Twenty years ago, IVAClar introduced IPS EMAC Barbara: Twenty years ago, IVAClar introduced IPS EMAC. And we all know how that has turned out. Hi, Voices, of the Ventures. Barb Warner here and I would like to personally invite you to IACLAR'IPS Emacs panel discussion which is on Friday, February 22nd, starting at 3:00 at the LMT Lab Day in Chicago. I will be joined on stage with Jessica Barrell, Stephanie Goddard, Mike Roberts, Jed Archibald, and Dr. Ken Malamn as we dive into the world of vmax. After the panel discussion, Ivaclar will be hosting a happy hour to commemorate this 20 year milestone. So amazing. So. So please join us by registering@labdday.com IVACLAR and I cannot wait to see everybody in Chicago. Elvis: Welcome to Voices from the Bench, a dental laboratory podcast. Send us an email at info, voicesfrohebench.com and follow us on Facebook and Instagram. This is the recording before we go to Vegas for Vision 21 Greetings and welcome to episode 356, Voices from the Bench. My name is Elvis. Barbara: And my name is Vegas. Elvis: What's up? Vegas, how are you? You're sounding good. You're sounding healthier than last week, but. Barbara: It'S the recording before we go to Vegas, so I just thought that would be appropriate. I'm good. Elvis: Yeah. So even though this comes out the day after the big Vision 21 meeting, E. fortunately, unfortunately, I don't know how you want to look at it, but we're actually recording this before either. Barbara: One of us is left and we might not bake it back, so who knows? Elvis: That's true. Barbara: You know that's true. Elvis: This could be our last episode. But let me tell you, we'd like to knock these out before these shows. I mean, we'd love to talk about the event right after, but seriously, I don't know about you. I get back what, like midnight on Saturday? When do you come? yeah, I don't want to spend my Sunday getting this ready. Speaker C: So. Elvis: Right then you get the before vision talk, but after the vision you get. Barbara: The Before Barbara's grilling and burning her meat talk, and Elvis, is chilling in 14 degree weather talk. Elvis: So, yeah, I'm 14 and you're. You're outside grilling cr. There's got to be a balance somewhere. Barbara: There's not. There's not. This week we talk all about burs, those little metal things Elvis: this week we actually get to talk all about burs. Barbara: I know and I loved it. Elvis: So you know those little metal things that are usually scattered all around your bench or they're neatly organized in a carrier? You're one way or the other. What do you do Barb? Were they all over the place? Barbara: No, I'm like that technician that only needs like three or four and I can guess. I don't need like 20. I've got my three, I've got my four and I kick with all four. So they're all in front of me a little bit. all over the place. Elvis: Have they been the same shape and size and everything forever? Barbara: I know, really? Elvis: Have you ever tried a different one? Barbara: My son has introduced me to several different, wheels and diamond. So yes. Elvis: So you are willing to branch out? Barbara: I have come to the party a little bit, Yes, a little bit. Elvis: I'm one of those people that have. I think I have a collection of about 20 birdss. They're all thrown in a big crown box and I'll mention on this recording, but I just grab whatever looks fancy. Barbara: I know you do. I think that's awesome. Yeah, it probably works for you though, you know? Elvis: Yeah, sometimes. There's actually a lot of companies that make burrs, but did you know that the first company to make them back in 1844 is still making them today? Barbara: I love that. 1844. Like, hello, yeah. Elvis: This had to have been turned by hand in 1844. Is that how that workede? Speaker C: Sure. Elvis: Like a pedal maybe, yeah. Nick Noito is on a mission to reduce remix in all labs But this week we're joined by Nick Noito, he's from SS White. Barbara: Oh, good job on the name. Good job on the name. Elvis: You either love their burrs or you've heard of them and you just don't know that you love their burrs. So Nick comes from a medical background, but he spent a fair amount of time learning the lab industry with the NDX group. He was pivotal in creating a sales team that didn't just do sales, but understood what the technicians were doing and how they related to the clinical team. Now that he's with SS White, Nick is on a mission to reduce remix in all labs. Now, it's not an easy feat for sure, but he and SS White see the benefit of teaching doctors the correct way with the correct tool to create a better prepice. And he wants to do it through the labs so we actually look like the heroes. It's a great conversation about the history of burrs and how the right burr for the right job can make all the difference. So join us as we chat with Nick Nodo. Voices from the Bench. The interview. Elvis: SS White Dental sends us some great people to talk to Barb and I are super excited today to talk to someone from SS White Dental. Now, now this is a name I've heard a lot about. I think it Was Dave Avery again, I think, he's our new manager here, sending us some great people to talk to. I think I met you in Florida, didn't I? Speaker C: Correct. Yes. We met at the Florida Dental show in Orlando. Elvis: Yeah. Nick Noedo. How are you, sir? Speaker C: I'm, doing fantastic, Elvis. Happy Friday to you and Barba. Barbara: Good pronunciation, Elvis. Well done. Elvis: Yeah. Yeah. A little bit of practice before, but, you know, it's very rare that I get them right. Barbara: Rare. Prior to being here at SS White, I spent some time at National Dentte Elvis: So, honestly, Nick, I don't know a lot about SS White, which makes this conversation a little bit more interesting to me. So before we get into what that is, where do you come from? Do you have a dental background? Speaker C: I actually do have a little dental background. Prior to being here at SS White, I spent some time over at National Dentte. Elvis: Oh, okay. Speaker C: There I was, based out of Florida and really concentrated on growing the commercial sales and marketing efforts for the organization. Barbara: Yep. So were you over by me, like, Tampa, Clearwater? Speaker C: I was based in Orlando at first, and then I moved down to the Palm Beach Gardens area. Barbara: Wow. Okay. Speaker C: Which is where they're headquartered out of, so. But ran the whole southeast at first, with a small sales team and really just helped them build that over the last eight years. Barbara: So were you in sales when you found National Dentte or they found you? Speaker C: I was. So that was my first stent in really, the dental space. Prior to that, most of my career I spent in the medical device world, selling everything from. Or instrumentation. I really got into some cool specialty stuff. I was a sales guy carrying a bag in the beginning, but we called it CH in cases. But you would basically have, to support every single case that you had a device for. And I ran all around Florida for quite a while until I got into the management side of things. Elvis: So what like a surgeon would say, like, I'm doing something. I need something. You'd run it over. Speaker C: Yeah. So initially it was all the OR instrumentation for your general and specialty surgeons. So every stainless steel instrument they used use on the back table had to come out of serrile processing and be ready to go the day before the case. then if it was a new device that they weren't used to, you'd go and support it. really just answer any questions that they had. That. Then I got into more specialty stuff that dealt with the spinal implants and some stuff for cancer patients that was a specific device. And the need for education, not only in the or, but once the patient got out to the floor, was tremendous. So I spent A lot of time just making sure the case and the procedure went well. And then once the patient's out there, whether they stay inatient or go to a hospice care, like, how do you use the device going forward? So it was probably some of the best training I could have ever had. People were like, hey, did you have a medical background or you a doctor? And I'm like, no, I just got taught by a bunch of engineers on how to use the product and the do's and don'ts of it. Right? Yeah. My job is to help you understand it. Elvis: So that's funny because a lot of technicians, people like, are you a dentist? Because you know so much, I'm like, no, just live it, just do it every day. Barbara: I make teeth. Speaker C: That's how it goes. I know, but it was a lot of fun. I did that for a while, got into management, worked for some big Fortune 500 companies like Cardinal Health is where I started my career. Oh yeah. Then M jumped over to, ah, carve out of J and J for women's Healthcare. And then from there I jumped over to National Dentehs. So this is actually only my fourth big job, which is kind of interesting. You don't see that often, but I like to say I stay where I'm at for a while until I really impact the business to the point where it's time for a new challenge, which is really how I got in the dental. Right. The whole ndx. I know you guys probably know that much better than I do, or at least I've heard things about it. But it was a pretty exciting challenge to go over there and help grow it to where it's at today, which was a complete project, if you will. And, just to be part of that team, I learned a bunch about labs, the passion behind it from the technician's perspective, but also what it takes to actually sell that. Right? Easy to say, hey, buy my lab service or use our lab, and here's why. And we've got 5,000 other labs to compete with, so. Elvis: Sure. Y. Y. came from medical to dental lab world What took you over there? Did you seek it out or. Speaker C: So I was fortunate enough to work with a group of guys really from my initial career at Cardinal that I knew and stayed in contact with over the years. They were the ones that came over. And it was the former CEO, I guess, two CEOs ago, who said, hey, look, I need some help kind of making this thing, a little bit bigger and building it out. So I said, what is it? And he said, national Dentist. I'm like, what Is that I really. I didn't know much about it. I'm like, what do you mean? They make teeth? Elvis: Yeah. Speaker C: So I went to a lab and I was blown away. I really was. That was where I was born into. Elvis: The dental lab world when you came from medical. And I'm coming from the perspective that I've never seen the medical side, but I always figured it was a lot more sterile than a lab, dental lab, so. Speaker C: Absolutely. Elvis: Was that, like, shocking to you? Kind of, that difference? Barbara: We're sterile. Elvis: Medical device. We're sterile, but you know what I mean. Speaker C: Yeah. Y. Yes and no. I mean, I, Yeah. I think the pressures of the O or to operate, the whole workflow of an O or is pretty insane. But, yeah. Sterile. Mean, I had a line I had to stand behind. Everything was obviously completely sterile. And it would have a little laser pointer to point. I'd have to literally point the technician step by step on how to put the device together. We had a spinal cement that you'd have to mix up. Right. So how much monomer and polmer add to it? Elvis: Spinal crazy. Speaker C: Yeah. Y. Elvis: No. that's a lot of pressure. Speaker C: I was pleasantly surprised when I came over the dental lab at how much more relaxed the environment was. Barbara: Yeah. Elvis: That's why I like it. Speaker C: Yeah. The tensions are super high in. Are. Especially when the surgeons walk in, depending on which surgeon it is and how their day is going. Elvis: sure. Speaker C: That's the whole tone. And everyone in there is like, on eggshells for the most part. Elvis: But it's good to know that or surgeons and dental surgeons are in that same kind of, personality areax. Yes. They set the tone for everything. Speaker C: Yeah. Very similar to, like, watching implants put in. Right. Or watching a full arch case with a oral surgeon. Barbara: Yeah. Speaker C: So from that point, I felt very comfortable. Speaker C: But, yeah, it's a little different. Elvis: I bet you fit right in there. Speaker C: Yeah. National Dentte wanted your help growing their customer service team to over 100 Barbara: So then you rolled over to National Dentte, and then you said that they wanted your help making them larger. So what was your role there? Speaker C: So I started off as a regional sales director, primarily focusksing in the Southeast. That's what it called it. I, Even though went from Florida to New Jersey. Elvis: Is this before they bought DSG or meergsg acquisition? Yeah. Yeah. Speaker C: So they had about, It was probably 30 or so customer service. I don't think they were called customer service. They were basically patient liaiaisons, if you will. They didn't really do a lot of what I call hunting or, like, looking for New business. It was just more managing day to day operations. Right. Communication with the customer or really the dentist or the office. Which is probably the number one pain point I quickly realized is the breakdown of communication. Yeah, but they were just helping the lab function, you know, schedule cases and all that fun stuff that comes along. Elvis: With it called stay in a afloat. Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. It's just exactly the whole day to day lab. Or I always say, and I shouldn't you guys probably laugh at it, but it's almost like organized chaos. Right. Everything functional's defin. Barbara: It's not like organized. It's organized. Especially in December. Speaker C: Yes, I know. Always Elvis and I were just talking to that prior to the call a crunch. But they weren't doing a lot of like looking for new business. Sor of speak. So the idea was, hey, can we go with additional headcount, can we go try to grow our current book of business, which I think every lab tries to do, has an initial investment of growing out a team of know 30 people to over 100. Barbara: Wow. Speaker C: So you got to hire them, you gotta train them. Right. The whole reason I got into sales is because my last lab had no dental background What's a dental lab? Kind of the same thing we're talking about. And initially it was a focus of a salesperson. And that sounds good if you're trying to grow sales. But I quickly saw that it wasn't really the salesperson you need. You need someone that knew the space, knew the anatomy and really understood the day to day. So I took it upon myself. I think it was the first one to say, hey, I think I want to go after some like dental, assistance or maybe some hygienists. If somebody knows how to make a temporary crown or just helps manage the flow of cases in and out of the office, they probably make a pretty good dental rep even though they don't know how to sell. Barbara: Yeah, that's a really great point and totally true. Speaker C: Every time I walked an office, the doctor would say so do you have a dental background? And it really wasn't comfortable at first when I would say, no, I don't. I came from the medical space, but. Barbara: I've seen spinal glue. Speaker C: Yeah, exactly. So once we pivoted to the technicians and the assistants, I think that's where we started to get some quicker lift. although their day to day change. Right. They're used to go an office every day, seven to threeock, seven to four, Fridays are off. And now you're in a sales role with a sales quota and you have a car you gotta drive all around the territor with. So I'm like, look, I could probably teach you the day to day managing your time, but for me to teach you the anatomy and be comfortable in a dental office or sitting chairside would be a tremendous amount of lift that I don't think we have the time to do. So we pivoted and we brought a lot of dental, folks on, which helped. And I think you see probably a lot of labs that joined that as well. Or, you know, I didn't invent it. I probably took it from other folks. It just felt like a better fit. You they would go in whether they were from that area, they knew other people. It was just an easier conversation. And the whole, you know, feeling like a trusted advisor, I think was. Barbara: Yeah. Speaker C: Was effortless. Elvis: The whole reason I kind of got into sales is because my last lab, we hired a salesperson that had no dental background. And every time they stop somewhere, her one answer was, yeah, give Elvis a call, he'll help. Or, yeah, I'm not sure, but let's call Tac Elvis. And eventually it's like, I'm just gonna do this myself'so. Speaker C: Funny. Yeahus. I mean, it's like a deer in headlights, right? You're like, I have no idea. Like, what do you mean the crown doesn't fit? Like, okay, let me call the lab and see. Elvis: Yeah, they don't need someone to tell them what the price is. That's written down. Speaker C: it was funny, but I really learned a ton about the dental, I bet space. But to me it was like, okay, we're gonna sell X amount more crowns this year. This is the goal. And I'm like, okay, well, a crown's a crown. A denture is not a denture. I guess you could say it is. But, like, what makes one better than the other? So, sure. I'm not the type of guy that says, yeah, I can just do something unless I actually do it. and I don't expect others to do that. So I'm like, all right, we're all gonna go to the lab. We're gonna spend a couple weeks in a lab, we're gonna make a crown or try to make a crown and really put our hands on it. To say, here's the difference on, you know, why this lab may make a more setic crown than this lab and talk to the talent of the team. And to me, it was really, wow, what are they doing? First off, this is crazy. I've never seen it, but holy cow, the amount of work and time that goes into it is Mind blowing. But then I saw the whole level of, like, passion and dedication, and to me, I'm like, boom. That's what I really need to explain to the doctor, why he should try this lab and why Barb S. Barb, right. she's known for everything she does. And let me tell you a little bit more about her. So as weird as it was, like, hey, we're gonna grow, make the company bigger. It was just, let's showcase the T of that lab and no specific technicians and make it that much louder. And then from there, I think the doctor was like, fine, I'll give you a shot as long as you deliver what you say you're gonna deliver. Elvis: that's the key. Speaker C: And again, I don't care if you're a dental technician selling it or an assistant or a hygienist. If it doesn't fit, for whatever reason, it doesn't fit. It's the same outcome, which is, like, that painful. O. you know, or we missed. We missed the deadline. I'm sorry, the case is not there and the patient's there. oh, like, let me figure out what just happened. Our view is, look, let's be as ahead of it as we can. And I hate to use the word babysit, but let's babysit the process as best as we can to ensure the patient has the best experience possible. And then the doctor's like, okay, you deliver on what you said here, I'll give you another case. Or, you know, if you're lucky, I'll give you an implant. Or here, take all my denture cases. And the lab would hate us. They're like, I hate denture. But a slow. It was a slow build up. But again, I told the team, I'm like, look, you can't just go sell this unless you know what you're talking about. you understand the pain points of the business, but know your lab, like, know your technicians. And I always said this, never to the technicians. I'll say to you too, but if you go out of your way for your technicians, they'll go out of the way for you. And if it's, that last minute, hurry up and need it done by tomorrow or whatever the day brings. They'll do it for you if you treat them with the utmost respect and truly take it upon yourself to understand what they do. don't say you understand it. Don't just go to the lab for a week and never show up. Or don't communicate and expect all this, like, truly understand it. And that was the fun part, because I could see who took that upon themselves and who didn't. Understanding why an impression doesn't fit was probably our biggest pain point And the ones that did, did very, very well. They're still there, right? They get along with their labs extremely well, and they just become part of the family. That's really what it is at the end of the day, it's just a small, small family that wants to deliver the best product they can to the end user. Elvis: So that speaks so much truth. Barbara: Yeah, he's like, hitting every single one of my pressure points. And the. Love it. It really sounds like you understand, and you went out of your way to go in and really get to know the lab and everybody in the lab, which I've never seen personally, a salesperson do or somebody in that role. Speaker C: That was my only way. I mean, I couldn't. I couldn't take another approach or even try to b'my way through it, so. But again, if you asked me specifically why this crown doesn't fit, I'd probably still struggle and have to call you or Elvis. But I could talk through it enough to say we missed the mark somewhere. a lot of the time. That was. That was probably our biggest pain point. Right? It doesn't fit. For whatever reason, forget being late or not even getting there sometimes, it just didn't, you know, the patient didn't like it. I'm like, okay, can we. Can we try to drive to root cause of what happened? And again, maybe you guys see this and you would agree or disagree, but we spent a ton of time on understanding different PV materials. Right. The applicator they use, is it the right applicator? What kind of trade did they use? Who took the impression? How long did the impression sit there? If you're in Florida and it's 95 degrees out, we pick it up that day. Did it sit? And by the time the lab got it, I remember walking in probably the first month I was there, and I had a couple, impressions in a plastic bag, because that's what they gave it to me. And I remember the general manager of the lab just Nadia his said no. And I'm like, what do you mean, no? And he's like, I don't want it. I'm like, you don't want what? He's like, it was a new doctor, right? He was all excited, like, hey, we got you a new doctor. And, yeah, I don't want it. He's. It's a garbage impression. He's like, I can see from here. He's like, look at all the tears. On it. I was probably 20ft away and I'm like how did you see that already? This is crazy. So again I'm like show me what you're looking at. Like what. What caused thatuse? Not that we spent time helping educate on proper impression taking techniques, but there is a technique to it. But understanding why they couldn't see the margin because of the impression or the poor quality of it and being able to articulate that back to the doctor was probably the hardest thing. And I'm still struggle unless I was sitting at a lab every day, I can really own it. I could talk to it a little bit. But the doctor I think appreciated when you said okay, I didn't realize that or maybe that assistant need some additional training, whatever the case was. So it was that for a long time. And then all of a sudden you got the big iOS boom. So I was there from 202016 to 2024. So I felt like w oh yeah. Barbara: You saw amount of time y yeah. Speaker C: I felt like the itero boom and everyone else that followed was great. Everyone. Oh, I'm gonna go jump to digital technology and this isnna make everything great and reduce my remakes everything. Elvis: Different problems. Speaker C: Totally right. The kind same problem just we can't see it on the image now versus the digitized image that we got. So we spent a ton of time with trainers, right? We'd sit chairside and help with technique on proper scanning techniques. So you didn't miss certain anatomy. Forget the prep. At this point we're just talking like adjacent anatomy. Right. To pile togethereah. So that was fun. And then still, I mean sometimes we had challenging, very challenging cases incoming. Especially when we looked at the higher production offices and the larger DSOs it was just like oh my gosh, how did we get to the bottom of this? Because the crown didn't fit. It was the latest best scanner on the market. But it still is the same issue that we were having prior. And I just thought this is the lab industry, right? This is what we do and this is how it goes. I don't know if there's a magic solution to fix it. So I come to SS White and I m honestly was like, yeah, I've heard the name. Don't know much about the whole rotary category which we'll get to. But ye. Yeah. Ah, it totally put a different perspective on gosh, we might be able to help address that market or that pain point a little bit differently. Just thinking about crown preps and what is the dentist using for the Crown prep and what is their technique? What do they know about crown preps? What does the lab really need? What does a technician wanna yell at me cause I brought a bad impression and what is he really complaining about? And how do I articulate that back out? But it just boils back to optimal crown prep. Right. I'm on the mission to reduce remakes is what I feel And having enough clearance and enough space to do whatever it is whether it's a bridge or a crown. And that's kind of where I'm at now. It's a fun little journey. So I'm on the mission. I'm on the mission to try to reduce remakes is what I feel. Elvis: Single handedly you got this man. We need you out there doing figure out. Speaker C: I'LET you guys know. SS White is the oldest rotary company out there Barbara: so segue into SS White. Elvis: Yeah. Barbara: So tell us all about the company. I not I'm familiar with it but you know, give us a little background. Speaker C: Yeah. So it's the oldest rotary company out there. This is actually believe it or not they' 108th old 180. Yes. Barbara: I didn't even know dental technology was that old. Speaker C: That't they were the first to invent the carbide burr back in m. Back in 1844. Elvis: Sure wasn't made out of stone or something. Speaker C: Yeah, yeah. We've got stories we could have a whole history on it. But they actually believe it or not, they wrote the nomenclature for all of the burrs. Right. Whether it's carbide diamonds, everything you see today, from a friction grip to just a handpiece spur, whether it's a 557 or all that you see they actually wrote back in the day and submitted to. Right. I believe now is the ada. Barbara: You're kidding me. Speaker C: Yeah. Barbara: That's so fascinating. Speaker C: Pretty tremendous history at the company. So it was a family owned business but basede out of New Jersey. Got about 150 technicians who basically do all the milling on these carbides and diamonds and polishers. We have a pretty robust funnel of current products. Right. If you need something you. Whether it's polishers diamonds or if you're a dentist and you're trying to access zirconia with some of the best, highest quality burrs out there that just helps them get the job done faster and easier. it's funny, I came here thinking, okay, I don't know much about this rotary space but let me kind of run Nick's playbook which is let me spend some time with these technicians and understand how a carbide made and what makes one better than the other. And what is a din. Barbara: Oh, you got toa go through that with me, inna know, Speaker C: Oh, it's just as impressive as making a crown or a denture, but it's a little bit more automated. But still, there's specifics in regards to the geometry of the tip. Right. And how the mill actually mills it. But they're basically a blank shank that comes into a machine and the computer gives it its design. And just like you mill a crown, you're milling a stainless steel burr or a titanium burr, or they have a process where they apply the diamonds to the blank. Right. And there's your diamond tips and how you apply it and how you bake it, just like a crown determines your output. Right. Do the diamonds really stay on or do they just flake right off quickly? So the faster you make a crown, the probably uglier it's gonna be and the higher likely it's gonna crack. So same thing with the approach on, building a diamond. It was just slow kind of faked process. Barbara: So talk about that a little bit. How do they. What do they do? They like, sprinkle it on and then fire it? Elvis: So it' it's gotta be a dip. They gott dip? Speaker C: Yeah, a dip. It's like an electromagnetic process where they actually dip them and bake em. But I think really what. And I'm not an expert by any means, but I think what really makes a difference is the material you're using. Right. The quality of the diamond. Ye if it's cheap quality or cheap porcelain, it's not gonna stack as well or look as good. So what are you using to build that up? But I think it's, in my opinion, the technique they use and the timing. If you were to bake a crown three or four times or stacked porcelain over and over, it's gonna look pretty and just be gorgeous. So how do they bake it? Well, how do they put it in the bath first and apply the diamonds to it is number one. And then really just the amount of time that they take in the bath process and then the QC process. Wow. Yeah, it's very similar. I think you guys would be blown away. We have our plants in Lakewood, New Jersey. If you're ever up there, let me know. I'd love to give you a tour, but just to see how the. Elvis: Oh, I totally want to go. Speaker C: How the mil Maines. We have a little piece online on how it's made. It's a real quick snippet, but it shows you the big NC machines that mill these and how much time goes into it. But you look at a burr and you think, oh, a burr is a burr or a diamond to diamond. And it's not everyone's different. Every shape'different you know, the cutting aggressiveness is different on every one. What is the doctor use for crown prep? In my days of National Dent X So it leads me back to crown prep. Right. What is the doctor use for crown prep? In my days of National Dent X, I didn't really know. I never even talked about it. I just assumed the crown didn't fit. It was impression or it was technique, I guess, on scanning. But, if the prep's unfortunately not good or you don't have clear visualization of the margin, I don't care how good your PVC or scanning technique is, you're not gonna be able to see it. Right. Barbara: Right. Speaker C: Why didn't you pack Corord? And what does corord really do to the technician's ability to build a perfect crown that's gonna sit out here? So that was my first question. Right. I hate remakes. It was the biggest obstacle for any lab to grow. And really just, you know, I love to wow a doctor or really a customer. Right. I think everybody does, but how do I get to that? And then I came here and fortunately met Mr. Dave Avery, who is a consultant for SS White. He used the product for years. I think he said it was one of the first products he's ever used and stands by it because of the high quality of it and the fact that he can use a burd till it burns out. I was just gonna say ye only. Elvis: To give David a hard time. He was probably there when they started 100 years ago. Speaker C: Y. I'm just Kidd. Elvis: Sorry, David. Speaker C: Sorry Dav. I didn't say that El was De. Barbara: He's not 180 guys a good dude. Speaker C: He's a great guy. And if it wasn't for him, I wouldn't be here right now on this webcast. So he was like, look, you guys have the best products. I think if you. And he was here prior to me, they had really launched in this lab space probablybably about two years ago, where Dave obviously helped them kind of get thought around. Barbara: So hold on. Were they only clinical where they just a burst for the dec. Speaker C: They were restorative primarily. Right. So your GPS primarily. And then they came out with an endodontic file for root canals back in like 2009, 2010, and really ran with that space for a while, which is a wholeher conversation on what dentists use for root canals. Which again was new to me. I didn't have that experience. Elvis: It would be new to me too. Speaker C: They were like, hey, we have the ability to manufacture carbides, diamonds and polishers and that's kind of weird. The lab uses the same thing, right? Barbara: All of those things. Speaker C: Ye, all of the above. But we just don't even emphasize or focus on labs at all. And I think they did this some research they saw. You know, there's 5,000 dental labs, there's a bunch of technicians out there that use the stuff. Barbara: Let's go get them. Speaker C: Let's go get. Let's show everybody why we're better and why we stand behind our products because of. And I always say, like, look, you can say a company's been around for a while, but if we were not that good or the quality wasn't there, we wouldn't be here at 180 years old and there's tons of competition, right? It's a very crowded space, definitely. But I'll tell you, the same thing that makes a lab a really good lab is the same thing that sets us apart, which is the level of dedication and the team that we have that makes it. It's the same thing as a crown. So we've got about 150 employees. The average tenure at the plan is 20 years. Barbara: So yeah, that's impressive. Speaker C: They aren't just like, you know, people coming in not knowing it. They're so passionate and dedicated to making it perfect so that, you know, we never get an RMA or we never have an issue, which of course is a pipe dream. There's of course issues. Just if we can have the passion about behind it to say, look, we want to minimize that as much as possible and great. But you know, I don't know if it was the lab space as much as they saw the need for CAD CAM burs, right. Everyone was milling like crazy. PFM's were going out the out the window. And there's this thing called zirconia. And there's so many different kinds of zirconia. How do we address or maybe help that market with a really cool cat camber, whether it's diamond coated or not. So the millling machine that makes a small handpiece carbide can certainly make a milli machine carbide. So I think that was Dave and team's initial look at was, hey, let's come out with some CAD camberss that we can help the market at a very, very competitive cost. that of course we control. Because we make it, but also faster delivery and just optimal product. I don't know if the team launched as best as they wanted to or as fast as they wanted to. So when I came in this year, same thing, right O we're selling the labs. Like, who can tell me about a lab? And it was very minimal that people knew anything about a lab. So I'm like, all right, here we go. I said, we're all going to labs. We're all going toa get our hand piece, and we're going to grind down on whether it's finishing a crown or cutting it out of a puck. This is what these lab folks have to deal with every day. Here's why our products are a little bit better and make that job a little bit faster and just help it first thing, they last forever, right? Barbara: Yeah. Who'd you call? what lab, if you don't mind me asking? Speaker C: So we went all over the place. So I've got a team that spread out the United States. So we went to some labs up in the northeast, some in the Chicago area, and then, of course, some here in Florida as well. that's great. Yeah, wherever. Honestly, we have friends that would say, hey, I don't mind a salesperson sitting next to me and watching me. But again, I'm like, don't just sit there and watch em ask them questions, understand what they're doing, and really try to absorb it. So we did that just in June of this year. So I feel like we're just now getting started. Dave: Until you can actually relate to what the customer is dealing with I had people that were scared to hold either cuth ye out a crown. I mean, that bird, they hold it like a pence. Elvis: You had people selling birrds that were afraid to hold a handpiece. Speaker C: Well, they just hadn't done it right. It was, like, brand new. So I'm like, until you can actually relate to what the customer is dealing with, you're gonna have a hard time having a conversation with them. Elvis: Yeah. Do they hold it like a pencil? Speaker C: Yeah. So we had Dave, fortunately, to really help us, understand iteah and articulate it. But until they actually got in a lab and, you know, we've got big discs for the model room that, you know, they're like, what is a model room? Like, let's really, let's understand this. And then, from there. Elvis: That's great. Speaker C: And again, we go through the dealers, right? We go through Zana and Noack, which is helpful. But for our team to even help educate their folks, they still have to know it. Elvis: Oh, sure, 100%. Speaker C: So we've got a dedicated team there. And really I think the quality that comes out of the manufacturing plan is what makes a difference. So it's pretty fun. How much does a remake cost a dental lab? It still is unknown So we're on a mission and I'm, probably Dave's right hand man, but I'm like, dave, let's go after remakes. Like, I hate remakes. It drives me crazy. It drives the doctors crazy and it drives the lab crazy. And not only does it drive them crazy, it's expensive. Like, how much does a remake cost? Which was always a. It still is, I would say an unknown. Right. I mean, how much would you guys say if you were to make a single crown and had to remake it? How much would it cost the lab? Elvis: Every amount we made from the first one, at least. Speaker C: Right? Elvis: Yeah. Speaker C: So I've heard anywhere from at least one to three. Some people say five. So I'm like, all right, there's 5,000 dental labs out there. Assuming they make 5,000 units a year. Let's just call it simple math. Single units, that's 25 million crowns that are made annually domestically. Right. Elvis: I wonder what that number is. That'd be interesting to find out. Speaker C: So we did some research. We did. The last study I could find on remakes was back in 2020. And it looked at a certain amount of crowns. Right. Ones that would pass and that acceptable. Right. versus had to get remade. It resulted in a 4% overall remake. Barbara: Yeah, that's what we strive for. Elvis: So the question is, is it a remake that leaves the lab? Because you know the old saying, if it hasn't left, it's not a remake. Speaker C: Isn't that a fun conversation? Elvis: But we still have to remake it. Speaker C: Yeah. Barbara: We always said your internal remake should be higher than your external remakes because you stopped it before it left. Elvis: Ye. Speaker C: Which is probably the better way to look at it, I would think. Right. Because we're talking about just the material cost of remaking it. But then you think about the whole experience for the Doctor and then the longevity of that customer for life, if you will. But then the patient experience. What do you mean? Didn't fit? I'm back in my temp. It's just a domino effect of just, just. It drives me crazy to this day. And I don't know if we're evernna be able to get to the bottom of it, but I'm like, gosh, wouldn't it be great if we just help labs reduce their remakes? It would be great if I can go in there and Say, hey, here's what I think you can educate your customers on. And of course I had the help of Dave and team and my former knowledge of it. But how much time did we spend on on the initial prep and what did that look like? We never talked about it. I don't know if you guys talk about it with your customers or not. Barbara: No, actually. Elvis: Well, here's the issue. I mean I know when a prep's not going to work. I don't know how to tell them to make it work. I can easily say, hey, I need more of a chamfer margin. Speaker C: Here's the issue with what I see. Totally agree. Right. Or I don't have any margin on this side of the tooth. Right. Barbara: I don't see it itear or a big undercut. Speaker C: Yeah. And what do you get? Hey, do your best, right? Can you make it work? Barbara: Or reduction coping, which makes me crazy. Speaker C: So I would always try to investigate before I ever communicated to a customer to why didn't it fit? And there was always this back and forth, right? Lab requested either additional impressions or maybe an additional scan. And there was like nothing coming in from m the office. So it was like, hey, I just needed by this date, hurry up and make it. Guess what, it doesn't fit. I'm like u so when I came here, I'm like Dave, how do we do this? I mean we've got some cool tools. And he's like, well he's like, I came up with a course years ago and I'm sure he's told you guys about this with him and a world renowned doctor, Bob Lowe, who's a professor at mususc. Speaker C: And they came up with a little hey, let's just do a basic tutorial on optimal crown prep led by Dr. Lowe, but a tag team effort to have Dave on the other side saying, hey, here's why he's saying this and here's how that articulates to a lab technician or CDT on why we're asking for that technique to be applied. Right. So the two of them kind of comboed on this great little two hour CE course which I'm like, let me watch it. This is great. And it puts things in totally different light. At least it was me like a light that went off thinking, oh my gosh, this is awesome. If I could just make this louder and get it out to labs to start. My thought was, hey, let me go to labs and say we've got an awesome virtual hands on course. So we would Send a group of doctors at typeodont and a little Birk kit that has all of your carbides, diamonds and polishers to make an optimal ground prep. And then have a doctor and Dave lead it. And you get two hours ce. If I'm a lab and I've got a bunch of repeat offenders that constantly are on the phone with us trying to understand why it didn't fit or just, I hate to say that the unhappy customers that are very rude to the lab technicians, which always drove me crazy, how do we reduce that? And is there an opportunity to educate these folks on optimal, crown prep? I can't tell them. Dave Low: If you apply his technique, he's a professor Maybe you guys could. And I know m, you guys are the trusted advisors. But from a salesperson's perspective, like, let. Let me get Elvis on the phone. Or in this case, let me get Bo Lowe on the phone. Or like, if you apply his technique, he's a professor at musc. He teaches this daily to all of the students. It should help move the dial. And what we found was on the folks that unfortunately were limited on how many crowns they actually made before they graduated dental school or how quickly they got picked up from a right Y and hurry up and get this production number. And it was the same thing. So my mind was like, all right, great. I've got a piece I think I can run with. Let me watch it. It was fantastic. Then if I'm a single provider with an assistant, great. Let me make sure my skills are brushed up. But If I'm a 5 to 10 office owner, I want all my associates to understand this technique or apply it if it's being costly. Correct. Every test has remakes. I think eventually everyone's goal is to get to zero. Remakes, which I hear it exists, will. Barbara: Never happen, but it's a good goal. Speaker C: If we can help reduce it, then we may have a solution that would be a value add and potentially separate us from the competition. So got everybody up and running on that. We just had a course a couple weeks ago. We've had a couple courses. And honestly what we found was, hey, I didn't really realize that or think about it that way or the impact of why CHD is important when I'm scanning. But ultimately the technique of the crown proud. I think the majority of dentists out there will use a diamond to do the bulk reduction, right? Barbara: Yep. Speaker C: And maybe they spend a little bit more time on it. They look at it, they think they have enough clearance, and off you are to scanning our impressions. So there's a Little bit of a. Again, I always try to relate stuff that I know, but you can make a regular crown or you can have a really high anesthetic crown that's gonna look a lot better because you took a lot more time on it. Obviously, there's a little bit more labor involved, but the better you get at it, it becomes your norm, if you will. And it's the same idea for a doctor, right? If the doctor takes a diamond to do bulk reduction and does that, and then maybe spends a little time with a carbide and just cleaning it up, you probably couldn't see all of the. You know, if you put a loop on it, maybe you could see what the actual prep looks like. But if you clean it up with a carbide, which sounds like, you know, different languages to some people, like, why would you take a carbide to, an already prepped crown? It's just gonna cut more, right? Is the initial thought. And watching these courses, that's everyone's like, what are you talking about, a carbide? Like, already I'm already reduced. Why would I reduce more? But it's just a very fine carbide. Again, they're all made differently and cut more aggressively than others. But it just really kind of fine tunes the. Not only the chamfer or your shoulder or whatever it is you're looking at, it just kind of cleans up the crown, and you take a polisher and you take it. And really just if you saw the course, which I encourage you guys both to see it, you'll see from start to. Barbara: I was seeing it in my brain as you speaking visual. Speaker C: I mean, the crown is absolutely beautiful. And I think every technician would just do a Toyota jump and say, yes, that's exactly what I need. So right now, we've been making a push into June to say, hey, look, whether you're an office and if you use SS White grape. But here's something we can help educate your customers on. Labs, right? You have a bunch of customers who have issues. Ideally, we like 20 to 25. It's probably the most amount of people. So again, you're at home or wherever you could be in your office, we send you a type ofont and a burb block kit, and it's led by Dr. Lowe and Dave. And then they're sitting there working on a typeodont to exactly what they're seeing. Dr. Low, do you have any questions? So any more than 20, 25 is probably too much. but it's two hours. There's c'that we offer and provide. And that's kind of where we're at with the whole reduction remakes. What we found was that either aha, ah moments some of the doctors would say, wow, I didn't realize that. most of them didn't, of course, and that's fine. But the question is, hey lab, are you seeing a reduction in remakes overall? Did it really impact? And from what we're finding, it definitely does have an impact. I don't have any numbers to like post, but that's the next step is right. We saw this amount of issues at this lab and we were able to reduce it by whatever, 2, 3, 4, 5%. And again, it's a win win for everybody, right? The lab on a cost perspective, the doctor who loves the lab because everything dropped in and the patient whos like smiling away. I perfect experience. I'm going to recommend that doctor because it was flawless. And look how pretty my crown is or my bridge. At first I was like, I'm like, Dave, is this kind of like too basic? is there really a need for this? And he's like, there's a tremendous need. And as I went around to different labs, you bring up remakes and it's like, let's not talk about remakes. It's annoying and everyone looks at it a little differently. But it's real. And if we can try to address it, I think that's the angle we should take. At least when you're talking to labs. Barbara: Are you the company, are you going out to the clinician recommending the course or are you going out to the lab? Speaker C: So we're going to the labs to start because I think they'll help quickly identify the group that they want to target. So a lot of these labs are getting hit with these big group, call it DSOs or GPOS. And the production seems to be coming and that's a lot higher, which is great, right? But if it's to say garbage and garbage out, it's not great. And it's more costly. And of course, if it's a dso, they want it at a very reduced price. And that'it just makes the whole problem even worse. So the idea was to go to them first and say, hey, is there a group? Is there a dso? SS White was originally thought of as a value add rather than a service You want us to go target? But hey, it's a resource you have. Thank you for using our carbide and diamonds. I bet you if you guys walk around your lab, you'd see SS White at somebody's bench or Somebody's, oh, I have it here. Barbara: Yeah, for sure. Speaker C: So it was more thought of as a value atit first than, you know, honestly. I'd walk in the labb and I'LIKE, who are you? I'm like, where SS White? And'like who's SS White? I'd walk over to bedch, I'm like, here you go. I'like, oh. And Dave was one to say that. He's like, look, if you've been around for a little bit, you know it because it was the only thing that anybody used if they wanted it. Now it's got a little bit more crowded with competition. Everybody has their own brand that they make. Right. Their own private label. So it got a little bit more crowded, but we still stand behind the quality. To me, it was a value add. I could say, hey, labs, let me help you reduce remakes. I think it seems like it's working. I mean, I have a small team of dedicated folks who are calling on labs, but it's such a short time. It's hard to really say exactly how much impact are we having? From what I see and hear from labs, they're like, thank you, that was great. Or groups. We just did one for a DSO and they had their 17 new doctors who just started take the course. Barbara: Yeah. Speaker C: And the head clinical director of education's like, everyone that we pick up and starts is gonna go through this course. So I'm like, all right, maybe they got in dental school, maybe they didn't. Maybe now they're a little bit more comfortable and they can relate. But having a hands on ability that allows you to do it from your home is as simple as I think we can make it right. Barbara: I also like the fact that you supply the burtit. Okay, you're gonna watch this video and you use A, B, C, D for each of these things. And this is why Dr. Lowe does. Speaker C: An amazing job of step by step. Here's what you use. It's all number correlated in the burd block. And then of course, they get to keep them bur block, which is a nice little gift. Whether it says the lab name on it or the DSO name. You can customize them. The clinician ends with that. And as long as they take that same approach, they should deliver you guys the best crown or the best scanned prep that you've ever seen. Elvis: So where I'm at, we have a huge conference area. Is this something that we could bring people in and make an evening out of it and everybody does it together, or is it mostly Just set up for like a webinar type situation. Speaker C: We can do both initially, especially at post Covid. Right. The whole travel people were kind. Sure, sure, you got. I just heard Greater New York was a super light show. But, we can do both. Elvis, if that would be a little bit more nice. call it intimate touch to that local group. And I would personally think the Hands on Face to Face would be ideal, but for the larger DSOs, it's like, hey, there's no way we're gonna do that. So. Elvis: Yeah'a question. Speaker C: We can do both. Elvis: I think it's a great service to offer. I mean, we bring these doctors in, we try to sell them on what we're doing, but why not just get them better at what we need? Speaker C: Really? I hate to say it, it's almost like, a 360 selfish, but it's like, look, we need better preps. And here's a doctor that'll show you what he does to get optimal preps. If you just take his approach, it's no different than someone sitting down with you or Barb saying, okay, here's what, what I do and why I do it. Just do it and you'll have a beautiful result. Elvis: I love this. How do people sign up for it? I mean, what, do they just contact you and say, hey, yeah, so. Speaker C: I mean, obviously, we offered it to all of our existing group of like, loyal customers at first, but, you know, if they're looking forward, it's something we can definitely talk to them about and partner with. I think the hard part is just targeting the doctors that you want and picking a date seem. Which seems to be something simple, but probably the hardest to get everybody at this date. The time works, but yeah, just have them give me a call or shoot me an email and we can get the process started. But Dr. Lowe and Dave are pretty flexible. It's just a matter of coordinating, on what their schedules look like. Still practices know, teaches daily at musc. And you guys know Dave, he runs around everywhere all the time. Barbara: Yeah, well, so I thought it was like a pre recorded. Is it a live course? Speaker C: So it's a pre recorded course that we do virtually because that's the simplest. But Dave and Dr. Low are on there live, just like the doctors. They can talk. Barbara: Great. Speaker C: a live would obviously be live in person. So. Barbara: Right. Elvis: Is there a cost? Speaker C: So there's the cost of, of course, Dave and Dr. after Lowe, the cost of the bur block. I try to minimize it as much as we can. And I'm pretty transparent on how much it costs per doctor. typically about $200 per person that attendskay is the cost involved. So whether we come m to an agreement or some type of. Yeah, you know, we're small and we're super flexible. I try not to make it like painful. But again, if the doctors want those burd blocks and you guys want to sell it to them, that's an option, right? If it says your lab name on it, we're totally open to having that conversation. Do I want to eat the cost 100%? The cost of a crown or gosh, forget an aesthetic crown Probably not. But, depending on the opportunity, perhaps it's something that can be done. Elvis: I would much rather have them be invested into wanting to get better. You if you give them a free course and free burs, most of them will show up just for free food. Speaker C: Free booze and yeah, and you're talking mean it. The cost of a bur block with 5, 6 birs and it's not much. It's minimal. Even though I know you guys know and nine know too. The cost of a crown or gosh, forget an aesthetic crown or a full arch case on how much that truly cost us and what the doctor wants to spend on it. It's the same with burrs, right? These things are a couple dollars a apiece and you'd be surprised. Like, I can get it for $0.40 less. And M. I'm like, okay, if that's what you wanna get, I guess go ahead and get it. Let me know how that goes. I hate having that conversation. But it's minimal to the doctor, especially when they see the longevity. And Dave would probably attest this the most and talk to it the most is these things, they don't burn out like the lesser quality ones do, right? So you can have that on your bench or on your wheel for a while or chairside for quite a bit if you're the doctor. Elvis: That's funny that Dennis will also le you. Speaker C: It blew me away. I was so excited, right? Because I wasn't selling a really high end. We know lab cost is the most expensive to the office and that's was trying highest bill. So I'm thinking, oh my gosh, this is like carbide diamonds and birds. This is goingna be great. And they're like, yeah, just wait. And I'm like, what? And honestly, with the online stuff, right, Everyone can just type in that part number and source it from whatever country they want at a super discounted price. And they think they're getting savings until they use it. It lasts one case or unfortunately, may break sometimes. Barbara: I think that a lot of people forget about that stuff. If you buy cheaper, you go through more. If you buy something more quality, you can use it and use it and use it and use it, and they just only look at how much, which is just super absurd. Speaker C: We have a Great White brand that is probably. Everyone knows Great White. They might not know S.S. whitee with the brand Great White. yeah, everyone's like, oh, I love the great white bird. You make the great White Bird. I'm like, yeah, no, we manufactured New Jersey. Like, oh, this is the best burr. So when I started here, I took my portfolio, which we call wallets. I took it to my personal dentist, and you would think I was opening, like, a display of, like, gold. I mean, his eyes lit up, and he's like, oh, my God, this is the coolest thing I've ever seen. I've never seen so many burrs beautifully laid out. I'll send you guys a link. But we have a virtual wallet, which is the same thing. It's just virtual. You can see it, but you can zoom in, and you can see all the different tip geometries and the shapes, and they're like, oh, my gosh. Nobody knows what they're really looking at, but they're like, that's the one I use right there. Even at labs. They're like, oh, yeah, this is the one I like. But nobody knows what it's called or why it's called that or how it's made. So, my dentist said, well, can I just. Can I just keep this for the night? I'm like, ye prom to give it back. He goes, I love burrs. He go, I just want to geek out with burrs. So he calls me the next day. He's like, hey, if you say that these birds are the best. He's like, I'd love to put an order in. M puts his order in, calls me and says, man, I can't thank enough. He goes, I just found the burr for the rest of my life. I go, which one is it? And he goes, the great white sea. And it's made to cut through zirconia. Because as materials change, which is probably where we're gonna take this thing next, is trying to stay up with the evolving technology of new materials, right? Called corneas or lithicates or, gosh, everything that everyone's coming out with. But how do we keep up to cut through that? But when they have to cut through a crown or access a zirconia for a root canal, they can't get through it. The material is so hard, they just burn through burs like crazy. So the average doctor tells me I use between three and four burs. It may take me like five to seven minutes. And we have one called the great white za, which everyone says 30 seconds to a minute. You have your access through. And I've had doctors at multiple trade shows call me out on that saying there's no way that's total Bs. And I'm like, well, here I go, here's one to try. Let me know how it goes. And they all come back like, holy cow, this thing is a workhorse. Barbara: That's pretty awesome. I would like to see how that suckers milled. Speaker C: Yeahah. Barbara: I think about that all the time. Like if I get a remake on how the hell long does it take a doctor to cut off a zirconia bridge or a single unit? And what a pain in the it total. So hard. Speaker C: Total pain. Especially if the burd breaks or gets heated up or a lot of them use diamonds right in the harderm of the material, the faster that that diamond coating is gonna come peel right off of it. And then you get. You're using two birds now. So your $3 may have went to $ and they don't realize it, but you, just want something fast and easy but really consistent that they can count on every time. Barbara: The lab can recommend things like that all day long. Speaker C: Den I'tell you, my heart lies with trying to reduce the remakes, but I'm like, let me educate these labs to quickly go to the doctors. And if it's a win win, then great. You know, it really is a win forever. But it's just, it's one less headache for the lab. I hate remakes. And I never had, uh, experience a remake as a patient I hate remakes. Barbara: I would say so. Speaker C: And I never had, un fortunate enough never to experience a remake as a patient. But it's got toa suck as a patient, right? Elvis: It's gotta be terror. Speaker C: You're in a temp or whatever. Elvis: You feel so bad. Yeah. Speaker C: And you're all excited and it's like, doesn't fit. I'm like, go back. That's the first remake. Sometimes it's a couple and then forget a denture. Forget trys and dentures. That's the whole. That's something I haven't addressed yet. I'probably pick your guys brains on next time I see you, on how to tackle that. Elvis: I don't know how burr'nna help you with it. Speaker C: No, no, we've got some, well, burrs probably won't help you with that, but when it comes to trimming and finishing for the final fit of the denture, certain polishers or we've got a laser sharp CAD cam bird that's used for some of the milling technique or some of this new PMMA material that you see out there. It's always fun. I want to touch upon shapes, shapes of burrs Elvis: I want to touch upon shapes, shapes of burrs. Why are there so many? see, I'm not a picky burr person. I know a lot of people and I'm sure, Barb, you have a shapey love. I don't. I'll just, I'll just grab whatever is available and make it work. Where do shapes come from? Why I don't. Speaker C: You know, it's funny, I'm actually in the middle of developing a new bur. Elvis: A new shape. Thanks, man. Speaker C: It generally because it's Dr. Preference is what, the answer is. Right. This doctor says, hey, here's a fishotomy bur. I think it'll be great for going after certain cavities, but it has to be the shape and that's where they stem from. But when it comes to the lab techs, they all love their certain shape and size and feel of that burr. It's probably harder than asking a doctor to change because they're so really, you know, once you have your habits built. But usually it'preference. Can I have one? I was at a show at endodontics show and they're like, can you make me a burr that has kind of like a reverse tip? Instead of being really aggressive on the initial part, it was like upside down. It was for accessing for root canals. But they wanted a small tip at the beginning. And as it got a little wider, they can get a little deeper because they want toa stick their file down there. But everybody always has a request and a lot of companies will say, yes, I'll make it for you. And then that's they's how they show up on the market. What was the first shape since you guys started this? Was it football Elvis: So what was the first shape since you guys started this? Was it football? Was that the first shape? Speaker C: It was probablyeah. I would say it was probably the. I can't wait to see you guys. I'll actually bring my wallet. I would say it was probably like either the pencil point or the football. I don't actually have the answer that question. Yeah, it could just be a simple round. Elvis: Yeah. Just, just curious what the very first shape was in 1844. Speaker C: I will take that as a, action item and Circle back with you and probably see if I send you the schematic of it. Barbara: I bet it was a football, Elvis. Elvis: You think so? Speaker C: Yeah, everyone loves the football. Elvis: Did they even have footballs back in 1844? Speaker C: You know, now that's a great question. You know, it's funny too when you talk to some technicians, they'd like to have a multi tool in one. So as simple as a polisher sounds, right. You've got some that just have different edges of it. Right. Where you can use kind of a two in one. Elvis: Yeah. Speaker C: Our buddy Dennis Urban is probably the biggest fan of one of our policies. Elvis: Oh good. Speaker C: Because use he can basically do two applications with one bird. Doesn't have to change it out, which doesn't sound like that hard. But he's like it just works perfect every time. We have a line of ah, polishers called jazz polishers that everyone seems to love. Elvis: Jazz polishers. Speaker C: We put together little tips and tricks for lab technicians on, you know, how to increase efficiencies which I'd be more than happy to share with you guys. But really when it comes to instrument to task from a lab technician'perspective that's where I think you guys probably get the biggest aha, moment from your folks on the bench. Because to your point Elvis. Right. You don't even care what burr'a burr. But they do have different applications and will make the job a little easier depending on what you're doing. Elvis: And I really don't even know what the shape and purpose is. I'll be honest. Speaker C: I can have my local Indianapolis rep come out there, please. Elvis: I have a, a collection of burrs. I don't know where they're from, but I got them from the lab when I started. They're all in a crown box and I look at what I need to do and it'mostly removable grinding mostly is what I do. And I look at it and just. Barbara: Grab one, say this looks like the. Elvis: One, this one looks like it will work. And sometimes ill use it for like three seconds and be like that's not cutting it at all. And I don't know why. So I just grabbe another one. Speaker C: It's amazing. Unless you're looking at these things with loops, they all kind of look the same but when you really look at them closely, they're totally different. And that's what really determines the cutting surface and the speed of the way it can cut. And dependingending. I mean we've got metal discks just for metal and they're completely different whether it's single sided or double sided. And that's the thing. We probably have 5,000 different skew that we can outfit you. And it's overwhelming for me and I work here. I cann imagine being a user of it, just thinking, hey, I want something that works fast and it's cheap. Hurry up. What can do? Barbara: Do you guys ever retire any of them after being around so long and be like, y. I don't need this one anymore. Speaker C: Yeah, I mean they all have a life. The carbides probably last longer than the diamonds, but depending on what you're grinding on, those diamonds will. Will probably wear out the fastest. So now there's other companies out there that will say, you know, this thing's down to nothing. I'GONNA I'm gonna bring it back to life by cutting on it myself. And that seems to work to me. It's such a low cost. Like just, you know, and especially if you're a clinician, like why wouldn't you want a brand new sharp one every single time you're talking a couple bucks just make it easier for sure. But they use them until there's no cutting surface at all. I've seen some that I'm like, ye. I'm not surprised. It's not cutting. There's nothing here. You just. You have a blank shank at that point. Elvis: Yeah, you're polishing more than cutting at that point. Speaker C: You are. That's funny. Elvis: Nick, thanks so much, man. SS White will be at lab day as well as visions I want to find out before we say goodbye, y'allnna be in lab day. Can people come find you? Speaker C: Yes, of course I will be at lab Day as well as visions. I just u. oh, got everything sign up. So yeah, we will be there. Probably walking around with Dave Avery. But yes, we will be, at lab day as well as most of the NADL events that we are currently sponsoring. So excited to be part of that as well. Elvis: Perfect. So, yeah, we'll definitely see envision see you in Vegas. Speaker C: Yes. Guys will both be there. Elvis: Yep. Yes, I would love to, have all of our listeners and everybody at lab day stop by and see your wallet, man. Speaker C: Yes, I will have it. So please don't be shy. Or if you want to email, I can send you the virtual wallet which I'll send to both of you guys take a look at. Oh, yeahah. Barbara: I'd love it. Speaker C: And if you have any interested parties on the, optimal crown course, please, or if you guys think you can use it at your labs too. I know we all want to get that message out us. And when you see it, I promise you're going to be like, oh, my gosh. It's not. That's not that difficult. But, gosh, it makes sense. And you can see it. And I know Barbie said you were kind of envisioning that, but when you see it, it's like it looks beautiful. And every time he does one, it's the same. Elvis: How do they sign up for this? Do they just reach out to SS White? Speaker C: Yeah, mean, they can reach out to me directly, and I can align them with, the territory, specialist. Or just call us. But, yeah, probably have them email me would probably be the easiest. Or call me. Elvis: Either way, I just realized, what does the SS mean? What does the SS stand for? Speaker C: So SS White is from the first creator and Samuel Stockton White. Oh, nice's the, original inventor of the first fur. Elvis: Nice. 1844. 2024. Geeez. Speaker C: Isn't that crazy? 180 years. It's funny, I see some marketing information, it says 175. I'm like, no, no, it. It's actually, it's 180. We have to change that. I may have said this, but like I said, the average 10 years, over 20. Elvis: 20Yearse. Speaker C: We have somebody celebrating their 56th year this year. Wow. Frankie. And I mean, talk about ded dedication and passion. It's just. It's fantastic. Elvis: That's awesome, Nick. Thank you so much. Barbara: Thank you. Speaker C: Thank you both Elvis and Barb, and look forward to seeing you guys in Vegas. Elvis: Yeah, absolutely. We appreciate everything, and, we'll talk to you soon. Speaker C: Sounds great. Thanks again. Elvis: Thanks. Nick White gave us a great primer on SS White and all things burrs Barbara: A big thanks to Nick for coming on our podcast and giving us a slowdown on SS White and all things burrs. I really, really enjoyed the conversation, but I know Elvis doesn't know the difference, but it does really matter that you not only have the right bur, but a good burr, a great burr that cuts well and lasts long. So, hey, guys, head over to ssiteental.com to see some or a whole lot of the options available. And if you are interested in getting your doctors educated on, the correct way to prep, which is really important, reach out to them on their website or email. Nick. N n o c I t o. That's nocedo s swhiteal.com and let's get you guys the preps you deserve. Elvis: I love it. All right, everybody, that's all we got for you, and we'talk. Barbara: Have a great week, y'all. Elvis: Bye. Barbara: I'm talking Southern. I'm gonna go flip the meat. Elvis: What the hell is that noise? Barbara: I'm grilling. I'm probably gonna burn, but I'm trying. Elvis: The views and opinions expressed on the Voices from the Bench, ##cast are those of the guest and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the host or Voices from the Bench, llc.