Hello, Voices from the Bench community. John Wilson here, and I wanted to share some news about the evolution of the Programill lineup. Most importantly, Ivaclair's new Programill 7. What stands out right away is the reduced air consumption this mill requires, but what you'll notice first is that impressive new touchscreen. For us, the biggest advantage has been increased spindle power. You know, my laboratory's known for these larger cases with complex geometries, and I can tell you, That extra power really makes a difference. Next time you see your Ivaclair representative, be sure to ask about the Program 07 and tell them John Wilson sent you. Thank you.
All right, Barb, we've officially made it to Mallorca for Exocad Insights.
Yes, I know. Somehow we're going to power through it, Elvis.
I know it's tough, but as promised, I finally tracked him down. Feel it! Felix, how are you?
I'm great, I'm great. Hey guys, I'm really happy to finally connect.
Yeah, absolutely.
So, you're here as an Exocad dealer. What is your take on the meeting so far?
Honestly, it's been great. Great turnout, a lot of familiar faces. Always nice to see what Exocad is working on, and we're very excited to bring these new features to our customers.
Is there something that stood out to you?
Well, one for sure is the Exocad Hub. It's a new cloud-based service, and also really excited To see that the AI services are not on the dental DB, yeah, we're still digging into the details, but as you can tell, there's a lot of things that still need to be worked on. We'll definitely use it in our milling center when it's ready.
Nice. That's really great. It sounds like a common rollout strategy for Imagine. Would you agree with that?
Yeah, for sure. Any of these new products that come out, especially from Exocad, we like to use them in our own production facility before we release them. Then for our support team, it's much easier to support our customers. And for ourselves to use those features as well, it's very beneficial to them.
You know, that totally makes sense. So for you... What's the real value of being here other than the beach being across the street?
Other than being in Mallorca, of course.
Yeah, I mean, obviously it's great to see everyone in person, especially our partners. We don't really usually get to have conversations with them, so it's good to see them without the e-mail or video calls.
Oh, for sure.
So Elvis and I totally agree. We do love face-to-face. Love these meetings.
Yeah, for sure, for sure. It's good to take a step back for a minute, see what's going on and... Not just do the day-to-day stuff that you do at work.
Yeah, plus it's not too bad of a place to do it, Andy.
Yeah, not bad at all. Not bad at all.
All right, let's get back to it.
All right, man. It's good to see you, Felix. I'm really looking forward to getting you on our full episode interview.
Here in the next couple weeks.
One hour, an hour. Yep, I appreciate, guys. I'm looking forward to it as well.
Thank you. Enjoy Mallorca.
Welcome to Voices from the Bench, a dental laboratory podcast. Send us an e-mail at info at voicesfromthebench.com and follow us on Facebook and Instagram. Greetings and welcome to episode 424 of Voices from the Bench. My name is.
And my name's Barbara, and I wish I had a Spanish way of saying that, but I don't.
I was there for two weeks and learned no Spanish, so...
Really? I bet you ate good.
Oh, I... I ate so good. So this is our first time back talking on an episode after Insights 2026 in Mallorca, Spain. What an amazing event.
You know, when you say amazing, like it doesn't even do it the justice. Like the people, the event, the arena, the country, the food, like it was just ridiculous.
Everything.
I am just so grateful. And you and I had some *** *** interviews. It was so much fun.
We talked to a ton. of people. We actually got to talk to a few past guests, which was cool. And we got to meet a whole bunch of new guests. So all sorts of great episodes from the Exocad Insights 2026 is coming up.
I will have to say the highlight was when you met the gentleman that brought your computer back to us. That was like the happiest occasion and so sincere. Can you please remind me of his name?
Jamie Marano.
Hi, Jamie. I hope you're You're listening. You're the bomb diggity. Thank you for coming by and giving us a hug. That was so cool.
Yeah, that was amazing to see him. My biggest regret is, you know, we saw each other and then we're like, hey, I'll see you around this weekend. And then I never did.
I know. That's because there were so many people. The event was sold out plus some. Like you didn't really run into a whole lot of people twice.
They said that people actually bought plane tickets, got hotel rooms, and couldn't get in because it was so packed.
And I'll say, it truly was. Like, there was people from every country almost. Just amazing.
Yeah. Way to go, Exocad. Yep. Fantastic job, yet again, to the people that know how to do a party right.
On.
But this week, we're actually starting the conversations that we got at the show, well, before this one in Spain, the DLAT, or the Dental Laboratory Association of Texas. Now, Barb, I know we mentioned this before about how impressed we are with this local.
Board run show and press doesn't even do it.
Let's say it again. They did an amazing job.
Yep.
And the times I do talk to vendors, I tell them, man, this is one of the most crowded exhibit halls I've seen in a long time.
No doubt, easily.
That's a lot because these vendors are what makes the show possible. And if people don't go to the exhibit hall, they stop going.
And we need the vendors.
We do.
Yeah.
Again, amazing show. But you know what? Let's get to some of these amazing people we got to talk to in this lone star state.
Okay.
So first up is an ex-ortho technician that wants to take social media to the next level, Jason Dias. But Jason isn't doing it alone. Clyde is coming with him.
Nice.
So who's Clyde? Well, he's the ortho outlaw. Jason comes on to talk about his journey that started in California and with a few different labs, eventually brought him to Tennessee. And with his new vision with Ortho Outlaw, he plans to share knowledge and product reviews to the ortho world.
I gotta tell you, he's got the best marketing dude ever. I brought one of his shirts back to a couple of my techs at work, and they wore them and loved them. So just a little plug there. Then we are visited by a great technician celebrating his 45th year, 45th year, I'll say it twice, as a CDT, Jim Collis. Jim is always a treat when he stops by to talk about what he's working on. And let's just say it's some cool printing stuff, stories from his early days of his career and a TV show with the Fonz and Captain Kirk. I know you love that Elvis, right? That's real. So you never know what Jim's up to. So join us as we chat with Jason Dias and Jim Collis.
Voices from the bench. The interview. Happy to be at the DLAT DLAT 2026.
Yep.
Ortho Outlaw.
Ortho Outlaw. I got to say you got an amazing marketing because I love that picture on the back.
Thank you so much.
Every time I see you walk by, I'm like, damn, that's ******.
Thank you so much.
You got to put a picture of that somewhere on Instagram.
We'll get it out there. Yeah, it's really cool. What's your name? Clyde, right?
Well, Ortho Outlaw is Clyde.
Oh.
So I just ride with Clyde. That's going to be his social media.
How did he come up with Clyde?
I don't know. It just came to me one day. I was putting it together. I have them in the Western theme where you put your face through and take a picture. And it's just like, I thought about coming out with a female version some days. So every Clyde needs his Bonnie, Bonnie and Clyde. I don't know. It just kind of came together.
I love it. Remind me, what's your name?
Jason.
Jason.
Jason Diaz out of Northern California. Diaz.
Diaz. Jason Diaz. And you're out of California.
Yeah, not now. I used to be. That's where my lab are. You're in Tennessee. Tennessee, Knoxville, Tennessee. Yeah.
Let's start over. How does one even get into this? Give us your story, how you even got into that.
From way back.
You were way back, 1998, maybe, 99. I was dating a girl. I had a city job. I was a construction worker, per se, a street department. And she was doing Crozettes. I don't know if you all know what that is. Crozettes, it's a old school appliance. Yes.
That's it. Jay does them.
Yeah, they're very rare. Yes, very rare. Very rare these days.
I've never met anyone else that did that.
Yeah, she so she was working for a. She was an assistant, and she'd bring him home and bend him on the table. She's a great wire bender.
Yeah.
And got to talking one day, and she goes, you know, I have to take these back to the doctor's office to solder them and finish them. She's like, if I had my own equipment, I could make more money. And back then, we're young. obviously we need money. And I was like, what do we need? A torch, this and that. So long story short, we end up getting the equipment, put it into our garage, started making a little more money doing that. And she's like, you know, he's wanting other appliances, Holly retainers and stuff. I knew nothing about nothing. I'm a construction worker. I knew about asphalt and potholes. So anyway, We put it on the garage. I picked up on the acrylic side of things. Like I said, she's amazing why I've.
Been there to this day. Yeah.
And we started off, we were broke. We started off with all the wrong equipment. Literally A Dremel with a cord coming out and the burrs wouldn't quite fit in there. We'd wrapped scotch tape around them.
Oh my God.
And if you don't do that just right, those burrs wobble. And it showed in our work, honestly. Looking back, looking back, it did. A bench grinder from Walmart. You know, I'd look at the stuff. I'm that guy. Look at it. I go, I get that. I get that at Sears, you know? And so we did all that. Looking back, it was terrible. But We're in the Central Valley of Northern California, so we had Sacramento above us in the Bay Area to the west of us. And so there's a big market to pull from.
Was there a lot of ortho labs in that area?
Not really. There were some big ones. TP Orthodontics was in my town for a long time. but no, not a bunch. I mean, small, you have one lady, she would do them out of her garage, I think, too, and she had enough accounts. And so there was work. And trust me, our work turned away a few people because we were using the wrong equipment. But we kept going. We didn't give up. She knew it really well. She taught me. I really love the acrylic side of things. So I picked up on that and we just kept going and we'd get some accounts and lose some to quality looking back.
Well, what do you have the Walmart brand?
Yeah, the Dremel, yeah. So, And it just started taking off for us. And when we seen what kind of money we could make in it, we said, let's get serious about this. And that's what we did. We went from one garage to another garage, and then we finally rented a suite in Stockton, California. And it just kept going.
So you went into business together?
Oh, yeah.
Are you still with her? No. Okay, I was going to say.
She's still great. The lab's still running, great girl, amazing wire binner. I don't think she bends wires much anymore, but Yeah, she, that lab's still going, successful, and kept learning along the way.
Did you hire employees or was it always just you?
So it was her and I. So it was weird how it worked out. I actually got fired from my job. Yeah. And so.
Because you were focused on the.
Kind of. Yeah. I dumped a bunch of asphalt one day and they're like, you can't do that. I won't go all into that, but I got fired. And so honestly, it was heaven sent because that firing is what I was like, look at this. We got to do something. We got to do something. And she agreed. And so I went full time 1st and started getting more accounts. I mean, we are.
Were you into sales too? Were you like going into offices and stuff? How the hell did you get?
That's what I was just going to tell you. want to know how? The fax machine. We were faxing in like flyers to these guys. To random ortho.
Well, yeah, you were.
I mean, you're talking 98, 99, so there wasn't big on emails and all that. I think we were on AOL dial-up, you know, and it just wasn't a thing. We did do some door-to-door, but the fax machine on there.
What was the name of your lab at the time?
J&J.
Okay.
J&J Ortho Lab.
So wait a minute. You would just find the fax number of an orthodontist and just send. Yeah, it's genius. I didn't ask.
Oh no. All.
Of a sudden their machines going off, they're going, what did I get?
Yeah, and it's me. Hi. Yeah, it worked out. It actually worked out. It was a surprise. Like I said, it was so far back. I was too nervous. I didn't know. Doctors just scared the crap out of me back then. I was too nervous to walk in and she was still working full time, but it worked.
How did you get the work into the lab? Do you have a driver?
Yeah, we go pick it up. A lot of times I'd send her because she knew the field and then I slowly got comfortable in it. But when you articulator, like I'm like, what the hell is articulator? So just little things like that. Once you get in it longer, you start to get more comfortable. Yeah, got to be around it.
So way back then, so it was all impressions. So you had to pour everything.
Yeah, usually they came poured. Yeah, but like I said, as we grew, a lot of stuff started coming in by mail too, because Sacramento is about 45 minutes, Bay Area with traffic's out. Without traffic, it's only a couple hours. But broken teeth, gluing them back together. I mean, we went through all this stone model age.
Did you answer, did you hire people?
Eventually. Eventually. So she ended up quitting because we had enough work and coming on full-time. So it was just her and I for a few years. And then TP Orthodontics was in the same town and they were great at training people. And so we had a couple. We ended up hiring, let's see. two more people, another wire bender, acrylic person, sometimes shipping and receiving. It just depends on how busy we were.
So you guys got pretty big pretty quick.
It was steady. And that's what we wanted. We didn't want to have too much work and not be able to do it and all that good stuff. So we definitely, it was definitely trial and error, bumps and bruises, learning along the way. And I mean, here I am, what, almost 27 years later. So, after that lab, I was thinking about getting out of this field, honestly, and digital.
Why were you thinking?
I don't know.
Doing what?
I don't know.
Going back to construction.
No, trucking. I actually owned a couple big rigs for a while. I have a Class A license, so yeah, I was like, Yeah, I just want out, you know?
I don't know. I can tell you there are many days while I'm out and about and I see a truck and I say to myself, Man, you do not have to deal with dentists and patients and... Just on my own, driving. Yes, cruising the highway. I'm sure it's got its own problem.
And mine was a dump truck and a backhoe. Just let me dig in the dirt. Dump trucks.
Yeah, that's freaking awesome.
So yeah, and I thought about it and then digital scanning came out. I was like, oh wow, this is really cool.
You were intrigued.
Yeah, I was very intrigued. And I was like, oh wow, we could get it on the screen now. You know, what's all this? So it kind of sucked me back in. We got a desktop scanner. Next thing you know, Long story short, we ended up opening another lab in Lodi, California.
That's like a satellite.
No, I was on my own at that point.
Oh, you left there?
Okay, yeah, I left J&J and then that came out. We're gonna try to do just scanning for folks. I don't know if you remember study models. Yes, study models were in basements and attics and... all over the place, storage sheds full of these things. I'm like, hey, we could get them on a hard drive for you.
So your idea is you go into these offices that have a basement full of models and scan them all?
And then they get rid of them.
Yep, get rid of them, because now they're in the cloud or on a- How successful was that? It was decent. It wasn't bad. We had a guy drop off, I mean, boxes and boxes, because I think in California, they got to keep them 14 years.
Wow.
Yeah. And a couple dentists, we know, they have to rent storage sheds. So not anymore. Them days are gone.
Yeah.
Yeah. So back then we're like, we're just going to do, we're going to stay digital. So it was digital.
What was the name?
Digital Ortho Pros. Okay. Yeah.
What standard did you start with?
The three shape. I don't remember the model number, but the basic, the, the $17,000 one that was the lowest one they sold. You know, so. But.
You were just scanning. You weren't designing.
You weren't building anything. Just.
That's got to be pretty.
Seamless, it was, it was decent, it was really decent, and so I started running across some of my old customers and, like, Why aren't you making appliances? Like, you're really good at it. What are you doing? Why aren't you doing it? And there's plenty of work around there for everybody, and I said, Okay, and I ended up with another gal. She was a... Dental assistant as well, so she knew all the terminology, this and that, and entrepreneur as well, she really is, and so we opened another lab. Wow, Orthodontic Lab Pros.
So, did you keep both segments?
No, we kind of combined them together slowly but surely. Okay, we're gonna combine them together and... I mean, here we are today. And again, opening a lab, big, beautiful lab. I love building them, construction guy, right? I love building them, putting all the systems in place, dust collection, lighting, whatever we need, plugs, we've moved walls, we've done flooring, I mean, done the whole thing.
That's a talent in itself.
Yeah, it is. It's fun. I like that part. And then, you know, I think every lab owner will tell you, as time goes on, you just get a little burnout. It gets monotonous. Yeah. It just is what it is, So.
You got to keep that flame going somehow, right?
What's done it for me is technology. Yeah. That's what keeps sucking me back in. I moved to Knoxville, Tennessee. I had two goals. I want to learn how to fish and I want to learn how to golf. And I thought maybe I wanted to buy some storage units and just not have to deal with doctors and, you know, the staff and deadlines and blah, blah, blah. But here I am. So long story short, we have a great lab. It's going. The wire bender's coming. So the AOS wire bender is down in Florida. And so I'm the guy, I like to go put my hands on it before I buy it. But we're like, you know, we only have one wire bender and we could do more. Let's check it out. So I go down to Florida, start talking to those guys. It turned out really good. And I told him, I was like, yeah, I'm thinking about leaving the field. You know, I told Constantine, the owner, and he's like, no, you can't. You can't leave the field. We can't. Yeah. And so again, here I am. And you know what? Going to OrthoOutlaw, what got me into that? When I went to buy that machine, that was a $90,000 machine at the time, right? So I'm looking online, I'm looking for videos, I'm looking all over the place. There wasn't a zero. So if you're going to spend, we didn't end up paying 90 for it, because they come down, I think, to 60-something thousand, but you're going to spend that kind of money. You want to do some research, and there was none. After Constantine got in my ear, and I just kept thinking about it, I was like, Man, here we are again, you know, desktop scanning. Now we got the automated wire benders are amazing.
They are, they're.
Amazing.
Fascinating just to watch.
Yeah, just to watch. And so we ended up buying that, set it all up, and Constantine's like, You should come to Germany, join us at IDS and these other shows, Chicago, Lab Days West, blah, blah. So that's what I did last year is when I started. I traveled all over the country, Germany. I did Philly, I did Southern California.
Just going to meetings and meeting people and seeing what was out there.
Yep, and just like.
You had never done that.
No. Wow. No, I still, in fact. Where'd I start? I started at Chicago last year, went to Germany. I got a direct flight from Germany to here to this show. I came in about a week early, had some time to rest, and I just started meeting people. Some of these people...
That's why we weren't at the show last year, because we were in Germany.
Yeah, I came straight to this hotel and slept for about a week. Yeah, I bet.
That meeting's a ball bust.
Yeah, And you know, you deal with people like Priscilla, JBC acrylic.
Yeah.
Talk to her on the phone for over 20 years. Never met her.
Yeah.
You know, Kate Tippett. I see his videos. He was a great guy, great channel, and never met him. And I just come through here and started roaming around. And back up real quick, in Germany, I was thinking, my cousin's an influencer, right? And he's like, you should really put some of this stuff in. And the goal was to get some video of at least the wire bending machines and new technology, right? Any kind of new AI, anything that's going on in our field that's exciting and could help people. For many reasons, and we'll get into that in a minute. That was the whole goal. I was in Germany talking to some guys. I go, I have a couple names in mind. I said, maybe Lab Daddy or Ortho Outlaw. Ortho Outlaw all day. So when I got here last year, Ortho Outlaw is like, I think I'm going to run with that. That's kind of my mentality my whole life.
But what was your vision for Ortho Outlaw?
Just to bring some videos and content.
So all social.
All social, no distributor too. So I do have another company that's a distribution company, Orthodontic Lab Solutions. So that was the goal at the time. time. And then the more I run with this ortho outlaw thing, it just keeps going and going and going. I am a distributor for some great products out on the market. And I'm just like, man, what do I want to do? And I keep coming to these shows. It's like, well, I've had some guys hit me up like Sunstone Laser Welders. We're going to team up at AAO in Florida, and I'm going to be in their booth. So I'm like, maybe brand ambassador. I don't know, a distributor. Yeah, I don't know. It's still kind of in the works. Y'all let me know.
The ortho outlaw marketing is amazing.
How did this whole image? I mean, we're on a podcast, but it's a skull with some teeth and braces. Very.
I got to be very honest. My cousin's an influencer. He has a few million followers.
Influencer of what?
You know, he started with video games. And I used to give him a hard time. I'm like, what the hell are you doing?
And now he's right.
I was like, well, he would do. like SEO, marketing, ROI. So any kind of SEO to bring more business to your plate. I go, keep doing that. What are you doing? This kid made 250 grand the first year playing video games on the damn internet. And I was like, okay, cousin, my bad. My bad. I'm out. Yeah, okay. Yeah, you proved old man wrong. Yeah, he's a lot younger than me. And I was like, okay, I'm old and stupid. This is what it is. So anyway, he helped me and I wanted.
He helped you design it.
The first part, just the head. I did this Recently, but I'm liking the hands. Yeah, I snuck that in there. I always do that on the start of my videos. I don't know, it's just one of my things, but at first he didn't have braces. I had a kid redo that logo, put a lot more detail in it. He just had a retainer, a Holly retainer at first, and And now this is the he's just rolled out at this show. This is his first show.
Do you sell your?
Yeah, I do have merch.
I need it.
Yeah. Ortho outlaw merch.com. And there's a men's and women's line there. It's fairly new. And so I did register the name. It's A registered trademark, Ortho Outlaw. Good call. Yeah, and so there'll be more designs rolling out slowly. Again, I have to rely on the younger people. They tell me, don't roll out a bunch of designs right away. So there's some great stuff on there. There's accessories, phone cases, shirts, cups, hats, good stuff like that. So.
And where do you post most of your stuff? Is it Instagram or?
All of them, yeah. All that Ortho Outlaw. Yeah, Instagram, Facebook.
So what do you come up? How do you get your content? Like what do you, obviously the shows, but if you don't have a show, what are you thinking of?
Product reviews. So the goal was to bring it, not just in our lab, but other labs, bring equipment in, unbox it, get it running, see how that goes, come back, maybe get it all set up and running, come back maybe three months later, six months later, and see how it did. Yeah. And I already have some equipment that's been given to me, basically.
So now they're coming to you saying, hey, can you put this in a lab? Yeah.
One of them was a wire bending machine. It never came through because they ended up in a patent lawsuit. So it still might come through, $70,000 machine. They're like, we'll ship it to you for six, 8 months, try it out, see how it goes, put it on tape. So that's the goal. So you're.
Not really at the bench right now.
No, I consider myself. So when I'm moving, when I moved, like I told you all earlier, when I moved out of California, I moved out of there for obvious reasons for me. And it was time to leave California, right? Born and raised, love it, but it was time to go. And so when I went to Knoxville, Tennessee, I said, I only thing I have in California left is a Harley. That's it. And it's time to get out of there. And How'd you pick Knoxville? A lot of research in, yes, yeah, a lot of research in Tennessee in general. It's flooded with Californians. Flooded, those poor people. Oh, yeah, It's mostly Californians moving in there. And New York and Chicago.
That's because it's so beautiful.
Yeah, their real estate's went up 60% in six years though. Damn. Yeah, so I love it out there. I forget what you asked me. I'm sorry, to begin with.
I don't know.
He was looking up your merch.
Yeah, I was just checking it out on social media. I think it's cool. I mean, it looks like you're everywhere.
Yeah, I get around.
Yeah, doing all sorts of videos, talking to everybody.
Yeah, it's awesome.
That looks like IDS.
Yeah, there's some B-roll there. And like you said, you got to have a little more content. So it just started last year at ORG, so it's about a year old. I had a few months off, so that's why there's not more content, but there's more coming. Sure. 100% more coming. We're on strong. Our trademark went through and we're good to go now. Wow. So. That's pretty sweet. The lab's still running in California. I'm not there. I consider myself, I guess, a retired. Lab guy, not really.
Well, yeah, okay, retired lab guy, definitely not retired.
Yeah, no, I'm gonna run with this and see how it goes, and it's honestly, it's fun. I get to meet folks like you and everybody else here. It's a great community. I think ORG is, it's been great because back in the day when I started... There wasn't one lab owner that wanted to talk to another lab owner. That you consider that competition. I'm not going to give you my secrets. Oh, don't even look at who my doctors are. Yeah, And this group has come together and just, it's been great. And I think.
And it's the only one in the world, they said.
Yeah, And I think it was when 3D printing came out and people were confused. They were absolutely confused, and they put this together, and you could ask questions: Hey, what software do you use for this, and what software do you use for that? And that's kind of the point of this whole Ortho Outlaw in the videos, too. A lot of us are older, like myself, and these kids pick it up really fast with the new technology. That wire bending machine, we have a kid running it. I stopped by Specialty Labs, too, and he showed me his first, right?
Yeah.
He has a gamer in there. This kid's click, click, click, click, click, click. He could do like a labial bow on a Holly in like 30-something seconds, design it on screen. And so, and that got me thinking, too. It's like, you know, us older folks, a lot of people shut their lab down, and that's terrible. They should be able to keep up with technology, bring some, even though we're older, you could still learn it. You really can. If you take the, if you have the patience, to sit down and learn it. It's a little frustrating at first, some of it. Even the software was a little difficult at first, but you'll get it. And then you're adding value to your lab, right? And then maybe you have something to sell. Don't they shut, I see a lot of people shut them down. And they're like, you know, who's going to take it over with the old school analog ways? I mean, I think everybody's 3D printing now, but if you bring in automated wire benders and anything else that could help you, they're printing night guards now. you add value, not just to your business, but the younger generation that might buy it from you. Go, hey, I could do this. I could run a computer. So that's how it all came about. And that's kind of where we're at. And we're going to keep pushing forward and try to help other folks out too. Just honestly, it was just because of that video, a lack of videos for the wire vending machine. And when you're investing that much, you really want to do your research. They were the only one in the game at that point. And I'm doing more videos because there's three out. They're here this year. I did a video last year and they've all three come a long way since then and I'll just keep doing content on that so people have a resource.
So you're showing them how to use these machines?
I've shown them basically the ins and outs of them. So I call it like the battle of the wire bending machines. Just showing them the different price points, the different features. Some take straight wires, some take rolled wire.
And you're doing this unbiased, right? I mean.
I own the AOS, but I always say that on my videos. I own this, but I'm being unbiased. Yeah. I have to be. I mean, I can't.
It's the only way to give a decent review. Yeah.
And they all have their strong points, and some of them have their weak points. I want to expose that in the right ways, but last year there was a couple that were fairly new, so it was really hard to... I'm going to go do some interviews with them here in a little bit. And they've added to them and they've answered questions.
They probably listened to your videos and said, damn, man, we got to get better.
Especially the straight wires. The guy over there, he's got 48 inch straight wire now. I said, well, that'll shut some people up on it.
Because I've only seen one in a lab and had a huge spool behind it and just constantly just ran through it. I was fascinated by it. I don't know anything about wire bending, but seeing that machine work is just like, I could watch it for hours.
Isn't it cool when it actually bends? Yeah, I love taking tape of that. and putting it up because it's the coolest. When it came out, I was just fascinated. No way. I have to go to Florida and see that. Well, I stopped by and seen Orleans first. But it's a younger generation, too. I mean, we all know that. That's the future. And, you know, the analog stuff is kind of going away.
Yeah.
You know, this is a dying, dying breed. I lost art, you know. There's not, it's really hard to find wire benders on our side on the ortho side of things.
All labs have that issue in some aspect, but we gotta turn the digital into the new art.
That's what it's gonna have to be. Yeah, I was talking to Arlen too. He's like, the schools that are actually still existent, they're closing.
Not many, I know.
They're just not teaching anymore. That's so true. Yeah, so you're gonna have to embrace this. You really are. And here I am. I'm going to try to help you embrace it.
I don't know which one to get. And it.
Keeps you fresh, too, because you're actually still staying in it. Because you got to learn how to do it and wins in the outs.
Correct. At this point. So I gave up on the storage units for now, but I'm still learning how to fish and golf. That's a tough one.
You golf at this thing.
I went out there yesterday.
We heard it was a blast.
It was a blast. Yeah. I got some good footage out there, but I was a golf cart guy. Yeah.
And a beer.
Yeah, beer.
My dad was a golfer and he was more of a golfer than a drinker.
Yeah. So awesome. It's great guys. Well, I appreciate it.
Congratulations. Thanks for coming over.
Yeah. It's cool.
I just love the image and what you're doing.
Yeah. And I'm going to add to him. So Ride with Clyde, obviously I have this cardboard cutout life-size and we have the one you put your face in and I'm going to keep putting him up on the website and stuff with different shows and different. different people taking pictures and I could see him maybe getting taken down to the bar area later.
Exactly.
You know what I mean?
That's how you blow things up though. Yeah, we're going to have fun.
We're going to have fun with Clyde. So we did a little skit coming here. Where's Clyde? Where's Clyde? I just found him here. He's here waiting for me. I love it. Awesome. Yeah. But thank you guys so much for having me. It's really an honor. It really is. You guys are great. Everything you do. I hope to do it again sometime as we involve. I'll see you at other shows.
Oh yeah, you're going to see me wearing a shirt. Guaranteed.
I'm not kidding. 100%. That's great. That's great. It supports all the traveling and hotels and things like that.
Yeah, we understand.
Oh yeah, you do. Same type of gig. Yeah. And brand ambassador, I have some people like, hey, you know, I want to do this and that. Will you help me push my brand? So that's coming to you. Like I said, Sunstone, Sunstone laser welder and stuff like that.
Sky's the limit.
Cool. Thank you. Good luck. Let's hope.
We appreciate it.
Awesome.
Thanks, man.
Thank you, guys.
See, I added five for you.
Thank you.
Hey, guys.
Everyone is super excited to be back at the second day of the DLAT show. Yes, sir. What an amazing first day. Yep.
Was it great?
It was great.
I had a three-hour hands-on course yesterday.
Oh, wow. That's why we didn't see you.
Yeah, I got here. I started it. I got here at 1230 to start it.
Jim Collis, by the way.
Yeah, we have a new shoot. Jim Collis. Don't tell anybody in here.
Jim Collis, old friend from the podcast. Three-hour hands-on.
Yeah, it was great. Yeah. What was it? It was on 3D printing and naturalized indenture bases. and how to transition from analog into 3D printing. And there were, oh, we had, it was a hands-on, so 12 people's a lot. Yeah, that's a good size. And we had a full course, and there were a couple people that were hanging out just watching.
Oh, wow. Yeah.
Give me some of the key points, like if I'm new and I'm thinking of going from analog to digital. How do you help somebody?
The first thing that you have to do is figure out what exactly it is you want to do. Just because, and nothing against salesmen, I think, you know, this industry has some, oh no wonder I'm stepping on this thing, it's just pulling my head.
The worst thing about this setup is the cords.
So, you know, there's a lot of great salesmen in this industry, full of knowledge. And they come to you and they say, you got to go, everybody's going digital, you got to do this, you got to do this. But they don't do the printing themselves. And just because they have a 3D printer, they throw it in your office. They don't do that, they help you, but they put it in your office or your laboratory. And then you're standing there with your hands wide open, what do I do with it? So you have to educate yourself, it just takes time going to courses. Looking things up online, and whenever somebody, whenever I have a question, because I have a lot of questions, I'm not that smart.
You are.
I always go to YouTube before I call anybody. I go to YouTube, and chances are there's 1000 answers to your questions, because there's a lot of people that can't stand in front of people. but they can stand behind a camera and they do an unbelievable job of teaching.
Sure, yeah.
So I go to YouTube. So I would recommend people go to YouTube and whatever your lab specializes in. If it's removables, go and type in removable 3D printing, designing 3D printing, you know, things like that. And you know, if you're going to go all full blown.
Are you talking about every single product when you say full-blown?
Yes, you're talking about.
Not just specializing in, say, digital dentures.
Even if you're just going to go digital dentures, you know, full-blown. You've got software, which is, you know, 15 to 20 grand. You've got your 3D printer, if you're going to get a good one. I have three different ones in my office at home, which is a great thing now. You don't need a lot of space. I have Dreve, which I absolutely...
You have what?
A Dreve. Dreve is, it's a Frozen printer. It's certified by Dreve. They make them in Germany. Have you heard of them?
I've heard of Frozen.
Okay. Dreve is, I want to say, fairly new to the United States, but they've been worldwide. It's a great company. And I met... Dr. Dreit's daughter, she's wonderful, really, really smart. And the printer, it's a frozen printer, but certified by Dreve. Dreve made changes to it, and they manufacture it in Germany. So it's got a heater in it, it has an air filter in it, a lot of them do, but it has a camera inside of it too. So wherever you're at in the lab, or I can, if I was printing something back to Chicago, I can pull up the app and take a look at it.
Do you have a lab in your house? Sorry. Or do you just?
Use these in R&D, sort of. I guess a lab in my house for R&D.
Okay.
I'm not doing, I have like one client I do production work for, and I'm hardly busy with that at all because I don't want to be. But I do use it for case studies, which is really nice.
Sure. No, I was asking about this camera inside that printer. Is it like aimed up at the build plate so you can watch it?
It's kind of aimed up at the build plate.
Interesting.
So when it comes up, when it just starts to be at the top of the build plate, you can see it. And then you can watch it all the way up.
Oh, wow.
It's pretty cool.
It is pretty cool. It's a neat idea.
I saw that and I said, what is that? camera? And they said, yeah. And he pulls it up on his phone as it was printing. I'm like, that is so cool. That is neat. Not that you're going to use it a lot, but if you want to check on something, see how it's done. So back to if you're going to go full blown, say, removable, you got to buy software. Then you have to learn the software. Then you have to buy a printer. It's going to cost you $8,500 for a really good printer, save degree printer. Then you've got to buy a washing station. I don't use alcohol anymore. I'm worried about setting my whole building on fire or setting a lab on fire. So Dreed has a material. Harvest has a really good material for substitute for cleaning. And there's also another one called Rhino, which is just On the internet.
I did not know that. That's cool.
Yeah.
I'd rather use non-alcohol.
Oh, because the non-alcohol things are non-flammable. They're biodegradable. So you can pour it down in your sink and rinse it down and I don't have to worry about it.
That's huge.
Yeah.
Is it more expensive than alcohol or about the same or?
Rhino is not. No? Rhino was not. I think Harvest is a little more expensive and Dreeds is probably about the same price.
Okay.
But, you know, you have to weigh it out. And I have not done studies on which one is better yet. Sure. So I'm going to have to do that probably in the next couple of months because I have all of them, you know? So then you got your printer and you got your wash station. You don't have to buy a wash. I have the Dreve wash station. It's incredible. If you go to my LinkedIn or my YouTube, you'll see it. It's completely automatic. All you do is put the build plate on there. It moves over. The one bucket opens up, drops it in there. It comes up, it closes, it drips, goes to the next one, opens up. It's so cool to see this thing. Yeah. And then it drips. And I always put a cloth under it when it's dripping for the final drip, the other drip, drips, drips, drips, into the buckets. So take the build plate off, rinse it off, and take the parts off. It's just incredible. I have dropped the tops of wash machines into my vat with my material. I'm clumsy. So I absolutely love that. And I do a fair amount of printing, so for me, it works. Yeah. Then you got your wash machine. Your wash machine, you can buy, you don't have to buy the same brand. I do recommend the Dreve, but the photo wash, but you can buy a smaller, smaller washing machine that has the dirty and the clean bath. So now you're all in and it's gonna cost you about 20, 25 grand. What you can do, there are options. You can just source out your designs, You can use Argan, you can use Three Shape. They will design your crowns, your bridges, your dentures through Three Shape Automate.
Which actually is such a huge benefit. I mean, if you don't know how to design or you don't want to add that expense and have to learn it, ship it out.
The really cool thing is for doctors now, because I was in Utah working with a doctor, and he He has Exocad and he wanted to use designing, but his assistant was having a hard time learning it.
Yeah.
She's really great at it now, better than I am. But...
Those kids.
Yeah, yeah, really. Yeah. She's like 20 years old and three minutes later she's a whiz at it. And here I am, like, you know, thumbing, texting. Yeah, that's me. Yeah. The three shape automate is incredible. So doctors, instead of buying the software, they can buy order forms.
Okay.
For 300 bucks, they get 1,200 order forms. Now, if you had, you know, 8 crowns on one order form, it's only one order form.
Interesting. Yeah.
So that's how they pay for the designs, by order forms.
No, I'll explain that. Okay. Instead of buying the software for the design, you buy an order form, so you don't have to have the design aspect.
Basically, you set it up, knowing you're not going to actually do the design, right.
Exactly. You tell it what you want it to do, because you have to figure that out. Just because it's AI doesn't know what you want it to do. So you set up your order form, and then you set it to 3Shape Automate. And then Automate will send you back like I did a three-unit bridge. It sends back the design. Now I have a PowerPoint that has it four times faster than it is. So it's like lickety-split, right? It was a three-unit bridge. It came back in three minutes and 45 seconds.
That's pretty remarkable. Was it right?
It was right. I was amazed. With that order form now, with Three Shape Automate, you're able to go in and tweak it and make changes with it at no extra cost.
Oh.
And then at the bottom, the very bottom in the bottom right, it says, if you like it, press here. It does not charge you until you press the button. It tells you exactly what you're going to pay for that crown. So those three units. Because we got them back in three and a half minutes. You can have, I think it's like within minutes, within like a couple hours or the next day.
Oh, you can choose your time frame and that's based on how much.
Yes. So if you're really, really cheap, you can get it back for like 3 bucks or 24 hours. But you know, you might be over the weekend and you don't care. You don't want to come in on Saturday. You just send it overnight. So That three-unit bridge was $8.04, so you press OK, and there's your STL file. You can mess with it and then press OK, or you can mess with it and say, Nah, I'm going home, and just hit cancel.
That's cool that they allow you to tweak it. You don't actually have the software.
Absolutely. And that's a that's a huge thing. So huge. So I use that all the time, you know, and they're now they're denture designing. Yes. That's usually like overnight.
And yeah, that's a whole lot.
And more expensive too. Yeah. It's like 30 bucks, isn't?
It? It's $25. Yeah.
Okay. Yeah.
But Again, you know, if a clinic, a clinician wants to get into it or a lab, like yesterday, he had a guy who said, God, I really like this printer. I'd like to buy it, but I don't want to pay for the software. I said, you don't have to. So a lab, you can buy your order forms and you can send in and, you know, I want this full upper or lower and they'll send you back the design.
Now, I don't know who came up with that. That's genius.
Are you able to tweak the denture designs with order form?
Yes.
Wow.
Yes, you can tweak them. You can't like totally design, redesign it, but you can tweak them. And for me, I think they're pretty close. And I always get in there and tweak everything. I, you know, I have to just get up and walk away because I'm always messing with whatever I do. It's not good enough. I look at that. That's beautiful. I take a picture now. I didn't see that.
That's why I can't design single units. I will never stop.
Yeah, I just get up and walk away at some point.
You have to.
Yeah. So it'll so it's going to wow this guy to buy a printer. He can buy a different kind of wash. He's got the lab in his house. There are no odors. People used to walk into my laboratory. Oh my God, the monomer. I said, what? What are you talking about? What smell?
You're dead to it.
And you can smell it, which is scary.
Yeah. And if you can smell it, it's in your body and it's loaded. I'm really lucky. I had cancer in my in my right kidney and luckily they got it and I'm fine. Good. You know, luckily. But now I keep checking because monomer is like one of the most toxic things on this planet.
Big time.
But when people walk into my condo, because I've had people come over and say, come on over, I got three different printers, take a look at them, and I'll print something on all of them. And they say, is there any odor? I said, do you smell anything? No, there you go. The only thing they would smell is the alcohol. And they don't use alcohol anymore. Nice. So they don't smell anything, which is really nice. So in my office, I've got, if you walk in and I've got a cart right here that is all the stuff that I use, little tools and all the resins and everything. I've got two big monitors, 29 inch monitors over here. I have two big ones over here. I have Axocad over here and I have my three shape over here. I do most of my stuff on three shape.
But you only have one client, you said, and you don't even like that. So you just, what do you do?
I do a lot of our trial and error.
He plays around. Like when you say R&D, does the companies ask you, hey, I want you to focus on this?
Yeah, like Drebe sent me some files and they said, well, will you print these up and let me know what you think? It was Crown and Bridge. Actually, it was my mouth because I scanned it.
Oh, cool.
I haven't met at 900. So I scanned it and they said, well, will you do those? Because we want to find out. if the dye was only an onlay in the back, if the dye fits in the model. So I said, Yeah, I would love to find out if the dye fits the model. 'Cause on Facebook, I see some of these people are so talented. They get all these big cases and stuff, and it's like, How are they doing that? So I printed it up, and in three shade, when you set it up, you've got the dye, and it prints everything, it has all the files, so I printed them up, and I cleaned everything up really well.
Without alcohol.
Without alcohol. That's cool. Yeah, I don't use alcohol anymore. And I think at that point, I was using a combination of Dreve and Harvest and even PatTet. I have them all in this thing.
All mixed together.
I'm sorry, guys. I love all of your company, so what do you want me to do? I love them all. So I just I was running out of one. I needed more. Finally got it to the top of the line and it was a combination of all three.
So you can just add them all and they're all...
It's probably not recommended.
It was just like Neopolitan.
Yeah.
Neopolitan. Neopolitan.
It's a suicide. Like the old sodas we used to get every flavor.
Yeah. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. I still do that. What are you talking about? My son would go into a 7-Eleven when he was, I took him for boxing lessons. His quarterback coach thought boxing lessons would be great for the footwork because he was 6 foot at the time in high school when he was a junior. He started, I got to brag a little bit, he was a starting quarterback from sophomore on. He only lost two regular season games of four years at starting quarterback. So he took him for boxing lessons. At the end of what?
Was the reason for that.
Footwork.
Just got to ask.
Footwork for footwork for quarterback, footwork. So by the end of his one hour lesson with this guy, I got to give you a lot of shout, Ray Franklin Street Boxing. Ray's an unbelievable coach. Brian Sarnes would be like this. So we would go like just hanging there. We would go next door to get the set to the 7-Eleven. to have the big Slurpees. And he would say, OK, first put in the blue, now put in the Coke, now put in the cherry, you know, Neapolitan, you know, and I'd have to carry it to the car because he couldn't lift his arm. He couldn't lift his arm.
Because he was so tired.
From the boxing and, you know, stuff like that. And his arms were just hanging there. Yeah. So Oh, the different materials.
You just threw them all in up to the top.
Yeah, and it worked. So the dye, it needed one tiny little adjustment. And I think that was like a connector was holding it up at the end. So I just buzzed that off and it slipped right down. And I'm like, wow, this is like really incredible. Now I know why all these guys are going crazy, thinking how much they love this stuff, right? So for a small laboratory to go digital, I think it's advantageous because they can have someone else do the design, get it back the next day. And when you think about it, you know, you're both lab technicians, you know, the case comes in. You might have to put a base on the model because, you know, doggone well that that doctor can't put a base. put a base on a model to say, well, they never do. Or you have to pour the impression. Then you got to trim it. Then you got to mount it if it's gone that far. Then you have to put a base on it. Then you have to set your teeth, you know, and all that's done for you overnight. And then if you like it, you just send it to the printer. And you've got, you know, you'll usually get two different vats, one for your tooth colored and one for your denture base. And that's it. Now, the Dreve also has a heated vent, which is pretty-- What does that do? It keeps the material at the optimum temperature. So what I do is I have a, Frozen makes a really great one, a resin mixer. Not only it tumbles it, but it wobbles it like this. I just bought a cheap one on Amazon, it was like 65 bucks. You put it in there, you turn it on, I put it on high, and it heats. up the bottle at the same time. And then you pour it into the heat of that and it stays at the optimum temperature for the whole print.
And what's the benefit of that if it's not at optimal temperature?
It'll be thicker and it might not stick to the build plate. It might stick to the bottom.
Yeah, I mean, every resin's got a different temperature. I mean, I use a lot of sprint rays in offices. And when you're going to print a full arch, if you don't preheat, You're adding like 15 minutes to that print because the thing goes, the build plate goes down and then it has to heat it up. I don't know.
And sometimes you hear a boing where it's pulling on the resin, on the, on the, on the FEP, the FEP screen. Don't ask me what FEP stands. So do you have to?
Like redo it if that happens.
Yeah, if it sticks to the FEP screen, you got to redo the whole print.
But most printers won't let you do it until it's at temperature. It won't be like, I don't know, maybe some of them.
No, no, it'll. Even the Dreve, he did that. Even with that, you put your material in. It'll print when you say print.
Oh, it will let you override that heat. Interesting.
Yeah, yeah, you just print and it goes to print. Now, last week I had the Sonic Frozen XL Plus, and this side printed. I was doing Keith for the course. I had 12 people, so I was making 12 ventures. This side of the theft printed of the plate, this side didn't. It's like, what the hell? So I did it again, but I moved this side of the teeth to this side so I had all the teeth. You know, at least five sets of teeth. And I'm like, why is that?
That's where the R&D comes in.
So I'm, yeah, this shows you where I'm at. I'm laying in bed this morning. I'm like, oh, I got it. You're kidding me. Oh, you know, I got it. When I, When you, you should always, always calibrate your printer every week. Or if you're doing a lot of printing, like some labs do it every day. The problem was, I calibrated it, and then when you're taking the, when you're chiseling off of the build plate, I have it laying on the knobs, and it's doing this. 'Cause I'm banging, I'm banging, and the screws are tight. But it's still, you know, it's just because something's screwed together doesn't mean it's going to hold it. And that's what happened because it did it evenly because as it's on an angle, the knobs are pushing down like that. Interesting.
And that came to you this morning.
I'm laying in bed this morning thinking, that's it. Out of the clear blue of that **** I have to recalibrate.
That is hilarious.
Yeah, yeah.
You might be a dental person.
I kind of hope not. Yeah, so the reason?
That we wanted to talk to you also is you announced that this is your 45 year CDT anniversary.
Congratulations. In September, I had no idea. I wasn't even counting the years. I know some people get off on that. I wasn't even counting the years. And I got this envelope in the mail and I'm thinking, oh, national board, can I pay my license fee? First thing came on my mind.
Am I in trouble?
Yeah, I said, wait a minute. No, I did pay it. I did pay it. I opened the envelope and there's a card and it had this little pin on it. I said, what the hell is this? And it said, congratulations on your 45 years as a CBT. And I don't wear it because I'm afraid of losing it. I don't know if they'd send me another one or not, but I have it on my life. in my office. It's sitting right there in the corner. I look at it every morning.
But it's meaningful for you. Can you tell us why? You know, we're advocates for certification.
I am too.
And I would love our listeners to hear after 45 years, why is it so meaningful still for you?
Well, as a CDT, you get to see a lot of different things that people that are not CDTs don't get to see. I remember taking my certification test at Brighton College, and that's where I went. You had to bring in your bench, you had to bring your whole lab. And I did really, really well. Not that I'm bragging, but one of the proctors told me that I was only the second one to receive, that he knew of to receive a perfect score in ventures.
Wow.
And the other guy was like in the military. If you go out of the military, they get unbelievable training there. So I felt really proud of that because I didn't do well in school. I flunked third grade because I was always in trouble. I didn't really care about school. But something hit me when I was at Triton College that I remember there was a bubble, simple, stupid thing. There's a bubble in the model light port. And I'm like, I'm not going to report this because the teacher wanted me to report. As a matter of fact, this is really cool. I got to thank my Denture and Crown and Bridge instructor three weeks ago. I hunted his name down. I haven't talked him since I graduated.
Wow.
And he's still around.
47 years ago. Al McKinner. Al, if you're listening to this, Al Bly, too, my best buddy. I hunted him down. This is what he did to me in school. There's a rumor going around that he threw his sister out of school. She was in school. And I'm here to tell everybody it's true because she sat next to me.
Was she no good?
He just said she wasn't any good. I can tell she wasn't any good.
This is not your, this isn't your cup of tea.
Yeah, you said, I just, she just doesn't have the hands. She was a mess, but nice person. So the day before, we were supposed to turn in our Crown and Bridge model, and Dole Morozic, Jesse Brett, and Paul Nadeau, They were in class with me. I'm still in touch with those guys to this day. I would copy from Bill. Well, Jesse would copy from Bill, Paul would copy from Jesse, and I would copy from Paul. And Bill was oblivious to this. He's such a great guy. So I figured, hey, I'm ahead. All my stuff was done. You had a three-unit bridge, a four-unit bridge, you had a couple onlays, an inlay, and you had the solder on a four-unit bridge, a fifth unit. So you guys all took it. So I go to turn it in, and I tripped on my mat, and I dropped it and broke it. Oh, come on. I did. So I brought it up to Mr. McKinner, and I said, Hey, Mr. McKinner, I dropped it, but all I have to do is report it, and I can turn everything tomorrow. He said, what? And he put his glasses down. He used to do that when you're in trouble. He put his glasses down, I'm like, oh, ****. And he said, college, you know what they call this in the business? And I said, no. He said, it's called a remake. So I went home that night. On the way home, I bought a Bic lighter with a bunch of butane and I sat at my desk and I waxed everything up. Before I left, I re-articulated the models and everything. I poured everything up. I waxed everything up. I set up all night long. I got into school at 5 o'clock in the morning. I talked to the janitor. He let me in into the room. I turned on all the ovens. And that's back when we used the hygroscopic method. Do you guys remember that?
I know the name, but I don't remember.
Hygroscopic is when you invest it and you put it in a warm water bath under the water and you wait for it to set up. No one ever heard of that before, right? So then I took all my rings out, I cast them all up and I finished them all and I put them on the model and I did not have time to put on. There's another thing. Have you ever heard of pyroplast?
Pyroplast. No.
Pyroplast was like one of the first things they did for facings. Oh, it was a material you you painted something on the metal for opaque.
Yeah.
Then you would mix it up and you would put it in there and and it was like a putty liquid. You would try to put in your anatomy and then you would boil it for 20 minutes. Not under pressure. Put a pair of hemostats on. And yes, I like hemostats.
I do too.
That's a call out to somebody. You probably know. And you boil it and you finish it. So I didn't get a chance to finish them. So I went up and I said, Here you go. And he goes, Collins, he puts his glasses down again, Where's your other models? So I brought all the other models over there. And I brought the sprues and I told him exactly what I did. He passed me with a C. And I hadn't seen him since. So I called him up two weeks ago because Al Bly, one of the really great people.
Why'd he pass you with a C? Was he just being a D? You know what I meant.
Absolutely. But that was, but that was, no, that was Mr. McKinner. And And Al Bly, who is one of the top removable technicians, he's, I can't believe he's like 80 years old now. He's running around like a 50 year old. What a great guy. And Al and Mr. Mc, Al and Al, there's two L's, they're good friends. He talk all the time. So he gave me Mr. McKinner's number. So I called him up three weeks and I said, Mr. McKinner, you probably don't remember me. I was in one of your classes, and you did something to me that I tell everybody about. And he's thinking I'm going to start complaining to me. And I said, You made me the technician I am today. And I went on and told him the articles, and I've traveled and all this stuff. And I said, It's all because of you, and it's all because of Wayne Zara Senior. You all know Wayne Zara. Wayne Zara Senior and Al were my teachers. And I got a chance to thank them both for teaching me. which a lot of people don't. I thanked Wayne Zara, and he passed recently, Wayne Zara, senior. And I talked to Al three weeks ago, and I told him the whole story, and then he remembered me. So I loved you, Al. I love it. Yeah.
It's good stuff, Jim.
Yeah. So, you know, after 45 years, I remember the first time I sat down on my first job. It was at Major Monroe. And they gave me this denture I'd never seen before. So I was trying to fix it and fix it, and the old man came over.
Wow.
And he slapped me on the side of the head, and he said, Oh, back in the head. He said, Use your head. I started thinking about it. So I started cutting in slots in it. It was a vulcanite denture.
Oh, wow.
A vulcanite. What is that?
Tire rubber.
Yeah. It was made by Goodyear.
What?
How do you know that?
Yeah, how do you know that?
I don't know because I'm fascinated with the fact that they did this, thinking it was a good idea because day one fit amazing. Day 3 soaked up everything in the mouth.
But people were wearing them for like 15, 20 years.
Yeah, they were not good.
Because, you know, they would they would adapt to the mouth. but they would soak everything up. And, but people, but people liked them. And they did fit, but nothing would stick to them. You had to use porcelain teeth because you couldn't put dietorics in a plastic tooth good enough to hold them.
Learn something every day. Thanks for this podcast.
Wow. Yeah. So, and I was the guy in the lab to fix those because I figured that you had to use porcelain teeth. and you had to put slots in and nobody else figured that. Yeah. So I was the guy to fix. Yeah. So I fixed all the Vulcan tentures that were coming in. It was a big lab. They didn't have a lot, but I had a couple a week.
Yeah, that's insane.
So I remember Vulcan tentures and then all the way now to photogrammetry. And years ago, if you would have told me when I was sitting in that lab doing simple repairs, If you would have told me that they're going to be scanning in the mouth or scanning on a model and putting it in the software ziny and a 3D printer, I'd say, you're out of your mind. What do you come up with this guy? But that's what it is. So all these years I've been through, when they were first putting implants in, they were forks that they were pounding into the ridges. And And they were just little knobs coming up.
Transmandibular.
Yep. They would open up the tissue. We'd make that.
I just restored one the day I left to come to this show.
Really? Yeah. We put new hater clips in one. How old are you? 47. Oh my God, you're a baby. I'm not going to ask you because you look like you're 27.
Well, he's pretty damn smart for he knows the photogrammetry and the implants. You know, he specializes in his thing. I specialize in mine, and so we both know a little bit of everything.
I couldn't tell you the hue of a tooth to save my life, but I can't even.
Imagine that. Right now, I think there's like 60 texts.
Wow, and how about how about you?
Maybe less.
What, how many texts?
Which is with Derby.
I'm with Derby. I'm told there's 80, but I don't. I don't see 80 when I walk in there.
I would say less than 60 at this point, but we do a lot of...
Two great labs. Two great labs. Yeah. Oh, I have to give myself a shout out. I opened up a website called CollinsDentalConsulting.com. And I've been wanting to do it forever because I've been doing so much consulting, but I figured I might as well just make it official. Sure. And yeah, I'm pretty proud of it.
So you're not bored.
Yeah, I'm not bored. I tried sitting in the pool because I got in the car accident, broke this, broke that, herniated 3 discs. And so I sat in the pool for two years and just got completely, totally dark. And I sat in the pool and just in the sun. That's all I did with the older guys. Carl is 80, Al is 75. Carl's wife is 80.
So you were the young one at the pool?
Well, there's one younger guy in the pool, and that's Russell. Russell and his wife. But it's a regular clique, you know? And so I brought my laptop down there, and I started writing books. So I wrote one book called Nail the Interview. It's how to go through interviews, and I think it's a pretty good book, and there's on Amazon. And then I wrote another book. It's a murder mystery. I'm not going to tell you about it. I don't know what side of the fence you're on.
A murder mystery.
So I'm not going to tell you.
I'm against murder. What sort of fence are we on? Is that on Amazon?
Yes, that's on Amazon.
All right, we'll find it.
It's called, it's by anonymous. It's by anonymous.
Well, then we'll never know who it is.
Yeah, just type in.
Yeah, you can't type in your name.
No.
Off the record, tell me later.
I'll tell you off the record, then you can announce it later. I don't care. I guess I'm to that point now. I just don't care. I just want to do what I want to do.
Well, you seem happy, full of energy, full of life, totally jamming on it, still passionate.
You know, I'm not an infomercial. You know, I'll sit down with people one-on-one or in a group session or 300 in a, when I was lecturing in Utah, two days I did. Two, two, three-hour, I did a three-hour hands-on in the afternoon, a four-hour hands-on in the afternoon. In the mornings, they did two two-hour lectures.
Yeah, just keep on going.
I was spent.
Yeah, I was spent mentally.
Yeah, but I love those guys out in Utah.
Lay it all out.
I taught them at Northwestern and Jody and Gerald Boseman. And Gerald opened up a huge practice. It's sitting right there in the mountains, and you can see all the mountains all over, and then the flat on the west side. And he sold the practice to his son, and I taught him at Northwestern when I was 20 years old. Then I went out there to teach his son.
Cool.
So I taught, so I mean.
He's talking about full circle. Full circle, full circle.
Yeah, but you know what? I just love what I do. I'm not a infomercial. I just do what I do. I like to do it. I love it. And Steve Kersheimer, a friend of mine that used to work with Dance Fly many years ago, I was shocked when he told me he was 70 years old. I was shocked. And I said, You gonna retire? He said, No, I'm having too much fun. He said, I'll retire when I'm not having any new fun. About three or four years later, he came in the lab one day, so I'm retiring. She's not having any fun anymore. I'm not having any fun anymore. So that was it.
Yeah.
You know, I didn't know when to fold him. But he was he's been in the business for years. So I've seen so much. Even I've even, you know, lived through the Jackson magnet era where he had magnets and then pre had magnets. Yeah. The pre magnets were better because they were totally encapsulated. the Jackson magnets. They were smooth. You can see the laminate. And after a couple months, the laminate would like disintegrate. So he had to redo them. He was kind of an amazing guy. He survived the plane crash. He was a pilot. Wow. And he survived, he crashed his plane, he walked away. He's a good guy. He was an amazing man. We've been a lot of amazing.
Well, Jim, you've seen it all, man. I mean, Vulcan Knight to photogrammetry.
But there's still, I wrote that article 45 years from Vulcan Knight to photogrammetry.
Wait a minute. Did you really name an article that?
Yeah.
And I just said that.
Yeah.
That's weird. I wrote it. I didn't know that was from Vulcanite to Photogrammetry, and then the name of his article, which I didn't know the name of, was Vulcanite.
Tory Palmieri Spectrum Publishing Company published that article. Yeah, three or four months ago.
Nice. Maybe I did see it subconsciously.
I do have the magic marketing.
Yeah, it was Jim Carlos 45 years from Vulcanite to photograph.
Maybe I did see it.
It's also on my website on the second page on the about.
Well, you're a Vulcanite, so you know. I am a Vulcanite. That's where you pulled that from.
I'm A Vulcanite. That's Vulcans. You're a Vulcan. Same thing. You're a Vulcan. Are you a Trekkie? I am a Trekkie.
He came to Tampa and he bought all kinds of cool stuff.
He found a toy store and he spent.
Way too much money. I didn't know that about him. And now I do. So yeah, Vulcanite, Vulcan, you know, I was close.
I can't do that either, but neither can William Shanner.
So yeah, that's true.
He had to tape them together to do it.
Did you ever see that TV show? with William Shatner, Henry Winkler, George Foreman, and what's his name? What's his name? The guy we're just talking about?
Oh, Leonard Nimoy.
No, It was, oh, Terry Bradshaw. Oh, they took these four guys. Wasn't that amazing?
It was hilarious.
And you know what? William Shatner. Perry Bradshaw is the loudmouth. George Foreman was like the common sense guy looking at these two.
When was the show on in the 80s or something?
No, there's a couple of years, maybe four years ago. Oh, really?
It was a movie for whatever reason.
No, it was every week. What they did is they took these four guys, four totally different.
Personalities.
And they took him to China. Then they took him to Thailand. They took him to India.
What a weird group.
Yes. And Henry Winkler was like the nicest guy. And I would love to meet him. And then Terry Bradshaw is the loudmouth. George Foreman is kind of the nice guy, but don't mess with him. And William Shatner is the real cocky guy to be looking at everybody. But you know what? I used to hate that guy. He's kind of funny. I like him.
Who, Shatner.
Yeah. I like him.
I've met him a few times in real life.
Really.
He's very standoffish.
He's very, probably. But he's funny. He's a funny guy. And George Foreman is just.
George Foreman's George Foreman.
Yeah.
This might be a record for the most off the wall topic. Yeah.
I know. Isn't that crazy? I know.
I know. That is free.
How did we do this? Yeah.
Well, congratulations, Tim.
Thank you so much.
I was really looking forward to you.
Yeah. I wanted to get down to yesterday, but I had to set up my course. And then by the time I I got done with it. And then we went to dinner last night at Ferrari's. It's an Italian restaurant.
And it was wonderful, I'm sure.
The second time I've been there, I was there seven years ago, and the owner recognized me. Because we had such a great time that night. And this time we brought eight people. And he's 80 years old, he still came over to the table, and he was cooking up flaming stuff. I videotaped and all.
Awesome. Well, thank you so much.
Enjoy the rest of this. Yeah, we'll see you. We got to get Marlon over here.
I know we are. We want to get a picture too. So maybe when she's off the phone, she can take a picture.
Awesome.
Thank you. Thank you. A big thanks to Jason and Jim for sitting down with us at the 2026 DLAT or DLAT show. It's really great talking to people from the ortho industry, and this is a great show to do it all. So guys, be sure to check out orthooutlawmerch.com, which I already bought 2 shirts, to see how cool the Clyde logo is and to get yourself some gear. And it's always great to catch up with Jim and hear what he's up to. and the things that he learned in the past that are still relevant today. So thanks again to the DLAP board for making these conversations with Voices from the Bench possible. Elvis and I could not be more grateful.
All right, everybody. That's all we got for you. And of course, we'll talk to you next week.
Have a good one. Bye.
I am awake and conscious. All right. The views and opinions expressed on the Voices from the Bench podcast are those of the guest and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the host or Voices from the Bench LLC.