Unknown Speaker Right about here, ladies and gentlemen, I want you to get yourself, your soul together. Are you ready? I said, are you ready? It's time for the Chris and Andre show you. Andre I can hear you great. I was gonna shout out Riverside. Chris You can go ahead and do that now. I'm sorry. Andre All right, you cut me off. So I just wanted to give a shout out to Riverside. We've been using their platform three years, maybe two or three years, and their app, or their native app for the Mac, has gotten a lot better. So really pleased with that. Only had one version where I had to end up using a browser, and it sucked. But yeah, Chris no, I do like Riverside. I mean, we don't leverage, uh, all of the features that it has, like, it's got a lot of stuff in terms of, like creating clips and, like, full episodes and whatnot. But we like, well, I like to have a little bit more control over that, and so tend to just do that the old manual way, but, but yeah, I mean Riverside for recording and everything. I mean the fact that we can stream and record simultaneously and get the separate tracks and everything's nice, high quality. Andre Yeah, it's been good. Yeah, when he said we he met him because I don't handle that part of our podcast, not my skill set. So Chris, thank you. He's also to blame for those trolling political shorts. Chris That's why, which we won't do anymore, because we're not talking about politics. So, yeah, you don't have to worry about me clipping something that you say out of context and rise out of people. Andre Yeah, let's not do that anymore. But something that's kind of politically adjacent. Are a few things that have been in the news. I'm only familiar with one of them, but I'm sure the other ones that you shared earlier, I can probably chime in on but all birds. What the actual Chris I mean as two major, you know, supporters, proponents, really, of artificial intelligence, I think, yeah, no, this is ridiculous. This is absolutely ridiculous. It's very clear. They had no money. Their business had tanked. And they were like, how do we get money? AI, and I feel like they're just gonna get a bunch of investor money, and then they're going to be like, Oh, it turns out those accelerated GPUs that we wanted to buy are really expensive or really hard to get. And so we already spent all the money on lavish things for our or golden parachutes for our executives or something I don't know. Andre Yeah, I read the story this morning. I heard about it yesterday, and I still don't know what the play is it? Chris The only thing I can figure is that they have space, and they figure that there's a need for there's a demand for GPU access, right? Is what they're banking on, and so I'm my read on it is that they intend to basically convert some of their existing like real estate, into these warehouses, you know, data centers, essentially, more or less, right, sure. But why you would trust a footwear company to know how to shift into accelerated GPUs? I don't know, right? Yeah, I'm with you. And then we were sitting here yesterday because so all birds is, was, I guess, no longer, probably a customer of ours. And the reps, my sales reps, were all here this week, and we were talking yesterday, one of them was like, all birds is becoming an AI company. And I was like, Wait, like all birds, the footwear company, like our customer. And he was like, yeah. And so I went to the rep who works with all birds, and I was like, did you hear about this? And she was like, Yeah, I just heard about it this morning. I have no idea what's going on there. That's not anything like my read on it also is that most. Of the internal staff had no idea that this was coming, right? I mean, if you're, if you went to work at all birds as a, as a footwear designer or developer, you're not going to want to stick around for new birds like so. Oh, I of course, Andre not right, but, but my question, I Yeah, so I think we're thinking the same thing. So they the real estate move. I kind of get it because there's been a national backlash against data centers. Outside of that. I don't get it because I, I think that the bubble is soon to burst, like just because of external pressures from, you know, other world events. Chris Yeah, well, and I mean, you've seen certain some AI companies are already starting to close their doors, right? Or at least portions of, I mean, like Sora shut down, and Disney pulled their billion dollar investment out, which mean that was never gonna last anyways, Andre yeah, that was, that was a bad play. I think for me, it's like, it's like the.com bubble in many aspects. The impact will be like the Oh 809 crisis, which is its own nightmare in and of itself. And if it's true that AI companies are propping up a good chunk of the value of the market. Well, that crashes, but unfortunately, like normal America, will feel the pressure first. Yeah, that that was a mind blowing story. When I read it, I was like, But why? Why? I mean, I understand my limits. Like, when people ask me about certain technologies that they're not my domain, I just kind of say, Yeah, I don't know, like, but I'm not. Seems like the Chris opposite of that, you know, right? My initial thought was like, okay, they're gonna develop an AI platform for designing footwear like or like, for shoe customization like I assumed, you know, when Andre I saw the headline, that's what I thought Chris footwear was somewhere, and then it was just like, nope, clean break. You know, Andre when I saw the headline, I was like, it's not April 1. What are we doing? And I was trying to think of scenarios with like shoes. And as I kept reading, I was like, Yo, this Chris has nothing to do with shoes. I mean, this would be like D zone, starting a footwear company, right? Like, guys, we're closing up. We're closing the website. We've sold answer hub, we're gonna build shoes from now. Andre What? What rich fever dream? Are you in that? Chris And that's where, you know, I mean, obviously, I don't have any evidence, but you kind of get the like, is this just a grift? Like, is this, is this some form of, like, just, we need money, and this was the quickest way that we saw to get an influx of cash, because of the business had had gone downhill so fast. Andre But so what I what I think is like they got a lot of VC funding, and when they went public, their IPO was humongous, and but their revenue dropped, I think it was 40% when I from like, year over year, or something like that. So it was pretty dramatic. So depending on what type of deals they had. It could be a panic move. I don't know. That's why not. I am not pro VC funding for most things, myself included, because you don't know the deal. And if your burn rate is so high and you're not able to keep up, like revenue and profit, you could get screwed. You could get sued. Chris I mean, that seems like the more likely scenario for a lot of EC, because so often they come in when they haven't achieved that high level of revenue yet. And it's, you know, it's the like, hype, hype, hype. We got to, you know, churn, we got to spend money to make money, kind of thing. And it's like, but yeah, eventually you actually do have to make money. Like, you can't just spend money to spend right? Andre But that, that's part of our stupidity with this whole thing, where it's like, we don't create companies to create companies. Create companies with an exit strategy. Yeah, we're not Chris creating companies to create jobs, right? We're creating companies so that we can build and not we, but like, so that you can build your own personal recognition. You Andre say, I changed it from No, but it's like, it's all about, well, look what I did, and put what I can put on my resume, on LinkedIn, or whatever, make it sound snappy when I'm hanging out at you know? Andre Well there, there is the whole 30 under 30 curse. So that's a whole nother subject. But a lot of a lot of those companies just fizzle out. It's not, it's not a good look, as far as like, economic stability for our country, it's just not a good look. Chris We talked about it last time that you know, like, AI, right now, AI, it is plummeting towards the trough of disillusionment, where you know, like right, its effectiveness, its usefulness, has not proven out based on the promises that were made and the hype that was built around it. And so now you have that backlash. And like you said, I think a lot of those AI investments like that, money is going to start going away very quickly, based on not only what's going on in the AI market, but just global economic conditions in general, are going to dictate that people get as much of that money back as they can, so that they can be more liquid to adjust to what's going to happen. Andre Yeah, I saw a story in the news while I was eating dinner, and they were talking about how the impacts of tariffs and the global supply chain, like delays are starting to affect North Carolinians. Well, it's not going to get better, like I don't know why we I'm not, I'm not anti billionaire. I just think that people that are billionaires are idiots, and the current ones we have are just, they're just weird. And there's, you know, self righteousness just annoys the shot of me so, Chris oh yeah. So Marvel, Disney laid off a bunch of people at Marvel Studios, I think it was, yep, 1000 Disney employees being laid off, and the bulk of them are Marvel's visual department. So it could also be aI related. Andre I think they learned after Secret Wars not to do that. But I think some of the All right, here's what I think some jobs will go away, probably not AI related, but I think that for some production, you probably want to outsource it like it doesn't make sense to to a lot of things in house, Chris which is funny, because Disney's been going around acquiring so many other companies to bring them in house. And now it's like, well, you'd actually be better off getting that done outside of your own corporation. It's like, but there's nobody left. We already bought everybody. Andre It's like a bad guy, Joe episode, I don't know, man, the acquisition, the acquisition, like, like, just cycle that we're in doesn't make sense to me. You know, I before we started recording tonight, I saw a video on YouTube, affinity 3.2 I'm not going to use affinity. Like, I just don't trust Canva. Like, it's just not going to happen. So I've committed, I'm sorry GIMP, but I've committed to GIMP again. So, like, I I'm just gonna, I'm gonna go down the path that in certain places that I can feel confident. I'm not gonna have to have to do a lot of like reworking of things, or I can increase my skill set. I say that, to say this, a lot of the layoffs are because people get too comfortable in their jobs from a person that's been laid off twice. Companies don't care about. You like, we got to stop pretending that's a thing. They're like, Pindo just laid off 10% of its workforce, which is going to hurt. Like, you know, Wake County Oracle, they had a number of layoffs, and they just keep adding up. That layoffs are stacking up, and it's not AI related, it's because of stock pressure. Speaker 1 So whether it's tariffs, whether it's the the secret recession that we're in, I like the video you sent, unemployment is around 4% job growth appears to be strong on the surface, and the GDP is still growing. But if this is true, why does it feel like everything is falling apart, and that's because the recession isn't coming. It's already here. The data just hasn't caught up yet. Because I think we've been in a recession since, like, covid, Chris to be honest with you, it doesn't, I don't think we ever really recovered. I'm never gonna financially recover from this, like we were. You were talking about the supply chain stuff earlier, and that's an area that really has not fully recovered from what happened during covid. And I think there's a lot of the economy that still, you mean, like the pressure that was in, that was put on in terms of inflation and everything, and how that was kind of handled for a while, but you know, now it, it's like, in a way, right under Biden, we kind of, we had the soft ish landing, and then, I mean, the last 18 months manage, like, if there was any chance that we were going to, like, start to climb out of the recession that we were clearly in, It was like, No, fuck it. Let's just plunge ourselves straight. Andre Let's make it really hard, Chris like tariffs, and then let's go to war. Andre And bro, I just paid $95 in gas last week. Yeah, 9595 20. I was like, damn, this is a problem. So that was $23 more than what I usually take to fill up my car. And remember, I fill up my car on a quarter of a tank. So it's like, yo. Chris I mean, I don't put, you know, I put the, I go to sheets and get the 88 unleaded. That's 30 cents cheaper than the 87 unleaded, and I'm still paying probably $15 more every time that I have to fill up my tank than I used to. Right The one thing I fill up when it's complete, completely empty, like running on fumes, Andre yeah, I'm too afraid. I want to have like zombie like movement, amount of distance i Yeah, the layoffs are pretty bad, and I'm still a revolutionary about this. And I think that if you get laid off and you have this is the way I look at if you have a skill that can't be easily duplicated, you need to figure out a way to work for yourself. We need to reset the system. I don't know why we haven't done that yet, but we need to bring back innovation, entrepreneurial spirit, spirit, and then, just like Dick over the people that are dicking us over. It's not and it's not for everybody, but I think if enough people can, can build companies that are meant to be companies and not just money machines. Like with the exit strategy, we solve a big deal, you know, a big part of the problem, especially developers. Like it bothers me when developers get laid off and get another job and plan on staying there until the next layoff. Chris It was the, one of the interesting things in that video about the secret recession, was talking about the jobs numbers and the, you know, the way that they look at, oh, if a full time salaried worker gets laid off and has to pick up two, you know, gig work, jobs like Uber and, you know, delivering food or whatever that counts as plus one net job creation Andre like, but, but what's ironic about that, that's what's what was called years ago, under employment, right? And you only hear about underemployment when there's a Democrat in office, right Chris here, complaints about a lot of things when there's a Andre Democrat to be fair. Okay, yeah, that's true, but I think that that's the hypocrisy of our of our system, right? Whether that's corporate media, whether that's politicians. They pick and choose which facts they want to highlight, and it doesn't, you know, it's not a complete representation of what's happening, right? Chris And they fudge the numbers, right? They fudge the way that things are measured, or what number it is that we're looking at. It's like we talked about before. I know you're a big fan of statistics in general, and how useful but it's true. Like, I mean, if you really want to, you are able to manipulate a lot of data to make it seem like, wherever you want, you know, and unless you're speaking to somebody that is also familiar with the data, and you know, is able to do their own true analysis, then it's very difficult to have a frank conversation about any of that stuff. Andre And that's that's what's frustrating, the fact that people are for the secret recession that art is that what the title of the video was called, Chris a hidden recession, or secret recession? I can't remember. Yeah, we'll Andre put a link in the bottom. It's pretty interesting. Or when I say we, I mean, Chris, it's if you're always using 12 months priors data, nothing you say, can help you pivot right? The only people, the only people that know it possibly are ADP or independent reporting companies. But the underemployment is bad. Okay? Here, let me get to my point. My point is this, in Wake County, North Carolina, the in carry apex, Morrisville, the median, or I think the median, salaries like six figures. So let's say, just for simple math, 115 to 120 right? Now let's do the other 90 or 99 counties. The only one that comes close is Charlotte in Mecklenburg County. Yep, that's it. I just saw a mayor in Fayetteville like thinking about a, you know, wanting to get a data center approved because less than 10% of the population makes six figures, and they're going to bring in new jobs. And I'm like, Well, this guy is highly unqualified to be the mayor of your town, and you should definitely vote him out of office, because there's a higher chance they're going to import those jobs and not really impact raising the average income in that in Fayetteville. So he's under qualified to be the mayor of Fayetteville, just Chris part of the group that signed off on that 14 bill or million dollar sports complex. Andre He he is, and I think that's the, you know, not, this is not a well, it is kind of, but it's not national politics. But, yeah, we're not doing we're trying not to do that, but that doesn't help the people in your community, right? When you make poor decisions like that, the mayor of Fayetteville should not get reelected because he's unqualified to make good decisions like Apple is building a campus in RTP with a promise of bringing jobs. Well, they're going to bring jobs because, because that campus is not going to be your typical Apple campus that's going to be for people that are way smarter than most, like engineers that graduate from state. It's not going to be a first year like job. You have to probably have a PhD. You probably there's it's not going to do what people think it's I mean, it'll bring some recognition, blah, blah, all those cool things, but you're not going to uplift any percentage of this population. They're going to be transplants. Chris And even if you did, it would be a shuffling up, right, not like a leap right, which, I mean, the shuffle would be nice to get but still, yeah, it's you're limited in what you're gonna get out of that, especially when you look at what you've given up to get it right, like the tax breaks and everything that they've given to them, and they haven't even hired job one. Andre It makes me so angry. That's why we don't talk about politics. Chris That's one reason. Yeah, Andre yeah, that's one reason. But the the topic of layoffs is, it's, uh, it's happening, and we constantly talk about it. It's like these companies don't care about you and I. Know that's it's hard to say, even if you like your or even love your job, you are, like, expendable like, that is a fact of life. Chris Yeah, and I think far too often I don't know, maybe not, because I feel like, you know my generation and like, the generation after me, there was a lot of, like, the job hopping for titles and promotions and pay raises and all of that and so worse. Yo, yeah, no, totally, and, but I think, you know, there's so that there's not that same sense of loyalty in necessarily. And that's, I know that's not, like, homogenous across the entire generation, but I don't know. I mean, like, I think, personally, right? Like, I've been fortunate enough to stay, I think, at least, like, three years at all, but one of the jobs that I've had and I mean, I was at D zone for seven years, seven and a half years. I've been at this job for almost seven years. I was at Galaxy cinema for three and a half, four years, something like that. So, but I think you're right in that, like at the end of the day, I never had any misconception that that organization, or like the company itself, cared about me in a way that would exceed their need to make money, right, or their reason for being in business, right? Like at the end of the day, if I fucked up enough, they were gonna get rid of me, or if it was, you know, if it was convenient or what made the most financial sense for them. Andre But I think, I think I agree with what you're saying, but I watch videos of people that have just gotten recently laid off, and there's no rhyme or reason to it, you know, right? There's, there's a hint that the supposed AI layoffs are like companies are regretting it because it's half big tech. Like, seriously, like, the wow factor is not there. But if I were in that position, I would be making a plan to not work for somebody the rest of my life. Yeah, plain and simple. Chris And there's enough demand out there, right, that you can do that. And it's not, you know, it's, it's, it's not easy, necessarily, and it's not for everybody, yeah, but there's enough people that I think are find themselves in that position, and immediately are like, well, what am I going to do? I have to go get another job, somewhere else. And then, especially in this market, when there aren't that many people that are hiring. What are you supposed to do? Right? I mean, again, you're gonna go get multiple gig work, like situations to support your family and whatever else it is that you need to do. I hate it for those people when they find themselves in that position, but if, I mean shit, if you're spending that much time doing the gig work, like, figure out how you set just a little bit of that time aside to build something, you know, Andre and I get that it's not for everybody. Like, I don't want to, I don't want to ignore that fact. But if enough people like that. It was for we're able to, like, if we were to build a a brand new, like, string of companies out of this impending disaster, we would be okay. Like, I think we would be okay. I saw this thing. It's, it's kind of related that it's two parts. One, the Pentagon is asking car manufacturers to make weapons now, which is so World War Two. And secondly, a executive at I believe it was Ford, said that they didn't want to let Chinese vehicles into the US because they would drive the prices down. That was like, Well, that's very anti capitalist, yeah. Chris So communism or socialism for me, but not for the right? Andre So for me, it's like, I look at, like, the factors that I care about in the economy, and I think if we have, like, a public recession, it's going to be bad for a lot of people, like, for a lot of people, Chris yeah, I mean, I you know. I'm not a financial analyst, so I I'm not going to pretend like I can foresee exactly what's going to happen, but I would not be surprised if this go around is significantly worse than what we went through and, oh, wait, I think there's Andre well, you don't have to be a financial analyst, like I am, Chris not financial advice. Andre It's true. That's really bad. Yeah, it's like, Chris what are we talking like we and like we said, right? It's not, this is not something that's going to happen. This is something that is already happening and has been happening for some time now. And it's just a matter of when everybody starts to recognize it and kind of admit it, that this is what's going on that but until then, yeah. I mean, it's the so Andre if the video you sent to me was true 18 months, right? Yeah. Well, if you do the math backwards, inflation has gone up over 18 months. Jobs creation is like fell off the map over 18 months. By definition, somebody in our government should have reported we're in a recession, but we know that's not going to happen, right? And nobody Chris in our government is gonna talk about this because they can't, right? Andre So it's like, it's, it's, Chris yeah, it's, it's depressing, is what it is, in some ways, I mean, or at least, just like, it's frustrating to sit here and watch people just drive this right off a cliff when you know we were already, like teetering on the edge to begin with, right you, all you had to do is gently turn back to the left. Instead, you just jerked it hard to the right. Andre Well, I think for me, what frustrates me is it's just the lack of concern about the layoffs. The only reason we know about the layoffs is, I think most states, if you're gonna lay off like 10% of your company, you have to report it to, like labor commissions. And if that weren't a law, granted that law does nothing. It does. It does absolutely, Chris literally, just means you have to report it. Andre That's it, right? It's the Chris most and we make, we may look into it, right? Andre It's like, the most feckless crap on the planet. It's like, yeah, I just have to tell that we're tell them that we're doing it and it's okay. And in most states and municipalities give so many concessions for these companies. I think back to Advanced Auto in North Carolina, and the State gave them so much to put their headquarters on six forks road, and they fucked us. Just fucked us. We're closing stores, we're laying off our staff, and blah, blah, blah, and it's just so it's so like infuriating I just Chris can't and especially because you know that none of that is guaranteed right when, when you sign those deals, you know that none of the promises from the corporation are guaranteed, and yes, maybe, if you are lucky, you can claw back some of the breaks that you gave them if they should default on certain aspects of it. But even then, how much are you spending on litigation going to court to have that be paid out? And you've still lost all of that time and effort and the development what could have gone in, where that was that could have produced revenue and jobs and all of that stuff. I not all of us, can understand the time value of money. Andre So, oh yeah, I don't remember who wrote that comment, but God, Jesus, Lord, have mercy. I think back to Vin fast, and I'm actually glad Vin fast was able to meet their production schedule. It's cool to see Vin fast vehicles in North Carolina. I was just in Florida. To see our like one of our sons and his wife. I only go to Florida because my kids are there. Nothing against Florida, but I only go there because my kids are there. Like I would skip it every other day, every time. Just wouldn't, wouldn't do that. But anyway, it's like driving around Orlando. I don't know where people work like, I really don't. It's like you either work at Disney, you work at something that supports Disney or universal, but it's not like people have normal jobs. There's a bunch there's a bunch of billboards for attorneys. It's just not a it's not a city built for the people that live there, basically. And that bothers me, right when I drive around most places in North Carolina, I understand what people do to support the town, and they probably live there. But going to places like Florida, where it's like a hodgepodge of and I'm not trying to shit in Florida, I'm sure somebody's listening from Florida, they're like, this guy is pretty mean to Florida. I'm not saying that, but I think that we've got to stop repeating the same patterns, right? Because for the sake of our children in the future of this country, hopefully we can kind of figure some stuff out. So anyway, Chris I mean, yeah, I was in Florida. Let's see, January. I had to go down there to Orlando. And, yeah, it is strange. I mean, granted, like the Disney area in particular, it is Disney or Universal Studios or nothing, right? And everything around there. Even the convention center is kind of built around the idea that that's all right there. Most of the stuff outside of that is not very good, honestly. Like even the stuff that's outside of Disney Springs and whatnot, the restaurants and stuff in the in the greater Orlando area, not that great. And so yeah, like it just even, I remember a few years ago when we went to Disney World, we stayed in an Airbnb, and it was one of those neighborhoods where they had, like the HOA had gotten together to ban Airbnbs and short term rentals, because that had become a huge portion of the whole like neighborhood, basically. And when we got there, the instructions were like, tell them that you are just coming to visit a friend and that you're going to stay, but not for the whole night, and then go back in the morning or then we'll have a parking pass for you in the house when you get here, so that you can park so you basically have to lie to security to get through. Are you kidding me? Yeah. Wow, yeah. But even driving through that neighborhood, you could just tell that most of the people there were short term rentals. They were not it was not meant for long term or not meant for but it wasn't being used as full time residential. Andre Yeah, that sounds about right. Wow. I have nothing for that. Chris Go Florida, go Florida. Andre Wow, yeah, yeah, so it's kind of hard not to bring up politics, a lot Chris of this stuff, because so much of what's been going on lately is just, and it's, I will say it's, I am proud of myself, because I've learned not to fall for the bait, as much, you know, like, or at least to recognize when I'm starting to take the bait and be like you almost got me, just In terms of, no, it's like, these stories don't matter. Like, yeah, I get that people are enraged, but it really doesn't matter. Like, it's in the grand scheme of things, if this was the thing that made you cross the line, go fuck yourself, whatever it is at this point, it doesn't even matter whatever it is like, you've had so many opportunities. Andre I There's so many things to riff on. But it's not you're right. I think you're right. Like I, I don't know, I just, I'm not amused anymore. It's like, the Pope, that's what you're doing. Okay, whatever. So, yeah, yeah, I just, I don't want to do it, because they're so like, we'll be here for like, six hours. Chris I well, you know, I could talk about what's that both of our schools hired new basketball coaches, Andre yeah, and apparently it's not going over so well. It's got $50 million in Chapel Hill. Yeah. Chris I mean, I will say, so we hired Justin Gainey, former NC State player. I was not wanting to go the former player route, because I feel like that just doesn't usually work out. But Justin seems like he's been, you know, doing a lot of he's learned a lot. He's been in a lot of good positions. Hasn't been a head coach before, but at this point, honestly, like, does it matter? Go for it. Go for it, man. Like I just, I hope he fucking succeeds. Mark Malone or Mike Malone, Malone, Malone at UNC I did not see that one coming. Andre That was way out of left field. He was the head coach when the Denver Nuggets won the championship with Carmelo Anthony there. So that kind of made me soften up a little bit. It was like I thought Chris it was when joke was oh, joke Oh Andre shit, it was damn so there goes that. Chris Well, and like, two of his kids play sports at UNC, right? So that's my understanding, is that that was part of how he was connected to like UNC, and why it was kind of even an option. Can I be honest with you? I would love for you to be honest with me about this. I did Andre not give a fuck who they chose. I was just, you were just done with Hubert? Yeah, I was, like, not impressed. Like, I'm a firm believer in not everybody's meant to be a head coach. Nothing against, nothing against Hubert. But I don't think I didn't I've never seen him being a good coach, basically, I think the talent on the team won the games. It wasn't his coaching. Chris Yeah, and I think I mean, it certainly seemed that once the talent that Roy had assembled wasn't there, then it also seems like Huber either wasn't able to identify the right talent or wasn't able to coach it up. I don't know, you know, I mean, like, it's, I don't Unknown Speaker care. I just Chris doesn't matter ultimately, like you fail to do the job. So, right? Andre So I wasn't really invested in because I saw you and see pick Belichick, Chris yeah, so you kind of had a feeling that it was going to be a shit show well, and that seems to be another thing at Carolina, is there seems to be some bit of power struggle dynamics going on in the sports Athletics Department. And like, the new ad is coming in right? Bubba Cunningham just left, so you got the new ad that just came in. But then during the Belichick thing, it was like you had the boosters. Were the ones who wanted Belichick, and the ad didn't, but they overrode rode the ad. And so that's it. Makes me wonder with this whole thing, like, Was this another back deal, backroom booster deal, or was the ad on board with this? Like, I know there were a lot of the other coaches that were still playing in the tournament that eventually said no, and seemed like they kind of used UNC to leverage their own stop Andre this guy's gonna have to get to the Sweet 16. Like, if he doesn't, they're gonna have to run with year one. Okay? If he doesn't, they're going to figure out a way to get out of the contract and 7.6 or $7.8 million a year. That's going to be a big blow to it won't be a big blow to their program, but it's gonna they're gonna lose credibility. That's gonna delay that anybody wanted to be recruited at UNC for at least four years. So because people don't believe in the coaching staff and they're like their athletic department, I just hope they made the right decision, right? I don't. Think Hubert was the right decision. I mean, like, just, I can't explain what it was about him. I'll tell you part of the the the battle they're having. A couple of people they asked in interviews about, you know, Coach Davis. One mentioned his like, his faith, like that has anything to do with basketball, and the other one did it. One was a booster. One was, I don't remember what what his position was, and it's like, no, I need you like, no offense. I need you to pick a good coach, like, I don't care about Chris like, yeah, Andre none of that other stuff is important to me. Is he a good coach? I think that, and I also know that UNC is having an identity problem or crisis because they are like, they're bowing down to this current administration. So I think multiple things are happening where it's like, I don't think it's the same school that is focused, especially in sports, are focused on the right things, to be honest with you, Chris well, and I think in a lot of ways, the Belichick hire kind of underscored a lot of that, right, right? Because that's not that higher. Andre That's not it, yeah, that's not a UNC hire, Chris no, that's, that's some school that's trying to make a big splash, right? Like that wants instant credibility for their football program. And UNC has always had credibility in the football program. They just haven't been able to quite get well. But even was it Larry dude, you guys have had good teams at times. And I mean, you have the 11 in one season, like, there have been opportunities you just couldn't quite get over the hump. I mean, it happens like, football's hard, Andre right, but Bill Belichick, who can't win without his star quarterback, and is, you know, all all American superstar, big, giant of a tight end or his speedy wide receivers, is not the best, is not the best coach, like hands down. Chris So for me, it also seemed like, with Belichick, that he, early on, identified some like, you know, gaps in the market in terms of talent that he could find in certain positions, like the, you know, smaller, speedy wide receivers, when most teams were going big, tall guys. But eventually the league caught up, and he never that's, that's Andre every season. No, it Chris is, I know it is. You're right. Andre That's my biggest frustration. It's like, Yeah, that's great until people watch tape on you. That's great until people figure those are always the it's the downfall of the chiefs. It'll be the downfall of any other team that thinks that we have the perfect package. We have the perfect offense. Like, look at the evil Right? Like, shit, I get frustrated. It's like, no, it's that worked out great. What are you gonna do next season? And they try to do the same shit from last season? Yeah. And screw it. New England does not beat the Broncos without the snow. No. Chris 100% 100% Oh, I mean, the New England had no business being in the Super Bowl. Let's be honest, right? Andre Fuck Denver wins the Super Bowl. Same, same conditions, yeah, they win the Super Bowl same quarterback, backup quarterback. Doesn't matter. They win that Super Bowl. Chris That defense was legit. Andre No may surprise Chris his defense. Oh, yeah. I was like, Yes. I was like, No, our defense, Andre you're talking about new like, New England. I was like, no, they're not. Chris Like, no, I want to know was what got you guys in that game? Yeah, that. Well, I mean, if, if, what's his name hadn't gotten, oh, Nick's what? Andre He probably would have scored the touchdown before the snow. But that was Chris still the right run, right though. Andre Anyway. Yeah, spilled milk. I'm not, I'm not really. I think Carolina will figure it out. I don't know if this guy is bad or good. I really don't care if he gets this sweet 16. Then, then I'll decide job, yeah, like, I mean, how does this is what frustrates me about ACC like original ACC teams without Coach K I'll even include Jimmy V, Dean Smith. Should? I mean, I'm not gonna say what I want. I'll say this. Oh. He won, because I might get a lot of hate. Coach Valvano wasn't all that great as a coach, like he had spurts, but he wasn't like or maybe the ACC used to be super competitive, right? Yeah, so Chris sure, winning record against Coach K Right. Andre So there's a lot to be said there, but Chris you're right, I understand, Andre yeah. So it's like, Chris I do think that Jim that coach valvanos lore like his, the the mythos Andre has been created around him. Yes, has gotten way out of proportion. Well, okay, Chris way out of proportion. It's gotten out of proportion. It's one of those people make a bigger deal about it. I mean, because honestly, even looking back at the Cinderella run in 83 the only reason they were Cinderella's to begin with was because, was it Cindy Lowe had gotten or was it or Terry? Oh, my God, no, no. I'm not doing this. I can, I can literally see Eric Wittenberg had gotten injured at the beginning of the season and didn't play until the very end of the season, and so when he came back, it was like, Oh, we got all our parts together again. And granted, right? Like the dunk to beat Houston was pure luck. See the time Wittenberg, you come on, worries that was not a pass, no matter what Derek Wittenberg says. But I mean that shit happens in sports. That's why we play the game. Andre My point being there, there are a lot of things about I'm not going to shit on coach. I'm not going to do that, but I will say that that's a different error, and I think that part of the acces problem now is that it's not the ACC and I don't know how they're recruiting, to be quite fair. Chris Yeah. I write a lot of what helped the ACC for a long time was the fact that it was the ACC in basketball, and that meant no even if you were going to play it, you know, Georgia Andre Tech Syracuse or UConn Syracuse, if I was going to pick between UConn and UNC, that's an actual decision, right? Even back in the day, yeah, like, if I'm a kid from like, the northeast, I'm probably gonna like, like, oh, but you know, Jordan played at Carolina, all right? Full disclosure, I forgot Jordan played Carolina, moved to North Carolina. I don't know why. It's probably because my family wasn't into college basketball, but I would, I probably would just shit all over Carolina. I would probably be a State fan just because, or actually, I might be a Duke fan because I don't like the color red, but that's another story. But if I'm from the northeast, I'm either going to play at UConn Syracuse or St John's End of story, somehow the ACC was able to draw players from like, you know, the Northeast consistently, because the program, Chris Julie is fucking Hodge to come play there, right? It got an Harlem, right? Andre So it was, it was a different conference. It was a different game. And then you had the whole east coast basketball, like, just the way they played when you like, you're playing against Georgetown, and they were beasts, Chris yeah, hoy is, I mean, the ACC, Big East, like, yeah, that was nuts every year. And now the Big East is gone, and the ACC absorbed a bunch of them, but it never made the ACC better. And basket. Ball. It never made them better in football. Yeah? Mean, like Miami, Virginia Tech and Boston College all as they shit the bed in football, and none of them basketball Andre teams, right? I don't want them in I don't want Miami in football, because Florida you just can't like I've never consistently, although Alabama would be the exception to the rule, I've never consistently seen any other state schools, except for Florida, just dominate Nebraska. I'll get the Cornhuskers Chris are for a while. Yeah, for a while. Andre Oklahoma used to be, but Florida was dominant for a long time when I was a kid like Miami, especially the hurricanes, like, fuck, they ran Chris over FSU when they came into the AC. Andre Yeah, the fuck am I talking, but yes, it was like, what can you do about that? Nothing. Chris Just state was the first team to beat FSU and football after they joined the ACC. Andre Oh, that's a fun fact. At least the Chris first team to beat them at their place. Maybe it's one of the two overall first at their place. Andre So I look at like the ACC is not being the ACC anymore. It's just like a hodgepodge of teams. Chris We talked about it the other day. You got fucking Cal and Stanford. The fuck are we doing? Atlantic coast, my ass even even like Notre Dame. At least you were kind of like this Mississippi Andre screw Notre Dame, because Notre Dame holding on to their football package has always pissed me off. If they're going to be in the ACC, let go of the football package, Chris yeah, and the Yeah. The whole idea was they thought they could eventually convince Notre Dame, which was never going to happen. And in the end, Notre Dame was the one who got to use the ACC for legitimacy to get to where they wanted to go. But it never went the other way around, right? Andre So and the Midwest teams are like in basketball have always been like a problem, Kansas, Kentucky's like a middle ish type of thing, Chris yeah, if they can get a decent coach, you know, like they could be all right, but it seems like so much of it now. I mean, maybe feel free to correct me or disagree, but money, right? I mean, like, with an IO and everything, it's just, it's all just about and not all, but so much of it is, well, I've got a booster that will give me an extra 2 million for this kid for this year, and what 19 to 20 year old is going to turn down 2 million, Andre not many so, so here, here's my my like, I don't know how to like, I don't hate nil, Chris me neither, Because the the kids deserves to get paid like this. This sport is making billions of dollars, and the fact that they weren't able to profit from it in any way other than their scholarship and the stuff that they received directly from the university was bullshit. But it is also created this monster. Now of you know, basically mercenaries in college sports, which case, yeah, and what it is in pro sports, too. So why? Why does it matter in college sports? Is it because it's tied to these universities and we have, like, this association with that that feels bigger than just the sports team, and so we get upset that these kids don't have that same level of attachment, because this feeling of like, go ahead, I don't, Andre I personally don't think that, like, I know that, especially with football players, they're getting CTE, they're, they're probably, you know, yeah, less than 1% are going to go, Going to go to the NFL, so get the bag. Semi pro football is a fucking joke. I don't care what the rock. Oh, that's the next thing we're talking about. How much I dislike the rock. Oh, good, Chris because I have something to add to that. Andre It's so I think that for the value they bring to the schools, they should be able to even the Olympics, right? So we we have this. We make money off of people's effort without rewarding those people monetarily for the effort that brings the money that we're we're or giving off of them. Drives me crazy. How much does Chris NBC pay for the say that broadcast the fucking Olympics every year and not none of that can go to the athletes like they don't get compensated. They get like Andre 25k for Gold Medal, the mother fucker what? What are we talking about? Unknown Speaker What are we doing? I. What's going on now, onto the rock. Andre Okay, the rock is on the list of actors who are in a movie. I will not watch the movie for some reason. I don't know how it happened. I don't know what was my final tipping point. I i I just fucking can't stand that guy. I'm sure was in Chris the last movie that he was in that you watched. Do you remember Andre he was, I think he did a was it? Was he in the last nose black? Chris Adam, yeah. I had to feel like that's the last thing that I saw him in, as well, because I didn't see the smashing machine that was like the indie film that he did about the MMA fighter that everybody watching. Oh, it's gonna be amazing. And it did not look amazing. But yeah, so I have gotten back into professional wrestling a little bit as a fan. Okay, mainly here recently, because there's this guy, I don't know if you've heard of, Dan housing. So he's this tiny little guy who wears, like silly kind of kiss makeup. It's more like Vampire kind of and he used to wrestle in a Ew, but WWE signed him. He had this horrible debut at Survivor Series where he came out of this, like giant crate that had been sitting there for two weeks, and now that shits fake. Yes, I do 100% but this dude is fucking hilarious, and that's the funny part about it, is that his whole thing is he curses people, and then bad things happen to them, like in their matches with him, that's how he wins. Like he's not a good wrestler, but I Andre love you, bro, but you're like, I swear to God, I've got nothing on that, but I will say, Fuck Gene Simmons. Chris Kiss a piece of shit. Andre He made his comment. He made a comment that like about who was being inducted the Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, and pretty much was shit on anybody black. And then part of me was just like, you know, without Chuck Berry, you guys don't have shit, right? You fucking Chris to be without Michael J Fox, Chuck Berry wouldn't have found that new sound. He was Marvin, your cousin, Marvin Barry, you know that new sound? Andre You know that new sound you're looking for? Well, listen to this. You know that's a movie, right? Fuck that shit. BB King, there's no rock and roll without Chuck Berry, there's no rock and roll. Elvis was a culture vulture. He was the first Justin Timberlake, Unknown Speaker big time. So Andre who else? Chris Sylvester Stallone, I mean, Justin Timberlake is gonna die on the toilet too, possibly. Andre I mean, I mean, dude's got, like, some type of drug problem. Chris But speaking of drug problems, Tiger Woods. Andre Man, leave that nigga alone. Man, okay, Chris dude, can't hire a driver at this point. Andre Look, look, first of all, I am not a big like I'm passing him bail, because I think he's just in a reckless part of Chris his life, right? I understand that. Andre You're right. He bought into the this is what I think Tiger Woods problem is. He bought into the acceptance lie, and then when people throw him away, ie Nike and like everybody else, because, you know, whatever happened with him and his ex wife? Yeah, like he did not, I think he just crashed out. Like, seriously, I don't have any ill will towards him. I don't I'm not like saying, oh, free Tiger. No, no, fuck that guy for that. Chris But people are saying hashtag, free Tiger. Andre But I kind of blame it on his parents, though, man, like they figure out a way to get the back. Got this kid. He was very devoted to his parents, and I don't think he ever knew how to like be himself. And so, yeah, this motherfucker is, like, drugged out. I mean, he's gonna be casualty to the acceptance disease. And, you know, he's but he's got two kids, you know, hopefully they turn out to be good people. Chris No. I mean, that's a really good point, Andre so I'm not gonna let you, like, No, right? Like that, you're right. That should be a clip, Chris yeah, but I'm the one that edited this shit together make me look like an asshole. Andre I mean, you ever think you ever look at it that way? Think like, No, I tired. We're close to the same age and like I look at like, just his history of like, his pop show boating him and like, part of his like, yo. They're trying to get paid yo. Chris And I remember when Tiger was first, like, kind of becoming big, when he, like, as a junior golfer and stuff like that. And my dad was like, that's what you need to do golf. Can you imagine getting to play golf, getting paid millions of dollars to play golf every day. I'm not very good at golf, Andre but you see, thank goodness you see my point, though, right? Chris Yes, absolutely. I was not good at golf, and my dad was not like the, I'm gonna push you beyond, you know, what you want to do sort of thing. But there was definitely the like, hey, you know the pressure? All right, yeah, there was a, there was an element of pressure. Andre My old man used to make me play baseball like that. You know, it's kind of like, I think subconsciously, as I got older and I was good at sports, I didn't want to play sports all that much because it wasn't fun anymore, like, if I was too good, it became like a job. You know, who wants to do fucking baseball drills for three hours? Fucking Nobody said I even in football, I was a good quarterback because I was good at baseball. Wasn't because, like, I was, you know, I could still run. I knew how to throw, you know, throw a ball. I could, you know, my vision was pretty good, so it was kind of a, you know, a blessing. I didn't make the team. I would have probably done anything just for my dad's approval. And that's sad, like to admit it like almost 50. So I can imagine, like me, personally, I can see myself in a Tiger Woods. What does that look like? Looks like you're fucking flipping over a car on fucking drugs. We talked about this before, like, you know, with my kids, like, when they were like, I'm done with sports, part of me wanted them to go, but the bigger, better part of was like, No, I understand, right? Because that's a bad cycle. Chris So you don't want your kids feeling like they're doing that for you, right, right? Like, if that's something that they're passionate about, then, you know, and that's, I mean, that's where I try to be with my kids, you know. I mean, like my oldest, when she was real little, was like, Hey, do you want to try soccer? Do you want to try basketball? And that was yes. And then it was two seasons of each and then it was, I don't think I want to do that anymore. And there was one she, oh, she did ballet at one point, and had been asking and asking and asking and went to ballet. And then, like, a couple of months or three or four months into it was like, I don't want to do this anymore. And I was like, okay, but we need to finish, like, this season. After that, you don't have to call it anymore, but, like, you made a commitment to do this, and you're gonna see that through. But then if you don't want to do this anymore, we'll go find something else you want to do. Andre I did the same thing with my daughter in karate. I was like, once you, like, she wanted to be a black belt, it's like, you got to get the black belt, and then you can make the decision. Then she went to black belt, went to Nationals again, you know, won a championship, and then she called it. But you better believe, like, you know, part of me, like, there's, there are always bits and parts of you that, like you live vicariously through your kids. My hyper competitive nature, it comes from a bad place. It's not because, like, I like to win because winning is cool. It's because I'm, like, looking for my old man's approval, and that's not healthy. Had to win. Yeah, so I played hurt. I played injured. I played like, in excruciating pain, and my knees fucked up to this day because, like, I never went, I never told my parents that I think something's broken. So, oh, man, thank God. Chris I remember the conversation that we had. It was like one of the first 10 episodes, I think of the Chris and Andre show, and I think, you know, one of your kids was telling you, like, I'm tired of being hurt, like I'm tired of being in pain all the time, and getting hurt like this just isn't enjoyable for me anymore. And, right, Andre yeah, yeah. And he and my son had a like, two full ride offers, just, you know, for college, one in football and one in lacrosse. And he was just like, I don't want to do it anymore. It's like, okay, Chris but like, whipping out that checkbook, fine, you're gonna pay me back when I retire. Andre So, but, but those things are, I mean, those, those are part of, those are the parts of being a parent that you kind of have to like, like, recognize, you know, like, am I even my dad? He said he was an athlete. He played basketball for the Air Force, and this is back when they would on the Olympic team. They would have like, like, service members or college students, like, make the team for the Olympics, and he got hurt, had to get knee surgery and never play basketball again. And I know that fucking bothered him, because he's really good at basketball. It's probably why he made me and my brothers, like, fucking be really, really good at sports, bro, I could probably catch a ball 20 feet off first base, get to first base, get the tag out, and throw the ball to second or third in a motion when I was younger, like, I can do it now, because I'm, like, physically not able to do that, but like, that's, those are the type of drills he would like make us do. He would throw the, you know, throw the ball, like, 10 feet beyond, you know, first base. You have to grab the ball, tag out, and get it to whatever base he called. And I could get to a point where I could do it without even thinking, like I knew the angle I had to throw it by the time my fucking right or left foot hit the damn back. That ain't healthy. Chris There's an element of like, is that what you like in your ideal scenario? Is that what you wanted to be doing, like, with your dad, right? I want, Andre I wanted to be on my dad, but I I did like, I started to not like sports, you know, yeah. So it Chris makes back, because it Yeah, it becomes like, this is the thing that connects us, and I don't want to lose that, but at the same time, like I'm kind of only doing it for that, right? Andre And you had to be perfect, right? You had to be perfect. And it's the and when you fast forward through life and you get to like adulthood, and you don't know when to quit trying to be perfect, you miss out on a lot. You know, there's undue pressure to not miss the mark, and then you're always second guess. There's a lot of shit that comes along with trying to be a good kid. So, yeah, that's that was deeply personal. I don't, I don't talk Chris about if you don't mind sharing. Andre So for all you dads out there, I mean, like, if that, if you ever been in that, that situation, that's what it feels like. And if you're you went through that when you're younger, like you got to manage that. So when you have kids, you don't pass that along. I remember when my son was telling me that about the football scholarship they wanted him to put on 35 pounds. Oh, it's like, he's like, Dad, I don't want to fucking do that. It's like, okay, like, 35 pounds is a lot, bro. I mean, yeah, it's a lot, and especially when you have like, two torn ACLs and, like, no, Chris that's not, that's not healthy at that point, like, putting that extra weight and the extra strain on the ACLs that have been reconstructed, like, that's not. It's not a good luck. Yeah, no, Andre so that was our parenting corner. And I will say this, I want to make sure I make a point I love my parents. They were and I tell them this, like when I see them, they were terrible teachers, where they taught me good lessons, like the, you know, my drive to be good, I've kind of tampered that down a little bit to where it's healthy, but it's actually Chris do a podcast with me, so Andre I so like, case in point, I hate being late, because if you're late when I was a kid, good Lord, Your life was over. Chris But now you don't have to worry about that, because usually I'm the one running Andre late, but I'm so paranoid that if I say, like, I'm gonna be 10 minutes late, my brain, like, triggers that I get shit done. Chris Like, yeah, two minutes after five, and I'm like, Shit, I thought I had eight more minutes around, Andre yeah, but, you know, again, they were terrible teachers, but they taught me good lessons, and so Mom and Dad, I love you for that. I really appreciate it. I know you guys aren't gonna listen to it, but Lisa can tell the people that listen that I love my parents. I am very critical of my parents. I tell them the stuff to their face now because they're old. So when my when my dad was younger, he was like, he's like, at least 6364, like, a solid 272, 80. That's a big dude. Man. Like, I was, like, scared, not scared, like, in a bad way. But I remember one day I was 16, and I was like, I can take them. And then my brain like, said, What do you think he's going to kill you? Chris This does not end well for you Andre Andre my brain was like, I know you're not good at math, but I remember that physics class you took Chris for every force, there is an equal. My brain was like, Andre I need you to, like, put that. But I really thought I was like, Yeah, I could take them. I'm like, and my brain was like, Bro, that's, that's a bad play. That's a very bad play. So everybody, thanks for listening to us. Hanging out with us, Chris, it's good to recording, and it's good to like, I need to talk to my people and being like, have people in my circle and helps me to process stuff and stay sane. So that's the other reason why we do this, not just because there's cool stuff to talk about, but as I tell my kids, like your mom and I are great, but you have to have to have people around you that you can be vulnerable with. And like, you know, check your shit on. And Chris is one of those people in my very small circle. And doesn't have to be like, 20 people. It can be like, I have three people I talk to. It's like, that's, Chris yeah, fortunate. I got to go last week before I went up to Portland for a trade show, I got to go to California to visit a customer and my buddy, Mike, who is my next door neighbor. He's eight years older than me when I was growing up there in Northern California, and he was like my babysitter, but also my older brother. He still lives there, and so every time I get to go back to Sacramento now, I get grab lunch with him, or get to hang out. And it was really great to get to hang out with him for a while, because you and I hadn't gotten a chance to do this, but I was very excited to be able to get back to recording. And it's always nice to get to hang out and just get the stuff that's on our minds out, other than national politics. But it is, you know, I think it's one of those things, right? We spend a lot of time inside our own heads, and it's easy to feel like you're the only person going through this stuff or that has these types of thoughts and feelings, and it's really great to have somebody that you can trust to be able to share those thoughts with. And like you said, like, check some of these things. Am I crazy? Like, what is what is going on here? Am I. My seeing things, right? And that's always been one of my favorite things about my conversations with you, is that you know the relationship that we have. We both of us, I think, feel very comfortable being honest with each other about what we see and how each other is, is responding to things and being able to give constructive feedback and figure out, like, how do we all navigate this stuff better? And that's part of why we record these and share these now, is because we're hoping that there are other people that out there that find these conversations useful in that way too. Andre And if you don't, you can always skip ahead. You No, I saw who was it? Heavy spoilers. He did a video about Invincibles the last episode, there's a spoiler. Knows the boys. And he goes, spoilers are coming on. He's a he's a Brit. And he goes, and if you don't want to watch the spoilers and go, Fuck off. Kind of got to the point there, bro, you know, I respect that. But then he goes, I'm sorry, I'm sorry, but you can still fuck off. I was like, Chris love that we appreciate you Andre guys hanging out with us always. You can find more of our stuff. We write stuff on our blog, at Chris and Andre show.com, and yeah, we if the audio version is everywhere, Spotify, Apple Music, Google podcast, which is now YouTube podcast. What am I missing? They're there. It's the Pandora Pandora. We put our stuff out there if you like it. We really appreciate it. Somebody said our emails not working in a previous email. If that's true, like, leave us a comment down below somewhere Chris to email us if our email wasn't working. Andre I don't I don't know. Dude, I like he there's a form that you can always reach out to us on a form on our website also, and I that's the part I do. He does all the pretty stuff. I do all the super nerdy stuff. But as always, Chris you know the difference between you and me. I make this look good. Andre Wow, somebody is really feeling themselves. This guy, he's got his pimp daddy like scene. I've got my sterile Chris setup, yeah. Like, like, Andre nerd scene behind me. Yeah. Anyway, thanks for hanging out with us. I'm Andre and I'm Chris. We'll talk to you soon. Chris Thanks for checking out the Chris and Andre show. This is the part where we ask you to like and subscribe. You can also leave a comment and share this with someone you think would find useful for more content like this, head on over to Chris and Andre show.com remember stay sane, stay safe and stay salty. We'll see you on the next one you.