
[00:44:55] Vince: [00:44:55] and would your messaging be different if they're a caregiver versus a patient? 
[00:45:00] [00:44:59] Julie: [00:44:59] Yes, it's very hard to be a caregiver. You don't realize how hard that is.
[00:45:04] Physically, emotionally, spiritually. Yeah. Very difficult. Um, you know, hope, hope is the biggest thing. Either way, whether you're the caregiver or the patient, just to hold onto hope and fight and, um, Have a strong connection with your family and God and, um, whatever, um, God or spiritual being that makes you feel good.
[00:45:36] You know, you just have to take it day by day, really too. And I remember, um, my sixth round of chemo, I thought. I can't do this again. If I have to do this one more time, I don't think I can do this, but you can't, you take a few more weeks and you start to get better again [00:46:00] and you do it one more time. So, um, you just have to take it day by day.
[00:46:05] Right on each day is different. Um, And with Dave, you know, sometimes we would have glimmers of the old Dave, you know, and sometimes we didn't, but you just hold on to those little glimpses of the good, the good in everybody and the good times. And when you feel good, you take advantage of those days. Right?
[00:46:29] Vince: [00:46:29] Well, We appreciate you sharing your stories. Thank you. Many people have that, especially at our youngest. I know. 
[00:46:38] Julie: [00:46:38] Um, I wish it were 
[00:46:39] Vince: [00:46:39] different. So do I. But, uh, again, thank you for, for coming in and telling us about the stories and sharing that with us and, and all of our viewers. And, um, as, as always, we're here for you.
[00:46:53] We love you, let us know how we can continue to be there. Thanks. 
[00:46:57] Daniel: [00:46:57] Thank you. [00:47:00]