Looking for a way to unlock the full potential of your digital dentistry workflow. I'm Elise Heathcote, associate manager of digital services with Everclear. I'm excited to introduce you to Cam Academy. I have a new in-person training experience designed specifically for dental technicians. This hands on course explores the full potential of program Cam software, helping you take your digital workflow to the next level, learn directly from our experts, refine your skills, and bring new precision and efficiency to your lab. Cam Academy is more than a course. It's your next step in digital excellence. To reserve your spot. Visit the Everclear Academy website or contact your local Everclear sales representative today. Welcome to voices from the bench, a dental laboratory podcast. Send us an email at info from the bench and follow us on Facebook and Instagram. Greetings and welcome to episode 390 of voices from the bench. My name is Elvis. As always, your name is Elvis and my name is Ford. Hi, guys. Well, happy birthday by. Happy belated, I guess. Yeah. Thank you. We were gonna record yesterday, but it was your birthday, so we decided to give you a day off. But that's not really the reason, but happy birthday. How's it feel to be, uh. Thank you, 32. Uh, I've got a six in my age now, so I'm happy because that is my lucky number. And my year could not have been any harder than last year. So I'm trying to look forward and be positive. So that's the way to do it. Well, let's talk about this because we got something coming up this weekend. Well yeah I mean it's actually by the time everyone hears this, it's already happened. But we're recording before the race for the future because we actually want to be available to, you know, do the race. So that's why we don't have the exact number of donations yet. We do want to take a little bit to thank everyone that donated to this amazing organization called the Foundation for Dental laboratory technology. Yeah. So this week we bring you our last conversation that we got at the Jensen Dental booth at the FDA symposium, along with a bonus conversation that wasn't gotten at the FDA. Nice. I remember that one, I was there. Yeah, you were actually there for the bonus. I know. First I had a chance to talk to a dental assistant turned lab technician three times, Leah Gold. Now I say three times because first we talked for about five minutes before I realized I didn't turn her microphone on. She was a real trouper. And we started it over and we did it again. And then when we ended it, we started talking after and she was telling me some interesting stuff. So we started to record again. Wow. That's pretty. I tell you, Barb. Yeah. When you're not there live, I'm a mess. You gotta really keep an awesome. Well thank you. I do tend to corral all that's going on, but Leah tells her story of going from Ohio to Florida during the pandemic, getting her first job as a technician with a prosthodontics God helper, and being thrown into all the different prosthetics while teaching herself okay. Then I was there. Elvis and I had a follow up conversation with our favorite tourist in Canada. Or one of them, I should say. We don't want to have favorites. Jade Connors, Jade, who we talk to just at the I.D.s in Germany, and she brought me to tears about work life balance, comes back on to talk about the process she went through making a bedazzled duck. And I say that duck set of dentures for the Kandola K competition. And let me tell you, it's not just making some normal, everyday dentures. Jade poured herself and her soul into these, and it's a story worth hearing. So join us as we chat with Leah Gold and Jade Conners. We are always talking about staying ahead of the curve in this rapidly evolving dental lab industry. The dental lab landscape is shifting fast towards full arch solutions, and if you're not mastering both removable and fixed protocols, you're going to be left behind. The smart technicians are positioning themselves as the go to experts that doctors can't live without. That's exactly why Zest Dental Solutions just launched their first ever Zest Lab mastership program. It's an intensive, hands on laboratory experience that's happening October 11th, 2025, in Las Vegas. Designed specifically for lab technicians who want to become full arch masters. Now, this is a full day of intense training where you'll unlock the advanced techniques that transform both removable and fixed prosthetics from ordinary cases to exceptional patient outcomes. You're going to master the art of creating life changing, full arch restorations. You're going to discover streamlined protocols, and you're going to develop the diagnostic skills that will revolutionize your lab. Plus, you'll get hands on experience with locator fixed. Now, this is the technology that is completely changing how labs approach fixed. You'll become the trusted full arch expert that doctors rely on for their complex cases. And when that happens, your case fees are going to soar. Your referrals will multiply, and your lab becomes the go to destination for the most profitable patient preferred treatments in dentistry. But here's the best part as a voices from the bench listener, you're going to get $100 off. When you register, all you got to do is use the Code Voices lab when you sign up. Vo I c e s lab. Head over to Forward Slash Lab Masters 25 or visit the full calendar at right now to secure your spot. All these links can be found on the show notes. And remember to use that Code Voices Lab to save $100. So October 11th in Las Vegas could be the day that changes your entire career completely. Register today at Zest Lab Masters 25 or by visiting. Zest Centcom. Voices from the bench. Be interviewed. Say something. I'm here. Hello? Yeah. Now I got you. Okay. Well, hey, you know, it is what it is. We can I appreciate you. Start back over. Yeah. Sorry. No worries. So here we are. Take two. Here we are. Take two. Oh, hey! Practice run down. You did a great job. That first five minutes before I noticed that the line wasn't moving. Hey, I was so enthralled with your conversation, I wasn't even noticing. Yeah, so. Leah Gold, thank you. Yes. Thank you. I'm sorry. Solid gold right here. Solid gold. All right, so I already know, but no one else knows because no one else is gonna hear what you just said. So how did you get in the industry? Okay. So sorry. No worries. It is all good. Go with the flow. So I knew I wanted to be in dental at about 12 years old. That's insane. Yes. So I want to be a dentist. Not necessarily I liked. You know, of course, there's women that kind of run the office. And then I actually had a female dentist as a kid. Yeah. So that was really inspiring. Actually, I didn't necessarily want to be a dentist, but I just the whole, you know, vibe of everything. Usually when you go to the dentist, you spend more time with assistants than you do dentists and I and I didn't say this on the first portion, but the assistant that actually worked for my very first ever little tiny cavity, I didn't even have to be numb. But her, she inspired me to be an assistant because she took me back to the back and was like showing me different things and the lab and like the sterilization area and, you know, showed you behind the scenes. Yeah. And I actually, um, so in my high school career, I went to Career Tech school, and I did my clinical portion for the dental assisting at my dentist that I went to as a kid. And they were like an internship. Yeah. Oh, very like a nine week program. And they were really, really great. And so what did you do, go to school for half a day, then go there the rest of the day? Or how did you. It was like a nine week portion. Yeah. It was like 3 or 4 hours in the morning. I had my, you know, internship and then I'd go go to school for the remainder of the day. Was it hard to go to school after that? Must have been I mean, yeah, it's always hard to go to school because you're like, it's like like out in the world, right? And now it was my senior year. So it's like, yeah, it's like I've just worked. Why do I have to go to school? Yeah. So but they were really great. And you know, my last day like had a cake and flowers for me and they just like like I was part of their team, you know, offer you a job. No, they didn't have a place for me or they would have. They would have, but they didn't have a place. But, you know, everything happens for a reason. And, you know, I did start working right out of, you know, high school as an assistant and kind of got my certifications and started bumping up into, you know, I went to school for the after program, finished top of my class. I have the clinical Excellence award at Stark State. Nice. My name is on a little plaque. Oh, how did you how do you do that? Just scores or. Um, yeah, I mean, I, I pretty much, um, within the clinical portion of the, the courses, I excelled. Um, good for, you know. Yeah. Every filling and just the mock boards that we would have, I would, you know, I was passing, you know, every time in general school, like in high school, were you excelling and stuff? Yeah, I graduated with honors. Oh, so you were just one of those smart kids that. Yeah, I guess, I mean, I didn't really try, and I hate saying that, you know what I mean? We hate, you know, you say that when they sent me the letter that I was graduating with honors, I'm like, what? Okay. Wow. So. Yeah, but I don't know. I've just always been kind of a humble person about it. I just. I'm passionate. I'm passionate about the dental field, and I think that's where it all kind of. I was wondering if you. Yeah. Like, if it just so having that interest as a kid kind of just built this like drive, you know, and when you're interested in something, I think it does. You know, you become passionate about it 100% and kind of growing into doing, you know, composite anterior restorations as an FDA and seeing people be excited about their smile again, like you're doing. That's so rewarding career work. And in Ohio, I was. Yeah. And so, so then coming down here to Florida when Covid happened, it was like, what the fuck am I doing in Ohio? It's snowing. Like, if I'm going to be if I want to be stuck anywhere indoors, it's like, what brought you down here? Absolutely. That's the pandemic. You're locked in Ohio and you're like, yeah, this is even worse. I got my I got laid off for two months. I'm like, what the fuck am I going to do? You know, it was it was the wildest time I loaded up a car and just know, like I planned it. I mean, nine months I was I decided January of 2021 that I was going to. That we were going to move and the whole family remember that's a whole that's a whole nother podcast. Okay. Understood. Yeah. Yeah. But you know, I do. I do have a son. Um, he's in baseball. And so that's been really great being warmer down here that he can play. You know you play all year for my son because I love him with all my heart. Yeah. So yeah I'm in Indiana. So Ohio Indiana I feel you. It's the same kind of weather band. Yes. Worth it right there. Yeah. And it's like brutal. You know, those negative degrees as you get older, it's like, no, I'm okay for, you know, vacationing to a cold spot for a week maybe. But like, give me the warm give me the beach. So do you line up a dental job for yourself? No, actually. Wild move down here with no job. Because every for nine months I was trying to have interviews. I got ghosted on interviews. Like video interviews. Really? I got ghosted, yes. I mean, it was the wildest experience trying to make that transition, but, yeah, came down without a job. And I knew I wanted to be, you know, looking for something lab tech related, making that transition from. How did you how did you know you wanted to become a lab tech? So I actually I mean, I have a friend who owns a lab in Ohio. Okay. And, you know, I've always. Did you work there? No. I kind of helped out every now and then. Here or there. The one doc I did work for, we did a lot of denture related things, so I'd do some different lab things. Just kind of dabbled in it really. And I think coming down here because FTAs aren't they don't have the expanded duties like they do in Ohio. Like we can't they don't allow people to place oh so permanent filling out. Or you could do here was less than Ohio. And I'm like, if I go back to chair side assisting, that's kind of going backwards for me in my career at this point. You know, I get that, you know, at this, I mean, I've been in this field for 18 years, you know, that's a that's a good sign. It's only 22. Yeah. It's up on grass. Nobody can see us. So yeah, it's it's been great though I love that I made the transition. But you never really did lab work. You just knew you wanted to do that part of it. I mean, I had an interest in it because of the artistry. Yeah. And working with doing composite veneer work and doing stuff like that, I mean, you know, basically waxing a crown at that point. Yeah. I mean, so I came into it with, I mean, I was just eager to learn. Okay. And with all my other experience, I was fortunate. I literally I was sitting in my bed Saturday night sore on indeed. Like prosthodontics hiring lab technician. Boom applied. They called me like you started at a Prasad artist. Yikes. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. Talk about no regrets. Because I love where I'm at. Right into the fire. I know, I mean, he's a perfectionist too, but they all are. Yeah. And but it's great, though, because it makes me feel comfortable about where I'm at. You're going to be a great technician because, you know there's no other way. My mentor. She has been amazing. She has like 25 years experience. And she's, you know, getting to the point where she wants to phase out. And I've been under her wing for the last, like, four. She started working for her orthodontist here in Florida. He he has a lab in his office. Yes. We have an in-house lab. With how many? There's just like two. Well, counting her will be three. Okay. But she's kind of going to go veering towards part time. Sure. And then we've hired a, you know, a new assistant. So. But yeah. What do you what do you doing. What do we do. We do a lot of. So my first week I, I did a wax try in like upper lower like, set teeth in two weeks. Yes. They had me. And they were. They threw me to the wolves. You set teeth and those winning a mouth? Yes. We did a wax try in. Yes. Wow. Yeah. And it was. It actually went really well. And I was like, damn, I can do this the first time. UX teeth. Yes. You didn't even, like practice on a model first? No. No, I had done some, like wax. What do we call that? Natural talent or. I mean, yeah, I mean it's. Yeah. That's insane. Was it an upper and lower? Yeah. Wow. Okay. Yeah. So I mean, I don't know. I just it's it's just it's been an interest my entire life. And I think maybe that has just. What am I like, what do they call it, a savant of like dentistry? But no, I mean, not like, not even close. But I have so much to learn. And that's what I have so much room to grow. So how long ago did this happen? This transition. When did you make your first wax up that went into a mouth? September of 2021. Okay, so you've been doing it for a while now. So what have you done since then? Just more denture work or you? Oh yeah, we do a lot of, um, we're doing a lot of hybrid dentures, a lot of all onyx things. And we are digitally doing those, or we're working with a certain company that does a lot of surgically guided. You know, they have a whole workflow. And it's really been great. Yeah, I have music. Can you say I can say synergy. Synergy or synergy? Yes. And it's been interesting. I really enjoy like I've got to go to some of the surgeries and like watch what they're doing and how all of that's going. And I'll do some of the intra oral scanning. Yeah. During surgery? Yeah. During surgery. So that's been pretty cool. So the person designing at surgery that's being outsourced. Yes. They have it. Yeah. They have a company they work with that will uh, fabric like they'll do the design. And then within like a day, we'll have that design file sent to one of our local labs that will print the provision. So you don't print them in your office. We don't print in office. We outsource. Actually, we outsource a lot of things because we are very small. Yeah. Like I came into it learning the the analog style. Yeah. You know, and I have been kind of transitioning I got doc to, you know, integrate into getting the XO CAD software. And I've been learning, teaching myself how to do digitally design teaching yourself. And yeah, I've done a lot of we've had several of my designs that have been printed and we've delivered of dentures. Mhm. Yes. For like immediate immediate dentures. Or have you done like night guards in the easy stuff first or you just, you just love just kind of just ramped right over. Yeah. You just kind of go from like 0 to 100 and then 100 to 200 with nothing. We'll go back to night guards eventually because that's my plan. I do what I would love to, to print our own night guards, at least because we could we would have enough space to at least do that, I think. But, I mean, all you need is a printer and. Yeah, but I'm so busy with just trying to just. Learning and integrating in the workflows of what I got going now. You know, it's keeping me busy for sure. So are you setting teeth on the All on X's or is this all done digitally outsourced so I can. Yeah. And you have. I have, yeah I have done wax ups on on all on X and then we will, we'll do try ins with those and then we'll send them. We had, we had one company we were working with. We would do all the analog style of everything and then send them our wax up. And then they would convert it to, yeah, to either zirconia or, you know, PMMa or whatever it would be. So wow. Yeah. We do titanium thimble. We've done. Yeah, we've done it all. Monolithic. Zirconia fixed. I mean, we do a lot of we've been ramping up I feel like on the fixed stuff. Well so yeah, it's becoming more and more common. And does he place implants? We don't place, but we work very closely with the surgeons to coordinate everything. Wow. So for someone that's got three lab technicians, you seem to send a lot out, but you still get a lot. Well, the one lady's not there all the time, and I'm with her being like the guru. Yeah, because she. I was under her wing for four years. Now it's me. And, you know, I don't know everything. So. And, you know, there's a lot of stuff that we, you know, we're all working together in the office to try to research, you know, what crazy implant are we working with here? Yeah. Like, you know, stuff that's placed in other countries and fixing things that are. You know, an emergency that somebody has had in their mouth. You know, they've had this issue for five years, and now it's our emergency. You know. So do you keep your assisting license here. And so everything kind of transfers over for me. Yeah. Yeah. I want to get my certification as far as CBT. Um, so that would be something I work towards. Sure. But. But you're assisting. License is good. Yeah. My f transfers. Yep. So you can go. It was a it was an accredited school. So. Oh yeah. Absolutely. Yeah I do I do a lot of the custom. I do all the custom shading actually that we need. Yeah. You have an eye for color. Wow. Yeah. So the lady I worked with, she did it all. She didn't do that. So, yeah, I came in and was like I used to do, you know, custom shading of temps, you know, as an FTO. Yeah. So I can I'm like, I can, I can do shading on a porcelain crown. And so that was, you know, that was really fun to learn. Yeah. And yeah. So I utilize for that I can add contacts and you know, so stuff doesn't have to get sent back for little minor things like that. Sure. Oh the crowns that come in, you just add a contact to it. What about conversions? Have you done any of those? I have not done those with that lab that we're kind of working with now with this new workflow. I mean, the conversions aren't happening at surgery there because after yeah, they're like the day or two days after. And then the patient just literally they'll come to our office and they leave with their provisional. Yeah. And so it seems to work out pretty well. Yeah. We've had a lot of success. And then, um. Going from? Well, depending on how long the patient wears, their provisional, you know, changes that we want to make. They want to make, you know, certain cosmetic if there's anything that needs to be changed in that process. And then, um, do you prefer to color them or put the. Yeah, I've done some of the tissue, like most recently I did do, um, we had like a roundhouse fixed bridge kind of hybrid thing on a temporary. So you did like. Yeah. And I did the composite. Do you use like GC? It was the GC. Yeah. That was, it was cool. Like mixing the shade and kind of like pretty good. Yeah. I thought it was really cool. Yeah. It's fun. It is fun. And that's the that's that is the thing about it. I'm passionate. But I also think it's fun, you know, and it's enjoyable for me. And I think that's why I'm just like this naturally want to like mess with and like tinker with. It's half the battle of finding a good career. Betty and I have this thing all the time. We're like, stop with it. Because you could literally sit there and keep fucking know. I've been saying this about technicians for years. You know, you're so you get into your little zone. You're like most perfect like micron. And you're like a technician will want to touch it, tweak it, round it. Yeah. Shave it something just to do it. And I'm like, you don't even need to. You gotta touch it. Just put it down. You know? And this is your first time to FDLE. So it is any any dental show? Yeah. I've only ever been to, like, a day ce kind of thing. Yeah, that's not the same. No. And so I was super, like, pumped about coming here. And. Are you in Orlando or. No, I'm actually living. It's in Pensacola, Florida. So how far away is that? I don't know, it's about 6 or 7 hours. Yeah. Did you drive? Yes. Wow. Okay, fine. I came over here for Disney, and, you know, I'm a nerd about it. To bring your son to Disney. No, he didn't want to come this time, so. It's like, what am I going to do? While you're there all day? I'm like, well, I could just take you to the park. Disney. Yeah. Hello? Yeah. He'll be 14 in September. So he's. Yeah. Yeah. He's a little man now. Oh, yeah. So. Yeah. So what do you think of LA? I mean, we're, what, the first days kind of wrapping up. Yeah. It's been it's been interesting. I mean, it's been enjoyable to hear like some of the speakers and just walking around the expo here, checking out some vendors. I mean, it's been it's kind of soaking it all in. It's a good group of people. Yeah. Everybody's super nice. Yeah, it's a lot of fun. So I mean, how long have you been? I know we're talking about me. Yeah. You're interviewing me now? Uh, I started in 2008. Okay, so about the same time then that we've been in the field, I guess. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I started packing and shipping at a lab. Okay. Part time? Yeah. Yeah. And here I am. So, what are you doing now? This outside of the podcast? I'm a chair side technician, so I'm in the state of Indiana for a lab out of Louisville, Kentucky. And I go around and I just help chair side and help grow business. My grandparents are from Louisville. Yeah. There you go. Yeah. It's a nice area. Yeah, that's all right. You know, it's Kentucky. Well, Miss Gold. Leah. Yes. Thank you so much. Oh, of course, it was fun. Loved it the second time around. Yeah, sorry about that. No, no worries me much. But thank you so much. Yeah. Of course. And welcome to Florida FDLE. Yes. Hope to be back next year. There you go. Thanks. Yeah. No problem. Addendum. Addendum. So I went to Hannah. Leah. Leah, right? Yes. Why did I think I said that wrong? I went to Hannah. Leah. This this post-it note that I got for taking her name and her email for the podcast. And it has mio on it, and she's like, oh, I use that. And I'm like, wait a minute. Here we are. Wait, what do you how do you use mio? We had a kit from one of our labs and they had provided us, you know, and I was like, I need to order more of this. Like, thank you guys for giving us the samples, but, like, I'm ordering some. Yeah. You know, and so I use it probably almost every week. We have a custom shade. I mean at least so you outsource all the hard work. Not the hard work like the crown and bridge. Yeah. We'll come. Yeah. We don't we don't do any crown and bridge work. So we outsource that and it comes back unfinished. No, it'll come back finished with, you know, the closest, you know, if we're working anterior and we're really trying to match a shade, we'll get the, you know, the closest base shade and then they'll make a note, you know, need you for custom shade. And then I've got my little palette. Go in there and you shade it right in front of the patient. Yes, chair. Yes. You knock it out every time. Pretty much. Yes. Mhm. Yep. And so do you have an oven right there. We have an oven. Yep. Pop it in there about 15 minutes. It'll be done. And I can do some little you know adding contacts and stuff here and there. But anything major we'll send back. Yeah. But yeah you know it's nice to have done. Have you done full arches with mayo? I've done bridges, but not a full arch. Not a full arch, but full arches. Definitely some implant bridges I've done, you know, definitely some centrals and some crazy. Yeah. This is doctor. Have any aspirations to start bringing in the manufacturing? Um, we just call the room. For all that know, you need to build you a bigger lab. Yeah. You know, but it's fine. It's it's it's. Maybe you don't want to do that. Yeah. Sometimes it's when I'm in the middle of doing something and it's like, hey, we need you to add a contact. It's like, okay, let me stop what I'm doing just for you. Yeah. It's like, I'm not busy at all, so. Well, but it's good. It's good to it's good that I can, you know, bring that in and utilize. Yeah. Utilize the mio shades. And we love mio and we love Jensen. Yes. Jensen's good. Thank you. Yeah, yeah. Love them. Awesome. Thank you so much. Of course, for the third time. All right, we'll get it. So Barb and I are super excited to talk to a good friend of ours and a fan favorite, Jade Connors. Welcome back. Hello. Oh. Hi, Elvis. Hey. How's it going? Last time we saw each other, we were all in Germany at the Expo CAD booth. Last time we saw each other, Jade got me emotionally and I totally was in to what they were saying. It was awesome collecting your tears, Barb. That's what I was going for. No, I felt it. I guess the key is, did you take away anything and make any changes? Because I know you talked a lot, Jade, about work life balance. Yeah. So, yeah, definitely at the beginning of 2025 and even the fall of 2024, it's been a year from the first time you guys interviewed me in August 2024, and so much happened in nine months time. So I'm really happy to report that my health has improved since since Germany, because I was good. I was complaining about it going a bit on the last, last episode and I've just. Yeah, just kind of like taking it a little bit easier. Um, sorry. My cat is just running around now. Of course. Of course. Sammy, calm yourself down. Okay. Sorry. Um, do you want me to. No, no no, no. That was perfect. I love cats. Okay. Because I remember. Oh, we did when we talked to you in Germany, I was kind of like, wow. You went from the interest association to lab de Chicago a month to, like. Yeah. Ides all and speaking engagements, like in the year before. None. And it's just like, wow. Yeah, I definitely went really hard. You know, like, I just decided that it was kind of time for me to be out and with the community and kind of doing my thing. And, uh, yeah, I definitely did it this year. I've been kind of gently scheming in this, uh, in this downtime as to kind of like what is, uh, upcoming and next for me. Um, but I'm sure we'll we'll get to talk about that more in this episode, so. Well, absolutely. I'm curious about when you're on stage. How do you get to your authenticity? Um, with the nerves and everything going on with all the people watching you. Like, what do you go into emotionally or physically to be able to talk so freely to your audience? Oh, man. Well, I guess I've always, like, been on certain kind of, you know, stages for most of my life. Like, I think I said in our first interview, like I was, uh, you know, a dancer and a synchronized swimmer. And that was always in front of me. Yes, a secret. I forgot. Yeah, totally. See that though. Honestly. Yeah. Oh my gosh, the discipline that goes into that sport. You know, it definitely like shaped me as a person. And when you're putting yourself in front of a panel of judges or, you know, in front of anyone to, to really be evaluated. Mhm. I think that you finally get to a point where you're just like, well, I've kind of already made every mistake possible on, on a stage or in a pool or, you know. Yeah. Or in a speaking engagement, you know, where you might slip and say something and you gotta just be kind to yourself and just be like, well, even if I mess up, I'm just gonna keep rolling with it. You know, that's a huge part of, like, show business is it's just like, well, most people aren't going to notice. And you being in your head is not going to help you perform or present or to be more liked, I guess. So you just gotta you just gotta like, show up and and be yourself and be okay. That like, if people don't like how you discuss topics or how you story, tell or share things, that's totally okay. Can't please everybody. Yeah. You don't have to be everyone's cup of tea. I'm definitely not everyone's cup of tea, but that means I feel like I'm doing it right. It's on them, not you. Right? No matter what. People are not going to like you. And that's okay. That's totally okay. I'd rather be disliked for being myself and just being authentic. And how I articulate myself. Then be maybe like by a couple more people for trying to put on kind of like a fake show. So. Well, it's even true with the podcast. I mean, I haven't told you this far, but we got our first one star review on Apple Podcast and I was all like, what? How could they? And I was like, eh, can't please them all. But that means that you're doing it right. That means that you guys are just being your own flavor. And that's really cool. That's great to see. I think it says a lot that they took the time to give us the rating. I mean, we have a lot of listeners that haven't even gave us a good rating. So. Yeah, people feel impassioned by a lot of different things in life, and I don't know. You can sometimes there's some really valuable feedback. Yeah, I love that word feedback. Yeah, that's that seems to be the buzzword nowadays. But it's true. And feedback is sometimes hard to handle. Yeah. Well or digest I think like feedback. And then, you know, me launching into my whole tangent about, you know, shame based interactions. Like there's a big difference in that flavor, right? Um, but people just project the things that they think often about themselves onto others. So if those thoughts and those kinds of like vicious negativity is already floating around in their brain, you know, you often I often think to myself, like, what do they tell themselves? What do they tell the people that are around them? And I think that's how I kind of like, uh, feed my engine of empathy, uh, in the world these days. Wow. Well said. Because I would like to say fuck off that I want, and you can beat me out. But, yeah, I think it's a better way to look at it that you just suggested, than I would automatically assume that I would react. So, yeah, I always learn something from you. And so thank you. Oh, yeah. Jade's the better person I know, I know, but it's. But it's not even about being better, right? Like, I'm just joking, I think. Yeah, I know, I know, I know, but it's just a again, I just think that the way that many of us are taught to react in this world. Yeah, for sure. We're taught that that kind of rejection is bad and you are a bad person and that kind of like, quote unquote badness or shame, um, can allude to, you know, losses or punishment or loss of opportunity. And instead I think that we can really reframe things and just really see it as, okay, what language are people using? Like, what are the points that they are trying to articulate? Can you see through the layers of like, shame or negativity and actually reach what the actual message is? And often there's some messaging that is, uh, you know, for the person that is speaking to you. But then there's also the feedback that's usually a little bit more hidden underneath it. Right. Um, well, speaking of not being rejected. Yeah. When we were in Germany, I believe we talked the day before they announced the winners. We did, we did, uh, let's see if I got this right. Candelabras, KSW. Is that what it's called? It's. It stands for something German. If I can say it properly. Kunsan work. Kunsan work? Yeah, yeah, yeah. To all the German listeners, we're so sorry that we pronounce it properly, but we're trying, so. Yeah, but you won. Yes, I won, you won. Oh my gosh. I did a thing. Yeah, you did a thing. I'll say it was bejeweled and beautiful, like Taylor Swift. Just saying. Sorry, but it was pretty awesome. Yeah. I mean, are you the first Canadian to win? I am the first Canadian to win. Yes. Nice. How long has this been going on? How many years? So this is the 14th competition. And I think it's like, been since the 90s. Good for you. Yeah, because I think they have it every other year. I didn't know it on such a history. Congratulations. It's beautiful. Thank you so much. Yeah. Um, yeah. And I definitely took a moment to kind of reflect and, like, look back and see who my other colleagues were. And a lot of them have been German. Uh, or from Switzerland or places in Europe. Sure. So, yeah, I feel like very honored and very special to be the first, uh, Canadian to win this award. Awesome. So talk to us about the process. I mean, did somebody reach out to you and say, hey, you should do this, or did you find this and say to yourself, I want to do this. So interesting. So Tebow from Candler. He is my rep for North America. He kind of put it in my ear I think in like the summer last year in 2024, because I think I showed him a picture of my work and he was like, hmm, you should consider doing the competition. And I'm like, there we go again. Mhm. Yeah. And I'm I'm just kind of like I was just really, um, how would I say it. Unsure of myself, I guess, because I know that there's so many of my colleagues who really breathe and live for Candler and for, like, Gerber style dentures. So, you know, there's like a huge following of dental technicians that, you know, really like practice by the guidelines and, you know, by the technical aspects of these kinds of dentures. And I just have always been curious as to like what my training as like a Canadian dental technologist and dentist. Yeah. Compared to to European training. Because what they tell us in school is that, you know, there's a whole belt of, uh, Germany and Interlaken, Stein and Switzerland that really covet, you know, all of the, the grandfathers of dentistry and prosthetic making. And I know that, like a lot of the Canadian prosthetic teaching is a byproduct of that. So I was really keen on always like having an opportunity to do some training in Europe and to see like, okay, how do things kind of compare to. So yeah, I decided to take Candelas Power Week, uh, last October, which was really, really great. I learned a lot, but it was really me sitting with these books and having entered this competition and just being like, okay, I want to create a masterpiece and I want to learn how to do this. So yeah, that's kind of how it how it started. When you say the books do, they have like this is how you have to do it. Page one, page two, page three. Like what? There's actually I really, really love the Swiss school of prosthetics and that's like run by controller. And it's so thorough. There's like five different volumes of these kind of like workbooks that they produced. It's super articulate and I love it. Honestly, there were probably like, I think three of them that I had my nose in during the competition and literally from top to bottom, front to back, just devoured these books in the most hyper focused, unhealthy, obsessive way. To again, like my goal and this might come as a surprise to some people, I had no thought or intention of winning. I didn't even look at what the prizes were. I didn't really care. And I think that a lot of mindset shifting that I've kind of done over the years, especially as someone who's competed a lot in my life, in a lot of different areas of my life. Yeah, I, I've kind of adapted my mind to kind of follow the book Atomic Habits by James Clear. I always repost his work because he's he's brilliant, and a part of his work that I really love is that he gives an example of, okay, you can be someone that might say, I want to lose £100, or you can say that I want to be someone who is fit and agile and strong, because what happens is when you actually achieve that outcome, you've attained that goal and building good habits and, you know, actually becoming the person that you want to become is not just like a one hit wonder. Right? So trailing back to kind of like the mindset and psychology I had when taking on this competition is that I did not care about winning. I cared that I learned the content of what Gerber style dentures actually was. And what that meant is that I basically locked myself in a my clinic slash lab, what I call my denture hole for my denture. Yes, I like let's not get into that again, okay? I do like that. Yeah. So, yeah, I just locked myself in my denture hole, which means that I'm like, uh, devoid of, like, reality. And I just. And I just, like, read these books and practiced. This is why, like, you know, I thought for sure, like, you know, I wouldn't even place because I know that so many of my colleagues who and very famous colleagues were participating in this competition, and I alleviated myself of that stress of. Winning. Because what was winning? Actually going to give me. Right. Yeah. It could be a happy byproduct, sure. But the real focus that I had is that I really wanted to learn and I really wanted to grow. And so I just, like, devoured these books. And if you actually asked me, like, one of the big criteria for this competition is like learning how to map your model and be able to kind of express all the information so the judges can see clearly on the model, like, okay, this is the the engineering points of like, you know, the functional limits and the static line and the stop line, like all of those things on your model. I probably redid that for a whole day. Wow. Yeah. Like it's the same thing over and over and over. Yes. Yeah. And I, I steam cleaned it because again, for me, I didn't have that practice anymore. We had done things like that in school, but that was so many years ago. So I had just told myself, it's like, I'm really going to learn this. I'm really going to, you know, take the time to practice and ensure that, like, every line that I do is thoughtful every it's like, for sure going to be right. I'm going to critique my own work and holy hell. The only thing that was preventing me from doing my best was myself. Yeah, because when you are on that pursuit of like, oh, I have a weird relationship with perfection because I don't believe that it's real and it's not real. But on that journey of trying to build like a masterpiece and something that, you know, is like rock solid and demonstrating your knowledge, oh my gosh, you're checking those lines like five times. So has that changed the way that you do set ups and your dentures and everything you're doing all of the mapping and everything. We learned that in school. And so I feel like really good that it basically just took everything one step further. So I feel like the way that I've been building dentures is still like very, very true and similar in so many ways to, you know, the way that they are teaching everything. It's just more so like the very particular kind of setup that you will do for a Gerber style denture, because you basically you have like a mortar pestle system and then you have like a counterbalance tooth that's on your premolar. And yeah, that's different. That's interesting. And oh yeah, I use that for a lot of my different cases. And now I just know one more way. How do you know treat my patients a little bit better. Is that what the Gerber means. It's the way the teeth are positioned. Yeah. Like it's. Yeah. All I know is Gerber baby food. Every time you say it, that's all I think of. Oh, my gosh, I was thinking you would think that actually. It's so funny. I mean. Yeah. Like basically he developed this so that again, it's a mortar pestle system because you basically want to create a stability with the dentures because especially, you know, back in the day they did not have the same materials that we used to do. Sure. So ensuring that the teeth were centered over the ridge and that like measuring the angles of the lower arch, right. Like there's certain degrees that like you can't have your teeth past. So like having a stop line, right footing like your largest tooth. So like your lower six at the lowest point of the mandibular ridge, like it's so many little, little things like that that, uh, yeah. Just just make it a bit different in your thought pattern. And when you're constructing it and it all makes sense, you know, especially for those cases where, you know, maybe their class three bite, maybe they are low ridge riders. Right. So yeah. Yeah. And you're just creating something that is going to be like a fail safe for basically anyone who's wearing dentures or who has had trouble like wearing dentures. So were you able to pick your case or did they pick the case for you? And then you had to set it up on all these parameters? Yeah. So they actually have like a case that they give to everybody and they send you, they send you like a little package and it contains some records and some teeth. And it basically says ready, set, go gives you something because you know, some information. But yeah, it's really highly technical. And they're definitely some things on the case that were making me. Like, have small panic attacks. Like that. Because, like, for example. Okay, I'm pretty sure out of the top 15, I am the only one that left in my upper sevens because of the ambiguity of the lower stop line, and I find that so interesting, right? Like everyone is going to do that different. But holy hell, I was in my head about doing that. But as a clinician, you know, I know that leaving in those sevens on the upper, especially if they're, you know, not going to be in the way of excursions, that that helps fill out the cheeks. Right. Who support the musculature a little bit better. So I got to think like a clinician and express that. And then you get to put that in your documentation too. That's a lot of work. How did that take you? How many did you make. Yeah. How many how many dentures did I make. Oh I only made the one. The real question is is how many times did I redo my setup. Yeah. Because oh my gosh. So another thing to note is that I live in Edmonton, Alberta, Canada. And during the week that I was doing my denture work, it was like -30, -40 Celsius. Yeah, I don't know what that is in Fahrenheit. Very very, very cold because I'm also a little silly been I have my bench right beside a glass door. And so sometimes if I not being thoughtful the like cold air can also like influence the wax. Oh yeah. Yeah. And then not only that I was trying to use some different wax that I hadn't used before. Hooray! Oh my God, trying to make it I know, I know, trying so many new things on this denture. Another really, really funny thing to just side note mention as well is that I had just got the chandelier articulated for like December 1st, which the dentures do, like January 1st, so I have to send it to Germany by that time. So I'm using a brand new article. Later I discovered that I only have one set of denture like mounting plates for this articulators. What I had to hand make some mounting plate. I'm so not surprised. Did they not give you a handful or. No. They only gave me one set and I just. I was like, oh my gosh, the small stresses during this case. So you know I'm out here like redoing this setup with this new wax on, a new articulators with these crappy little bass plates that I had made myself. And I'm just sitting there being like, why have I done this to myself? Is this what personal development? What was I thinking? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I mean, along the way, too, like, I am obsessively taking photos of every single little thing that I am doing so that I can defend it. Right? Yeah. Because the other, the other half of, I think, you know, being judged in this competition is like how well you're doing the documentation. And also because I'm a neurotic art kid, I wanted to make sure that they look pretty happy with lighting. You can ask me about my mental health later. Yeah, but the photos look really great. I don't think we will ask you about your mental health later. No, no, no, I think we know the answer to that. Uh, we're just staying sane. It's fine. I might get a little hard. Yeah, exactly. So, yeah, there were lots of little challenges that came up, I think where I sprouted the most gray hairs, though, is like, after I finally processed the case, it turned out beautifully, which I was so relieved. Sure, I got it in a box after many nights of not sleeping like a normal human being. Then German customs decided to hold it. No, and I'm anxiously just sending emails to counselors like it's. In Germany. Please. Please accept this. No stress there, right? Yeah. So it was a tiny little bit late, but because it was already in Germany, they were kind and they still accepted it. So thank you, Candela, for that. Yeah. It's not your fault. I mean oh my gosh. So like I know, but I, I definitely feel like there's a part of it where it's like, well Jade you go to sent it sooner. Yeah. But of course I had no idea. In any case, it made it. It got judged. I sent it all blinged out for them. And I think that's beautiful. I think they definitely did not know what to think of it at first. Well, how did you come up with the jewels and stuff? Like, where did that even, like, enter your psyche? Well, okay. Have you met Jade? So. Well, yeah. But I mean, I love it. I mean, it's very artistic, but how did you, like, win? Were you laying in bed one night and you were like, okay, I got it. Well, I mean, for me, like, I took the time to actually read like, the history of Kandola, right? Like, and I really wanted it to be representative of my own flairs and flavors because I've definitely seen, like, past competitors take the time to, like, paint the freaking Alps on their mountain. Right. There you go. And and kind of do, um, yeah. Just like do small artistic things on their cases. I was like, I want to do something fun. I want to do something that, you know, feels like me. Mhm. Yeah. And whenever I'm creating art, like I always. You know, I want to incorporate the correct design elements for what I'm trying to make. And so a part of that was just reading the history and a part of Angela's history. Like the name like Kandor means shine and then Oro is gold. Right. Um, and then the like contemporary aesthetic now of Candela is is using the color red. So I wanted, I know I wanted to mix those elements in. And it also aligns, you know, with my own aesthetic too. Right. Um, yeah. For some of the other like, performance arts that I do, and I just wanted to kind of bring it to life. I wanted it to look like royalty, because I spent a lot of time on that denture. And I named my denture, too, because, again, in my head, I'm like, I'm making a masterpiece. I want to make a masterpiece. I'm going to name my art. So the dentures name is Anastasia. Nice. And I love it. Yeah, I wanted something royal and suiting for like, all the rhinestones and gems that I. I took the time to embellish on it. So. So it gets through customs. They have it and I'm guessing it's just a waiting period. Oh yeah, it's just a waiting period. But again, like I just did not put that pressure or even have it in my head at all, even after you sent it. No, you didn't start stocking the competition. And. No, no, none of that. Why would I? Why would I do that? I don't know, Jade. What's it like? You know, again, like I, I've tried to create a mindset for myself. Like, you know, there's a lot of things in life that we spend a lot of time trying to build our skills in, right? It's obvious that I've spent a lot of time in my life working on art and learning how to build really high end prosthetics. We know that. But the thing that I have probably worked the most on in my life is my mind, and the way that I view and conceptualize the world. Right. And so a part of that is just like understanding that it's like, well, what is the point in me being anxious about who is competing and about me winning something, right. Like, what is that actually going to achieve? What's that actually going to prove to me. Right. Because my goal is to actually learn. My goal was to know how to build this so that I can actually help my patients better. Right. Getting a prize or recognition? Sure. That like that always feels nice. It's really nice to be appreciated. But that being said, you know, like I am, I'm building a denture along with some of the best prosthetic makers in the world. And for sure, um, I think that that competition only, you know, elevates and creates this energy of, like, all of us trying to do our best. Right. I'm really proud of, like, all of my colleagues who did decide that. Hey, you know what? I'm going to try this thing, and I'm going to put my work in front of a panel of judges. That in itself is an enormous feat. And I think that it's it's really, really casual and easy for so many people to be flippant about that as an achievement in itself, I don't know. I think that when you put your work in front of somebody else to judge it. That should be like a very big risk for anybody. I mean, to have somebody else say, all right. It's either good or it's bad or it's mediocre or not. I mean, that's a real risk, in my opinion, for sure. And it's scary. Oh my gosh. Of course it's scary. It's so scary because again, it's like all the things that we associate with rejection and not being good enough. Approval. Yeah. Approval. Person's approval of what we're doing. Like it's. Yeah. Yeah. It's scary because we are geared for again connection. We are geared towards social approval. Right. And I think that like when you relieve yourself of those things, I think that that's actually how you gain kind of that social approval. Right. I would agree. That's actually for yourself somehow. Yes. And that is how I have kind of freed myself in so many ways in my life. Right? Is it's just like it's exciting. It's exciting to see other people compete and then it's exciting to see people improve. Like if you look at all of the people who were who entered in this competition, I'm really happy that Kandola actually names and says, like, you know, this person actually moved up like three spots from last time the competition was, oh, you know, that's like such a beautiful thing to like, recognize is that growth because that's why we're doing this competition. So yeah, I just had already assigned to myself that I wasn't going to win. Because I had never actually made any authentic Gerber style dentures before this competition. Amazing. Now, that being said, you know, I don't want to downplay it or commoditized that. Like I've had training that is similar to. But there are different elements with Gerber style dentures. Like I incorporated so but I had already relieved myself of that where it's just like, cool, I did this thing and not comparing myself to others. Right? Right. I love that. Yeah. Voila. Then you won. Like, what the hell? What a plot. Were you surprised? Uh, yes. Yes, I was very surprised. The thing that I told myself that I would, you know, potentially maybe win at or be acknowledged for is my documentation, actually. Yeah, I've seen it. It's intense and it's thorough, and it's probably one of the best things I've ever seen. Oh, yeah. For sure. Needless to say, like, I am really curious. I would love to see, like, my colleagues who did end up like placing for their documentation what they produced because I. Poured my heart and soul into designing this like really beautiful book with my explanations and everything. So yeah, when I won, not in documentation, but the actual denture and technical challenge, I was very, very, very, very surprised. Yeah. If you want to put this into the podcast or not, I'm gonna I'm just gonna I will. Yes. Okay. Oh, yeah, I feel bad because, like, I feel bad, but I don't feel bad because this happens to all of us in, in life. Right. Mistakes end up happening. And so what it actually happened for a few hours on like a week before the competition is Kandola had accidentally posted the results on their website. What of the competition? Yeah, which again, you know, it was only for a few hours. But at that time, if you guys recall me being super, super sick. I was on a flight from London to Berlin, literally having a two hour flight where I'm just trying to breathe and trying to concentrate because I was so sick. I thought, I think I was like really badly food poisoned. And so as soon as I got into cell service, I got this message from one of my colleagues that's like, congratulations. And I'm like, what? What do you what do you mean? They sent me the link and I just started crying like, I'm on this. I'm on this plane feeling already so overwhelmed and so ill. And it's the night before my birthday, too. I remember taking, like, the little bus from my plane to, like, the terminal. And I'm just sitting on. I'm just sitting on this bus gently sobbing, oh, this woman comes up to me and she's just like. It's gonna be okay. And I, I turned to her and I'm like, no, it's it's really it's really good news. I'm just very overwhelmed right now and I don't know how to feel. And then proceeded to take an hour long train ride into Berlin, attempting to get into my Airbnb, and I spent the next 24 hours on my birthday. Maybe too much details, vomiting and having diarrhea for like you. Poor baby. I was so ill and so overwhelmed. And then also with this news and the next day and, you know, fairly so right. Candela sent out an email that was like, hey, these are unofficial results. We're very sorry that, you know, this was published. And then I was having a whole mental case about that because, you know, obviously mistakes can be made. They're still editing things. But I decided again, like at first I think I was like. This is not how I expected things to go. I'm sure. Yeah, yeah. I'm like, this is not how I thought this would happen. And I also did not think that this would happen. So I took a couple of days and then I finally just, like, grounded myself and just kind of reframed it where I was like, this is actually a really awesome thing because it means that I can write something. I can write an acceptance speech if this information is actually true. And I'm really happy that I actually got to say something and that, like, my words were published. You guys can find that on my Facebook page. Maybe we can link in the podcast. I don't know, but I really love that I got to, you know, talk about my passion and talk about, like what this competition, you know, meant to me and acknowledge, like my colleagues, you know, because it's so much like, as someone who has done leadership before and like run community events and run things like this, it's an enormous amount of energy to put on a competition. And enormous amount of energy and love and dedication for our craft. From all of my colleagues to right. Oh, yeah. So it just was really a nice moment that I got to actually, you know, have an acceptance speech, probably their first one ever. And just see what was on my mind. And this also, you know, I thank you guys as well for like wanting to take the time to, you know, let me share part of the larger part of the story behind. Oh I love that petition. Right. Is that it was a roller coaster from top to bottom. But like after I received that award, you know, like the thing that I've been saying and a kind of common saying, at least in the art community here in Edmonton is it's, um, I finally felt like I received my flowers. Mhm. I've dedicated 15 years of my life and a lot of passion, a lot of time, a lot of sacrifice to chasing this career and learning more and growing, and to be recognized with so much love and admiration for achieving this, it's just been so heartwarming. So I think everyone who's, you know, also recognize me in this way, because there are so many people that are doing so many beautiful things in our industry. I'm very privileged to be able to have this, this little moment and this little achievement with me in my career. Well, even though you said you didn't go at it to win, you deserve it. It's beautiful. You did a great job. And it's not always about the final product, but it's the process. And for sure it's the journey. You deserve it. I mean, that's all there is to it. Thank you. I think one other thought and people definitely have laughed at me for it. I commonly say I'm just some guy, you know what I mean? It's just like I'm just some person out here in the world. And I built a really, really nice denture once. Yeah. Right. And I and I think it's important I think it's really, really important though for me to say that because from our last time they interviewed me, it still stays consistent and the same as that. Like I don't really want to be put permanently on a pedestal, you know, it's like, I really just want to be treated with that respect for the passion and that drive that I have for our industry. But does that mean that I am forever going to stand and bask in in a little spotlight? No. And I and I don't want to, you know, like, I think that it's really important for us to humble ourselves and to understand, oh, for sure that. Yeah. And to understand that it's just like, I know a few things about a few things in this life. Jade, you're a clinician. You're gonna stick a denture that you think is beautiful in a mouth that the patient's not gonna like. And that's the most humbling thing that it could happen. Yeah. I don't know. Can't please everybody. You can't please everybody. And like, I think that people who understand that they don't know that much are the ones that get to continuously learn. That is the thing that is kind of most important to me, is that I am a permanent, lifelong learner. Yeah. I want some of my thoughts and ideas to become outdated eventually, because other people are going to grow and surpass me. And I love that, because that means that all of us are kind of like trying to push the envelope forward. And that means that I will have an ability to learn from other people. You know, so I'm just some guy out here just making a couple dentures, and sometimes I add a couple runs stones to them. It gets really nasty and people look at it a little longer. So keep doing what you're doing. Jade. Yeah. We love it. Thank you so much for coming on to share about this journey. Congratulations again. Thank you so much for having me. I love talking to you guys and curious to kind of see, you know, next time we decide to have another chat. Where am I going to be? Where am I going to be? Where are you going to be? Where will we be? No doubt. Yeah. Fingers crossed for Dubai. I'm hoping to. Do that. Elvis, I hope you got to go there and thank you. Maybe. Maybe I'll even see you there. There you go. Yeah. It's been really, really cool because after the competition, I think that there have been people that have been slowly recognizing my work and being able to have even more eyes on kind of what I'm doing is really special. So I get to actually lecture in Tremblant, which is, uh, in Quebec, um, in the middle of September, which is super, super exciting. And then I actually have started to work with a couple different companies and one of those companies being done. So I'm actually gonna get to do. Oh, what? For you? Yeah. It's been so good. Really, really good to me. And as I said, like there's various different companies that have been really, really supportive of my work. And in turn, you know, I, I want to be able to support them too. But yeah, I'm gonna get a chance to go to Germany and hopefully get to you. I'm going to do some training with Bri Dent and then also have a little visit with Anax, which is super, super cool. I love the German guys. Seriously, you guys are so cool! I love hanging out with you guys there. And then, yeah, it looks like I'm going to be at Spectrum Days in Toronto November 7th as well. Geez. So yeah, if you guys are out and about. Excellent to say hi to. Uh. We will. I'll be super shy, but, like. Yeah, I'd love to say hi to you guys if you're at any. Good for you. So I'm so happy for you. Thank you. You deserve it. Thank you so much, Jane. You guys are a part of it, so thank you. Seriously, I love talking with you guys. We appreciate you. And, uh, I think we're going to talk to you again real soon, no doubt. Uh, I love it. I look forward to it. Have a good one here. Yay! A big thanks to Leah for sitting down with Elvis in the Jensen booth at the FDLE symposium in Florida, my home state. I really think more assistants should look into becoming dental technicians because we're the bomb. They already know teeth. They speak dental, and they're probably just as crazy as we are. You know, the more and more I do chair sides, those assistants are as crazy as we are. Heck, yeah. I'm sure it was really nice to hear Leah's story, and we can't say thanks enough to Jade for coming back on to update us on her winning the competition. That was a big deal. She made a unique and beautiful set of dentures that are totally worth seeing, and if you want to see them, head over to candler.com and click on the page to see hers and all the other dentures she was up against. Nice job and congratulations again I say. All right everybody, that's all we got for you. And of course we'll go through this week. See ya. Yeah. You get like a weird like, every now and again. So. The views and opinions expressed on the voices from the bench podcast are those of the guest, and do not necessarily reflect the official policy or position of the host or voices from the bench, LLC.