Looking for a way to unlock the full potential of your digital dentistry workflow. I'm Elise Heathcote, associate manager of digital services with Everclear. I'm excited to introduce you to Cam Academy. I have a new in-person training experience designed specifically for dental technicians. This hands on course explores the full potential of program Cam software, helping you take your digital workflow to the next level, learn directly from our experts, refine your skills, and bring new precision and efficiency to your lab. Cam Academy is more than a course. It's your next step in digital excellence. To reserve your spot. Visit the Everclear Academy website or contact your local Everclear sales representative today. Welcome to voices from the bench, a dental laboratory podcast. Send us an email at info at voices from the bench. Com and follow us on Facebook and Instagram. Greetings and welcome to episode 391 of voices from the bench. My name is Elvis. My name is Barbara. I like the way you emphasize one because you're number one. You came in number in one. I did not. I did not. I actually came in third. And I'll tell you exactly what happened. Only because all the triathletes. Right? No. So we were both in the 10-K and what. There were six people running the 10-K. I mean, it was really light. And there were two gentlemen younger than me. Right. So we start the race. Boom, I blow out, I'm out in front of everybody. It is one and a half miles out, one and a half miles back. Right. I didn't know that we were going to have to go another one and a half miles out and then one and a half miles back. So I was in first place halfway through it. And then when they told me to turn around and do it again, my psyche, my mental, I just went, bullet. That happened. I was like, do I gotta do this again? The exact same thing. Yeah. And these, these younger guys who just kind of went by me and I came in third, but that's fine. I mean, I still had a good time compared to what I regularly run, but. Oh, you were awesome. I was so happy for you. You know, don't make runners go out and back out and back out and back out and back. Just no, no, no, I'm not going to say anything negative about the race because I love the people and I love the event. But it was hard for me to just start with three people. Like when I race, there's like, yes, citizens of people or hundreds of people. So that was tough for my psyche. And I forgot my socks, so I had to wear. Yeah. No sock barf. Yo, that was awesome. So who forgets their socks for a race? Barbour does like, duh. And then my knee kind of effed up during the process. Not because of the socks, but you know what? It was fun. It was I, I watched you just go like a rabbit. It was awesome. Good job. I had a lot of fun the whole couple days. Great trip. I know Fort Worth, Texas does not disappoint. We had a great dinner at this place called Billy Bob's. I watched a bowl, bro. I would probably not walk in this place on my own, but since dinner was there, we went and it was, I don't know, this thing was the size of like six Costco's put together of just bars, bull riding, square dancing. We saw a bull ride. I videotaped that, that was like the most amazing night of my life. I loved it, it was so cool. All of our listeners from Texas are like. What's the big deal? How much did we raise? Well, the total at the race was $87,000. Wow. Which is huge. So big thanks to the sponsors and everybody that pitched in, whatever little amount. Man, it all adds up. All the people that donated this. Thank you so much. And I know it's all coming back to the industry. Yep. You know, but we have decided to go back to Texas next year for the same race. And there's plenty of time for people to kind of put it on the calendar. Join us. It's tons of fun. Well, I just want to let you know I'm doing the whole thing. The triathlon. You're going all in? I'm in. Yep. I'm committing. Love it. Yeah. It was kind of weird for me to just go with, like, six people to the race. And I'm thinking to myself, self, you should be doing the whole thing. So I'm in. I'm coming. You saw the guy that was running with us that was in jean shorts. Yeah, I did this guy coming and he was stopping and walking, then running then. Hey, at least he's out there. It's just. Yeah, it was out of place. That's what happens when you're in Texas. People wear jean shorts when they run. Never seen it before and I'll probably never see it again. But it was fun. Okay, so our next dental related trip is actually November 6th. To the eighth for the No Axe Lab fest that's happened in New Orleans. It's all over Facebook and social media. I'm sure people know about it. Did you see that video of them as babies? Yeah, that was funny. That was hilarious. So unfortunately, Barb is unable to make this trip, so I want to say why. So my mother is taking all of my siblings, which is one brother and one sister and all of their people that they're married to on a cruise in honor of my father. So I am sad that I'm not going to be there, but I think it's we're going to spread his ashes over the ocean, and it's going to be just a really neat thing. So sorry I'm not going to be there. But I know you're going to stand tall for me, and I am making it a goal to make you so jealous that you wish you. Where are they? I already wish I was by having so much fun. Do you spend time with your family? Very often? I try not to. Did I say that out loud? But seriously, this thing in November is going to be amazing. Nola Fest. Com you get all the details about the speakers and the events, so at night they are sponsoring me to be there. So I'll be recording at their booth all weekend. I know that, up, man. You better stand tall. Well, you need to be there to help me remember to hit record. But as we've always said, a better meeting is better recording. And we know this is going to be amazing. Oh, yeah. I'll be there in spirit, as you will. Something that's kind of been hinted on social media and I'm super excited for that. I'm actually hosting a Family Feud style game show for lab techs at this event that is so perfect for you. You are going to just drop it. I cannot wait. So I've been watching videos of all the family feuds Steve Harvey and Richard Dawson. Oh yeah, I'm not going to kiss anybody, I promise, but I'm so excited. We've been working on the questions and the format and it's going to be so much fun. So if you want to come for any reason, come to see me host Family Feud, it's awesome. Hopefully somebody will record it so you could watch it. You know they will. So this week we talked to two people running the education for Zest Dental Solutions. So even though they do a lot of courses for clinicians, these two have pretty extensive lab background. Joining us again is their director of sales for the US, Todd Haddock. So good. Yeah, he was on. Years ago. And he's back to give us updates on their new angled locator abutment, which was much needed. And you're geeking out on that? I know a little bit. Oh, and of course the locator fixed. But also joining him is the director of education for zest. Amy. Hello. Amy talks about her clinical lab journey that brought her to zest. And after dabbling in sales, they soon found out how good she is at education. And they're putting on an upcoming Lab Masters course in Las Vegas. And of course, we get all the details about it. So join us as we chat with Todd Haydock and Amy. Hello. Voices from the bench. The interview. Hello. Hello. Hello. There's somebody else on here. Yeah, we got talent. Hell. Hell like hell. Hey, hey. Hey, Barbara. How you doing? Hey, l. Hey. Thank you. Hell. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. Hello. All right, we better get going. I'm gonna forget it. Hello? Hello. Barb and I are super excited today to talk to some people from zest, one of my favorite companies. If you know anything about me, I'm a nerd for over dentures. So the people that bring us. Yeah. So the people that bring us the locator attachment and so much more from zest. We're welcoming back to the podcast. Todd, I look this up. You're on episode 70. 70. It was a while ago. I thought two years ago now. It was a while ago. And I also noticed I was like, oh, he was on there a second time. And I was like, that's weird, I don't remember. Oh yeah. He was with Doctor Shearer and Doctor Shearer just talked the whole time. Yeah, yeah. Todd hi tech. Welcome back to the podcast. How are you sir? Good, good. How about yourself? Are man doing fantastic. But you're bringing a new one to the podcast. Someone I actually yeah. I got to meet at Derby. We had a evening event talking about the locator attachment. They invited me to come witness it. And I always go in there with a mindset that I'll know more than the speaker. And boy, was I wrong. Welcome to the podcast, Amy Helliwell. Hello. Hello. Very. Hello, Amy. Hello. Welcome. How are you? I am good Elvis. How about yourself? Hi, Barb. How are you? Hi. I'm so happy you're here. Thank you for having us. Absolutely. And you know, he's going to mispronounce your name. And that's okay because that's how we roll. That's okay. As long as he can get Amy down, then we're pretty good. We're halfway right. Well, tell me, Amy. Uh, no. So, Todd, what you been doing since you've been on since five years? Obviously, you're still with Seth, still killing it. Anything new to update us on? Oh, I'm sure because I've seen it. Go ahead. Well, I'm the director of sales for the whole US. I have a great group of sales folks out there speaking the good word of of locator. I've had a heavy emphasis on education. We're actually currently right now at our Las Vegas, our global facility here in Las Vegas, doing a zest mastership with about 35 clinicians. And so we've been doing a ton of education, not only here at our facility, but also remotely, uh, across the country, whether it's a two day mastership or evening programs. And yeah, it's been fantastic. It's been a great ride here at zest and just. Constantly, you know, just getting the word out there and supporting all the clinicians that that need the support as well as laboratories on locator locator fixed. Yeah. So it's been it's been great. I've seen your ads over everywhere. I think I got emailed one. I've seen them on Facebook. How did you guys. Is that like a dream team sort of thing, where you guys realize that you wanted to start bringing people in and teach them? Yeah, it started actually probably right around Covid. You know, as you know, with Covid, a lot of people were furloughed, a lot of offices were and laboratories were closed down. So there was a lot of education being done online. And what we realized is that there's a ton of clinicians as well as laboratory technicians that we're looking for education and not just like high level overview education. They wanted more detailed education specifically on full arch therapy. So what we did as a team is we created a mastership program, which was like a number of different courses online, like on demand prerequisites. And then we created like this weekend immersion course specifically on, you know, removable and fixed prosthesis. And so this is something that has evolved over the years. And now with our own facility here in Las Vegas, we have a full operatory, full dental practice actually here on site. And we're bringing live patients. We've brought in, you know, clinicians from not only around the country, but we've had clinicians from around the world come and attend the mastership. So it's just something that we saw where the need is and the need is continuously still there. Yeah. And we're just doing everything possible to support the dental community. How long have you been with Todd? Been over six and a half years now. Have you ever run into anyone that's never heard of the locator? Uh, no, I didn't think so. It's kind of like Coca Cola. I knew this was going to happen. When you talk about education, but you really don't need to let anybody know about it. Everybody knows about it. I would imagine it's a core like staple. I feel with solutions out there. And you mentioned around the world, is it in every country? Yes. Pretty much. Yeah. We work with a number of different dealers and distributors as well as implant manufacturers globally to support locator, I bet. All right, Amy, you're the new one in your story. I need your story. So when I ran into you at Derby, I looked at your foot and you had a tattoo. I did, I did, and I was like, I do know this has a meaning. This has meaning. Everybody hang with me. And I look at this thing and I said, is that a David Bowie tattoo? And he goes, you're the only person that's ever recognized that ever, ever. That's strange to me because I'm so not surprised, y'all. So, you know, I've had this tattoo on the front of my left foot for probably 15 years. And yes, in all the times I've gone out and nobody has ever acknowledged that or recognized that it was for David Bowie. So. So I'm curious, Elvis, how did you notice her tattoo? I don't know, I'm a David Bowie fan. It was. Oh, there you go. All right, that makes sense. And I said to Elvis that Elvis Presley and David Bowie share the same birthday. Oh my God, no wonder. Hey, so there is that connection between the two. How did you know Elvis Presley shared the same birthday as a David Bowie? So when I was in high school, I did a like a kind of big paper on David Bowie, and I did all this research and just in my research that came up about his. His name and where how he got the name Bowie and all. All of it. So if anyone ever wants to forget dentistry and learn about David Bowie, you've come to the right place, I call you. Yeah, I've got to get all my questions in now, because I know you guys are going to geek out about implants. So I just was, you know, the first ten minutes in mine, and then I'm going to hand it over, so. Absolutely. That's fantastic. Yeah. I can't believe you knew that. Yeah. So, hey, where do you come from? Do you just end up at zest? Start talking in Kentucky about locators. I mean, where is your background from? My dental journey started about 25 years ago when I was, you know, I was in college, didn't know what I wanted to do. That general biology major, as most of us do. And what are you going to do with that? And it was a family member of mine that said, have you ever thought about going into dentistry? And so hold on, was that family member in dentistry? Yep, yep. She's a dental hygienist. Oh that's cool. And it was. Hey, did you ever think about being a dental hygienist? I'm like, absolutely not. I don't want to be looking at people's mouths. But you know. So I decided to take a look at it in a local college near me. I live in Connecticut, offered a dental assisting program. It was a kind of a one year. Dental assisting certificate program. I says, hey, let's let's try it out. Change of pace. Started that up. Went. My first day of class. Walk out of class and fell in love. I remember going out to dinner that night with some friends and drawing on a napkin. The general anatomy of a tooth. So like you were just all in. You just knew. And after boring them for about a half hour of talking about dentin, enamel and pulp, I was I was hooked. That's so cool. And they all said she finally stopped talking about David Bowie. No more into dentistry. So now I can talk about both. Because, you know, when David Bowie switched from his David Bowie English teeth to a full set of, I think, PFM, you know, that was a yeah, those teeth were not pretty. No, I think I think that was a wise decision that made him go into a roundhouse. 1987, my best friend, she loved him and I was just kind of like, hey, I know that. She's like, that's so beautiful. I'm like, his teeth are effed up. Um, so after that, I a few years later, I worked as a dental assistant, loved it, loved being a certified dental assistant. Worked. For a great general practice in Wolcott, Connecticut, but went on to hygiene school and fell in love with becoming a dental hygienist and did that and then just kept going, you know, earned my bachelor's degree in dental hygiene and just loved being a clinician, was a clinician for about ten years as a hygienist. But like Todd was alluding to, after Covid, things kind of change. And I started to feel that pressure and stagnation of being a hygienist and started looking elsewhere. And so what does that mean? Help me understand that when you say pressure and stagnation, well, the repetitiveness of being a hygienist, you wake up, you start at 8 a.m., you see 8 to 10 patients a day, and then you kind of go home. It's just like repetition, repetition, not only repetition, but mental repetition. Yeah. You know, because I have really making a difference in the dental community in the, in the just general community. And you know, not really. Yes. I'd go on my soapbox and talk about flossing and bacteria and gum disease and don't feel like you had vision, huh? Yeah. I didn't feel like it was really, really impactful. I mean, it was for that short time. Yes. For those. Yeah, 45 minutes per patient. It wasn't packed full. And I'd see children, I'd see geriatric population and everywhere in between. And it was impactful. but I knew with my passion of dentistry and my passion for education, I wanted to do more. And that's what led me to kind of look outside of that clinical realm but still stay in that dentistry arena, which I put so much education myself, you know, personal education into. I wasn't going to give that up and start a new career path. You know, that's kind of what led me into the laboratory space, working as a as a sales rep, believe it or not, for a lab. So what? So thank you. Yeah. So you put your, you know, whatever out and application out or resume or should say yeah was a resume. And and they love the fact that I had that dental background. Yeah sure. Oh, we totally do. As I'm sitting here next to the director of sales, I hated sales. It was just not me. But I'm like, hey, I can fake it until I make it and I can sell something. Can't sell that Elvis. Yeah, lab sales are hard, and we're not selling widgets. You're selling something that might not work. Oh, yeah, and I'd go in there and I'd start talking, and then I'd get into the back room, and then we'd start. I'd look at, you know, cases, and then you start geeking out again. And then they would kind of trust me and say, oh, she she knows what she's talking about. She's not just selling. Yeah. Just. You know, I say used car salesman. I actually knew what I was talking about. So I did very good in my job as a sales rep for this laboratory. And same thing I kind of sold by way of education, but in true Amy style, kind of got bored of that and moved into a clinical support role for the lab. And they started teaching me on the on the job, on conversions, denture conversions for all Onyx cases, and actually had a traveling mobile dental lab. And I would go to offices and sit there during surgery, convert the denture. So, you know, same thing. Started back up in schooling learning about CBT and and I just I don't stop because I want to perfect what I'm doing. So you were in a dental lab. In a van. In a van? Yes. So you must have been one of the first ones. It could be. I don't know when that started, but all I know is I was rolling around in this van with pressure pots rolling around and polymer monomer in the back, you know, for a good time. And, yeah, it was a good time. It was a good time. Did you like it? I loved it, I loved it, and that's what had me moving on and getting that CBT, you know, accreditation onto that. People make fun of me that I have a lot of letters after my name. And I think I just want to. I'm going to go for the whole alphabet. I'm going to go, so do I. Sister, so do I. I'm going to go for the whole suite. Um. I just love you. I it's Barb. I like you, too. Yeah. That's special. I'm serious. I mean that in a respectful way. I think that's natural. I appreciate that. I and I just, I loved what I was doing. Like, I love that I could talk to the doctors as a dental professional and not a, you know, oh, I'm an employee of a lab or an implant or a sales rep or whatever the case. No. I'm Amy. I could sit there and we could talk about, you know, dentist, and I can talk about teeth and patience in that connection and in the service we're providing for them. You got to get these patients that were either a dentist or terminal dentition, and then they walk out of there with a set of teeth. You know, you're changing people's lives. And so that was very exciting to me. So you were doing like old school conversions. Oh, yeah. Absolutely. With the old. Yeah. The acrylic. Poor dentures and everything. Yeah. I had. How long were you doing those? For about a year. Yeah. Yeah, I had a sketchy lathe that was, you know, another with duct tape and hope and hoping that thing. Um, I still have one of those. Yeah. Like, can I get a new lathe? The truck is broken, man. Just slap some duct tape on it and hope for the best, so it'll be fine. I still have all of my fingers, and my eyesight is pretty good. That left. I got a lot on, so I'm doing pretty good. And how many of these conversions did you do? And you thought to yourself, they should be a locator, they should be a local. Believe it or not, I did not know about locator. For. I knew about zest as a dental professional, but as that in that hygiene, you know, you kind of know over denture. Yeah. You know, I started going on some of these sponsorships and some of these dental events locally where I was in the northeast area, and I started talking and teaching, and I've never done that. Oh, really? You were doing that back then? Yeah. It was just like, hey, Amy, do you want a microphone? I'm like, absolutely, I want a microphone. And I would start talking about the lab and I'd talk about, you know, what you can do with fixed full arch and, you know, screw retained and conversions and, and also promoting the laboratory and hey, I can come to you and we can do this in the office. You don't you don't have to have a lab. I will come to you. So at that moment where I was speaking on Long Island and it was kind of brought up to me about a position that was possibly available with Zest Dental Solutions and looked into it. And that was about almost four years ago, three and a half years ago, where I started at zest. As I said again, back to a sales rep. They suckered me back in as a sales rep. I knew that that wasn't going to last long, because I knew I wanted to be more clinical and then morphed into a clinical role. And I they I say because Todd was my was my manager, he was my boss. And after about a year of that, I couldn't stand that anymore. So I didn't like it that way. I moved into a clinical support role that was supporting some of our DSO accounts, but it was nice because I kind of got back to my roots of scrubs and dentistry and talking dentistry. So what does that mean? Clinical role. Like, instead of selling parts and pieces to labs, you go and educate the clinics on how to use them. Did you know at zest? We have a great, great division of there called clinical support representatives and their all dental background. They're either a dental hygienist or dental assistant. So we have these wonderful, you know, persons that are dental background that go to these offices and support them from everything from stock reorganization to lunch and loans and education to evening programs to troubleshooting and kind of everywhere in between. So it really connects the clinician with zest in a just a very, very clinical base. Non selling non you know pushy type of environment. And knowing that we are here to support them. We want them to feel supported. We want them to use the product and help these patients out. So we have clinical reps across the country that work in conjunction with our sales reps, and they work with the education team, and they're just a great resource that we have access to allow for offices and laboratories. And they go into labs as well and help educate the lab technicians. And just to kind of spread the good word of locator locator fixed and, you know, locate our angle. Who needs more help, clinicians or labs. That's a great question. I mean, it's I would say the clinicians do I say it's the doctors, you know, they come out of dental school. They want learn to make one denture. Now nowadays, you know, they come out maybe making 1 or 2 dentures. And we throw them into the fire and you know. Yes. You know, you got these dentists, they want to do cosmetics. They want to do veneers, they want to do single tooth crowns, but then they see that dental walk through the door and they freeze and they don't know what to do. Oh yeah, they call me. Yeah. And they say please, you know. And now we're in that in this transition time, where do we want to do analog. Do you want to do digital. And they don't they don't even know what to do. You know they're like how do I start this. And we get those cases. What do I do? Where do I start. So they call zest and say like how do I start this? They do. We get questions. And Todd, I'm sure you get a lot of questions like this from your reps. And they ask all the time what you know. I have a patient. What do I do? So you guys, that builds loyalty. I just want to say. So the one thing that I know is when they need help and you're there, that builds loyalty. And it also helps them build. So. Todd tell us. I totally agree. I mean, we have our reps on the, on the street, our clinical folks on the street, but we also have a great technical service team in house. So, you know, any clinician or any technician can call the 800 number. They could actually go on our website and hit the chat box and get somebody live within 30s. They can just chat with them. Like typing, they can actually depending on their device that they're using, they can even do something, you know, you know, via like just speaking or even doing like a, almost like a FaceTime. And it can kind of review, especially if you have a patient in the chair. And that's why it kind of ties back to education. Again. It's because there's so many clinicians out there that want that additional education, and there's building blocks to be able to really support those patients that they're needing to provide for in their practice. So if I'm chair side and I need to change out an insert and the current insert is brown, you can tell me what color it used to be. That's sorry, it's an inside joke. I yeah I hear you. But yes we can. To answer your question Elvin. Oh you can we can help identify insert color. Nice. Something I want to touch on. I haven't had a chance to see one in person, but the angled abutments, we've only been asking for them for 20 years. 25 years, 25 years. What brought them out and how are they doing? So to answer, you know, the first question, what brought them out is, you know, that was definitely, as you know, a need in the industry for this. And they're available now. We're working on, you know, multiple different connections for different companies as we move along. The reason things have taken longer, instead of having a full blown out launch of every single connection, is because through the FDA, you know, we're now we're not making just a locator that screws into the internal threads of a dental implant. This angled abutment is actually, you know, integrating with the geometric shape of the, you know, the connection of the implant. So it's there's there's more involved with that. And, you know, there's a lot, a lot more red tape to go through with the FDA. So we have a number of different companies right now. You know, kneel down with the Grand Morris. We have noble conical. We have Zimmer with their tapered screw vent. We have a strawman with the bell. And then we have a number of other companies, or I should say connections that are coming out like very, very shortly. And you're going to continue to see that throughout the rest of the year going into next year. There's just going to be a continuation of that portfolio. But I think as as everybody knows, not only from a clinical standpoint, but from as a technician standpoint, it was something that was needed. You know, for a long time, that project, you know, kind of they were working on that behind the scenes as we launched locator fixed. But once locator fix was already established and completed, then they put a lot of energy into the angle locator, which now allowed us to to launch what we currently have now. And it's just one angle, right? Yeah. Currently. Right now it's just one angle. It's 15 degrees. And the reason for that is that depending on whatever type of case you're working on, whether it's removable or fixed, and based on the angulation that you need to get that as parallel as possible, you're able to achieve that with the 15 degrees plus all the various types of inserts that are out there. So if you need to do a removable case and you can use the extended range, if you're doing a locator fixed case, the locator fix, the inserts can go up to 20 degrees per site just in itself. So you can imagine 20 degrees plus 15 degrees. That's already giving you of 35 degrees to achieve that. So right now 15 degrees is really all you need. Are there plans to do other degrees or do you think that should be enough? That's a great question. I mean, right now it looks like that should be enough. I mean, this this competition has come up with our, you know, R&D team. But at this point, our goal is to get to the market. All of the current angle that we have now for all of the connections that are available, I've always said if you need more than the extended range, it's a surgery problem, not a prosthetic problem. Oh Lord, here we go. Yeah, I knew this was going down 25. You were waiting for it, Barb. Waiting I was, I was. Elvis loves this stuff, and I totally get it. So go, go for it. No, I feel like I'm on the spot. You are on this. I know I've got to hear this. Oh, Barb. So what was your question? Well, if the implants are so divergent and you can't compensate it with the parts and the pieces that come with locator, then the surgery is to blame because the implants are too divergent are wrong here. Is there a locator fixed? You know, a lot of times with, you know, with like all on X type cases, those implants are purposely put in an angle to avoid sure anatomical landmarks. So with that said, we get the implants where they need to be with sufficient bone, and then we correct the angles, you know? In the past, it was with Mouat. And you know, as most, you know, clinicians and technicians know, we make a locator that goes on to the universal MUA, but then that becomes a stackable type of process that also takes more restorative space. Whereas now if you put a 15 degree locator angle with a locator fixed insert, you're going to be able to achieve the angles that you need, even when you had angled those implants purposely. Well, yeah, because an MUA can only go up to 30 and you're going up to what, 35? Five? Yeah. 35. Max, if you need. If you need that, you're even. Five more. 17. You could accommodate the 30. But once again, it's set up to where, you know, you have more opportunity to do these cases. You know, utilizing locator. And using, you know, whether located, removable or locator fixed. Yeah. But I'm going to validate this 35 degrees is is aggressive. So if you're over 35 degrees it's it is a could be a surgical problem. There you go. That's the better you feel better now. We got it. I do, thank you. Thank you. Amy. When you showed up at zest and started working in sales, was it difficult to grasp the concepts of all of it, or were you already pretty familiar with the whole system of locator and fixed? And what happened to what happened to the other one? TX what happened to that? Ft. So ft. And then TX are is another is another button? Yeah. So I'll let Todd talk on that one. But I'm going to answer the question on. Yeah sorry to know as a multiple part question. You know no it wasn't hard to grasp because of that dental background to begin with in the lab background on top of it. Um, and then my nerd ism of going to back to school and everything, I would drive and listen to Doctor Shearer's YouTube channel on learning and learning the terminology and learning. You know, the like you said, the widgets, learning the pieces and parts. So, you know, we have a great online education system as s we have a lot of great resources and even our YouTube channel is a great resource. So it didn't take me long to get down the parts and pieces and how to utilize it. I mean locators pretty pretty straightforward. One abutment, you know, once you kind of get that. Can't be surprised. I know, I know, but once you kind of do it, it's pretty much. Why do you say you'd be surprised, Elvis? Because I talked to so many clinicians and they just don't understand that once you have that locator abutment in, it's all the same on top. And they also always call inserts O-rings. And it drives me nuts, drives me nuts too. And we also get a lot of, you know, we'll get some pictures and tech support. And we have a picture of an overt interrupter and they're like, oh it's a locator. And we're like, nope, that's not a locator. So you know we have to get over that hurdle. First of identifying is it a locator or is it a, you know, another over denture abutment. So you know, I agree. It's I think we're fighting kind of an uphill battle sometimes. But but you're doing it. You're taking them out to Vegas and giving them everything. Absolutely. We're just going to call it an insert, not a no ring. Trust us, we get that all the time with the difference an O ring versus an insert. Or is it just vocabulary? I'm going to let them do it. Talk to me. It's different. An O ring is the shape of an O. It's almost like a it's an O ring. It's an O shaped ring that'll fit like a donut that fits over like almost like a ball attachment. Okay. So you got o and you got ball. My two favorite words. Yeah. And it goes over like a like a gasket over a ball trailer hit. Yeah, that's a better word of looking at a trailer hitch where an insert, a nylon insert goes into a housing that snaps over the abutment. So, okay, almost like a Lego where it makes sense. But why do you think they confuse it? I always figured they got it wrong because o ring was the only thing they learned in school, but oh, that's a huge part of it too. They don't know the terminology or they just that's what they're used to. And a lot of these GPS see like 1 or 2 patients a year. You know why? And they just don't do it enough to get good at it. Okay? I think they're afraid of dentures. They're afraid of. Yeah, sure. And one of the things we're trying to solve is that case acceptance. They feel they're already going into these patients that said, oh, they can't afford an implant supported prosthesis. So I'm not even going to present it to them. And they just kind of give them a denture. And their mother had a denture and their aunt had a denture and their friend had a denture. So that's what I want to get a denture. And the dentist is either doesn't want to explain it, doesn't know how to explain it, or does not believe that the patient has that value or is creating a value in their treatment. And so they're not even proposing implant supported prosthesis as an option, or they're not comfortable doing it and they're afraid to present it because then they're going to have to do it, right. Yeah. Then they're going to be put on the spot is, oh my gosh, I have to actually do this and actually pick up a denture or, you know, for an overnight or write a lab script to a lab and requesting over denture. They don't even know the words. They can't get o ring down. Or are they going to write a prescription? Yeah. So, you know, that's that's part of our an education. I say part of our education initiative is that it's not just teaching them the pieces and parts and the techniques. It's. All encompassing. It's teaching them that case acceptance, teaching them how to talk about overt. Enter their what is an overt entry. You know, starting at the bottom. What's an over denture? What's the difference between removable and fixed? You know, what's the difference between tissue supported and tissue retained. So, you know, there's an implant supported, an implant rotated rather. So there's a lot that we want to do and a lot that we're educating these clinicians on. You're fighting the good fight. And we are we are fighting the good fight one locator at a time. So Todd what happened to FTX? So FTX came out in 2016 and it came out while I was in the lab space. And so kind of similar to locator fixed where you have a fixed like hybrid restoration but with no screws, no cement. The only thing is with FTX, it was it's a new abutment design, and it's almost like a like a peak ball that screwed into the housing of the denture. And so there wasn't as much surface area, you know, with this and, you know, it actually worked well. But at the time there was no direct representation on the street from zest. So education really from like videos or came, you know, came from literature and that was pretty much it. So we had clinicians that had really good success and others that had some frustrations with it. And I think pretty much based on not having that, that type of support on the ground. And so over the years when we we took over zest, we realized that we would still have that product, but we weren't going to majorly push it. We were going to focus on what we did best, which was removable. At the same time, you know, looking at another option out there for fixed, but something that had to be simple. And so the design started with it has to fit on the traditional locator abutment, not a new abutment, not in any type of new design. It had to be specific that what doctors are familiar with and snap over the existing locator abutment. And so where locator fix came into play then was to create a new housing which looks fairly similar to the original one, just different color, more retentive elements, but the insert, the inserts actually a proprietary material that we it's milled, it's precision milled. You milled each one of those tiny little things. Yep. Yes. That's awesome. That's where you got to get the precision from. Because if you think about it, you know, minimum for implants. You get that cross heart stabilization, but there's no indexing. We're talking about round componentry. So when it actually snaps over the locator it's fixated. There's no micro macro movement. And so there's it's a different surface area than what like Ft was so ft. Those components are still available for those, you know, clinicians that are working. Oh really. Pieces are there. They're available, but it's not available in terms of like that's a product that we, you know, actually are pushing or selling. Oh, I can't start a new case. Or if you if you start a new case, it's like it's whatever, you know, whatever's available is there. Yeah. It would be more optimal to use locator fix because it's far superior in terms of its design and ease of use and workability for the clinician and the technicians. I mean, I honestly, when I first heard about fix, I was like, that's the smartest thing I ever heard. Using the exact same abutments. So all the cases that are already removable, you could easily switch them to fixed with pretty minimal cost. Correct. Is that where you're seeing mostly is people that were removable becoming fixed, or are they going straight to locate or fixed? This is where we geek out. Yeah. So this is. Yeah, this is the exciting stuff. I know it really depends on the case at hand. You know, we see a lot of clinicians that see and get exposed to locate or fix. And the first thing they think of is I have a handful of patients who I would love to convert from their current locator removable into locator fixed. And maybe it's because of that's what the patient needs. That's what they wanted. Maybe they couldn't afford it at the time. You know, we still have to take into consideration restorative space. But the ease of taking a, you know, making a reference denture, for instance, and picking that up in the mouth, which is what majority of clinicians are doing already. All that. Like it's all the same. And then, you know, cutting that back and making a provisional kind of putting them in there like, you know, their training wheels and making sure that the patient likes having something that's fixed to the point where we can set the stage for the technician at the laboratory to then decide, you know, what's the best material to use for the definitive prosthesis? So we see a lot of those conversions, you know, taking place. But then there's a lot of clinicians that are gravitating to locate or fix because they want to get more involved with the fixed full arch realm in dentistry. But yet they might not have had the training. Maybe they don't have the experience, maybe they have a certain perception of like, it's cost too much or it's too complicated. And then once you put somebody who is familiar with locator and show them locator fixed and how easy it is now they start really dipping your toe in that full arch, you know, fixed pond, and they start doing more cases, even to the point where when they're working on a case and they're prescribing locator fixed and the technician comes back and says, well, this case might work better if it's a screw routine. The clinician is like, well, what do I need to do? What are other steps? And so locator fix is actually expanded the opportunities and horizons for a lot of clinicians that have never done fixed full arch. And now they're doing it on a regular basis. Interesting. But a patient in a current locator, you can't just change out the housings to fix cut off the flanges and deliver it. You could. You could. So you would actually do a new pick up? Yeah. Just pick up the new housings. Yeah. You know, theoretically, yes, you could do that. But you have to think about, well, is that going to be your definitive prosthesis because the denture may or may not have any reinforcement. And the reinforcement that it probably if it does have it, it should. It's probably just a mesh. And so if you look at locator fix the rules of engagement still apply as screw retained. You would never put a screw in restoration that's only supported by mesh. You would have contoured zirconia. You would be maybe using some of the new polymers you would be using, you know, metal like, you know, thicker metal bar, things like that. So those all the fundamentals of screw retaining fixed fillers all apply to locator fixed. So you still want to make sure that you have the proper thickness of your materials. And you can choose whatever material that you want. It's all based on the clinician and based on what the patient needs. So there's nothing holding you back there. But I'll give you an example. We see a lot of these locator removable cases that they want to convert to fixed. The recommendation is don't do anything with the existing prosthesis. Make a reference denture. Talk with your lab. Scan it. Duplicate it. Whatever you need to do. Make a reference denture. Pick up the reference denture and then cut everything back. And then start it as a provisional. And the reason why is because. What if something did break? What if something did go wrong? You can easily go and put the patient back into their locator removable prosthesis, which they are already familiar with. It already engages all of them. Exactly. You just. That's your backup if you ever need to for for any reason. And then at least you're establishing, you know, this fixed prosthesis in a provisional state. And then if the patient wants different colored teeth or if they decide, you know what, I thought I wanted to have my teeth fixated, but I decided not to. I want to take my teeth out to clean them. Well, now, we didn't really commit to anything other than a provisional. We didn't go to the definitive prosthesis yet, but we could still use that as our training wheels. And we're seeing that all the time. Interesting current denture, whether it's a traditional denture or locator, a removable denture. Majority of the time dentists are working with their labs, making a reference denture, and then starting using that as the provisional to continue on to the definitive. Are you seeing a lot of offices and labs do the printed denture for these cases? I am in terms of the Provisionals, I see printed dentures being done. But you know, as you know what, there's various types of printed materials that are out there. I think the key thing is with all the different types of technology in these materials that are coming out from a printable phase, it still comes down to is also thickness is very, very important. And then, you know, even for the provisional. But as you're getting to the final restoration, I'm seeing a lot of dentures that are being like milled. I do see, you know, a combination of different types of materials, you know, combined together, whether it's zirconia, you know, with the, you know, metal substructure. Once again, it all depends on is the thought process and the belief of the. Clinician in conjunction with their collaboration with their dental lab, as well as what does the patient need based on their opposing based on their prior functional habits? All those still apply when it's zirconia. What are you cementing the caps in there? Yeah. The housings. Yes. Just just cannot believe I said cap. I was just going to say Elvis and you're you're worried about O-ring and you just said caps. Yeah I know. Come on. I'm not going to edit this either. I was so ready to say that. So thank you for bringing that up. But they just cemented in. Don't they have deep bonding issues or anything. So it'd be very similar to when a laboratory is cementing the tie basis. Yeah. And so you're using you're still going to sandblast the housings. Yeah. You're going to prepare the zirconia appropriately. You're going to use a cement that you're using with a titanium zirconia. And it still works the same way. So, you know, the thing is with deep bonding, you could see deep bonding even with screw retain cases if you see the whole time so well. And but why is that when you break it down, it's a lot of times it's maybe the case wasn't prepared properly you know for the cementation. Yeah. Others. And part of that is, is like the spacing. So if you're making the appropriate spacing for the housing and for the cement you'll be fine. But as you know, even the greatest cements that are out there if you're relying on too much cement. You could have a problem if you have two little cement. You can have a problem. So all these apply to locator fixed as well. Now the interesting thing is with the advent of locator fixed, and with the fact that a lot of clinicians are familiar with picking up locator in the mouth, there is a fair amount of clinicians out there that will actually have the prosthesis fabricated by the lab, but they'll actually pick up the housings in the mouth. That's the preferred way, right? Well, keep in mind this is that we're talking about a fixed case. So there is no palate. There are no flanges. This is so because right now nobody picks up a definitive screw case in the mouth. So it actually opens up even more applications to the clinicians out there. And they're they're loving it. They need to even pick up zirconia. You know, they isolate each of those areas. The cement, the zirconia in the mouth. They got the human articulators. They pick it up. The technique is very, very, you know, simple to do. But at the same time, if a clinician does not comfortable with doing that, that's perfectly fine. We can still go through the normal workflow and have the laboratory process everything. Well, how do they pick up a full arch zirconia with no palate or flange out? You just line it up, bite and tweak it until it looks good. If the case was started, even if you had a working model and you're scanning that model, you know, on the bench or you're scanning the patient's mouth, once the restoration is designed, we have scan caps. Yeah, that actually go on top of locators. So that actually creates the exact spacing for the housing as well as the material that you're going to shoot those housings into that material, cement included. Correct. Correct. So that's of course Elvis. Cement is not extra. No. Yes I know. So? So therefore, the clinician will take the housings and put them in the mouth, not them in the mouth, because the housings have the black inserts initially, just like traditional. Yeah. Okay. Correct. And then they will, you know, make sure everything's prepared and then they will use the material. Depending on what material that we're using for the prosthesis will depend on the material that's used for. We're picking up the prosthesis and they'll do a pickup. They'll put it in the mouth. Line everything up. Have the patient just gently, you know, interdigital their dentition and let everything cure up. And then once everything's done, they can pop it off because it's easy to pop up because of the black inserts. They'll clean everything up, Polish what they need to do, switch out with the final inserts and snap the restoration in the mouth. Mm. If only there is a place in October that lab technicians could learn more about this. Here we go. Here's the glove. That's good. Well, Elvis, I'm so glad that you brought that question out. Because not only am I a dental assistant and a dental hygienist and everything else, I also manage our education here at Zest Dental Solutions. Nice. So props to you. Yes, props to me. So with that being said, we are offering a phenomenal program for our laboratory technicians to come to Las Vegas and learn everything. Locator. You know, we started earlier in the program talking about our two day zest mastership program, and we thought that the lab technicians are cool kids too, and they need their own program. So we we are so we are we have developed a laboratory mastership course. And it is specifically marketed to laboratory technicians. To learn that side of the locator life, that journey. Because a lot of the times, you know, you were teaching the clinicians, the dentistry, the implant placement, the AP spread, you know, everywhere in between. And then we just expect, you know, magically to get fabricated. And there's it, there is there's that disconnect. We did talk about that in the beginning of how do the doctors translate what they want to the lab technician, and how do the lab technician translate their questions back to the doctor? So with this mastership, it's a full day course in Las Vegas at our Las Vegas Education Center on October 11th. It's a full day, kind of 8 to 5 all day. And it's an very intensive lecture and hands on, so didactic and hands on. It's being taught by John Madden, who's a phenomenal CBT, who's been oh my God, I love him. Well he's amazing. We know him well. We know him well as well as myself will be there as faculty as well as Todd. So it is going to be a phenomenal program with. Yeah, you've got John's knowledge. Todd's knowledge. You know, my knowledge, you kind of. We all have kind of different strengths. And you put us all together and we really, really have developed a comprehensive program where we take that lab technician from over dentures, you know, componentry, pieces and parts from analog, digital, how we're kind of doing everything in between. And because not every clinician is digital, not every clinician is just analog, some kind of fall somewhere in between. And in lab technicians fall somewhere in between. So we've really developed a curriculum to cover everything from that. So they learn the skills they do learn the nomenclature of things, they learn the pieces and parts, but it's how to use them, how to make it work for their lab and their workflow. Because again, not everyone does a digital workflow. Not everyone does just an analog workflow. So we've kind of developed this program where we can take that technician no matter where they are, where they're where they're at the bench, where they're at their in their journey as a lab technician and get them comfortable with locator over denture locator, fixed locator angled, and how to have that communication with the doctor to make successful cases. Because we all know, as you know, lab professionals. It's not just the frustration coming from the clinician. We have a lot of frustrations on our end too. So it we're trying to teach them on what questions to ask their clinician. They should be able to go back and say, hey, I need this. This is what I need to get a that is so true. Yeah. Everyone puts blame and oh, why did your crown not fit? Oh, the lab need me a bad crown. Well, let's give you that impression. Let's take a peek at those margins. Did you, you know, can I see full, clear margins? Did you retract the cord properly? You know, did you do all of these things? But instantly we jumped down the throat of the laboratory technician. So always we want to be able to elevate these lab technicians so they know what to look for. They know what the pieces and parts are. And I always I call it a recipe. I say, what's the recipe to make a successful over denture or locate or fixed utilizing the pieces and parts correctly. So having that lab technician properly educated elevates not only them as a professional, but that lab as a whole. And that's when you get the clinician that says, oh, you have to use this lab. They're phenomenal. And why? Because they're educated and they know what they're doing and they're able to communicate their needs to. Exactly. That's why we've developed this program. And we're super excited because there's an online component as well. We we wanted to make it very, very immersive. So the technicians can go online, do some on spec ten CE credits for the technicians. So I've seen it like literally everywhere, especially at my lab. So can you kind of give a like a lowdown on what they will learn. Absolutely. So you know again that online component starts them off. It's on demand. They can work at their own pace and they can have, you know, there's no timeline to complete it. Right. They come into the facility for a seven Siu program. So it's all day. And we start with right away with hands on with hold on all day in Vegas. All day in Vegas. But not night. So we want to go. We let you we let you out at night to to enjoy it. Well I think that's very important because honestly that's a really good location. Everybody can fly in direct flight mostly most of the time, um, fly into Vegas and get all the see and everything you guys have to offer and fly out and fly out, you know, great weather. You know, there's something for everybody. We have a lot. Even at our mastership, a lot of our clinicians come in with their family members and their families, go shopping, whatever, or see the sights, and then they do that and then, you know, great places to eat, great places for entertainment. So Vegas is a really great location to come and visit and to love it. I would like to be invited to that. I'll come. You know, at the end of this, I'm going to give you a how to sign up in a little I would love that would offer you to my son is amazing and needs to go. Sincerely. He's the implying tech. I'm the ceramist, but he's really smart. And that's what we're seeing. Because, you know, we go into these labs and we hear that and think, I need something. I want to learn how to do this. So we've developed a program. Barb, I know you were asking what we're going to be learning is we're going to learn everything. Locator, locator, angle locator, fix the components, the pieces and parts, those actual. We're going to get that in their hands and show them how to use it, how to take things apart, put things together, the analog workflow of it, the digital workflow of it. We're going to be talking about impressions starting from the bottom. It's impressions how to scan what we're scanning, what anatomy are we looking for. So when you get this scan at your lab and you open the box and then you see this impression sitting in your pan however you want to send it, what do you do? I didn't you didn't need to capture this. You need to record this. And that's what we're we're teaching these labs. Oh, I'm so excited. And how to communicate with the doctors and how to what they're looking at. We're going to go over again. Digital scans, printed models. We're going to do a demo. We have some scanners that are going to be at the course, do some demonstration, take some impressions. So they get to kind of play with all of the pieces and get some. Get them. Get some dirt on their hands as well. Playing with all of the componentry. Um, you know. And then we're going to go into converting these cases how to what to look for for a denture and converting it into a locator. Fixed. So it's we're going to cram a lot into that eight hours. But yeah we've, we've dialed it into what a laboratory technician needs and not all that excess that they might not get benefit from. So that's why we want to have this dedicated laboratory mastership. So what is the benefit for you guys just to be able to teach or like give me like long term. The benefit for us is that every time we educate somebody, whether it's a clinician or a dental technician, we're working in conjunction together to help the patients that are out there. And so the more educated that everybody is, the more like, I think the more efficient that everybody is with their workflows, how they're communicating, you know, with each other to the patients. And so overall, I mean, isn't that what our overall goal is? I mean, even sure, like everything that we do should be for the best interest of the current patients and future patients. And so that's the benefit for us. If we have everybody being more efficient, then that means that they're they're using the product properly, having better outcomes, getting more comfortable, and then you're just doing more cases. So it's a win win win across the board for sure. Yeah oh that's a great point. I mean you have one doctor in one case and it goes bad. They'll they won't sell it again. They won't even try. And the other benefit too is you know, as you all know like in the laboratory industry, we watch every year more and more laboratories close up or try to combine resources together and keep moving versus where laboratories, you know, were 10 or 20 years ago. And then, as you know, over the years, there's less and less educational opportunities for. People to become dental technicians. And so one of the biggest problems that we see out there with dental laboratories is it's very difficult to find good people, meaning good technicians, trained technicians, and more and more labs are going to cross training their employees. And, you know, and a lot of labs rely on like one main person for various departments. What happens if that technician leaves? What happens if they pass away? What happens if they just can't practice anymore? Well, then it puts the dental laboratory at risk. So more and more labs are working on their depth chart, cross training technicians to be able to accommodate, you know, the need that's out there because it's harder and harder and harder to find dental technicians out there on the field to add to your team. So this laboratory mastership is specifically geared for laboratories and technicians that are looking to cross train their folks, looking to expand the knowledge and skill sets and experience of those folks to be able to accommodate the need that's out there. And so that's what I'm really excited about, because I remember how tough it was for me to, you know, to bring on new talent when there wasn't a lot of people out there. And then what do you do? The work keeps coming in. You can only work your people so much. So that's why it's important to kind of diversify, cross train your folks, decrease your risk of running into issues at the lab because you don't have enough people that are trained well. That brings up an interesting point. What type of technician should labs be sending to this course? New removable technicians, veterans fix technicians all on for conversion experts. So I would say it would be somebody who, you know, it could be somebody who's newer into a department. That is it could be, you know, just talk about full arch therapy, you know, dentures. It could be, you know, implant related for implant, removable implant fixed. And you know what? Like talking about the experts. If you have an expert in your laboratory, is there. They're probably already doing all the things that we're teaching. But I can assure you that those experts, you're relying on, that one person, then where it'd be, it'd be more mindful to have cross-training other folks to help them become the experts in the future. Right. And that's what that's the goal of most laboratories is getting all of their technicians being experts at various facets of implant or just dental technology. And I feel that the lab mastership is going to help contribute to that. I'm going to disagree with the expert because I considered myself I considered myself an expert. And then when we had a phone call just talking about doing this recording, I learned something. So I think experts can still go to a course and learn something. I agree with you. We welcome everybody. I mean, it's interesting we host these clinical, you know, master ships. Yeah. For the for the dentist. And every mastership we have, it could be an oral surgeon, a periodontist, a prosthodontics period. And even dental technicians will join our current mastership programs. And I asked them, like, what? What do you want to get out of this program? They just say, I just want to walk away with some more pearls. I can always be learning and I want that attitude. And so same thing happens. And you know what? I agree with you. If there's experts out there that feel they want to just continue to learn, even if it's just a couple pearls and they can get away from the bench. We we welcome that. I think that's fantastic. I love that. It's so smart. You know technician burnout and tired of all that stuff and be able to go away. Travel to Vegas, learn some amazing things from you guys and then come back Energized and ready to roll. I love it. So when is it? October 11th is October 11th. Yep. You're in Las Vegas. We have a there's a tuition for coming to the course that's going to have all your supplies and provide you with a great day of learning. Um, so it's 495 per technician to come in. But with this podcast and with listening to this podcast, we have offered a $100 off promotion. What what I know that's pretty significant, y'all. Which is let's go. It's a great promotion. It's just so there's a promo code. It's very simple. Voices lab vo I c e s l a b. Thank you. Voices lab is the promotional code for unique. I know, I think I came on my big brain came up with that all the way on. I love it because I don't think, uh, David Bowie lab would have worked. I went voice of lab. That's pretty funny. Amy. You're awesome. I, I I I try we really wanted to make this accessible to lab techs. And like you said, burnout is a is huge across the board. With all you know, members of. I might have experienced everything you might have. So it's great. And to get with like minded individuals, it's, you know, we've we've run into each other at, you know, lab day up in Chicago at midwinter. And why is it such a great event? Because all of us crazy dental lab people can get together and talk lab. And this is a great environment where it's a safe environment, it's a fun environment, and it's just a great opportunity for a day of learning not only locator and locator fixed, but just continuing in dentistry. And like Todd said, is the outcome is helping patients and improve their quality of life. And that's what we want to do as dental clinicians and us too, like just being able to get away and be with like minded people. Absolutely. I think that's really nurturing it. Absolutely. So, so yes, that's the environment we wanted to create and works to create. So, you know, if anybody has any questions, they can even visit our website, which is very easy. It's zest zest. So I want everyone to go visit Zest Comm. They can find the education tab. Find this course that lab mastership course. Enter that promo of voices lab to get that $100 off. Or even a tad mention. We love it! Great online resources for education. We have that chat function on our website. They can even type in and speak to somebody directly with tech support. That's huge. So we want to just be available. We want everybody clinicians, lab techs, dental assistants. Well, I'm going to do my best at night dental here in Oldsmar, Florida. I know my son wants to go. So we're in. Thank you. Sign. Awesome. And I will look forward to myself and Todd and John Madden. Look look forward to welcoming you to Las Vegas on October. John Madden's the ball. Yeah yeah he has we're we're excited. We have a great program and we call on you look forward to seeing everybody there. Well, the question that I know that's on Barb's mind right now is how far away is this facility from the strip. Oh, so we're looking we're looking at right of our board was not there looking I wasn't, you know, maybe 20 years ago obviously, but now now I'm sending my son, for crying out loud, he's 27. Perfect, perfect. Or if you're going to come this chaperone. So I expect it to be here as well. Yeah. I mean, that's a great question to come back without his mom. Yeah. Thank you. Elvis. Appreciate you. Well, Todd. Amy, thank you so much. We appreciate it. You know, I'm a big fan of the locator. Love me some over dentures. I love that you're doing the education, not just for laboratory. I mean, that's great, but, man, you got a lot of work ahead of you with this clinician, so thank you. We absolutely do. And Elvis and Barbara, thank you so much for having us on. We appreciate it. Yeah that was super. Thank you and your dedication to the learning locator. So thank you so much. All right well I guess Barb we'll see you there in October. Third out. All right. Let's go. See you all later. Have a great night. Thank you. Bye bye. And a big thanks to Todd and Amy for coming on our podcast and talking about David Bowie. I mean, your laboratory master program. Just saying, this sounds like an amazing course for anybody that does any kind of full arch cases, even if you don't work on over dentures. Just think a course just for lab people and it's Vegas. Like super cool Vegas. What could go wrong? I don't know what could go wrong, but it might go wrong. They say what happens in Vegas stays in Vegas. A bunch of lab people in Vegas, huh? Oh, it happens on October 11th, which is, what, like three weeks away? It's close. Link to register on this episode. Show notes. So don't forget to use the Code Voices lab guys. $100 off. Let's go. And thank you for doing that. Says so, guys. $100 off. Let's go. All right everybody. That's all we got for you. And of course we will go next week. Have a good week, y'all. Bye. See ya. And they are. Stop. Oh hold on, I'm laughing. Okay, go. The views and opinions expressed on the voices from the Bench podcast are those of the guest, and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the host or voices from the bench, LLC.